It's referred to as a suicide substance. The mysteriousness behind it has piqued my curiosity. Apparently, it's not SN. Anyone have any ideas what it means? The state is currently persecuting seven people in connection to the sale of this toxic powder, as it's referred to. It's said to be extremely fatal and even a tiny bit of it can result in death. Is it really not SN or are they just saying it to deter people from obtaining it? One suspect, a senior citizen in his 80s, is said to have distributed it at least 640 times. The main suspect had been handed a 3,5 year sentence last year. The group of seven are being treated as a criminal organization, seeking to aid suicide, which is apparently punishable by law.
Pluto
Meowing to go out
- Dec 27, 2020
- 4,100
No. It's sn
They say it's a meat preservative
Sn
They say it's a meat preservative
There seems to be some disagreement. Some sources imply it's SN (like the Reuters link you posted), others claim it's sodium azide.
Thanks for answering, everyone. The reason I asked is because of the Dutch article on Wikipedia, which says (I will add a translation below):
"Middel X is de geanonimiseerde benaming van een aantal giftige stoffen, die worden toegepast in de chemische industrie, onder andere als conserveermiddel en desinfectans. De stof wordt gezien als mogelijk middel voor humane zelfdoding."
"Volgens Nitschke is Middel X geen natriumnitriet, maar een andere giftige stof.[24] Nitschke propageert gebruik van Middel X voor mensen die geen toegang hebben tot het middel dat zijn voorkeur heeft, pentobarbital."
("Substance X is an anonymized name of a number of toxic substances, that are applied in the chemical industry, as preservatives and desinfectans amongst other things. The substance is seen as a potential way to commit suicide.")
("According to Nitschke, Substance X is not SN, but another toxic substance. Nitschze is a proponent of using Substance X for people that don't have access to the substance of his preference, pentobarbital.")
Basically, it's being denied that it's SN, hence my question. The Wikipedia article does speak of adverse affects that are common in those that take SN. Perhaps this Nitschke fellow is either a) mistaken, b) purposely misleading others or c) right.
Tesha
Life too shall pass
- May 31, 2020
- 911
justcallmeJ
<3
- Nov 9, 2023
- 408
I think they are misleading, what else can it be. There is also no other real answer of what it might be, it also has most of the same effects as SN i think
Fading flower
Member
- Apr 26, 2022
- 10
The infamous 'Substance X' is said to be NATRIUM AZIDE (NaN3) by the people in the Netherlands who discovered it after doing some lengthy research. Wikipedia lists NaN3 as Sodium Azide (not sure is this is an intentional misdirect?) However the pro-suicide group behind its use as an end-of-life option (as a suicide powder) clearly identify it as NATRIUM AZIDE. NaN3 is a colourless or white crystalline salt with diverse medicinal and industrial applications. As a suicide powder, it distribution could potentially result in the deaths of more than 600 people in the Netherlands (there is currently a court case for its 'illegal' distribution). Not all NaN3 deaths are considered peaceful or without pain and some reported its use as neither gentle nor humane ..
The Dutch pro-suicide group searched a long time for a substance they could get their hands on legally and easily, with the end goal being to slowly distribute information and awareness about using it as an end-of-life option. This became the infamous 'Substance X'. It is a chemical used specifically to preserve food but also to inflate things in the car and airline industry (think air-bags and aeroplane escape chutes). It is highly reactive to metal. You could potentially blow yourself up with it, but the pro-suicide group behind it suggests to take it orally with water. They say its the most humane way they could find to terminate a life, although some individuals witnessing suicides using product X definitely think otherwise. Some deaths were not at all peaceful. Seven members of this group currently stand accused of distributing it illegally. If found guilty, they could go to prison and one of them is over 8o years of age. All they did was stand up for what they fundamentally believed in ..
The Dutch pro-suicide group searched a long time for a substance they could get their hands on legally and easily, with the end goal being to slowly distribute information and awareness about using it as an end-of-life option. This became the infamous 'Substance X'. It is a chemical used specifically to preserve food but also to inflate things in the car and airline industry (think air-bags and aeroplane escape chutes). It is highly reactive to metal. You could potentially blow yourself up with it, but the pro-suicide group behind it suggests to take it orally with water. They say its the most humane way they could find to terminate a life, although some individuals witnessing suicides using product X definitely think otherwise. Some deaths were not at all peaceful. Seven members of this group currently stand accused of distributing it illegally. If found guilty, they could go to prison and one of them is over 8o years of age. All they did was stand up for what they fundamentally believed in ..
Last edited:
EyesOfNight
the night will be eternal
- Feb 2, 2024
- 371
It's not misleading. Na is Sodium in english. Some languages have the name Natrium or a variation of it. I believe the element has been named after the german name Natron or Natrium (I don't remember) and that's why it's chemical symbol is Na.
verrobasd
Member
- Feb 24, 2024
- 37
The problem is also that most of the media don't really know the difference between sodium azide and sodium nitrite that well. Most of the articles I've read about 'middel X' are about a substance that kills in 2 grams and has no antidote. Which means sodium azide instead of sodium nitrite.
From everything I've read I'd have to say all the main distributors in the Netherlands, at least the ones who were prosecuted, were mainly selling SA instead of SN. Because of the dosage but mainly because of the lethality. People who purchased from those sellers, took it and changed their mind could not be saved when ending up in the OR. Success rate seems way too high for middel X to be SN.
I've found a 2023 court ruling. The ruling includes a description of substance/middel X and substance/middel Y. The court describes that middel X revents oxygen from being absorbed by the red blood cells, causing the brain cells and muscle cells to die and that there is no antidote for. So this is clearly SA instead of SN. The description of middel Y clearly fits that of Sodium Nitrite.
It was proven that suspect provided help to ten people who died by suicide. The verdict says nine out of ten took middel X and only one used middel Y. Suspect stated in court he mainly sold middel X. There was much more demand for it, because there is no antidote and the lower fatal dosage so peope could easily take capsules.
This is what surprised me when I started reading on this website. In the Netherlands SA is just way more of a preferred method than SN. It was also my preferred method, now it's SN. But without SS I would definitely have ordered SA. Maybe I would've taken it already, because SA requires much less preperation to get it right. With what I know now, I'm pretty sure never to make an impulsive suicide attempt with SN.
From everything I've read I'd have to say all the main distributors in the Netherlands, at least the ones who were prosecuted, were mainly selling SA instead of SN. Because of the dosage but mainly because of the lethality. People who purchased from those sellers, took it and changed their mind could not be saved when ending up in the OR. Success rate seems way too high for middel X to be SN.
I've found a 2023 court ruling. The ruling includes a description of substance/middel X and substance/middel Y. The court describes that middel X revents oxygen from being absorbed by the red blood cells, causing the brain cells and muscle cells to die and that there is no antidote for. So this is clearly SA instead of SN. The description of middel Y clearly fits that of Sodium Nitrite.
It was proven that suspect provided help to ten people who died by suicide. The verdict says nine out of ten took middel X and only one used middel Y. Suspect stated in court he mainly sold middel X. There was much more demand for it, because there is no antidote and the lower fatal dosage so peope could easily take capsules.
This is what surprised me when I started reading on this website. In the Netherlands SA is just way more of a preferred method than SN. It was also my preferred method, now it's SN. But without SS I would definitely have ordered SA. Maybe I would've taken it already, because SA requires much less preperation to get it right. With what I know now, I'm pretty sure never to make an impulsive suicide attempt with SN.
Last edited:
Fading flower
Member
- Apr 26, 2022
- 10
I find it very interesting that Philip Nitschke (Exit International) calls this substance (almost) as deadly as cynanide. There is so much media hype about this substance, but no sources willing to name it directly in the newspapers or online articles. This leaves people guessing about what it could be, which doesn't help make things safer for serious seekers of solutions ..
The main reason this substance seems to works as a 'suicide powder' seems to be the following : Substance X causes a strong reduction in blood pressure in all cases. The direct result is often that people pass out or collapse. "The mechanism of action of Substance X has not yet been fully unravelled, but it is clear that the agent blocks cell respiration," says toxicologist Antoinette van Riel of the NVIC poison centre. "Cells need oxygen for their energy balance, but drug X blocks this process", she says. Cells suffocate, as it were. Some tissues can go without oxygen for a while, but vital organs, such as the heart or brain, cannot. The brain is very sensitive to oxygen deprivation. The feeling of tightness may explain why some people panic (from scientific literature)
The reported side effects of Substance X vary from 'none' to severe headache, foaming at the mouth, panic, dizziness, shortness of breath, vomiting, cramps, seizures and cardiac arrhythmias.
The main reason this substance seems to works as a 'suicide powder' seems to be the following : Substance X causes a strong reduction in blood pressure in all cases. The direct result is often that people pass out or collapse. "The mechanism of action of Substance X has not yet been fully unravelled, but it is clear that the agent blocks cell respiration," says toxicologist Antoinette van Riel of the NVIC poison centre. "Cells need oxygen for their energy balance, but drug X blocks this process", she says. Cells suffocate, as it were. Some tissues can go without oxygen for a while, but vital organs, such as the heart or brain, cannot. The brain is very sensitive to oxygen deprivation. The feeling of tightness may explain why some people panic (from scientific literature)
The reported side effects of Substance X vary from 'none' to severe headache, foaming at the mouth, panic, dizziness, shortness of breath, vomiting, cramps, seizures and cardiac arrhythmias.
Last edited:
