Trying to get the nature of this forum..about suicide or psychiatry bashing??

[Mtnwildflowers]

The fact that forced treatment is found in other parts of medicine doesn't negate criticism of the practice within psychiatric medicine. You're not comparing apples to apples when you say someone in a coma was kept alive versus someone who wants to commit suicide has their rights taken away by the state and is institutionalized. If anything, you're supportive that forced treatments are often damaging. People are making clear here that there are circumstances of personal violation unique to mental health services, and there are many other issues in mental health services that are completely unrelated to the rest of medicine.

I was medicated for many years in my youth and hands down I know many doctors are not straightforward about side effects and potentially life altering long-term damage. I worked in pharmacy for many years and I know medical professionals are generally dismissive of side effect concerns. So we need to become doctors to be patients and know all the potential harm that could happen? They need to be held accountable. Medical professionals need to take responsibility for patient outcomes. It's part of their duty. They deserve valid criticism. If they gave proper warning and the patient consented that is one thing, if they were dismissive or even forceful with their approach then that can be a problem.

I don't think you're pro-life. You seem to have stated you support assisted suicide for the mentally ill. You are sensitive to criticism against the healthcare profession. Maybe that bias comes from your time working in healthcare.

I am presenting views from both sides and that seems to be rubbing people the wrong way. But in order to learn we have to accept there are things we don't know on both sides of issues. If people here just want to be all negative about psychiatry, then I respect that's where they are at. I don't deny atrocities happening. if anything, I'm just adding to the point that these atrocities are happening across all medical specialities. I realize that may come across as like I'm diminishing that atrocities are happening in psychiatry.

I don't just support assisted suicide for the mentally ill, I'd like it as soon as possible.

You don't need to apologize. I have learned in my short time here that we learn from each other and get different perspectives from having these discussions. You're probably confused of the forum because of the way this place is perceived in the media. When I came, I was under the same impression as you. I thought I would only see posts of people ready to go and how to go. But, it's a really loving community here. Some people want to recover or are not ready to go yet. Here, people can vent about how life has done them wrong, people can ask questions about religion and the afterlife, and a lot of the members here have become really close friends. If you want, you could start a thread about people who do not hate the field of psychiatry and have a discussion with like minded people. I do not hate the field, per say, but I do think it needs to be revisited in how doctors operate. Two doctors' mistakes have ruined my life...

Thank you for that information. That is helpful. That was what this post was originally meant to be for. Answers like that. Not turn into people thinking I'm pro psychiatry

 

[InezSerrano]

"But I almost want to leave this forum because of the users who reply with posts referring to "all" psychiatrists as torturers or murderers or being tortured by treatments."
I've never seen anyone do this.

 

[noaccount]

@InezSerrano - Westie is referring to a post I made about the psychiatric violence many of us have gone through, and is misdescribing it badly. You can see my post earlier on this thread for details.

 

[Somber]

I don't just support assisted suicide for the mentally ill, I'd like it as soon as possible.

- Are psychiatrists, psychologists with a license to prescribe medication or is it a different field altogether (aka, can you work as a psychologist as well)?
- How do you determine if somebody is suffering from a mental illness?

Can we please not chase off the psychiatrist, pls.

 

[Snake of Eden]

I realize that may come across as like I'm diminishing that atrocities are happening in psychiatry.

Yes it did really come across that way. People have no voice in the real world to complain about a whole systemic issues and you are right. It is not just psychiatry but it is more palpable with invisible ailments when people are almost never given the benefit of the doubt and being listened to carefully to help figure out what is wrong with them. Your stance on criticizing people speaking up about failures of psychiatry and possible crimes committed by it , comes off as dismissive and jarring tbh. Not trying to be rude to you but maybe being more sensitive to people and validating their concerns is a better way of handling such matters even when you dont agree with what they have to say

 

[InezSerrano]

@InezSerrano - Westie is referring to a post I made about the psychiatric violence many of us have gone through, and is misdescribing it badly. You can see my post earlier on this thread for details.

Ah, sorry, I am not here often. I may have misread OP as saying this is an attitude present in the vast majority of discussions when in fact they were only talking about a specific thread.

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

As I said you are free to seek the information you find useful. We do not tolerate anti-choice rhetoric here. Your propensity to be pro psychiatry is odd. add to that you only disclosed being a health care professional later which sounded suspicious thats all.

My propensity is only to always accept all perspectives. I can present a unique one. If this forum only accepts anti psychiatry views, then you are right, I'm in the wrong place as I'm open to trying to understand both sides. Didn't realize this was an anti psychiatry forum. I thought it was a forum about suicide.

I disclosed my profession to give honest context. To share experience. How many people out here are disclosing their professions right away? I'd be curious to know.. please share

 

[demuic]

I think what's most interesting is you were "promised no harm". if someone really did that, you should have questioned them right there. There are no Medications or interventions like ect for example in psych that will cause no harm. There will be some side effects of varying degree. That's an obvious lie from the beginning from that individual, and I would have said no and asked others if possible . I have permanent brain damage from ect as well . So you are preaching to the choir about life changing effects. I have memory and cognitive deficits that are permanent. Permanent Tardive dyskinesia. You name it I probably had or have the side effect. But I signed informed consent for my treatment and have to take responsibility for that. I signed up for my side effects because the alternative was shooting myself in the head. I understand people who didn't research treatments ahead of time or understand their consents or even as some people claim on here were "forced" into treatments. That's frustrating. We are all frustrated. But I take responsibility for the treatment choices I've made

This is victim blaming. Many people have no reason to question the psychiatric or medical institution until something bad happens to them, when it is already to late. Over and over again people are told to trust doctors, physicians, psychiatrists, saying that they know what's best and a layman can never know what is the right or wrong treatment for himself. You can see this over and over in the midst of the pandemic, the experts are always right and any doubts anyone may have about whether a treatment will be beneficial for them is always wrong or ill informed. This is no "informed consent," that is what the medical industry tells themselves to wipe their hands of responsibility of any wrongdoing for ruining the lives of people who trusted them to help them.

No institution is sacred or free from criticism. I see the dismissal of the suffering that people have gone through in order to prop up an industry which is rife with corruption. You can see the field as being sometimes beneficial to certain people without brushing under the rug the huge problems that exist.

This site is also not just a place where people sign up to die. This forum is many things and it is what the users make of it. Much discussion comes from what leads people to take want to take their lives and yes, psychiatry and the bad experiences with it are a huge part of that. To ignore that is to be willfully ignorant.

You are free to criticize people's viewpoints just as others are free to criticize yours.

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

Yes it did really come across that way. People have no voice in the real world to complain about a whole systemic issues and you are right. It is not just psychiatry but it is more palpable with invisible ailments when people are almost never given the benefit of the doubt and being listened to carefully to help figure out what is wrong with them. Your stance on criticizing people speaking up about failures of psychiatry and possible crimes committed by it , comes off as dismissive and jarring tbh. Not trying to be rude to you but maybe being more sensitive to people and validating their concerns is a better way of handling such matters even when you dont agree with what they have to say

My original post was just about people calling psy

- Are psychiatrists, psychologists with a license to prescribe medication or is it a different field altogether (aka, can you work as a psychologist as well)?
- How do you determine if somebody is suffering from a mental illness?

Can we please not chase off the psychiatrist, pls.

i don't work in psychiatry so I have no idea those specifics. They can prescribe medication so I would assume they could prescribe whatever they give for euthanasia. I k ke it's something they've done in Europe

 

[Snake of Eden]

My propensity is only to always accept all perspectives. I can present a unique one. If this forum only accepts anti psychiatry views, then you are right, I'm in the wrong place as I'm open to trying to understand both sides. Didn't realize this was an anti psychiatry forum. I thought it was a forum about suicide.

I disclosed my profession to give honest context. To share experience. How many people out here are disclosing their professions right away? I'd be curious to know.. please share

Nobody has attempted to silence you when they point out where you maybe wrong about certain things. Yes the general sentiment is not favourable one for psychiatry but we are not anti-psychiatry. When you started the thread you said everyone here speaks of psychiatrists as torturers and murderers when you were actually seen only one comment that referenced actual documented cases of criminal acts done in the name of psychiatry yet you purported that as the general sentiment here. You have every right to say what you like to say as long as you follow the forum guidelines and we are here to make sure of that/

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

This is victim blaming. Many people have no reason to question the psychiatric or medical institution until something bad happens to them, when it is already to late. Over and over again people are told to trust doctors, physicians, psychiatrists, saying that they know what's best and a layman can never know what is the right or wrong treatment for himself. You can see this over and over in the midst of the pandemic, the experts are always right and any doubts anyone may have about whether a treatment will be beneficial for them is always wrong or ill informed. This is no "informed consent," that is what the medical industry tells themselves to wipe their hands of responsibility of any wrongdoing for ruining the lives of people who trusted them to help them.

No institution is sacred or free from criticism. I see the dismissal of the suffering that people have gone through in order to prop up an industry which is rife with corruption. You can see the field as being sometimes beneficial to certain people without brushing under the rug the huge problems that exist.

This site is also not just a place where people sign up to die. This forum is many things and it is what the users make of it. Much discussion comes from what leads people to take want to take their lives and yes, psychiatry and the bad experiences with it are a huge part of that. To ignore that is to be willfully ignorant.

You are free to criticize people's viewpoints just as others are free to criticize yours.

So you are saying i shouldn't be blaming myself for all the permanent deficits I have

 

[noaccount]

Well, they're not criminal acts per se, they're legal state-sanctioned assaults. ("INCITE! Women Of Color Against Violence" has some of the best analysis on and activism around state-sanctioned assault that I've seen, if this is something anyone wants to know more about.) But yeah.

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

Nobody has attempted to silence you when they point out where you maybe wrong about certain things. Yes the general sentiment is not favourable one for psychiatry but we are not anti-psychiatry. When you started the thread you said everyone here speaks of psychiatrists as torturers and murderers when you were actually seen only one comment that referenced actual documented cases of criminal acts done in the name of psychiatry yet you purported that as the general sentiment here. You have every right to say what you like to say as long as you follow the forum guidelines and we are here to make sure of that/

How do you know what I've browsed through? Is that something you can see? What I'm clicking on? If so, that's creepy. I just posed a question to gather the nature of the forum. Now I'm being accused of plenty of things that are so far from the truth because I've been deemed pro psychiatry and "pro life".

 

[Feeding Pigeons]

But I almost want to leave this forum because of the users who reply with posts referring to "all" psychiatrists as torturers or murderers or being tortured by treatments. I don't think most of my providers had Ill will against me.

I did therapy for 8 years, I dealt with about 7 psychiatrists. I don't think they're torturers or murderers, but I think they're scumbags, and I stand by that. I have nothing else to go on but my experiences, and in my experiences, they're scumbags.

And I'm not going to soften it with the "but not all" shit, its always "but not all", people just add that to sound like they're being unbiased.

Once again by the way, another person that joins and immediately comes out of the gate debating everyone.

 

[NeverReallyHere]

The reason people bash mental health professionals on this forum is the same reason people bash cops or lawyers or politicians elsewhere. It doesn't mean these are necessarily bad or uncaring individuals - most of them are not. It's just indicative of wider systemic issues which have failed or harmed an awful lot of people.

 

[Snake of Eden]

How do you know what I've browsed through? Is that something you can see? What I'm clicking on? If so, that's creepy. I just posed a question to gather the nature of the forum. Now I'm being accused of plenty of things that are so far from the truth because I've been deemed pro psychiatry and "pro life".

Yes as a mod I am able to View what you browsed but that is not something I done here as it would be unethical for me to use knowledge about you to try and "own" the debate. I am simply pointing out the fact that there is only one occurrence where someone @noaccount in this case posted documented cases about psychiatry being implicated in torture, murder and unconsented treatements. Being prolife or propsychiatry isnt grounds to get banned here being anti-choice is which is sometimes referred to as prolife but is meant for anti choice crowd. Like I said you are free to be here and express your views just like everyone is allowed to criticize your posting in respectful manner in accordance to our guidlines

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

My original post was just about people calling psy

i don't work in psychiatry so I have no idea those specifics. They can prescribe medication so I would assume they could prescribe whatever they give for euthanasia. I k ke it's something they've done in Europe

My post wasn't criticizing people speaking up. My post was asking what the nature of this forum was. Suicide or bashing psychiatry. It's a fair question if I find bashing psychiatry effects me negatively because it does nothing to
Help my suicidal thoughts. Bashing psychiatry won't make me feel less suicidal. If that helps others, great. Can't say it's a coping mechanism that works for me

Yes as a mod I am able to View what you browsed but that is not something I done here as it would be unethical for me to use knowledge about you to try and "own" the debate. I am simply pointing out the fact that there is only one occurrence where someone @noaccount in this case posted documented cases about psychiatry being implicated in torture, murder and unconsented treatements. Being prolife or propsychiatry isnt grounds to get banned here being anti-choice is which is sometimes referred to as prolife but is meant for anti choice crowd. Like I said you are free to be here and express your views just like everyone is allowed to criticize your posting in respectful manner in accordance to our guidlines

Yes I stated at the beginning of the post that I was new here and just trying to get a feel for what the forum was. I've exhausted too many years of my life getting mad at psychiatry. It's not helpful to me. It sure as hell isn't going to change my suicidal thoughts. That's great if it's helpful to others.

 

[Somber]

i don't work in psychiatry so I have no idea those specifics. They can prescribe medication so I would assume they could prescribe whatever they give for euthanasia. I k ke it's something they've done in Europe

Hmm, I must have misinterpreted something, but I still can't find exactly what branch of healthcare you work in. Do you work at intensive care? I hear a lot of medical professionals are having a difficult time due to pressure and COVID patients dying.

 

[Feeding Pigeons]

My propensity is only to always accept all perspectives. I can present a unique one. If this forum only accepts anti psychiatry views, then you are right, I'm in the wrong place as I'm open to trying to understand both sides. Didn't realize this was an anti psychiatry forum. I thought it was a forum about suicide.

I disclosed my profession to give honest context. To share experience. How many people out here are disclosing their professions right away? I'd be curious to know.. please share

Theres the door.

 

[Snake of Eden]

My post wasn't criticizing people speaking up. My post was asking what the nature of this forum was. Suicide or bashing psychiatry. It's a fair question if I find bashing psychiatry effects me negatively because it does nothing to
Help my suicidal thoughts. Bashing psychiatry won't make me feel less suicidal. If that helps others, great. Can't say it's a coping mechanism that works for me

This forum is many things but it is primarily a community of people who are suicidal because they cant find acceptance and meaningful help anywhere else. You looked at one posting and decided that we are anti psychiatry forum who consider them all torturers and murderers. That doesnt sound like a balanced take and rightfully you will get backlash for calling us so

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

This forum is many things but it is primarily a community of people who are suicidal because they cant find acceptance and meaningful help anywhere else. You looked at one posting and decided that we are anti psychiatry forum who consider them all torturers and murderers. That doesnt sound like a balanced take and rightfully you will get backlash for calling us so

And I stated that I was new and hadn't been on the forum long. How is asking a question making an accusation? That's a very defensive response to an open question being asked. It's a question that I'm open to whatever the answer may be. I didn't accuse anyone of anything. I brought the question up to jus get general answers.. no accusation there.

Hmm, I must have misinterpreted something, but I still can't find exactly what branch of healthcare you work in. Do you work at intensive care? I hear a lot of medical professionals are having a difficult time due to pressure and COVID patients dying.

Well I'm being accused of working in psychiatry so maybe that's why you got that impression

 

[lostautist]

If this forum only accepts anti psychiatry views, then you are right, I'm in the wrong place as I'm open to trying to understand both sides. Didn't realize this was an anti psychiatry forum.

You took one post out of context and now you're making blanket statements about the forum in general. This is unfair to say the least. Just participate in what interests you and click past that which doesn't.

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

Theres the door.

Why please elaborate

You took one post out of context and now you're making blanket statements about the forum in general. This is unfair to say the least.

No I raised an open question to get peoples view points. Are you not open to explaining your viewpoint in an open way? This is a very defensive stance to a question that I made no assumptions to what the answers would be

 

[Somber]

People can be very argumentative and suspicious of others I've noticed. Apparently if you joined after december you are suspected of being an anti choicer by definition. It's not true for everyone, and it's not true for the others all the time either, but there are certain topics that trigger people easily. If I don't agree with something, I tend to roll my eyes and let it slide.

 

[Samsal112]

I encourage you to stay with this site. I am not sure what posts you have been looking at, but other than this post, I have not seen anyone bashing psychiatrists. We're on a message board, so it is possible we have all misinterpreted one another. I read the post as you defending the field and wondering why bashing of the profession was allowed on this site. You're saying that you wanted to get a feel for the site. This site is a lot of things. Methods are discussed here as well as recovery, venting, stories, and off topic discussions. I saw that you are creeped out by the Mods, but you shouldn't be. Zeroornothing has been nothing but helpful to the members here and he often adds a lot to the discussion of threads. If you are looking for recovery, which it sounds like you are, then you should browse the recovery section. Good luck to you, and I hope you decide to stay!

 

[Feeding Pigeons]

Why please elaborate

No. I believe you came here in bad faith, I don't believe you came here to try and understand things, you took one post that was against psychiatry and took up the banner for them. The reason why places like this exist is because psychiatry is primarily about pushing pills and making profits. Do I think there might be decent people out there that're psychiatrists? Sure. Just as I'm sure there are diamonds in other complete shitpiles too.

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

I did therapy for 8 years, I dealt with about 7 psychiatrists. I don't think they're torturers or murderers, but I think they're scumbags, and I stand by that. I have nothing else to go on but my experiences, and in my experiences, they're scumbags.

And I'm not going to soften it with the "but not all" shit, its always "but not all", people just add that to sound like they're being unbiased.

Once again by the way, another person that joins and immediately comes out of the gate debating everyone.

Well if you read the post the whole reason I was posing the question was to see if the forum was for me so if people respond, of course I'm going to answer..it's my post. But thanks for the blanket statement

 

[Foresight]

Man, am I the only one who's like what in the world? I don't even know.

 

[Mtnwildflowers]

I encourage you to stay with this site. I am not sure what posts you have been looking at, but other than this post, I have not seen anyone bashing psychiatrists. We're on a message board, so it is possible we have all misinterpreted one another. I read the post as you defending the field and wondering why bashing of the profession was allowed on this site. You're saying that you wanted to get a feel for the site. This site is a lot of things. Methods are discussed here as well as recovery, venting, stories, and off topic discussions. I saw that you are creeped out by the Mods, but you shouldn't be. Zeroornothing has been nothing but helpful to the members here and he often adds a lot to the discussion of threads. If you are looking for recovery, which it sounds like you are, then you should browse the recovery section. Good luck to you, and I hope you decide to stay!

I think everyone should be able to share their opinions about doctors meds and treatments. I thought the theme was suicide. Was really posing the question just to get a feel for the community and what it was all about. But then got so many defensive responses that took aim at making accusations about me when I meant no criticism to anyone.

No. I believe you came here in bad faith, I don't believe you came here to try and understand things, you took one post that was against psychiatry and took up the banner for them. The reason why places like this exist is because psychiatry is primarily about pushing pills and making profits. Do I think there might be decent people out there that're psychiatrists? Sure. Just as I'm sure there are diamonds in other complete shitpiles too.

Well then you are wrong. I didn't come here to talk about psychiatry. I came to find a better method to commit suicide

 

[Feeding Pigeons]

I get the field has some bad history.

Yeah thanks for the understatement.

Well if you read the post the whole reason I was posing the question was to see if the forum was for me so if people respond, of course I'm going to answer..it's my post. But thanks for the blanket statement

Youre wondering whats with the antipsychiatry rhetoric, I'm giving you a fucking answer. I've had nothing but a train of bad experiences with them.