Should Russians take collective guilt and full responsibility for Putin's warcrime?

[summers]

What war crimes? You've been watching too much western media fakenews.War is war, dead man is just a dead man. I am of Russian descent and I am ashamed of this war but there is no good and bad side. I hope the war ends soon and Russia be the winner. Fuck the Nazis of maidan and azov!

So let me ask, how many Ukrainian people do you know personally? I know 6 (who all live in the Ukraine), who I speak to daily. The media is telling the truth. Those Russian pieces of shit are raping and torturing women, children, and babies.

So to answer the OP's question; maybe not the whole Russian populace, but the soldiers, government, and civilian supporters of this invasion are all to blame. And Russia is going to be fubar economically for decades because of this bullshit.

Honestly, I'm just hoping one missile misses and lands in a NATO country, because that will bring this entire conflict to a swift and decisive end. And mark my words, Xi will stab Putin and Russia in the back when NATO allows him to control enough of the oil to make China at least semi-oil independent.

No. As soon as you justify blaming the citizens of a country for something their government does, Pandora's box is opened. It's ludicrous and dichotomous thinking. Imagine how many people don't want anything to do with politics and just want to live their life earning a living and providing for their family?

Governments should work for their people and do what their people want. It's not the other way around. I fully admit the US fucked up with Iraq, and we should have stood up to Bush and said no.

 

[GrumpyFrog]

Ordinary people that aren't running around wrapped in "Z"s and do not rejoice at the deaths of other ordinary people are not to blame for anything. I am deeply sorry for all the Russian (and Belorussian) people that do not appreciate the horrible political system they are living in and do not want to support it and I'm deeply sorry that they have to be judged for what their bloodthirsty leader does and that they suffer from the consequences of sanctions intended to make aforementioned leader financially incapable of setting the whole world on fire (I hope at least some people understand this, sanctions aren't there to make average Russians suffer, they are there to limit the capability of Russian army to obtain more weapons, there is unfortunately no better way to achieve it without hurting innocents, it's a lesser of two evils). I have nothing but compassion for every Russian that didn't want this but has to suffer the consequences, and I'm a Ukrainian that just recently lost a dear friend, an innocent civilian, to this war. Some people here do hate all Russians and while I do not believe that is right you've got to understand that seeing immense suffering and loss of the people you love burns out human souls and makes them incapable of feeling anything but hatred and fear. I hope everyone whose soul was affected by this war, as well as any other ones, anyone who lost their loved ones, can one day be healed and experience peace inside themselves.

 

[motel rooms]

Ordinary people that aren't running around wrapped in "Z"s and do not rejoice at the deaths of other ordinary people are not to blame for anything. I am deeply sorry for all the Russian (and Belorussian) people that do not appreciate the horrible political system they are living in and do not want to support it and I'm deeply sorry that they have to be judged for what their bloodthirsty leader does and that they suffer from the consequences of sanctions intended to make aforementioned leader financially incapable of setting the whole world on fire (I hope at least some people understand this, sanctions aren't there to make average Russians suffer, they are there to limit the capability of Russian army to obtain more weapons, there is unfortunately no better way to achieve it without hurting innocents, it's a lesser of two evils). I have nothing but compassion for every Russian that didn't want this but has to suffer the consequences, and I'm a Ukrainian that just recently lost a dear friend, an innocent civilian, to this war. Some people here do hate all Russians and while I do not believe that is right you've got to understand that seeing immense suffering and loss of the people you love burns out human souls and makes them incapable of feeling anything but hatred and fear. I hope everyone whose soul was affected by this war, as well as any other ones, anyone who lost their loved ones, can one day be healed and experience peace inside themselves.

I'm relieved you're back & I'm so sorry for your loss, Nessie.

I hope you read Nessie's post, @Capsicum_Corral.

 

[Famous Last Words]

A good YouTube channel that I can't remember the name of but I think the persons name is Roman, I'm not sure but theyve been sharing the Russian view.

Roman's channel is great. He's had to move to Georgia so he can continue with YouTube videos as YT is blocked in Russia now.

He just made a video addressing this question - whether Russians support the Special Military Operation



Another channel that gives an ordinary Russian perspective is https://www.youtube.com/c/LETTERSTOKING/videos

He's currently out of the country for "work purposes" so he's able to continue making videos.

 

[Insomniac]

I mortified at the fact that this is even a question.

and the answer is yes, obviously. a single human cannot start a war you know. It takes a country to start a war.

not just Russia. If we lived in a normal world, everyone should feel responsible for something this serious. Everyone would feel obligated to mobilize and do something.

but we live in a world where most people are irresponsible and disconnected from one another.

 

[Istanbulite]

Of course. They are in this together.

 

[SuicidallyCurious]

Every American who pays taxes is guilty of genocide against the Iraqi people since they are complicit in financing the military

I apply the same standard to the Russians.

Looks like the whole world is just one big genocide at this point a genocide of all against all due to global warming

 

[Istanbulite]

The response by Russia signals that Ukraine actually sank the Moskva: in the past two days, they've used their depleted stocks of Kalibr PGMs.

 

[SuicidallyCurious]

Of course. They are in this together.

Russian version of lynndie England and Charles Graner

 

[Lost Magic]

The Russians who I respect the most are the ones who speak out against Putin's war crimes. Even though they face jail and maybe even death, they stood up for what is right anyway. The rest are just too scared or brainwashed to do anything. Dictatorship states are the worst.

 

[Weebster]

No that's silly. Everyone is responsible for their own sin.

 

[Istanbulite]

 

[UndoUndoUndo]

Germany took it, but there was no internet back then to scrutinize their leader.
Russians could, but there's state propaganda. It's hard to say.

 

[My_name_is_Luka]

Every American who pays taxes is guilty of genocide against the Iraqi people since they are complicit in financing the military

I apply the same standard to the Russians.

Looks like the whole world is just one big genocide at this point a genocide of all against all due to global warming

wrong. This is not about paying taxes to a country that fuels wars.

I strongly invite you to talk with russian people on their forums; then you will see the amount of hot headed people in that nation.
I've been talking with grandmothers and told them about the children being killed; their answer was "let them cry. No one did cry for the losses in 8 years in Donbas".
I've never seen so many americans exhibiting symbols in the style of the worst extremist ideologies; or images that spread xenophobia on a neighboring country. Most of those behaviors are discouraged in Europe and America; but they are encouraged in Russia.

Many Russians are guilty as hell, threatening whoever tries to talk to them and dissuade them from the idea that their country is being righteous and the whole world is corrupted.

The ones that still have a human conscience are feeling guilty and they are in shock, as much as european people are in shock for being unable to save those human lives. We are neighbors, they are suffering a few hundred kilometers from us, but we are unable to save them.
Anyone with a human soul would feel crushed and would accept that there will be consequences.

 

[SuicidallyCurious]

wrong. This is not about paying taxes to a country that fuels wars.

I strongly invite you to talk with russian people on their forums; then you will see the amount of hot headed people in that nation.
I've been talking with grandmothers and told them about the children being killed; their answer was "let them cry. No one did cry for the losses in 8 years in Donbas".
I've never seen so many americans exhibiting symbols in the style of the worst extremist ideologies; or images that spread xenophobia on a neighboring country. Most of those behaviors are discourages in Europe and America; but they are encouraged in Russia.

Many Russians are guilty as hell, threatening whoever tries to talk to them and dissuade them from the idea that their country is being righteous and the whole world is corrupted.

The ones that still have a human conscience are feeling guilty and they are in shock, as much as european people are in shock for being unable to save those human lives. We are neighbors, they are suffering a few hundred kilometers from us, but we are unable to save them.
Anyone with a human soul would feel crushed and would accept that there will be consequences.

One reason to delay CTB would be to see a hypothetical future putin death or cancer diagnosis . When I learn top global pols have cancer I laugh with glee

 

[My_name_is_Luka]

One reason to delay CTB would be to see a hypothetical future putin death or cancer diagnosis . When I learn top global pols have cancer I laugh with glee

yes, that's my wish too. Or to use my energies for a worthy cause, as bringing the truth and the images of the tragedies to as many disbelievers as possible

 

[SuicidallyCurious]

yes, that's my wish too. Or to use my energies for a worthy cause, as bringing the truth and the images of the tragedies to as many disbelievers as possible

If someone gave me access to an explosive jacket or backpack I would gladly detonate a Russian embassy .

 

[Istanbulite]

The weaponry and kit NATO have supplied has been helpful so far but it will not turn the tide.

We absolutely need to supply Ukraine with whatever heavy weaponry they need.

The argument against it in case it angers Russia is nonsensical, we are already supplying weaponry killing their soldiers.

It needs to be done with unity and agreement throughout NATO and quickly because time is running out for Ukraine. And after Ukraine, who will be next?

All of Europe has appeased or ran scared of Putin for years, we need to exert authority now.

 

[GentleJerk]

I wouldn't even give people an opportunity to answer 'yes' to this question by asking it, personally.

 

[Istanbulite]

Ukrainian advisor to the mayor of Mariupol Petro Andryushenko claimed that DNR head Denis Pushilin opened an office of the United Russia party in Mariupol on April 15. This action likely indicates that the DNR is preparing to begin governing Mariupol (or what remains of it) soon. Andryushenko further claimed that Russian "filtration" measures are reaching a crescendo in Mariupol and that the Russians have announced a complete lockdown of the city on Monday, April 18, to allow them to complete the "filtration" process. The Battle of Mariupol and the fight in Donbas generally have cost the Russians and proxies dearly, however. Social media confirmed that the funeral of the deputy commander of the Russian 8th Combined Arms Army, Major General Vladimir Petrovich Frolov, was held on April 16.

 

[PreussenBlueJay]

No. Don't feel bad about any of this. We are all alone as far as responsibility. A human being living in Russia is no more to blame than a human being living in Buenos Aires or Dublin. If someone gives you any guff, say you're sorry and don't mean it and all is well if they spare you.

 

[antoniamonroe]

No.

 

[T90-Alpha]

Nope.
EVERY SINGLE COUNTRY HAS COMMITTED WAR CRIMES.
America, NATO, China, Vietnam, Serbia, Soviet Russia, Iraq, Afghanistan, North Korea, Ukraine, Israel, UK, Ireland, Germany, and Nazi Germany are just some of the countries that have commited war crimes
Nobody should suffer because of war crimes commited by their own country

 

[tiredplant777]

I don't think I'm super informed about this, but my impression is that the Russian people are also at the mercy of Putin. These things can be complex though.

 

[FractalTears]

@FractalTears why was your previous user name (apparently) "@fixthe26"?

It was too provocative:/

 

[Fml]

Personally, I don't think Russian civilians should take responsibility or feel guilty for the actions of a psychopath. Yes, the majority of you wanted him to lead your country but none of you could have known back then what he was going to do in the future. If you all had the power to other throw him then you simply would but as we've all seen that power has been taken away from you, you can't even speak out against him without being arrested. Do not blame yourselves for any of this as it is all out of your hands. I really feel for all of you and I hope that he won't be in power any longer and that you can have a more humane president in control of your country. Much love.

 

[My_name_is_Luka]

Personally, I don't think Russian civilians should take responsibility or feel guilty for the actions of a psychopath. Yes, the majority of you wanted him to lead your country but none of you could have known back then what he was going to do in the future. If you all had the power to other throw him then you simply would but as we've all seen that power has been taken away from you, you can't even speak out against him without being arrested. Do not blame yourselves for any of this as it is all out of your hands. I really feel for all of you and I hope that he won't be in power any longer and that you can have a more humane president in control of your country. Much love.

not all. But I could should you that in Russia there is a good group of people with extreme ideologies, extremely nationalistic and aggressive toward specific groups of people.
You could have a look at this, for example:

video

She is a Russian teacher in Sweden; she insulted heavily a young ukrainian woman, publicly, in the streets.
She was tearing down the ukrainian flags from the russian embassy and kicking them in the street. The girl took a photo and the RuZZian started with the insults.
She got immediately fired permanently from her job. Hopefully she will get her name recorded at the civil court and she won't be allowed to get an European Visa ever again.

Such people have to learn that their disrespect have no place in Europe.
I'm sorry for the open minded and tolerant russian people that their country is being insulted so badly because of these psychopaths.

 

[indigomoon]

The Russians as a whole should not be blamed for Putin's actions. I feel that most Russian citizens have no say in what their government does. They are just there and are forced to put up with the BS.

 

[xxxbmw]

I think every one know the answer to this every individual should be accountable for their own actions etc… you know the answer

 

[Not_A_Seagull]

Lmao no