Discussion Ungrateful

[StupidLizard]

Hello.

First thread from a (very) long-time lurker.

I'll be straightforward: I'm haunted by the shame of what I am not. Does anyone else feel this way?

In other words, there are many individuals in this world that are born with congenital deformities, and utter poverty.
I am lucky, in a sense. I haven't suffered such. On the contrary, I am much better off from a financial standpoint (not tremendously so, but not complete monetary deprivation. I get by.) than most.
And to my knowledge, I'm healthy. Well, physically. Mentally is questionable.

So I suppose my question is, does anyone feel ashamed they have considered suicide, when they are so much better off than most? It feels like a waste, when so many people strive and would sacrifice so much to be in the condition I am in. Yet, I want to give - no, waste - it all away, by choice. I feel like suicide would be an easier choice, if I was poor and suffering physically. But I'm not.

It also makes it more difficult to explain my problems to others.

 

[Jean Améry]

You seem to think only poverty and extreme medical conditions produce suffering or at least enough to somehow 'justify' suicide. The problem with that is that it's impossible to objectively measure suffering and quantify it so there is no real basis for comparison.

It's a myth that physical suffering is somehow more real, weighs heavier, is more difficult to bear... than the mental variety while it's been shown it registers in the brain in pretty much the same way. If I was schizophrenic and heard uncontrollable voices I would kill myself in a heartbeat: for the life of me I could not endure such horror. If depression is so severe and long-lasting it makes it impossible to lead a good or at least an acceptable life (to one's own standard) in my opinion it makes sense to (want to) die. It's unnatural to be ok with great suffering, especially if it's prolonged and unfixable.

If you think your problem/suffering isn't serious enough to CTB over that's fine. Count yourself lucky. You could try to do something for those whose suffering you rank higher than your own.

I will never be ashamed nor let anyone-else talk me into being ashamed for feeling the way I do nor will I stay alive when I'm sure it's no longer in my best interest merely because I'm not in extreme physical pain nor have to beg in the street.

 

[Deleted member 1768]

You seem to think only poverty and extreme medical conditions produce suffering or at least enough to somehow 'justify' suicide. The problem with that is that it's impossible to objectively measure suffering and quantify it so there is no real basis for comparison.

It's a myth that physical suffering is somehow more real, weighs heavier, is more difficult to bear... than the mental variety while it's been shown it registers in the brain in pretty much the same way. If I was schizophrenic and heard uncontrollable voices I would kill myself in a heartbeat: for the life of me I could not endure such horror. If depression is so severe and long-lasting it makes it impossible to lead a good or at least an acceptable life (to one's own standard) in my opinion it makes sense to (want to) die. It's unnatural to be ok with great suffering, especially if it's prolonged and unfixable.

If you think your problem/suffering isn't serious to CTB over that's fine. Count yourself lucky. You could try to do something for those whose suffering you rank higher than your own.

I will never be ashamed nor let anyone-else talk me into being ashamed for feeling the way I do nor will I stay alive when I'm sure it's no longer in my best interest merely because I'm not in extreme physical pain nor have to beg in the street.

Bravo!!!

 

[Kokobushi_bae26]

I'm in a similar situation but I am very poor. While that isn't a basket of kittens I would legitimately trade an arm or a leg or take some kind of physical disease over the mental issues. I can take pain but suffering is in the mind

 

[Quiet_Sandwich]

Do I feel ashamed? No, because I didn't choose to be this way. It wasn't my choice to become an orphan, it wasn't my choice to be bullied and abused for years. What WAS my choice however was to continue living for the next 20 years, while going through debt and depression with a side dish of severe anxiety, constant insomnia and physical pain.
I've simply reached my limit. I gave it my best shot and it just wasn't enough.

I know there are many others, in an objectively far worse situation, who would consider it a blessing to be in my place instead. If I could switch places with them, I would. Despite my hate for modern society, I did quite enjoy helping others was I was still able to. Making others happy was enough to make me happy as well.

Is it a waste though? I'd say no, not really. My body's a wreck, my brain's a wreck. I've no remarkable skills or abilities either. By this point I think it's safe to say that it is in fact NOT going to get better, if anything, it has been steadily getting worse. It's continuing all of this that would be a waste. A drain on the resources, time and mental strength of those who take care of me.
I've recently realized how much my condition has deteriorated over the years. Even simple things like leaving the house or just ... talking, are beginning to become a challenge. I've decided to go while I still can, before I become so weak and miserable that I'll be only able to wish for death to finally come, stuck in personal hell without a way out.

I've stopped caring about trying to explain this to others. Unless they're also dealing with mental illness, they'll never understand how this feels like. How despite having 3 hot meals a day, my own room, luxuries like a PC and even some disposable income, even getting up from the bed feels like a Sisyphean task and nearly every moment of the day is empty and devoid of purpose, it's just waiting for the clock to move.
Life's not fair and we're not all created equal. Unfortunately, knowing that there's someone out there, living in poverty and missing several limbs yet still trying to find happiness and joy in life, didn't make my burden any easier to carry.

 

[Jean Améry]

Do I feel ashamed? No, because I didn't choose to be this way. It wasn't my choice to become an orphan, it wasn't my choice to be bullied and abused for years. What WAS my choice however was to continue living for the next 20 years, while going through debt and depression with a side dish of severe anxiety, constant insomnia and physical pain.
I've simply reached my limit. I gave it my best shot and it just wasn't enough.

I know there are many others, in an objectively far worse situation, who would consider it a blessing to be in my place instead. If I could switch places with them, I would. Despite my hate for modern society, I did quite enjoy helping others was I was still able to. Making others happy was enough to make me happy as well.

Is it a waste though? I'd say no, not really. My body's a wreck, my brain's a wreck. I've no remarkable skills or abilities either. By this point I think it's safe to say that it is in fact NOT going to get better, if anything, it has been steadily getting worse. It's continuing all of this that would be a waste. A drain on the resources, time and mental strength of those who take care of me.
I've recently realized how much my condition has deteriorated over the years. Even simple things like leaving the house or just ... talking, are beginning to become a challenge. I've decided to go while I still can, before I become so weak and miserable that I'll be only able to wish for death to finally come, stuck in personal hell without a way out.

I've stopped caring about trying to explain this to others. Unless they're also dealing with mental illness, they'll never understand how this feels like. How despite having 3 hot meals a day, my own room, luxuries like a PC and even some disposable income, even getting up from the bed feels like a Sisyphean task and nearly every moment of the day is empty and devoid of purpose, it's just waiting for the clock to move.
Life's not fair and we're not all created equal. Unfortunately, knowing that there's someone out there, living in poverty and missing several limbs yet still trying to find happiness and joy in life, didn't make my burden any easier to carry.

Very well put. I agree fully. Nobody should be made to feel ashamed about this when it isn't their fault. Right now I'm going through a deep depression (I've lost count of how many episodes I had) and it's indeed true that life seems incredibly futile, one ceases to care about anything and it becomes near impossible to summon the willpower to do even the most simple things.

What sucks is that I have to look for another job, I've got medical appointments to keep and I can't study for exams. Oddly work is actually a great distraction but in a month my contract is up. I dread being alone and idle again: it's then the depression becomes the worst.

All of this leads me to think that no matter what I do it'll always come down to this (whichever way one chooses to conceptualize depression it's clear that it's a very recurring phenomenon and in my case it's been on and off for 16 years now so I'm thinking it'll probably be permanent) and I'll always get stuck in the same hell not being able to enjoy and do what I went to enjoy and do. What then is the point of life?

My motivation to hang on was care and love for others but I'm beginning to think it's no use to anyone if I can't be happy and life keeps wearing me down so I might aswell do it and get it over with.

Now I still need to find the energy to do the preparation all the while feeling like I'm all alone in the world. Not even my cat nudging up to me gives me any joy anymore. I saw my nephews today and nada: no feeling at all. It's like I'm dead inside.

 

[Weems]

Yes. I was dealt a great hand in life and played it terribly. Smart kid who didn't study. Good athlete who quit. Handsome boy who was too cowardly to try with girls. Now that I'm about to be 30 I feel utter horror at the gifted youth I wasted.

Ultimately it seems clear that we have no free will and are just working out biological and physical processes. That said, the phrase that captures my life most clearly is "moral corruption." Masturbation is really the symbol of my life. Narcissism, sloth, and self-deception in one. I withdrew from life into fantasy more and more from puberty. Often it was literal masturbation and porn, other times it was movies, books, music. Constant "rape of the senses with art," as Nietzsche said (I'm paraphrasing). I became a passive consumer of sensations. My self, my will, my intent disappeared and I became a weak daydreamer.

And the best days of my life passed. The teens and twenties of a genetic lottery winner--what could be more precious? They only happen once, every second irrevocably turning them into past. And I threw them away. I consciously thought: this opportunity is worthless. This class, this sport, this social opening...&c. The arrogance I displayed is sickening.

 

[Quiet_Sandwich]

Yes. I was dealt a great hand in life and played it terribly. Smart kid who didn't study. Good athlete who quit. Handsome boy who was too cowardly to try with girls. Now that I'm about to be 30 I feel utter horror at the gifted youth I wasted.

It really doesn't help that we're forced to make some of the most important decision while we're simply too stupid to fully comprehend the consequences.
Fueled with hormones and rocked by the changes in our bodies and impressionable brains, we've to choose our path towards future.

Certainly, some mistakes aren't necessarily life ending, some can be fixed, some can be safely ignored, some are there just to teach us a lesson... it still feels an awful lot like rolling a dice. Which impulses will we act upon, what company will we find ourselves in ... that's a lot of things that we're only technically in control of.

 

[dreamsofdestruction]

So I suppose my question is, does anyone feel ashamed they have considered suicide, when they are so much better off than most? It feels like a waste, when so many people strive and would sacrifice so much to be in the condition I am in. Yet, I want to give - no, waste - it all away, by choice. I feel like suicide would be an easier choice, if I was poor and suffering physically. But I'm not.

Yeah, I have that a lot. Someone more worthy could have made a lot more out of the opportunities I had in life. Instead all those resources were wasted on someone who can't even find the will to stay alive.

 

[Deleted member 1768]

I'm in a similar situation but I am very poor. While that isn't a basket of kittens I would legitimately trade an arm or a leg or take some kind of physical disease over the mental issues. I can take pain but suffering is in the mind

Suffering is also in the body, and produces mental suffering. My 2 greatest wishes: no separation of body and mind, and the recognition that humans are animals just like all the rest of the critters on the planet.

 

[Extremly kind <3]

Hello.

First thread from a (very) long-time lurker.

I'll be straightforward: I'm haunted by the shame of what I am not. Does anyone else feel this way?

In other words, there are many individuals in this world that are born with congenital deformities, and utter poverty.
I am lucky, in a sense. I haven't suffered such. On the contrary, I am much better off from a financial standpoint (not tremendously so, but not complete monetary deprivation. I get by.) than most.
And to my knowledge, I'm healthy. Well, physically. Mentally is questionable.

So I suppose my question is, does anyone feel ashamed they have considered suicide, when they are so much better off than most? It feels like a waste, when so many people strive and would sacrifice so much to be in the condition I am in. Yet, I want to give - no, waste - it all away, by choice. I feel like suicide would be an easier choice, if I was poor and suffering physically. But I'm not.

It also makes it more difficult to explain my problems to others.

People who were born poor got used to it same applies to the people born with disabilities, the problem is when a rich person becomes poor and when a normal person becomes disabled, the brain keeps dwelling on making the suffering worse !!!

 

[Deleted member 1768]

People who were born poor got used to it same applies to the people born with disabilities, the problem is when a rich person becomes poor and when a normal person becomes disabled, the brain keeps dwelling on making the suffering worse !!!

It is a form of grief. When something dies away from your life you grieve. Any kind of sudden change that seriously alters your life produces grief. The brain only dwells on the issues until acceptance comes. Then you can move forward. All things must be accepted before change can take place. Passionate denial of the situation is 'fear'. Acceptance leads the way to doing what can be done to continue living as close to your old self as possible.

 

[Extremly kind <3]

It is a form of grief. When something dies away from your life you grieve. Any kind of sudden change that seriously alters your life produces grief. The brain only dwells on the issues until acceptance comes. Then you can move forward. All things must be accepted before change can take place. Passionate denial of the situation is 'fear'. Acceptance leads the way to doing what can be done to continue living as close to your old self as possible.

I agree with your statment above, but there are situations where there is no light at the end of the tunnel, sudden unfortunate events takes place leaving you with no hope of recovery or progressing forward !

 

[Deleted member 1768]

I agree with your statment above, but there are situations where there is no light at the end of the tunnel, sudden unfortunate events takes place leaving you with no hope of recovery or progressing forward !

Have to agree on that one Kind. I am in that position myself right now. But, in my view, suicide can and is an acceptable alternative, and with acceptance comes planning, research, and shopping. So...with even a modicum of luck, success.