Nitrogen gas execution of Kenneth Eugene Smith sees him "shake and writhe on the gurney, sometimes pulling against the restraints

[G50]

The inert gas method is considered to be a peaceful and instant way to go, but when Kenneth Eugene Smith made history today as the first prisoner executed using nitrogen gas, newspapers reported that:

The execution took about 22 minutes, and Smith appeared to remain conscious for several minutes. For at least two minutes, he appeared to shake and writhe on the gurney, sometimes pulling against the restraints. That was followed by several minutes of heavy breathing, until breathing was no longer perceptible.

This does not sound like a peaceful or instant death.

 

[BornToFail]

Seeing this made me angry.

 

[iusedtobehappy]

The inert gas method is considered to be a peaceful and instant way to go, but when Kenneth Eugene Smith made history today as the first prisoner executed using nitrogen gas, newspapers reported that:


This does not sound like a peaceful or instant death.

This was exactly what I was trying to say earlier. We don't know without seeing it. Now we know and it makes me very sad

 

[G50]

Seeing this made me angry.

Prisoners facing execution should be treated humanely, and that only means one thing: they should be killed using the barbiturate pentobarbital (Nembutal), which is considered the Rolls Royce method of terminating one's life, and is used by Dignitas in Switzerland.

But the pharmaceutical company Lundbeck Inc that manufactures pentobarbital opposes the use of this drug for executions, and so will not provide pentobarbital to state executioners. This then means that prisoners have to endure less humane methods of execution.

So a pretty dumb move by Lundbeck Inc.

 

[UKscotty]

I think it's misleading by the media again.

Of course the body will writher and thrash, its dying. Will be the same with any method that is not instant.

The main thing is he was smiling and unconscious, they should have focused on that.

The only true 'peaceful' methods if you don't want things like that are probably jumping or guns, which take you out in milliseconds.

 

[Meditation guide]

A reporter who has witnessed five executions said it was by far the most violent one he has seen. He said the prisoner appeared to be holding his breath at first as long as he could, and when he did take a breath writhed and shook violently. He said he shook his head back and forth violently. Then his breathing slowed and eventually stopped.

The U.N. human rights office said the method could cause pain and suffering because Alabama would not be sedating Smith for the execution.

The death penalty has been in less use recently in the U.S. Many horribly botched executions have accelerated its disuse. Some states are bringing back the use of firing squads.

In America, electric chairs replaced hanging as the execution method of choice in the late 1800s, but eventually were no longer used due to the gruesome sight of men often catching on fire.

Lethal injection was then used, often in the middle of the night to avoid as much publicity as possible. Drug manufacturers increasingly banned the use of their drugs in executions. States became secretive about their exact protocols.

Dr. Philip Nitschke, who has made a career of advocating for assisted suicide, and says he has witnessed over 50 deaths from nitrogen, said that using a mask was a problem that would cause distress and pain. Alabama had used a mask over the prisoner's face.

I hope anyone considering using nitrogen as a ctb method reads this.

 

[MBG]

The inert gas method is considered to be a peaceful and instant way to go, but when Kenneth Eugene Smith made history today as the first prisoner executed using nitrogen gas, newspapers reported that:


This does not sound like a peaceful or instant death.Yh

The inert gas method is considered to be a peaceful and instant way to go, but when Kenneth Eugene Smith made history today as the first prisoner executed using nitrogen gas, newspapers reported that:


This does not sound like a peaceful or instant death.

Don't trust reporters: most are Leftists on a mission to ban the death penalty. The 22 minutes is from when the curtains were opened to when they were closed. The relevant time period is from when he started breathing 100% Nitrogen to when his heart stopped.

Don't trust this condemned murderer: during his "botched" lethal injection execution attempt he refused to make a tight fist with his hand to make his veins stand out. IOW his inaction helped "botch" the first execution attempt. He then claimed that the botched attempt gave him PTSD. Never forget this guy accepted money to kill a man's wife and he killed her. NEVER trust him, he's psycho.

Here, his pulling on the straps and writhing on the gurney were the first ~3 minutes when he was fighting with all his might to hold his breath: that was not pain from breathing Nitrogen. IOW he did that to himself and I'd bet was acting.

Once he breathed Nitrogen he quickly stopped writhing, breathed deeply for a few minutes (his body trying to "catch his breath" after holding it for as long as he could), and then stopped breathing. That took less than 8 minutes total. Those are the two times and behaviors that matter. Both indicate Nitrogen has offers quick, painless unconsciousness followed a few minutes later by death. Just what I want.

 

[uzuf86]

This is confusing since the pig videos on Youtube show that the pigs pass out instantly. and become unconscious. The one where the pig got back up seems to be showing that it doesn't remember anything, and go back and stick its face back into the food chamber filled with nitrogen, only to pass out again and not remember a thing.

Does all the shaking and suffering while unconscious really still count as shaking and suffering?

 

[Meditation guide]

This is confusing since the pig videos on Youtube show that the pigs pass out instantly. and become unconscious. The one where the pig got back up seems to be showing that it doesn't remember anything, and go back and stick its face back into the food chamber filled with nitrogen, only to pass out again and not remember a thing.

Does all the shaking and suffering while unconscious really still count as shaking and suffering?

The mask seems to be the issue here according to Nitschke. The pig was in a chamber.
Be aware that the people giving the nitrogen had no familiarity with this at all, who knows the type of mask they used or how it was rigged up. Going by the previous reports of them being unable to hit a vein before in this man, and yes they tried all over his body including his groin, this is basically some people without any experience or medical training doing this without any knowledge about it.

No details of exactly how they did it or what kind of mask was used. Did they hold the mask on his face? Was it a rebreather mask? A basic oxygen mask with vents? Where did they get the info on how to do it? No one knows.

 

[Abyssal]

I know this should be meaningful to us, but it makes me sad. I'm not sure what this man did, but I wonder if he wanted to live. Was he scared? How could death ever be peaceful if you don't want it?

They kill people who want to live and force us to stay alive. It feels backwards. I can't agree with the death penalty.

 

[rozeske]

The initial movements are just from him fighting to hold his breath and trying his best to escape his restraints. It could also be his way of saying f*ck the system on his way out. The rest could be involuntary movements that are common after unconsciousness with most methods. Dying usually isn't peaceful.

 

[intr0verse]

Maybe his reaction was due to the fact that maybe he hold his breath for as long as possible thinking it's a toxic gas? It's definitely not a good ad for Philip's No-AirPods, i can't wait to see his reaction to this...

 

[Glandular]

The inert gas method is considered to be a peaceful and instant way to go, but when Kenneth Eugene Smith made history today as the first prisoner executed using nitrogen gas, newspapers reported that:


This does not sound like a peaceful or instant death. The execution took about 22 minutes, and Smith appeared to remain conscious for several minutes. For at least two minutes, he appeared to shake and writhe on the gurney, sometimes pulling against the restraints. That was followed by several minutes of heavy breathing, until breathing was no longer perceptible.

We are talking about very different circumstances. This guy was not trying to exit this world - on the contrary: he was fighting as much as he could against it. Of course he would try to hold his breath as long as possible, trying to stay awake. My guess is that he tried everything so that this attempt to kill him would be aborted (like last time).
When an inert gas is used to ctb it is advised to first breath out all air and second to take deep breaths of pure Nitrogen. That way consciousness will be lost within 10 - 20 seconds.

 

[Meditation guide]

All any of us can do is guess what happened.
My guess is the mask they used was a five dollar oxygen mask with vents to allow in air.
So he was breathing a mix of oxygen and nitrogen.

 

[thewalkingdread]

 

[outrider567]

The inert gas method is considered to be a peaceful and instant way to go, but when Kenneth Eugene Smith made history today as the first prisoner executed using nitrogen gas, newspapers reported that:


This does not sound like a peaceful or instant death.

The ones here were peaceful--Remember that this guy was fighting it--When Inert Gas is used with the EEBD Hood, no oxygen gets in, and you take in deep breaths to facilitate death--My tests were pretty dramatic as I took 5 deep breaths and my Oxygen level crashed from 98 to 46

I know this should be meaningful to us, but it makes me sad. I'm not sure what this man did, but I wonder if he wanted to live. Was he scared? How could death ever be peaceful if you don't want it?

They kill people who want to live and force us to stay alive. It feels backwards. I can't agree with the death penalty.

You're not sure what this man did?? He brutally stabbed to death a young woman, he stabbed her 15 times, all for a lousy thousand bucks

 

[thewalkingdread]

They kill people who want to live and force us to stay alive. It feels backwards. I can't agree with the death penalty.

Then you also won't agree with what this little "angel" did... I am not fully informed about the case, so I could be wrong, but this man was hired and killed a woman by stabing.

What about his victim?! She also wanted to live. But she didn't get a peaceful execution by inert gas... No... She was stabbed to death!

PS: I'm also against death penalty. But not for the "humane" or pro-life/religious reasons most people are.

 

[outrider567]

The initial movements are just from him fighting to hold his breath and trying his best to escape his restraints. It could also be his way of saying f*ck the system on his way out. The rest could be involuntary movements that are common after unconsciousness with most methods. Dying usually isn't peaceful.

True--When California used to gas condemned men, they always told them not to fight it, and take deep breaths

All any of us can do is guess what happened.
My guess is the mask they used was a five dollar oxygen mask with vents to allow in air.
So he was breathing a mix of oxygen and nitrogen.

Exactly--With my tight and correctly fitting EEBD Hood, I took deep breaths of the Nitrogen, about 20 seconds, and my Oxygen level plummeted from 98 to 46

 

[Dot]

Don't trust reporters: most are Leftists on a mission to ban the death penalty. The 22 minutes is from when the curtains were opened to when they were closed. The relevant time period is from when he started breathing 100% Nitrogen to when his heart stopped.

Don't trust this condemned murderer: during his "botched" lethal injection execution attempt he refused to make a tight fist with his hand to make his veins stand out. IOW his inaction helped "botch" the first execution attempt. He then claimed that the botched attempt gave him PTSD. Never forget this guy accepted money to kill a man's wife and he killed her. NEVER trust him, he's psycho.

Here, his pulling on the straps and writhing on the gurney were the first ~3 minutes when he was fighting with all his might to hold his breath: that was not pain from breathing Nitrogen. IOW he did that to himself and I'd bet was acting.

Once he breathed Nitrogen he quickly stopped writhing, breathed deeply for a few minutes (his body trying to "catch his breath" after holding it for as long as he could), and then stopped breathing. That took less than 8 minutes total. Those are the two times and behaviors that matter. Both indicate Nitrogen has offers quick, painless unconsciousness followed a few minutes later by death. Just what I want.

Pls clarfy whre u gt th/ specfc infrmatn on timngs

 

[thewalkingdread]

Don't trust reporters: most are Leftists on a mission to ban the death penalty.

MBG... Your commentary was quite accurate. The only thing you said with which I disagree is when you asserted that this is a "Leftist" mission to ban death penalty.

While I do agree with you that many "Leftists" are indeed unconditionally against death penalty, to say that the media coverage of these cases is "left" biased is inaccurate.

Many "rightists" also believe that the death penalty should be banned. Many of them are also fervorous Christians who believe that "only God can take or give life"...

So... the death penalty is an issue that transcends the usual political cheerleading contest between "left" vs "right".

Once again all we can safely say is that here we have, once again, the pro-lifers bias tumultuating the public discussion with their misinformation, lies and manipulation to get what they want, at any cost.

 

[mortuarymary]

Witness says Kenneth Eugene Smith writhed for 'minutes' in execution


https://mol.im/a/13009165

 

[penguinl0v3s]

I think it's misleading by the media again.

Of course the body will writher and thrash, its dying. Will be the same with any method that is not instant.

The main thing is he was smiling and unconscious, they should have focused on that.

The only true 'peaceful' methods if you don't want things like that are probably jumping or guns, which take you out in milliseconds.

I interpreted it as the prisoner trying to resist. But yeah, I guess it could be dying convulsions.

This does not sound like a peaceful or instant death.

Nah the science is really clear on what nitrogen asphyxiation does, and that hypoxia is peaceful. Of course a voluntary suicide is gonna be way more peaceful than a guy who is actively resisting being killed. He successfully resisted pentobarbital injection ffs.

The same "experts" called pentobarbital overdose a painful death that will make you suffocate and foam by the mouth, which makes 0 sense if you understand the mechanism of action of pentobarbital at all.

 

[thewalkingdread]

The same "experts" called pentobarbital overdose a painful death that will make you suffocate and foam by the mouth, which makes 0 sense if you understand the mechanism of action of pentobarbital at all.

Case in point.

All we can safely say is that here we have — once again! — the pro-lifer's bias tumultuating the public discussion with their misinformation, lies and manipulation to get what they want, at any cost.

 

[Old Friend]

The annoying thing with all this is how Nitrogen as a suicide method will get conflated with execution and get caught up in America's capital punishment debate.

Already, a week or so ago, we had a guy on here banging the pulpit by spreading false information about it as a suicide method because he was against capital punishment.

The obvious difference between suicide and capital punishment is that suicide is voluntary. Execution is forced. A condemned person will be put in some sort of restraint. If there's a problem with the mask, as @Meditation guide proposes and CO2 is staying in the mask, then suffocation will be felt. Someone voluntarily killing themselves will simply take the mask off if this is the case. The condemned prisoner cannot.

I'm surprised they didn't go for a chamber, similar to what they used years ago with poison.

BBC article outstanding as always. They "gassed" him with gas we breathe in near enough every moment in our lives. You always know the BBC's own personal opinion on every topic they cover. Their mission seems not to inform but to lead you to their own conclusion on any given topic.

 

[blacksand]

Guarantee he was holding his breath. I'm also suspicious of the mask they used- I'm not sure how common the knowledge is not to use a simple oxygen mask for ctb purposes using inert gas. No air can be allowed into the system.

 

[Abyssal]

Then you also won't agree with what this little "angel" did... I am not fully informed about the case, so I could be wrong, but this man was hired and killed a woman by stabing.

What about his victim?! She also wanted to live. But she didn't get a peaceful execution by inert gas... No... She was stabbed to death!

Save your breath, I'm not defending his actions. Life in prison is punishment enough, we don't live in the Middle Ages where we must gauge out a man's eye if he did it to another. What he did was wrong and was done to him is wrong, you can't have both.

 

[Justnotme]

I do not understand what is the difference between a medical mask and a bag?
Wouldn't the nitrogen flow rate be enough to push carbon dioxide out of the mask?
After all, the bag works on the same principle: we have to leave a gap at the bottom so that carbon dioxide escapes
Why, then, can a mask make death painful?

If it's oxygen, then again, what's the difference between a mask and a bag?
In theory, the nitrogen flow should prevent oxygen from entering, due to the nitrogen flow rate.
But oxygen should also not flow through the mask, because the nitrogen flow will push it out.

 

[Intoxicated]

No air can be allowed into the system.

Small amounts of air are permissible. As long as the concentration of oxygen is less than 6%, fainting occurs quickly.

Concentration of Oxygen	Effect
18–21%	No discernible symptoms
11–18%	Reduction in physical and mental performance without appreciation
8–11%	Possible fainting in minutes with risk of death below 11%
6–8%	Fainting occurs after a short time
0–6%	Fainting occurs almost immediately

 

[blacksand]

Small amounts of air are permissible. As long as the concentration of oxygen is less than 6%, fainting occurs quickly.

Concentration of Oxygen	Effect
18–21%	No discernible symptoms
11–18%	Reduction in physical and mental performance without appreciation
8–11%	Possible fainting in minutes with risk of death below 11%
6–8%	Fainting occurs after a short time
0–6%	Fainting occurs almost immediately

Understood. Do you think much air was getting into this guys mask? I recall it being made very clear to me that using a regular O2 mask connected to nitrogen is a no go.

 

[Meditation guide]

I read the mask was a fireman's mask, and they could hear gas escaping from around the edges of it. That makes sense if they were pumping in nitrogen, the gas has to go somewhere. Maybe they had the pressure turned up too high.