Should LGBT persons have a right to ctb due to their orientation?

[Szinuus]

The science says its unchangeable, so in my opinion persons, who do have unwanted same-sex attraction, should have the right to ctb, even if homosexuality is not a disorder. It is unwanted trait for them that leads them to deep suffering.

 

[wantittoendsoon]

Yes, it would be a shame nut You have every right to go if you want to.

 

[spinningship]

I think everyone should have the right to die when they want. A lot of the shame about being same sex attracted comes from society. I imagine if you were somewhere like Qatar or Iran it would be awful to be lgbt just because you could never express your love for others. I think in more accepting societies like the UK or US you'd probably benefit a lot from some type of therapy to work through why you feel shame. There's nothing inherently shameful about being gay.

 

[ChocoholicSawako]

如果这样，所有有理由证明自己遭受痛苦的人都可以合理合法获得协助CTB的支持，是否有可能造成大量欠考虑的死亡/放弃生命/自杀的冲动性决定？
我保持此提议有待考虑的立场。
当然，自我性的自杀受到理解和保护，所有因任何原因而受苦而逝去的生命应当得到尊重和理解。
此网站非仅英语论坛，如果我没记错。希望任何语言/形式的线程/发帖亦得到支持和接受。

 

[SamTam33]

There are many unwanted traits that lead to deep suffering. I'd put people with deformities and degenerative diseases at the top of the list.

But ultimately, everyone should be granted the right to die for whatever reason or no reason at all.

 

[Rational man]

You could postulate the same.argument with heterosexuals. It is humankind that opposes samesex, gender -fluid people in many countries. More tragic is the imposition of the omnipresent god as judge. In my eyes love is love and god is a tragic human invention. Take ❤

 

[FuneralCry]

I believe that no matter what the right to die is a basic human right, and voluntarily leaving this world doesn't need to be justified with reasons, none of us are obligated to stay here a second longer than we wish to. I certainly believe that we all deserve the option of a peaceful way to exit this existence after so unfairly and selfishly being brought here into this horrific world in the first place.

 

[myownpetvirus]

Probably but I don't understand why someone would ctb over than unless they live in a country that makes it very difficult to live a productive life in any capacity as an LGBT person. Though I do understand trans people wanting to ctb as gender dysphoria is extremely unpleasant and the options for recovery are faulty and often times don't work in making the person look how they want

 

[Szinuus]

Probably but I don't understand why someone would ctb over than unless they live in a country that makes it very difficult to live a productive life in any capacity as an LGBT person. Though I do understand trans people wanting to ctb as gender dysphoria is extremely unpleasant and the options for recovery are faulty and often times don't work in making the person look how they want

Someone may want traditional family or having biological children or just want to be like the majority of society.

 

[myownpetvirus]

Someone may want traditional family or having biological children or just want to be like the majority of society.

Why though

 

[Forever Sleep]

I'm not that bigger fan of gatekeeping suicide for ANY reason. I'd hope that help is available to ALL people who want it. I'd hope that everyone thinks deeply about the decision and isn't doing it impulsively. I do struggle a bit when it's children (even though I was a suicidal child.)

Still- if WHATEVER cause in someone's life has got them to the point where they would rather be dead than alive- who the hell has the right to say their reasons aren't good enough? It's like saying- I don't want you to feel pain when I hit your thumb with this hammer. That person IS feeling what they're feeling.

How they then act on it is something else. It's going to depend on their own coping mechanisms, the support around them, their will to live. Again though- that's something they themselves will have to decide upon.

 

[Szinuus]

Why though

Just because. Not everyone would like the gay style of life.

 

[myownpetvirus]

Just because. Not everyone would like the gay style of life.

Sure if you want to overpopulate the earth and pretend you're doing something good and have a wife you never want to fuck sure I guess you can blast yourself. Do you I guess lol. Is that your thought?

 

[odradek]

I would rather live in a society that is accepting of or at least more tolerant of people's orientation and gender identity, rather than continuing to produce people who are conditioned to hate themselves by our bigoted society. But I might be unbelievably naive hoping for that day to ever come...

 

[Szinuus]

Sure if you want to overpopulate the earth and pretend you're doing something good and have a wife you never want to fuck sure I guess you can blast yourself. Do you I guess lol. Is that n

Not everyone is an antinatalist. When someone wishes to have a traditional family and cant, its their reason for suffering here.

I would rather live in a society that is accepting of or at least more tolerant of people's orientation and gender identity, rather than continuing to produce people who are conditioned to hate themselves by our bigoted society. But I might be unbelievably naive hoping for that day to ever come...

There was a case from SS forum about some person after early transition and their failed surgeries that lead them to ctb. Not always society is a problem.

 

[myownpetvirus]

Not everyone is an antinatalist. When someone wishes to have a traditional family and cant, its their reason for suffering here.

There was a case from SS forum about some person after early transition and their failed surgeries that lead them to ctb. Not always society is a problem.

Why not adopt though?

 

[odradek]

There was a case from SS forum about some person after early transition and their failed surgeries that lead them to ctb. Not always society is a problem.

I don't understand how that's not society's problem. If someone is questioning, living in a society without fear of discrimination and bigotry, they could explore their identity more safely and find themselves. Maybe the anecdote you're referencing would not have happened.

 

[Szinuus]

Why not adopt though?

There might be no option in their country for homosexuals or someone just want to have biological child. There are many couples who struggle with it for a years and yet still not decide for adoption.

I don't understand how that's not society's problem. If someone is questioning, living in a society without fear of discrimination and bigotry, they could explore their identity more safely and find themselves. Maybe the anecdote you're referencing would not have happened.

How come discrimination and bigotry lead to the failed trans surgeries and too early transition procedures? These are performed in countries where acceptance towards it is very high.

 

[odradek]

How come discrimination and bigotry lead to the failed trans surgeries and too early transition procedures? These are performed in countries where acceptance towards it is very high.

I don't know what you mean by "failed trans surgeries" and detransitions (not sure if this is the right term) are incredibly rare and are the exception.

I'm not trans but I would say even in countries where acceptance is high, the discrimination is still there, it just filters to work or housing discrimination or any other way to keep the marginalized down.

If the options are state sanctioned suicide or working towards a more tolerant society, I would choose the latter every time.

 

[MrShino]

Science doesn't say it's unchangeable, modern media influenced by some minority organizations with political agendas do, however. Not judging anyone's natural inclinations, just saying that I strongly believe it can be changed if you truly want that.

When that is said, as for one not in the situation, I do not see why it would be so important that you would consider suicide for it. It's just an attraction, our bodies and feelings gives us alot of impulses on a regular basis, we do not need to validate or express them if we do not want. Say you are a married man and still feel attraction for other women, this is probably in many cases 'unwanted', but still just a natural encounter. You cannot help it, but you do not have to listen to it and do what the inclinations tell you if you don't want.

 

[Szinuus]

I don't know what you mean by "failed trans surgeries" and detransitions (not sure if this is the right term) are incredibly rare and are the exception.

I'm not trans but I would say even in countries where acceptance is high, the discrimination is still there, it just filters to work or housing discrimination or any other way to keep the marginalized down.

If the options are state sanctioned suicide or working towards a more tolerant society, I would choose the latter every time.

Many people here struggle because of society. Thats why every human being should have the option to leave.

 

[maybemaybemaybe]

I mean yes, I think anyone should have the right to CTB for any reason as long as they're of sound mind to make the decision and they're sure it's what they want. But as a queer and trans person myself, it makes me really sad that so many of us die for that reason. I think it's usually more due to the stigma, including internalized stigma that makes people think there's something wrong with them when there really isn't. IMO, this includes reasons like not wanting "the lifestyle" or wanting to be like everyone else.

With the issue of wanting biological children, most LGBT people are capable of having biological children, sometimes through sperm donation or surrogacy. Trans people who get bottom surgery can bank sperm or eggs beforehand if it's important to them to have biological children in the future.

And yes, gender dysphoria can be absolutely brutal, but most (though not all) sources of dysphoria can be mitigated through various forms of social or medical transitioning. I really believe that the vast majority of trans people can mitigate our dysphoria to the point where it doesn't make us miserable if we have access to what we need, like therapy if we need it, hormones/surgery if we want them, things like makeup or binders etc. I hear so many trans people wanting to CTB for reasons like "if I haven't started hormones already at my age I'll never be able to pass," which is not true in most cases, and there's no way to be sure unless you try.

It's sad that our society is so homophobic and transphobic, and that it causes so many people to lose support from their families and communities. It sucks that discrimination in employment, housing, and healthcare are so rampant that a lot of people just can't get into a better situation, like moving to a more accepting area or getting what they need to alleviate their dysphoria. It's fucking terrifying that so many states are introducing anti-trans bills just to make our lives harder and to vilify us as some kind of abomination that women and children need to be "protected" from.

I hope someday there will be a world where people don't want to CTB just because of their orientation or gender because being queer or trans is just considered a natural variation of being human, and our communities will accept and support us and make sure we have access to whatever medical care we need without years-long waiting lists.

 

[odradek]

Many people here struggle because of society. Thats why every human being should have the option to leave.

I never denied people here struggle nor did I say there should be no right to die.

 

[Szinuus]

I just think that there will be never an ideal society, where every human being accepts LGBT people. If this is someone's reason to die, because, for example, someone is more sensitive to comments or bad starings, that person shouldnt suffer here because of someone's beliefs.

 

[odradek]

I just think that there will be never an ideal society, where every human being accepts LGBT people. If this is someone's reason to die, because, for example, someone is more sensitive to comments or bad starings, that person shouldnt suffer here because of someone's beliefs.

I never meant to imply that they should, apologies. A pessimistic outlook on progress towards a more tolerant world is warranted tho. I would still hold on to my naive hopes rather then agree to allowing someone to choose MAID based solely on their orientation. That notion is incredibly tragic to me. But I understand the desire and ultimately it wouldn't be my choice. So yeah... Idk what else to say.

 

[BroodingBleu]

I would say I can empathize with this point of view to a degree, although I have other reasons for my yearn to CTB. Mine stims less from my orientation and more in regards to my transition. It is absolutely the worst thing that I could imagine having to deal with [in my own life] and I hate everything about it and wish every single day I didn't feel this way as I know my life would be so much better otherwise. As for orientation, I come from a place where its relatively more respected than other places, but I can also understand the desire not to feel that way.

In my own mind, I just hate the societal requirement to have to put labels on absolutely everything rather than just let people love who they love and shit. Its one of the things our kind has regressed since earlier times in our history.

 

[WorthlessTrash]

Sure if you want to overpopulate the earth and pretend you're doing something good and have a wife you never want to fuck sure I guess you can blast yourself. Do you I guess lol. Is that your thought?

(Not that this user will see my reply)

Not every heterosexual couple will have kids, so overpopulating earth is a bad argument.

 

[LunaXCBN]

I don't think it should matter.
I see no reason for it to matter.

 

[CTB Fella]

Everyone should have a right to CTB.

/discussion