Help Nitrogen Gas Cylinder

[venom.52]

Hi I'm confused about the cylinder capacity and volume,the PpeH recommends to have atleast about 20 Cubic feet or 566 Litres Nitrogen Gas cylinder at 15 LPM flow rate,I was seeing online that the sizes are mentioned in cubic metres and water capacity in litres,for eg i saw a 7 Cubic metre tank with water capacity at about 45 litres and height about 4.5 feet and weighs about 50 kilos,i thought 7 cubic metres= 7000 litres? ,is there a difference between gas capacity and water capacity and I'm confused between the both? What does the 45L water capacity mean? Can anyone tell me how much cubic metres do i need?
Thanks.

 

[TheCrow]

20 cubic ft is apparently more than enough, but some people buy the 40 cubic ft tank for peace of mind, or in case they feel like they may end up needing some wiggle room for trial runs.

 

[venom.52]

Yeah i know that, I'm confused between water capacity and gas capacity, by the way do you have an idea of how tall would the 20cu ft and 40cu ft cylinders be?

 

[TheCrow]

If you're in the US and ordering from Cyberweld, the 20 ft is 13.75", and the 40 ft is 17.5"

 

[venom.52]

oh okay,i have one more question, i cant seem to find a nitrogen regulator with a flowmeter and the ones that are available are expensive like $320,all the flowmeter regulators are either for Argon/CO2. Is it fine to use an Argon one with the nitrogen gas?

 

[TheCrow]

I believe so. Someone recommended this one to me awhile ago & I saved the link:

https://www.amazon.com/BETOOLL-HW90...1528525424&sr=8-2&keywords=nitrogen+flowmeter

 

[TheCrow]

Just skimmed the mega thread & found that this is the one that the most knowledgeable member of ours on this subject,@TiredHorse has, & it's CO2/Argon:

https://m.harborfreight.com/regulat...exit-bag-and-inert-gas-megathread.8393/page-4

 

[venom.52]

Thanks for the info @TheCrow , appreciate it . I Can source all the supplies now,just trying to know more about the method so that i don't screw the act up.

 

[dandan]

I tried this before... gas emptied before I lost consciousness, maybe I fucked up

this is a good regulator, just be sure it has your tank type

Amazon.com: Medline HCS8725M Mini Oxygen Regulator, Latex Free, 0 - 25 Liters per Minute, 870 CGA Connection, Brass Sleeve : Health & Household

Buy Medline HCS8725M Mini Oxygen Regulator, Latex Free, 0 - 25 Liters per Minute, 870 CGA Connection, Brass Sleeve: Oxygen Accessories - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

actually the regulator that Max Dog Brew company sells is a very similar one, and it says Oxygen... is not Nitrogen... that is observable in the pictures

here take a look, it says "Oxygen" in the regulator...

MDB EU Nitrogen Regulator Kit (USD)

maxdogbrewing.com

 

[freetoleave]

when a gas is pressurized it liquefies and takes less volume, on the contrary water is so difficult to compress because of the strength of hidrogen bond that people are commonly considering that it can't be compressed at all, that's why a tank that only can contain 10L of water can contain much more of pressurized gas.

so there are two given values, the compressed volume (inside the tank) and the uncompressed volume (outside the tank) which is the one important to you.

 

[Jen Erik]

actually the regulator that Max Dog Brew company sells is a very similar one, and it says Oxygen... is not Nitrogen... that is observable in the pictures

here take a look, it says "Oxygen" in the regulator...

https://maxdogbrewing.com/products/mdb-nitrogen-cylinder

It is similar, but it is not an actual oxygen regulator.

The item Max Dog sells is custom built for them; it uses an oxygen regulator base with a CGA 580 connector, which is the connector required to hook up to a nitrogen cylinder.

A standard oxygen regulator has a CGA 870 or 540 connector, neither of which is not compatible with nitrogen cylinders.

(I have the U.S. regulator; the EU regulator may be different.)

 

[dandan]

It is similar, but it is not an actual oxygen regulator.

The item Max Dog sells is custom built for them; it uses an oxygen regulator base with a CGA 580 connector,.....

A standard oxygen regulator has a CGA 870 or 540 .....

Simple, you buy a $5 CGA adapter 580 - 540

 

[Jen Erik]

Simple, you buy a $5 CGA adapter 580 - 540

That's good info to have, thanks.

 

[dandan]

That's good info to have, thanks.

ADAPTADOR #13A CGA-580 AGA A CGA-540 - 02-13

GYMCO - Gases y Materiales de Coahuila - Venta en Saltillo, León, Ramos Arizpe, Arteaga, Derramadero.

www.gymco.com.mx

only in Mexico

 

[venom.52]

when a gas is pressurized it liquefies and takes less volume, on the contrary water is so difficult to compress because of the strength of hidrogen bond that people are commonly considering that it can't be compressed at all, that's why a tank that only can contain 10L of water can contain much more of pressurized gas.

so there are two given values, the compressed volume (inside the tank) and the uncompressed volume (outside the tank) which is the one important to you.

Okay, now I get it. I have to take in consideration the gas volume/capacity in cubic feet or cubic metres and the water capacity is irrelevant. Thanks for the logical explanation.

 

[how2toGetout]

Hi I'm confused about the cylinder capacity and volume,the PpeH recommends to have atleast about 20 Cubic feet or 566 Litres Nitrogen Gas cylinder at 15 LPM flow rate,I was seeing online that the sizes are mentioned in cubic metres and water capacity in litres,for eg i saw a 7 Cubic metre tank with water capacity at about 45 litres and height about 4.5 feet and weighs about 50 kilos,i thought 7 cubic metres= 7000 litres? ,is there a difference between gas capacity and water capacity and I'm confused between the both? What does the 45L water capacity mean? Can anyone tell me how much cubic metres do i need?
Thanks.

I stumbled upon this thread when i included the keyword 'argon' in my search query.

i think the 45 L water capacity means the tank size can hold 45 L of water. But the tank CAN also hold 7 cubic metres of the said gas (i.e. Nitrogen). And 7 cubic metres is equal to 7000 Litres. So how can a tank that can hold 45 L of water, hold 7000 L of Nitrogen gas? --Answer: The gas is compressed. 7000 L of Nitrogen is compressed to 45 L or so, so the gas is stored at compressed pressure, higher than at, say, an atmospheric pressure.

Correct me if i'm wrong.

What i'm wondering is how does pressure reading in regulator gauge relates to this concept of compressed gas. I haven't had the chance to order a regulator gauge yet, but a nitrogen regulator or an argon regulator seem to measure in "psi" or "Kilo-Pascal". So i'm just trying to get my head wrapped around this concept of compressed gas being measured by a regulator. Is there supposed to be a conversion factor from a volume of Nitrogen to a pressure of Nitrogen at that given volume, and vice versa?