I think many point the finger at this website. But many people here say the roots for suicidal thoughts have nothing to do with this forum. So the people here who consider suicide are more of a symptom of underlying societal issues.
I find it insane that countries where free health care for anyone is not implemented wonder why there is a spike in suicides.
Poverty is often a big factor suicides. Also in my case. If I had a real safety net which would spare me the abyss of decades of poverty maybe I would not be this anxious anymore. I just need to vent and cry about all my anxieties. If countries don't want to materially support vulnerable people it is no wonder these people contemplate suicide. And yes the social organisations in my country say welfare had to be the amount of 650 euros for a life with dignity (that is far from reality). And I fully agree on it.
Most people agree the current amount is not enough but nobody cares because unemployed people don't have a powerful lobby.
Yeah if society doesn't offer me a way to live in dignity I have the right to say goodbye to this world. Maybe when I kill myself one could say his suicide would have been preventable. Though society and humans are too selfish for that. Maybe it is the nature of humans to be selfish. Well if this is the case I am selfish too and take my life due to it.
So my first suggestions would be free health care for anyone and material support for anyone to live a life in dignity. If you cannot provide that you should not be surprised about high suicide rates. The elites had the power to do something against the roots of suicides. But they don't act on it. It is enough for populistic platitudes but real honest interest and full support is very rare.
There should be better treatments and enough therapists. It is pretty hard to get a therapist. You wait insane amount of time often. I had 3 therapists. And sometimes the chemistry does not fit. So either you take this one or wait another 6-12 months? You should not be surprised that this system does not work.
I never was an addict. Though my experiences were addiction is kind of stigmatized in clinics. I had the feeling many professionals blame the patients for it. This is at least my impression I never was in this position. I mean there seems to be a correlation of child abuse and substance abuse. It is kind of cyncial to blame addicts in such cases. They deserve love and respect as anyone else too.
Many people here are critical towars medication. In my opinion some are too pessimistic towards it. Though I can understand their anger. In my experience the patients don't get educated on the pills, the side effects, the pro and cons of medication. In this case it is obvious that there can't be confidence in them. Many side effects are not taken serious even if the patients suffer because of them like for example severe weight-gain. I have the feeling most professionals are pretty numb towards such suffering.
Moreover I have to say. At least this is my experience it is hard to get a compassionate psychiatrist. I think psychiatrists have a very decisive role and can help people a lot. Though I have experienced many who were emotionally cold. Kind of numb, Maybe this is the effect when someone listens 24/7 to patients who express agony ect. On the other hand they don't have an honest approach to suicide. Professionals called people who commit suicide insane per defintion straight to my face. In every case I mentioned assisted suicide they said we don't allow any discussion on that/ we are not interested in your arguments. Oh you wonder why I go to a suicide forum then? If you call everyone with suicide thoughts irrational or even insane I cannot take you serious anymore. I am no child but i feel treated like one.
I will go on with this rant later. I wanted to add something about medication. In the US the pharma lobby is greedy, full of mafia like middle men who are responsible for the opiod epidemic. Responsible for thousands of people who suffer now due to the addiction. They have lost everything and live on the streets.
Many probably committed suicide because of it. Many journalists treat homeless people like trash. And you wonder why the people don't trust medication and pharmacy? The US health care system is so deeply fucked. Every newspapers which supports this system (even only indirectly) should not have the arrogance to judge about the health crisis. You are a big part of the problem. if you don't call out the scam which is happening. You should feel deeply ashamed and stand up against the injustice of the US health care system and fight for a better system. But most of them are scared about the mighty lobby.
I think an honest approach to the topic suicide could prevent suicides which could be have been prevented. With preventable suicide I mean suicides which could have been prevented if the person could have received certain help. One psychiatrist once categorized me as a case which cannot be prevented. And she is kind of right with that. Maybe with the exception there would be a sudden revolution and capitalism would be transformed or something similar. She said people like me cannot be locked up in the psych ward forever. Which is kind of true that contradicts our notion of freedom. People who are very determined to die over a long period of time will eventually find a way. This is at least something I read. I am no expert and cannot really say whether this is fully true but it seems for me to be plausible. The alternative result could also be the person will have brain damage forever, will be consciously imprisoned in a body without the ability to communicate. And yes I think these results can also be blamed on people who are responsible for assisted suicide prohibition. I can speak from my own experience. I am and most other suicidal people are extremely anxious about such brain damage. It is probably one reason why many people are willing to break the law to prevent such an outcome. I mean what would you do in our position? Trying to be a law-abiding citizen or risking a severe brain damage which can last for the rest of your life?
I think the society, (in my experience) many professionals and politicians are hypocritical on this topic. One can see that when all people who commit suicide are placed in one category. Like one therapist who called people who commit suicide insane. Therapists are not trained for longterm suicidal people, They are not prepared for that and in my experience often overburdened. There is often this self-defence mechanism they won't allow any discussion on it. But why? Are they afraid about an honest exchange on such an existential question like suicide? I have a guess why most people reject a discussion. There are several reasons for it. Legally they are often forced to give only one answer because assisted suicide is illegal. No matter what their real stance on this ethically complex issue is.
If they see the world this black and white of course there will be no open and honest debate on it. The topic is stigmatized as fuck. In my country there is a majority for liberal assisted suicide laws. Though the elites impose their will on the people. Against the democratic desire for it. When people are extremely desperate for something there will of course develop blackmarkets. And if you don't like how the blackmarkets are handled you should ask why the people have this desire in the first place. You have to ask yourself are the current regulations reasonable? Is the discussion nuanced enough or do we put all these people in one category? Because this is basically what most countries do.
Suicide = prohibited, sanctioned and stigmatized
Peaceful and safe means = illegal
If this is your approach you should not wonder why it does not work.
There is a need for an honest debate for this ethically complex issues. There has to be listened to different perspectives. If you go on like that there will be no solution. Ban one forum? Soon the next one will emerge. There will always be people who are extremely desperate and in extreme pain who search a way to leave.
Either you implement reasonable and nuanced laws with regulations that are socially accepted or otherwise there will always be enough support of people who say. Well what do want? Criminalize all suicide people? Put them all into prison? Which is sort of already a thing because all peaceful methods sooner or later become illegal.
Yeah kind of a long thread. Do you have ideas how to prevent suicide? Except the measures I have laid out. Was not sure which sub-forum fits for this thread.
I find it insane that countries where free health care for anyone is not implemented wonder why there is a spike in suicides.
Poverty is often a big factor suicides. Also in my case. If I had a real safety net which would spare me the abyss of decades of poverty maybe I would not be this anxious anymore. I just need to vent and cry about all my anxieties. If countries don't want to materially support vulnerable people it is no wonder these people contemplate suicide. And yes the social organisations in my country say welfare had to be the amount of 650 euros for a life with dignity (that is far from reality). And I fully agree on it.
Most people agree the current amount is not enough but nobody cares because unemployed people don't have a powerful lobby.
Yeah if society doesn't offer me a way to live in dignity I have the right to say goodbye to this world. Maybe when I kill myself one could say his suicide would have been preventable. Though society and humans are too selfish for that. Maybe it is the nature of humans to be selfish. Well if this is the case I am selfish too and take my life due to it.
So my first suggestions would be free health care for anyone and material support for anyone to live a life in dignity. If you cannot provide that you should not be surprised about high suicide rates. The elites had the power to do something against the roots of suicides. But they don't act on it. It is enough for populistic platitudes but real honest interest and full support is very rare.
There should be better treatments and enough therapists. It is pretty hard to get a therapist. You wait insane amount of time often. I had 3 therapists. And sometimes the chemistry does not fit. So either you take this one or wait another 6-12 months? You should not be surprised that this system does not work.
I never was an addict. Though my experiences were addiction is kind of stigmatized in clinics. I had the feeling many professionals blame the patients for it. This is at least my impression I never was in this position. I mean there seems to be a correlation of child abuse and substance abuse. It is kind of cyncial to blame addicts in such cases. They deserve love and respect as anyone else too.
Many people here are critical towars medication. In my opinion some are too pessimistic towards it. Though I can understand their anger. In my experience the patients don't get educated on the pills, the side effects, the pro and cons of medication. In this case it is obvious that there can't be confidence in them. Many side effects are not taken serious even if the patients suffer because of them like for example severe weight-gain. I have the feeling most professionals are pretty numb towards such suffering.
Moreover I have to say. At least this is my experience it is hard to get a compassionate psychiatrist. I think psychiatrists have a very decisive role and can help people a lot. Though I have experienced many who were emotionally cold. Kind of numb, Maybe this is the effect when someone listens 24/7 to patients who express agony ect. On the other hand they don't have an honest approach to suicide. Professionals called people who commit suicide insane per defintion straight to my face. In every case I mentioned assisted suicide they said we don't allow any discussion on that/ we are not interested in your arguments. Oh you wonder why I go to a suicide forum then? If you call everyone with suicide thoughts irrational or even insane I cannot take you serious anymore. I am no child but i feel treated like one.
I will go on with this rant later. I wanted to add something about medication. In the US the pharma lobby is greedy, full of mafia like middle men who are responsible for the opiod epidemic. Responsible for thousands of people who suffer now due to the addiction. They have lost everything and live on the streets.
Many probably committed suicide because of it. Many journalists treat homeless people like trash. And you wonder why the people don't trust medication and pharmacy? The US health care system is so deeply fucked. Every newspapers which supports this system (even only indirectly) should not have the arrogance to judge about the health crisis. You are a big part of the problem. if you don't call out the scam which is happening. You should feel deeply ashamed and stand up against the injustice of the US health care system and fight for a better system. But most of them are scared about the mighty lobby.
I think an honest approach to the topic suicide could prevent suicides which could be have been prevented. With preventable suicide I mean suicides which could have been prevented if the person could have received certain help. One psychiatrist once categorized me as a case which cannot be prevented. And she is kind of right with that. Maybe with the exception there would be a sudden revolution and capitalism would be transformed or something similar. She said people like me cannot be locked up in the psych ward forever. Which is kind of true that contradicts our notion of freedom. People who are very determined to die over a long period of time will eventually find a way. This is at least something I read. I am no expert and cannot really say whether this is fully true but it seems for me to be plausible. The alternative result could also be the person will have brain damage forever, will be consciously imprisoned in a body without the ability to communicate. And yes I think these results can also be blamed on people who are responsible for assisted suicide prohibition. I can speak from my own experience. I am and most other suicidal people are extremely anxious about such brain damage. It is probably one reason why many people are willing to break the law to prevent such an outcome. I mean what would you do in our position? Trying to be a law-abiding citizen or risking a severe brain damage which can last for the rest of your life?
I think the society, (in my experience) many professionals and politicians are hypocritical on this topic. One can see that when all people who commit suicide are placed in one category. Like one therapist who called people who commit suicide insane. Therapists are not trained for longterm suicidal people, They are not prepared for that and in my experience often overburdened. There is often this self-defence mechanism they won't allow any discussion on it. But why? Are they afraid about an honest exchange on such an existential question like suicide? I have a guess why most people reject a discussion. There are several reasons for it. Legally they are often forced to give only one answer because assisted suicide is illegal. No matter what their real stance on this ethically complex issue is.
If they see the world this black and white of course there will be no open and honest debate on it. The topic is stigmatized as fuck. In my country there is a majority for liberal assisted suicide laws. Though the elites impose their will on the people. Against the democratic desire for it. When people are extremely desperate for something there will of course develop blackmarkets. And if you don't like how the blackmarkets are handled you should ask why the people have this desire in the first place. You have to ask yourself are the current regulations reasonable? Is the discussion nuanced enough or do we put all these people in one category? Because this is basically what most countries do.
Suicide = prohibited, sanctioned and stigmatized
Peaceful and safe means = illegal
If this is your approach you should not wonder why it does not work.
There is a need for an honest debate for this ethically complex issues. There has to be listened to different perspectives. If you go on like that there will be no solution. Ban one forum? Soon the next one will emerge. There will always be people who are extremely desperate and in extreme pain who search a way to leave.
Either you implement reasonable and nuanced laws with regulations that are socially accepted or otherwise there will always be enough support of people who say. Well what do want? Criminalize all suicide people? Put them all into prison? Which is sort of already a thing because all peaceful methods sooner or later become illegal.
Yeah kind of a long thread. Do you have ideas how to prevent suicide? Except the measures I have laid out. Was not sure which sub-forum fits for this thread.
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