why do people choose to live despite it all?

[Darkover]

When I look at everyone's lives around me, I am just so stunned. For most people, life is nothing more than a cycle of working your ass of all day so that you can make enough money to feed yourself so that you can then wake up the next day to repeat the same thing. Again, and again, and again, until you die.

And I have not been able to cope with this, not at all.

I looked at my future and I was horrified. Nothing but working to live the next day, to then work for the next.

In the past it was even worse. Slavery was a thing, slaves actually chose to live. Why? Why? Why did they choose to live? Why do the Chinese, who work the entire day, choose to live?

is it because in humans survival is the most basic need before all others. So even if surviving means negative outcomes, it is far better, in most people's minds, than being dead.

 

[Dot]

Tht = simlr logc as sme1 sayng 'u r 2 privlgd 2 b deprssd' tho

Ppl wth gd xternl circmstncs shld b hppy & ppl wth neg8tve xternl circmstncs wld wn2 b ded

= nt tht simpl

 

[Ash]

So you look at people's lives. Do you talk to them? I don't mean people like us who are largely talking about suicide or recovering from being suicidal. I mean people out there, in the real world, living the lives that horrify you. Do you talk to them about their lives, what they love and hate and put up with and change and make do or mend and enjoy and long for and work towards and save up for? What do they think about their jobs and careers? Are they just a way to feed themselves, hand to mouth? Or do they like what they do? Is any of what you've posted based on any kind of evidence or is it just one giant assumption?

 

[hematomatema]

Tht = simlr logc as sme1 sayng 'u r 2 privlgd 2 b deprssd' tho

Ppl wth gd xternl circmstncs shld b hppy & ppl wth neg8tve xternl circmstncs wld wn2 b ded

= nt tht simpl

This. People seem to forget that others aren't as depressed as them, that others can still experience quite a lot of joy despite whatever circumstances they may be in. Not everyone has no will to live - quite the opposite.

 

[Tesha]

You can clearly see that other people don't view working in the same way you do. You were unable to cope with your projection of your future, and that's ok.

Many people however get enjoyment out of working, out of the interpersonal relationships this brings, out of the sense of purpose it can give some. When I'm well, that how I feel. When I'm in my deep depression and trauma mindset, I can't see much joy or point in the world.

I do wonder whether a lot of the nihilism / neet movement these days is actually some form of internalised pathological demand avoidance. I'm not diagnosing or accusing any one of this, I'm just voicing my thoughts.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

So you look at people's lives. Do you talk to them? I don't mean people like us who are largely talking about suicide or recovering from being suicidal. I mean people out there, in the real world, living the lives that horrify you. Do you talk to them about their lives, what they love and hate and put up with and change and make do or mend and enjoy and long for and work towards and save up for? What do they think about their jobs and careers? Are they just a way to feed themselves, hand to mouth? Or do they like what they do? Is any of what you've posted based on any kind of evidence or is it just one giant assumption?

It wouldn't matter if they told him why they choose to live. When you are stuck in a particular mindset like his, the perspectives of others just goes over your head. It would basically be like them speaking a weird foreign language to him. You can only truly understand what you are willing to be open-minded about and the OP is not at that point. I'm not saying this to be rude, btw. This applies to others too and this also applies to a lot of situations regarding understanding different perspectives in general. People like to assume that they are right about stuff, even things those things do not have a right answer, and that can make it hard to understand why people arrive to other answers.

 

[Ash]

It wouldn't matter if they told him why they choose to live. When you are stuck in a particular mindset like his, the perspectives of others just goes over your head. It would basically be like them speaking a weird foreign language to him. You can only truly understand what you are willing to be open-minded about and the OP is not at that point. I'm not saying this to be rude, btw. This applies to others too and this also applies to a lot of situations regarding understanding different perspectives in general. People like to assume that they are right about stuff, even things those things do not have a right answer, and that can make it hard to understand why people arrive to other answers.

I know, but sometimes in a discussion the question needs to be asked, even if you know there is unlikely to ever be an answer.

 

[Dayrain]

When I look at everyone's lives around me, I am just so stunned. For most people, life is nothing more than a cycle of working your ass of all day so that you can make enough money to feed yourself so that you can then wake up the next day to repeat the same thing. Again, and again, and again, until you die.

It's just a fact, this is a fascist manner. Doing the the same again, again, again and again without looking left or right...

 

[BackToLobby]

Life can be great and I truly had chances to be happy but I self-sabotage over and over again and I blame my parents for raising me this way

 

[divinemistress36]

Their brains produce healthy amounts of serotonin and dopamine that keeps them motivated

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

Even though this can be considered one of the society's most pressing questions, there will probably never be a defintive answer to this. Because even if there was an answer, there is no real solution - other than not exisiting. Which would involve...welll, you know...

I personally feel that those of us the share your feelings can only do one thing that is under our control. And that is to eliminate all probability of forcing someone else to possibly have to suffer through decades of the same thing. By not having children of our own. And those of us that do decide to have children better put 100% into it. No days off. It was a choice you made, and your responsibility.

What I don't like is all the commenters trying to invalidate your question by accusing you of not providing empirical evidence to backup your perception. Or that suggest that most people here don't agree with you, when in fact there are many here (including myself) that do. It's doesn't take a rocket science to see all the people around that hate ther jobs and complain about having to go to work. Or see articles about the nets that Apple has to install under the windows of their factories in China to prevent workers from jumping to their deaths. One google search could retrieive countless job satisfaction survey results pointing to the fact that the majority of the population don't like what they do for a living and only do it to survive.

Nor should you even have to justify anything in the first place. It's how you feel and people should respect that and not insinuate that you have some sort of twisted mindset. Everyone is here on this forum for a reason and nobody's reason deserves to be invalidated.

The current dynamic of human society is pretty much a zero sum game. At least in capitalistic cultures. For one person to make money, another person has to lose money. Often by being cheated or robbed. For one person to be successful, another person has to be taken advantage of. Some of us are fed up with it and would choose not participate in this if we had the choice. And there is nothing wrong with that.

 

[Hotsackage]

Science and my peeps that I might be related to

 

[Ash]

Even though this can be considered one of the society's most pressing questions, there will probably never be a defintive answer to this. Because even if there was an answer, there is no real solution - other than not exisiting. Which would involve...welll, you know...

I personally feel that those of us the share your feelings can only do one thing that is under our control. And that is to eliminate all probability of forcing someone else to possibly have to suffer through decades of the same thing. By not having children of our own. And those of us that do decide to have children better put 100% into it. No days off. It was a choice you made, and your responsibility.

What I don't like is all the commenters trying to invalidate your question by accusing you of not providing empirical evidence to backup your perception. Or that suggest that most people here don't agree with you, when in fact there are many here (including myself) that do. It's doesn't take a rocket science to see all the people around that hate ther jobs and complain about having to go to work. Or see articles about the nets that Apple has to install under the windows of their factories in China to prevent workers from jumping to their deaths. One google search could retrieive countless job satisfaction survey results pointing to the fact that the majority of the population don't like what they do for a living and only do it to survive.

Nor should you even have to justify anything in the first place. It's how you feel and people should respect that and not insinuate that you have some sort of twisted mindset. Everyone is here on this forum for a reason and nobody's reason deserves to be invalidated.

The current dynamic of human society is pretty much a zero sum game. At least in capitalistic cultures. For one person to make money, another person has to lose money. Often by being cheated or robbed. For one person to be successful, another person has to be taken advantage of. Some of us are fed up with it and would choose not participate in this if we had the choice. And there is nothing wrong with that.

Read the post again. It's presented as a statement of fact and I for one am fed up of some people on here continually misunderstanding the difference between opinions and facts. If the former are presented as opinions, fine, carry on. But if they're presented as facts then damn right they'll be queried.

 

[iLikeFrogs]

For me it's SI and little hangouts with my friends that I eventually manage to go to once I'm out of bed. I guess I'm just waiting until I have enough strength to try to commit while I'm appreciating my last moments with my friends

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

Read the post again. It's presented as a statement of fact and I for one am fed up of some people on here continually misunderstanding the difference between opinions and facts. If the former are presented as opinions, fine, carry on. But if they're presented as facts then damn right they'll be queried.

How can it be construed as a fact if it is presented in the form of a question? Fact is typically presented in the form of a statement, not a question.

Maybe YOU should read the post again. The first sentence of his post "When I look at everyone's lives around me" clearly suggests that what he is saying is purely anecdotal and that everything that is to proceed are his own personal feelings based on his life experiences.

Those that don't agree are free to say so. But to talk down to him as being abnormal in the way he thinks is uncalled for.

 

[unfixablegirl]

Their brains produce healthy amounts of serotonin and dopamine that keeps them motivated

I agree with this. I've always been lacking in those despite being on many medications.

 

[untothedepths]

I think suicide may be more prevalent in places that are horrible than some of these people say. I know this is going out of the way here, but as though there are literal living hell situations the assumption that "3rd worlders are less suicidal" makes me want to definitely doubt those claims until I see better evidence. I think what keeps people less suicidal though is probably a strong family/community. If you have that, you can withstand a lot, so I do believe that people may be able to handle a lot. However, in the 'western world' we apparently see higher suicide rates...but we also have some of the strongest economies, yet the wealth disparity can be stark. Putting my tin foil hat on right now, I wonder if this rhetoric about less fortunate countries being less suicidal is just some pro-capitalist talking point to make people feel better about their shitty living conditions and to not question them, nor question the validity of using cheap labor overseas.

 

[divinemistress36]

I agree with this. I've always been lacking in those despite being on many medications.

Same!

 

[Forever Sleep]

Why do you or I do it? If you and I do it and we detest life as much as we say we do, that makes even less sense than someone who either claims to enjoy life or, at least bits of it.

Not meaning to have a go at you but, I suspect some of their reasons are similar to ours. Lack of a peaceful exit out of here. Fear of death. Fear of the process of death and especially suicide. Fear of the unknown afterwards. Life is all we remember having. I guess some people just feel more comfortable with sticking with what they know and trying to make it work as best they can.

I suppose I do wonder what makes some people consider suicide and some not. I don't think it's always to do with how bad their situation is. Mindset seems to play a part too. Whether that's down to mental illness I suppose is debatable.

 

[Ash]

How can it be construed as a fact if it is presented in the form of a question? Fact is typically presented in the form of a statement, not a question.

Maybe YOU should read the post again. The first sentence of his post "When I look at everyone's lives around me" clearly suggests that what he is saying is purely anecdotal and that everything that is to proceed are his own personal feelings based on his life experiences.

Those that don't agree are free to say so. But to talk down to him as being abnormal in the way he thinks is uncalled for.

Well I didn't call anyone abnormal. It's not a word I'd use beyond medical test results. But if you want to put words in my mouth, I'm clicking unwatch and heading off to bed.

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

Well I didn't call anyone abnormal. It's not a word I'd use beyond medical test results. But if you want to put words in my mouth, I'm clicking unwatch and heading off to bed.

Maybe "abnormal" wasn't the proper choice of word. But to me, you clearly had your pitchfork out aggressively demanding that he provide some sort of evidence to justify his thoughts. Gaslighting him into thinking that all he has in his head is "one giant assumption".

..."unwatch"..."go to bed"...by all means, do whatever makes you happy. This is not a matter that should get any of us this worked up.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

The overwhelming tendency is for people to fight like hell for their lives. You can see that literally everywhere, anywhere you look. Those of us who don't share that same inclination truly are the aberrant ones. People who can't see that are either being deliberately disingenuous or just lack a sound understanding of human nature (and therefore aren't equipped to dictate what the fate of the entire human species should be).

 

[ninfanatic]

This answer might just be 'personality disorder speak', but I think in some cases it may be repetitive negative instances and that's all being what some of us can see. I'm not trying to say that you need to have a personality disorder to have this mindset, but it's like, I don't know, getting accustomed to tragedy and feeling bad. I don't think this would apply to every suicidal person, but in general it's a very difficult mindset to escape from. Maybe either just not being able to see a way out of your current crisis or expecting another.

 

[AmberianDawn]

I understand your point, because I have had depression since I can remember basically, but to answer your question: people do whatever it takes to live because it is precisely the only thing you have to do in life, live. There is nothing else, everything you think you have (money, clothes, jewelry, house, car, etc.) is temporary, just like our bodies. I mean that the purpose is not to have a car, a house or nice clothes, the purpose is to live and that's it, nothing more, there are babies who are born and die and barely managed to live, there are also people who live too long, there is everything in life, but the purpose is fulfilled from the moment you are born until you die, you already lived, that's it, do not expect great things or magic, life is very ephemeral in reality, the human mind is what makes things more complex by searching and searching everywhere things that do not exist, satisfying desires that will give rise to more desires and thus maintain the vicious circle, but there is nothing more than that

 

[Ash]

Maybe "abnormal" wasn't the proper choice of word. But to me, you clearly had your pitchfork out aggressively demanding that he provide some sort of evidence to justify his thoughts. Gaslighting him into thinking that all he has in his head is "one giant assumption".

..."unwatch"..."go to bed"...by all means, do whatever makes you happy. This is not a matter that should get any of us this worked up.

Well if he hasn't spoken to the people around him and is just watching him, then it is just an assumption.

And I deeply resent the accusation that I'm attempting to gaslight him. I'm simply pointing out what I said in the previous paragraph. If you're unable to see that, whatever. As you're right, there's more important things. I was up throughout the night with my dog who was ill and I'm waiting to see how she does this morning before I ring the vet. So you carry on.

(Turns out unwatch doesn't turn off alerts for direct quotes so I'll put the thread on ignore. Got even more real world problems to deal with today.)

 

[ijustwishtodie]

I don't understand it either and I don't think I ever will. I think that normies just have a different neurotype to us. It's absolutely bizarre at how they're okay with slaving away. It's a reason why I wish I was never a human in the first place. Being a human is awful and exhausting

 

[permanently tired]

I told my mother the life she lives is boring and if I don't succeed at the one thing I want then I'm not going to bother living. She told me my expectations for myself are too high and that she only wishes for her family to be in good health, have good interpersonal relationships, and enough money to not live paycheck to paycheck. Her response to where she wanted to be 10 yrs from now? For her children to be financially stable and for us to all eat together at the dinner table. I inquired abt why she doesn't desire more. She's content surrounding herself with family. It's not for everyone, certainly not me but I can understand it to some extent. Her anchor is her family and the purpose she works.