Discussion Were you always pro-choice or were you pro-life at one point?

[Worthless_nobody]

Always pro choice. As a child I went into a nursing home frequently to visit relatives and I have never understood why it's unmerciful to let a pet suffer and they get human euthanasia but people? No...they must sit there and suffer. After seeing the immense suffering people in nursing homes go through I became pro choice as a child ehen I learned of euthanasia.

 

[LenkaX]

I was never a pro-lifer. I've subconsciously known, that I will ctb one day, since the age of 10.

 

[Bustedhornet]

I used to enjoy life. Never even thought about being prolife or prochoice. I definitely couldn't understand what would bring someone to kill themselves. But since I've been severely depressed for over a year, along with my dad succeeding in suicide, I find myself here.

 

[Lupgevif]

I was a pro-lifer before being suicidal, and still for some years after deciding I wanted to kill myself. I had hope then. Now I lost it, and I realized I have no right to hold anyone on this life if they don't want to stay themselves.

 

[RottenDeer]

I was pro-choice since I understood what suicide is and why people commit it.

 

[Shades of Grey]

I have pretty much always supported the option of humane euthanasia for those that are terminally ill or dealing with chronic, debilitating, physically painful conditions. It seemed a gross miscarriage of justice to me that it would be considered inhumane (perhaps actionably so) to subject a pet to the things that we regularly force human beings to endure.

I did not become pro-choice in the context of mental illness until I became chronically suicidal myself. I think that when I was younger, I didn't really think much about the fact that mental suffering can be just as unbearable as physical, and that for some people, it doesn't get better. Some people do all the "right" things and still fail to respond favorably to treatment. And quality of life means different things to different people. Someone may be perfectly satisfied with a partial response to treatment, and someone else might find that existence unbearable. Who am I to make that decision for anyone other than myself?

I will say that I've probably been smacked with the "pro-life" label in here because I don't (and will not) encourage suicide. It is a deeply personal choice, and I strongly believe only we can know whether or not it is right for us. It's also a very final one with the potential for terrible repercussions in the event of failure. I will absolutely discourage those expressing doubt (suicide will always be there, but it's forever... if you think you might want to try something else, I believe that you absolutely SHOULD explore that first while the opportunity is still there) or discussing an impulsive, ill-conceived plan likely to result in permanent, life-altering injury ("I have x, y, and z in my house and I'm going to be alone for three hours, what happens if I take them?" NO.)

 

[Squiddy]

I was kinda brainwashed with the idea of "you gotta live on no matter what" some years ago but truth be told, I've been suicidal since I'm a teenager.

Yeah I was also brainwashed with the idea of living and I've been suicidal off and on since 14

 

[ARW3N]

I don't know if I've mentioned this before but every reason for living is also a reason for dying. Pro-lifers will try to encourage some people to live, for example, by telling them they might win the lottery. Most people don't win the lottery which also makes that a reason for dying.

 

[Pho3nix]

I was suicidal as a child so I've never been pro-life. I think it's disgusting how humans are expected to live with agonising conditions while sick pets are lucky enough to get the needle.

 

[FatalSystemError591]

I have always been pro-choice only because the second I learned about death is the same second I wanted to ctb so... I think coming here has only strengthened that pro-choice part of me

 

[stupid little girl]

I was probably pro-life until I wanted to commit suicide. After I became suicidal at 12 I thought that if I wanted to die I should be allowed to. That transcended to anyone should be allowed to. Before wanting to commit suicide I didn't really grasp the concept, but if someone would have told me they wanted to die then I would've told them not to, it's a permanent solution to a temporary problem, etc.

 

[MichaelNomad123]

I have always been pro-choice, but the reasons for that have changed. It was originally as a means of diminished responsibility for me. You can very easily detach yourself from your humanity by simply saying "well it's their choice". I think this is a toxic mindset and unfortunately a little too common in the pro-choice camp.

I am still pro-choice these days, but I feel a responsibility to at least talk to someone about their issues. It's basic compassion. I have spent a lot of time alone in my life and there has been no one to help me. If I can help someone feel like there is a purpose to their life or at very least help them feel less shitty for a time, then I try to do that. I feel obligated to offer that which I did not have. Without our humanity, then we are just animals afterall.

Ultimately, I think that these polar opposites are not so different when you closely examine them. I think that they are just convenient labels for folks to clump to, to explain away their lack of empathy or critical thought. Life is rarely binary like this. It's all mostly just a big shade of grey, despite what these discussions try to claim.

 

[Green Destiny]

Honestly when I was young I didn't think much of the topic Suicide. But somewhere down the line I remember hearing about a lady who had a terrible disease or cancer and moved to Oregon from California so she could die before she suffered too much pain and I thought to myself "I can understand why she's doing this, to spare herself from suffering." It's a mindset I stick to this day, that people should have the right to die when they so choose.

 

[Deafsn0w]

I don't know if I was pro-choice or not before I became suicidal, but I remember thinking how people could be sad for several weeks or even years. I thought depression was normal and temporary. When I became depressed and suicidal, I immediately became pro-choice and tried to find a suicide forum that discuss suicide methods about two weeks before this site existed. Sadly, I ended up buying an impure helium tank.

 

[LastFlowers]

Well I can't remember a time when I wasn't, but who knows. (People tend to be hypocrites.) I was always questioning things and doubting things, I grew up catholic but never really believed in religious concepts anymore than I believed in Santa Claus. The same mindset that lead me to agnostic atheism also lent itself to other things, like the pro-choice argument. I don't think I was always thinking about it in terms of "right to die" or anything, when I was younger it was just me wanting to escape and knowing I should be allowed to do so. That my situation was horribly unfair and torturous. As I got older and actually had people try to stop me and lock me away, I saw that this was a larger issue that many people dealt with and how the anti-suicide movement is truly a systemic atrocity of the ages.

 

[everydayiloveyou]

Always pro-choice, but when I was younger I was a little more in the "only if you're 70+ years old and have a terminal illness" category. I also had more hope that my problems would go away eventually so I felt that mental illnesses should be excluded. I also had (and still have) a concern that bad people could use legal euthanasia as a sort of eugenics measure against people with disabilities, chronic illnesses, and mental illnesses. Of course now I feel differently about a lot of those things.

I don't think the situation is as simple as just letting anyone who wants to die to kill themselves though. There's lots of people of all ages and conditions who are so overwhelmed by their emotions and/or situation that they can make this kind of decision impulsively. That's not to say that everyone who wants to kill themselves is doing it on sheer impulse, but I mean cases like suicidal children and grieving widows, yknow? Or people who are going through a sudden bout of depression, mania, or a physical illness. In those cases, I think it's reasonable to restrict the availability of these sorts of things. Maybe until you can demonstrate that you can make this decision rationally, and that you do not respond to treatment.

I like the Netherlands' model of physician-assisted suicide. A professional evaluates you, determines if you're of sound mind and condition, and then gives you the N to take for yourself. Their model allows psychiatric patients, and patients as young as 12. I guess we will never know who slips through the cracks with that sort of model, but the way I see it, it's better to have those bare minimum restrictions. Once you die, there is no coming back, at all. There's nothing that you can do to reverse a suicide or make it better. So it needs to be done with that in mind. I think those few restrictions would also make it slightly harder for bad actors to take advantage (e.g. a rouge doctor euthanizing patients they dislike, toxic family pushing a sick relative to commit suicide for life insurance money, or a eugenics supporter targeting vulnerable groups of people)

 

[Smashingairwaves]

I used to think suicide was selfish, until I became suicidal at 14.

 

[AbsoluteNothingness]

Pro life? That garbage? Ewww no. Never. And fortunately NEVER WILL. Even reading that word makes me want to vomit lmao. I'll never understand why that sht is a thing in the first place. 'We' didn't ask to be born so we should have the RIGHT to die if I simply just literally DONT want to experience/live/do 'life' no matter how it is etc (my case, and there is no reason at all but well anyways most of 'you' if not all will assume that there are 'reasons' lmao ok) or you actually want to live/experience/do life and explore 'the world' and care about/are interested in things, 'good things' and all that** ((I just don't lmao I simply dont give a shit for me there's nothing "good" nor "bad" nor "exciting"/"interesting" nor "boring" nor "positive" nor "negative", everything is indifferent to me (and why do 'things' have to be 'different' for 'me' lol why is existence and all these things that "I" were 'brought to' and that "i" 'see'/'perceive' and that "I" perceive 'this way' [I dont want to have any perception of anything and I simply just dont want to perceive anything any single way, the question is why do 'I' have to want to? why do I have to and if I don 't iTs bEcAuSe oF a ReAsOn, bEcAusE yOuRe dEpReSsEd aNd aPaThEtIc aNd hAvE lOsT iNtErEsT aNd mOtIvAtIoN aNd Or My LiFe iS 'bAd' aNd 'pAiNfUl' aNd 'hArD' aNd 'sAd' oR 'bOrInG' aNd iM gOiNg tHrOuGh dIfFiCuLtIeS (as if I gave a fcking sht lmao) blab blah blah and all that crap, why? why cant I simply just NOT WANT AT ALL WITHOUT BEING BECAUSE OF A DAMNED REASON? where's the problem of literally just not wanting to exist at all nor experience anything nor be anything nor anyone nor anywhere nor any way? it sucks that this is obligatory. I'll never understand why I cant just want nonexistence.)) **but their lives are painful and they're suffering and dont want to live a 'life like that'/'that way' or I LITERALLY SIMPLY JUST don't want to live life and simply just not care about/are not 'interested' in 'life' nor anything in general (my case, my life isn't 'bad' or whatever the fuck 'bad' means and I'm not suffering in any ways/aspects and I'm not depressed nor anxious nor any other thing , and so what? Why can't I simply just not want to participate in 'life'/'human life' why can't I just not care about 'life' in general no matter what perception I have of it neither how I perceive it and 'the world' and ' planet earth' and things in general, and no matter how 'life' in general/'the world'/'planet earth'/'things' in general are and also no matter what 'life ' is 'all about' neither what/ how "I" can make it be about neither what meaning/concept/definition I can give it. I just dont. I've never had any problems nor issues and no one and nothing is making me "suffer" nor "contro lling my life " and my life is 'good'/'great' (and I don't care, I simply just dont want to have nor live any life of any type, and I don't want to live 'my life' nor 'life' in general i any way, I just don't) or whatever people who care about life, the world, planet earth and things wanna call it and I 'have it all' and I couldn't care any fucking less either. It sucks that just because "i" 'am' inevitable an "I", 'something'/'someone'/ a 'person'/a 'human being'/ an 'entity'/ an 'individual'/ a 'life form '/ a 'living being'/ a 'living creature' or whatever the fuck that is and was forcedly put inside a "human body" and a "brain/mind" (or whatever that is and whatever it's called) and was forcedly/ inevitably/against my will 'created'/'made', 'brought'/'taken' to 'existence'/a 'thing' that's part of a 'planet' called 'earth'. i DON'T say I don't want to live "bEcAusE oF tHe cUrReNt sItUaTiOn/cOrOnAvIruS"/"bEcAusE oF thEsE diFfIcUlT aNd rOuGh tImEs (as if I gave a fucking shit about "coronavirus" or whatever the fuck its name is ,as if I gave a shit about things in general lol why is it obligatory to care and want to care about things what the fuck what if I just don't and don't fucking want to for fucks sake.) i dont say I don't want to live life bEcAusE oF a ReAsOn' 'bEcAusE iTs tHiS wAy" its not that "i wAnT tO lIvE thIss wAy/tHiS lIfE/tHiS t YpE oF lIfE wIth thIs aNd tHis wiTh tHiS aNd tHaT hApPeNiNg bUt iF iT wAs dIfFeReNt/dIfFeReNt |aNotHer wAy wItH dIfFeReNt tHinGs aNd oThEr tHinGs hApPEnInG aNotHeR wAy i wOuLd" nor any other sht like that nor literally any other 'reason' at all in general. It's NOT "I want to live life as long as it's 'good' but if it isn't i don't" NOR any other reason at all. There are no reasons at all.
I never asked to exist, in general, wherever the fck is where 'I' exist|am 'brought' to/'couldve existed'|'brought' to neither what 'I' 'exist as'/'couldve existed as' nor what the fck it's what 'i' 'experience'/'can experience' etc, it was the 'decision' of 'others', not 'mine', it was against my will and forcedly/inevitably and 'I' had no choice, but the fact that 'I' 'am' 'here'/'im' a 'person'|'human being' and 'I' 'exist' and was 'brought' 'here' (((had no choice, whether i simply want or simply dont want {that's the case, i simply dont want lol} 'i' was gonna exist /'become'/'be' 'something'/'someone' and 'brought' to 'something'/'existence'/'life'/'human life'/'the world'/'planet earth' blah blah [I dont want to be 'brought' to/'experience' anything whatever/however it is lol] yes or yes because that was the "goal" of two 'human bodies' because they wanted to 'reproduce'/'create' 'another one' lol and 'bring it's to 'life'/'human life'/'existence'/'existence on earth'/'life on earth'/'the world'/'planet earth' or whatever their 'names' are lol))) DOESNT mean i have to be 'here'/'exist and want to be 'here'/'want to exist' and 'do'/'experience'/'live'/'explore'//want to 'do', 'live', 'experience', 'explore' 'life'/'the world'/'planet earth'/'existence' etcetc whatever and that i have to care about/want to care about // be "interested" in/want to be "interested" in // 'like'/'want to like' (I neither "like" nor "dislike"/"hate" anything at all, i just dont care at all and never will and everything will always be indifferent to me. Theres a huge difference.) /'want to be part of'|'participat in' 'life'/'the world'/'planet earth'/'things' from|about 'life', 'the world', 'planet earth' blah blah/'things' in general uNlESs iTs 'bAd' or whatever other "negative"/"bad" 'thing', yes or yes and if i don't iTs bEcAuSe oF a ReAsOn. No. I didnt ask for absolutely anything so dying/not existing should definitely be a BASIC 'RIGHT'. 'i' should leave and disappear and not exist at all if thats what I want (not because im "suffering"/have "bad life"/have "depression" NOR "nihilism" NOR "mental illnesses" NOR "low self-esteem" NOR "disabilities/illnesses" NOR "feeling of 'emptiness' and/or 'hopelessness" NOR literally any other 'thing'/'reason' (or whatever the fuck "empty"/"emptiness" means lol and Im not "hopeless" about anything. forget my "username", i put that username bc I have no way out and i dont think I'll ever have/find one, well i hope I will find one but it's not gonna be anytime soon so.... And anyways, apart from not having any way out, not wanting to 'hurt'/'devastate'/'traumatize' 'my parents'/'my family' is also the 'reason' why I havent ctb yet. also i have a cat (if i 'care' about something it's her, lol. literally nothing else at all and dont want to,never wanted and never will why do i have to lol) and she loves me a lot and will be extremely 'sad' if i leave but im sorry I guess, that 'my parents'/my family' and my 'cat' will be 'sad'/'hurt'/'devastated' and will 'suffer' and cry but that won't make 'me' (and never will lol) want to 'experience'/'live'/'do' 'life'/'the world'/'planet earth' blah blah (In GENERAL, it's not that i dont want to live/do/experience life/the world/planet earth if it's a 'certain'/'particular'/'specific' 'way'/'type of life|the world|planet earth' and if this or that happens and it's NOT that i dont 'like' [I neither 'like' nor 'dislike'/'hate' 'life'/'human life'/'the world'/'planet earth'/'things' nor any other thing in general at all whatever/however it is lol. I don't "dislike"/"hate" anything, i just simply literally DONT CARE.]
it's not that I dont care about/Im not "interested" in/dont want to live|do|experience 'life' blah blah etc iF iTs tHiS oR tHat wAy / iF tHiS oR tHaT hApPeNs blah blah. No. I mean VERY GENERALLY NO MATTER HOW/THE WAY IT IS. 'life' as something 'understood'/'described' as "'something' 'human beings'/'people' and other 'living beings'/'creatures'/'life forms'/'species' although in different 'ways', 'do'/'experience' during their 'transition'/'road'/'path'/'passage'/'existence'/'stay'/'journey' in/through 'existence' in 'existence in general'/'existence in 'planet earth'' and in/through 'the world'/'planet earth' because 'we' were 'brought' to it, since our 'birth' until our 'death'" [and i hope death is eternal nothingness/non-existence lol, I dont want any type of consciousness coming after this one nor in general any type/way of "afterlife" in any form imaginable/unimaginable, just NOTHINGNESS. Im 'sorry' for those who want an 'afterlife' though, lol, this is just what i 'personally' want] in that very generic/general/'objective' way is what i mean when saying that i LITERALLY SIMPLY SERIOUSLY just dont want to 'live'/'experience'/'do'/'enjoy'/'know'/'learn about'/'discover 'life' (nor any other thing), as a/the 'thing' that 'we', 'human beings'/'people' and other 'creatures'/'life forms'/'living beings'/'species' but differently and making it be 'about'/making it 'work' 'other' 'things'/'other' 'ways', 'do'/'experience'/'live' during/in/through 'our' 'lifetime'/'journey' there during 'our' 'passage'/'road'/'step'/'path' 'through' 'the world'/'planet earth'/'existence' or whatever their 'names' are. Thats what i mean, very generally, 'life'/'human life' can 'be'/'be like'/'mean'/'be about'/'work like'/'have' etc many 'things'/many 'ways' and I dont give a fck and it's 'something' 'subjective' and I dont give a shit, and it's not the same 'thing'/same 'way' for 'everyone', that it doesn't have the same 'meaning'/it's not "all about" 'the same' for 'everyone' and that it doesnt 'work' the same for 'everyone' unless we're "talking about" the "life standard"/"'universal'|'fundamental' 'life standard'"/"modern life in a 'common way'" and blah blah, that usually is "the same" for 'everyone' in 'some aspects' like having to pay "bills"/"taxes"/"study"/"work" and blah blah {and i dont give a damn sht lol *the fact that 'modern life' is about "that" is NOT the 'reason' why i dont want to live life. What im saying is that no matter what 'life'/'type of life' it is and how it is/what happens etc, I simply just dont give a damn single shit lol and simply just couldnt care any less and simply just dont want to experience/live/do/be part of/participate in etc it nor literally any other thing whatever and however it is. *It's not because of that nor literally any other reason lol. 'life'/'modern life'/'human life', whatever 'name' you want to give it, can be /mean/be like/be about/work like etcetc whatever whoever wants/whatever it wants or whatever the fuck in general and i couldn't give any less of a sht anyways lol. So it's not because of a 'reason', it's NIT bEcAuSe tHereS tHiS 'tyPe Of Life', depending on "each one's" 'perspective'/'point of view'/'concept' of what/how 'life' 'is'|'isnt'|'can be'/'opinion'/'perception'/'interpretation' of 'it' and 'the world'/'planet earth' and whatever other 'thing' etcetc blah blah and i dont give a sht lol. I dont refer to any 'life' in 'particular'/'specific', to anything "particular"/"specific" when saying i simply JUST DON'T WANT TO 'LIVE'/'DO'/'EXPERIENCE' 'LIFE' and that i simply just don't care about it/dont have any "interest" nor "curiosity" at all about 'it' and never will. I refer to the 'thing' 'life' as VERY VERY GENERIC/GENERAL, no matter how it is/what it is about/how it works/the 'perception' and 'perspective'/'concept'/'meaning'/'definition' 'I'/''you'/whatever 'person' in general can 'have' about it/can 'give' to it blah blah. I dont want to have any "perception" of 'life'/'the world'/'planet earth'/'things' nor literally my other thing in general nor 'perceive' anything in any way at all. I dont have/dont want to have any 'meaning/'concept'/'definition'/'perspective'/'point of view' etcetc about 'life'/'the world'/'planet earth'/'existence in general and 'on earth'' nor literally absolutely anything else in general. It's not because of any reason and Im not reffering to any 'way'/'type'/'kind' of 'life'/'world'/'planet earth'/'thing' in 'particular'/'specific' at all.
I just literally simply dont want to want to live/do/experience etc 'life'/'the world'/'planet earth'/'existence' blah blah, nor literally anything else/anything at all in general whatever/however it is.)

(continuation of 'explanation' of why my 'user' is this one although I'm not "hopeless" abut absolutely anything at all lol, excepting the fact that i have no way out) well, when i was registering the forum I realised that it's gonna be hard as fck to find a method/way out to disappear and finally not be anything/anyone/anywhere at all for all eternity,and that despite aaaaaaall the years that have passed until now i simply just have no way out made me become 'hopeless' or whatever that means lol, about me finding a way out/method suitable for me to ctb, I just hope i will, will have to keep researching..

I've always been pro-choice and will always be. Everyone should be pro-choice. Why make 'existence'/'life' an obligation?

 

[muffin222]

I've always been pro-choice. I believe we're the ultimate masters of our destinies, and that we should have the right to leave this world if we decide to do so. My only hope is that people will exhaust other options first before taking the plunge and treat ctb as a last resort.