rational suicides

[mimiopo22]

do rational suicides really exist for you? and if they exist, why don't people see them as rational anyway?

 

[Nymph]

Most ppl just see suicides as a negative thing and they don't care if it's rational or irrational. I do think rational suicides exist, you give recovery a chance, it doesn't work and you just feel hopeless and want to end it.

ppl just don't understand that a suicide is not negative and that it's an escape from suffering, it's freeing. They don't get it, they don't want to lose you and are selfish

 

[Maka hiamoe]

Yes. I think if more people knew how to listen without getting overwhelmed by their own emotions, they would realize plenty of people have completely understandable reasons to want to die.

 

[KleinerWolf]

I'm not sure.

I think that there's always hope available somewhere,
it just couldn't quite reach them in time and the physical/emotional suffering appears so drastic that people a unable to wait and see.

It's also hard for people to relate to one another on a precise level,
since we are experiencing our own realities.

For someone who's probably gonna commit suicide, I still think that it's best to be alive but at one point maybe things are bad and people just decide they had enough..

 

[StringPuppet]

All suicides are rational. You're just choosing a quick death over a prolonged one.

 

[mimiopo22]

All suicides are rational. You're just choosing a quick death over a prolonged one.

there is a reason why i want to do this, but sometimes i think i am doing normal happy me a favor too to avoid life problems

 

[DrWh033]

Of course there are rational suicides that are not related to mental health issues. Terminal illnesses, illnesses that take over control of your life and diminish any pleasure from life are such examples. I am talking about stuff that are not treatable and are being managed by a palliative mentality focused on "hang on in there'". There are also honorable suicides where the victim feels the obligation to take their lives instead of becoming a burden.
Yes suicide can be reasonable. There are several good books about this subject.

 

[yive]

All suicides are rational. You're just choosing a quick death over a prolonged one.

exactly. and... for me, death [non-existence] is preferable to life

 

[demuic]

there is a reason why i want to do this, but sometimes i think i am doing normal happy me a favor too to avoid life problems

I don't see anything wrong with wanting to avoid life problems.

 

[Deleted member 94]

All suicides are rational. You're just choosing a quick death over a prolonged one.

That's what euthanasia clinics were designed for, they are there to hasten death for the terminally ill. Unfortunately mental illness isn't considered terminal.

 

[yive]

I don't see anything wrong with wanting to avoid life problems.

i think it's smart to want to avoid problems and pointless suffering, and it's stupid to remain in slavery and suffer

 

[mimiopo22]

È per questo che sono state progettate le cliniche di eutanasia, sono lì per accelerare la morte dei malati terminali. Purtroppo la malattia mentale non è considerata terminale.

they would begin to consider it if there was someone who knew it thoroughly.

 

[awfullife]

I don't see anything wrong with wanting to avoid life problems.

It's a unique situation that will never resolve. Family members and loved ones want us to stay around because they love us.
We don't want to exist because each and every day is a struggle and we are tired of it. The shame of the self killing is the pisser. It brings intense shame to the survivors which is bullshit because there are usually several contributing factors which got us to CTB zone and none of those are shamed.

 

[SmellyRat]

why don't people see them as rational anyway?

Cause humans are naturally very prejudiced against death, and fear it so they go into cognitive dissonance.

 

[yive]

after all, the only reason people [parents, friends, government etc.] want you to stay here is because they need you as a slave and they want to exploit you, even if you suffer unbearably

 

[Deleted member 94]

after all, the only reason people [parents, friends, government etc.] want you to stay here is because they need you as a slave and they want to exploit you, even if you suffer unbearably

When I attempted my mother gave out to me, she said she would never get over losing me if I had succeeded. Doesn't sound selfish she genuinely cared for me and tried her best to ensure that I could be comfortable in life.

 

[http-410]

Yes.

Just look at the people who receive euthanasia for physical or (rarely) mental reasons and the bureaucratic ordeal they're put trough. I doubt that euthanasia would be granted without a rational basis.

Also many people on SS plan their suicide very rationally. Before I discovered SS I didn't realize there was much planning involved.

Nevertheless, I don't rule out people commit suicide less rational/impulsively.

 

[mimiopo22]

Yes.

Just look at the people who receive euthanasia for physical or (rarely) mental reasons and the bureaucratic ordeal they're put trough. I doubt that euthanasia would be granted without a rational basis.

Also many people on SS plan their suicide very rationally. Before I discovered SS I didn't realize there was much planning involved.

Nevertheless, I don't rule out people commit suicide less rational/impulsively.

I quote fully, there are irrational suicides considered rational by the victim

 

[livefreeorpeace]

That's what euthanasia clinics were designed for, they are there to hasten death for the terminally ill. Unfortunately mental illness isn't considered terminal.

Unfortunately indeed.

 

[http-410]

there are irrational suicides considered rational by the victim

Which types of suicides do you mean?

 

[DrWh033]

Define reasonable. If by reasonable you mean defended by objective logical arguments that weigh living Vs non living then yes some ppl suicide without any sign of unreasonable mental disease. People with physical terminal illnesses and chronic pain refractory to treatment.
Of course someone can argue that even being depressed counts as a reasonable cause. You might be handsome, rich, healthy,intelligent, successful, social etc and still commit suicide because life gives no pleasure any more. I do not know how to answer to that. Maybe that is reasonable too but in that case I think responsibility Vs people that depend on you comes first. If you have no protected members to support then I guess ctb is reasonable in that case too. Who am I to tell someone to enjoy life when there is no pleasure left. However there may be cures for mental illness we don't know yet.

 

[mimiopo22]

Which types of suicides do you mean?

those of people with unsolved problems acting on impulse.

 

[sweater]

I feel as if most suicides are rational?
none of us asked to be born and put on this earth in the various situations that we see ourselves in. I see choosing to opt out of this life that we were given without consent a rational idea, IMO.
I feel that it is only illegal to do so because the capitalist society we lives in needs our labor and our consumption to keep the cycle going.

 

[http-410]

Looking more closely, perhaps it's also a philosophical question of what "rational" and less "rational"/impulsively mean. Someone who ends their life ends their life - for whatever reason. For them, the reason is probably legitimate. To outsiders, perhaps not. Is it irrational for someone to end themselves because they have just been abandoned by their partner? I cannot answer this question.

 

[DrWh033]

I feel as if most suicides are rational?
none of us asked to be born and put on this earth in the various situations that we see ourselves in. I see choosing to opt out of this life that we were given without consent a rational idea, IMO.
I feel that it is only illegal to do so because the capitalist society we lives in needs our labor and our consumption to keep the cycle going.

I do not think that suicides were any less common in non capitalistic societies. I won't ctb to make a political statement about the exploitation of labour and accumulation of wealth by the few. Yes life is not fair in that regard but it never was, and in fact it was far worse.

 

[Deleted member 94]

I do not think that suicides were any less common in non capitalistic societies. I won't ctb to make a political statement about the exploitation of labour and accumulation of wealth by the few. Yes life is not fair in that regard but it never was, and in fact it was far worse.

People commit suicide for variety of reasons, in Japan and India failing college exams is the death knell for some students.

 

[Misanthrope]

If I set you on fire besides a swimming pool and you jump into it... How irrational of you! Have you ever tried enjoying a good book a film and time with friends and family whilst on fire? I am sure being on fire is not remotely distracting or undermines the experience. If I poke you with a pointy stick I am sure you will move away from the pointy stick. If you tell yourself hard enough that a pointy stick is not a pointy stick then I am sure it won't be so pointy. Life is full of pointy sticks and things that can set you on fire. If you poke a cat with a pointy stick and it runs away how very irrational of it. Medicate that cat immediately! Who knew escaping pain was so irrational it's almost like we have bodies and brains structured around the concept of moving out of and away from pain.

The problem isn't if it is rational or irrational. The problem is the failure to remove causes of pain in the first place. If a person cannot remove that source of pain then it seems rational to me to escape it. It won't be viewed that way though because psychiatry dominates the discussion who frame suicide as a symptom of mental disorder. So there is little in the way of study on rational suicide. So no proper discussion is really had. So little ground is gained on humane responses to pain and the desire to escape it. Even less effort is made to reduce causes of pain when it comes to societies role in it. Instead it is often individualised and made out to be you at fault for not being okay with being on fire. The truth of this is mirrored when people then imply you just are not trying hard enough or not appreciating the wonder of existence or point out people who are on worse fire than you. Bit hard to appreciate much when on fire, it's just an invisible fire and so our true needs become invisible too. What is rarely realised is the fight to keep going on whilst on fire, especially when avenues to put out that fire have been exhausted. I am tired of being on fire and having to pretend otherwise. Seems rational to me to want to put myself out.

 

[mimiopo22]

If I set you on fire besides a swimming pool and you jump into it... How irrational of you! Have you ever tried enjoying a good book a film and time with friends and family whilst on fire? I am sure being on fire is not remotely distracting or undermines the experience. If I poke you with a pointy stick I am sure you will move away from the pointy stick. If you tell yourself hard enough that a pointy stick is not a pointy stick then I am sure it won't be so pointy. Life is full of pointy sticks and things that can set you on fire. If you poke a cat with a pointy stick and it runs away how very irrational of it. Medicate that cat immediately! Who knew escaping pain was so irrational it's almost like we have bodies and brains structured around the concept of moving out of and away from pain.

The problem isn't if it is rational or irrational. The problem is the failure to remove causes of pain in the first place. If a person cannot remove that source of pain then it seems rational to me to escape it. It won't be viewed that way though because psychiatry dominates the discussion who frame suicide as a symptom of mental disorder. So there is little in the way of study on rational suicide. So no proper discussion is really had. So little ground is gained on humane responses to pain and the desire to escape it. Even less effort is made to reduce causes of pain when it comes to societies role in it. Instead it is often individualised and made out to be you at fault for not being okay with being on fire. The truth of this is mirrored when people then imply you just are not trying hard enough or not appreciating the wonder of existence or point out people who are on worse fire than you. Bit hard to appreciate much when on fire, it's just an invisible fire and so our true needs become invisible too. What is rarely realised is the fight to keep going on whilst on fire, especially when avenues to put out that fire have been exhausted. I am tired of being on fire and having to pretend otherwise. Seems rational to me to want to put myself out.

i loved this answer, thank you so much

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

It's irrational to want to be old. But most people are brainwashed into wanting to grow old. It's rational for me to kill myself before i become old and imobile and need to be turned by nursing aides every 2 hours so i don't develop bed sores. Screw that life is hell when i'm young and healthy. i can't imagine being old when i'm a blob of wrinkles and pain.

 

[yive]

It's irrational to want to be old. But most people are brainwashed into wanting to grow old. It's rational for me to kill myself before i become old and imobile and need to be turned by nursing aides every 2 hours so i don't develop bed sores. Screw that life is hell when i'm young and healthy can't imagine being old when i'm a mass of wrinkles and pain.

you're right! being an old man is disgusting... so much really POINTLESS suffering :(
tbh, i don't know why many people dream about longevity so much. it's a nightmare