Neotame and N

[Nigh]

Yes, thank you. I wonder if I can try this out with water, I know it's not a bitter substance, but I just wanna determine at which point neotame becomes bitter instead of sweet. But 5-8 does sound about right. Really taken this seriously as I've thrown up in other suicide attempts, and don't wanna mess up the holy grail - N

Try it with a bitter drink. If you really want to put in the work, try it with kale juice or something. I'm not sure about the exact number of teaspoons full of sugar, but I am 100% sure that overkill with the amount of artificial sweeteners is not the way. Putting them straight on my tongue made them all taste bitter.

Yes, I'm thinking about buying bitter gourd juice, apperently that tastes like shite.

 

[roguetrader]

Well, it sweetens espresso, which is bitter. It has to work to some extent. Will it make N taste good enough? Idk……
But I can say with almost 100% certainty that you cannot use too much sweetener. So far, I think the people who have tested it with N have used way too much Neotame.

 

[Smart No More]

The blurb on neotame is that it works against bitter tastes (used in correct amounts obviously) which is part of its appeal in improving the palatability of vet N. It's just hard to work out the right amount as the amounts you can experiment with are so small. I'm pretty certain sugar and other sweetners have been ruled out for this purpose so hopefully neotame can meet the requirements. I'm just not sure where to start with it. Of course getting N and neotane would be the first steps lol.

 

[roguetrader]

Sugar and other sweeteners work on espresso, which is bitter. I guess you can try with kale juice, which is super bitter and nasty. All I know is the appropriate amount isnt too much as these sweeteners become bitter tasting in excess

 

[PerpetualPain]

My conclusion regarding Neotame is it may be good to use before and after to fill your mouth with sweetness but I don't think it will be effective to mix with N. There may also be better substances such as coating your mouth with honey and chasing with liquor and chocolate. That seems to be the most tried and tested method from what I have heard. Just gonna have to accept the terrible taste and be more determined than ever to get it down. My anxiety and SI which makes me nauseous makes it seem like it's going to be incredibly hard to achieve. If N was the cure for my disease I would have no worries whatsoever about getting it down.

 

[roguetrader]

I think you used too much Neotame for the 1ml of N you tested. It won't sweeten it. If you don't believe, just put a pinch of neotame on your tongue. It'll be bitter

 

[roguetrader]

What we need is mathematics. Like 1/8 teaspoon of N per 100 ml.

Most of us don't need it to taste great just bearable and not puke-able!

The problem is the amount of Neotame I'm using is tiny and it's already so sweet. I've no idea how much weight wise I've used. I got a 25g bag and the amount I'm using is probably 1/500 to 1/5000 of it at a time? Can't measure things that small. For perspective, in the pic I posted, that little plastic spoon is about 1/10 volume of the black spoon. Those specks of Neotame may be 5-15% of the plastic spoon volume? All just pure estimates….
Btw, don't get hung up on a sweetener being 1000x sweeter than sugar or whatever. Stevia is supposed to be 200x sweeter or so and you use about 5-10% the volume for same sweetness, not 0.5 to 1% if you believe the 200x number……

 

[roguetrader]

Well, you still need to know how much to swish….so it's sweet, not bitter! Lol

 

[Smart No More]

I think it may still hold promise. Being mixed in and used beforehand. I think the amount is the key part. Seems like the amount needed is very low. Also seems like it may only have a limited effect but in such small quantities anything of an improvement is a bonus. Given how bitter N already is I fear it may be harder to mask and the dose of neotome or any sweetner needed may have to be so high as to cancel out the benefit. Therefore rendering it null and void overall. I hope to be wrong!

 

[roguetrader]

I disagree with the amount of neotame needed being high. High amounts of sweeteners are bitter! I know that for a fact because I've tasted neotame and stevia on their own by putting it on my tongue. A mouthful of sugar will certainly be sweet….a mouthful of neotame will probably be as bitter as N!

 

[Smart No More]

I'm not saying it should be high. I specifically said I think it needs to be very low. I think there may be a sweet spot. It's what I've been saying all this tine. I just worry that the bitterness and other nasties might be too strong to be overpowered in those doses and therefore neotame may end up being unable to fulfil our needs. As I said, I hope to be wrong about that. I'm just throwing out thoughts in the name of finding our way to working out if this stuff will work out or not.

 

[roguetrader]

Given how bitter N already is I fear it may be harder to mask and the dose of neotome or any sweetner needed may have to be so high as to cancel out the benefit. Therefore rendering it null and void overall. I hope to be wrong!

I thought you did say the amount needed would be high.
Anyway, I have played around with Neotame enough now and believe I know the amount that's going to help. How much help, I don't know but I'll find out for real at some point!

 

[roguetrader]

Can you take a picture of the amount you think would be helpful to be mixed into the N—preferably on a teaspoon or whatnot? ? I know it's not scientific but I will take any help at this point. You can post or PM me. Thank you so much!!!!

I posted a pic earlier in this thread. That amount helped sweeten espresso for sure. I tried another espresso at half the volume and about 2-3 times that amount and I'm not sure if it tasted much better or sweeter, so it may have reached the point where neotame is starting to get bitter? Definitely not a scientific study here haha.
Feel free to PM me anything else you want to know.

 

[Red Scare]

Anybody have any thoughts here or anything else to add?

I feel like is thread wasn't very informative, but I would like to know if this will actually help improve the taste of vet n or not.