KL Officially Arrested

[FuneralGrey]

Charged in connection with two deaths in Canada, it looks like.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/peel-regional-police-sodium-nitrite-case-1.6830156

 

[storeboughtisfine]

So unfair. He was doing good work for those of us who want to go peacefully.

 

[uniqueusername39]

well, at least i hope he still has a way out of the situation...if that is what he wants...

 

[FuneralGrey]

So unfair. He was doing good work for those of us who want to go peacefully.

I agree he was doing good work, but he obviously took it too far. Selling SN is one thing (totally legal), but offering consultations crosses a line, legally speaking, especially since it sounds like he wasn't being selective about who he gave advice to.

 

[RedHotRage]

It's interesting how the writer of the headline needed to make it as sensationalist as possible. A man charged with selling a "lethal substance" that caused "2 deaths". They don't even want to mention assisted suicides until after you click - just vilify someone who's genuinely helping others and shock people for more clicks.

 

[Salvation_]

Month long investigation... investigation started on March 31st... IC had been up for 2 years and only now KL is getting busted...

 

[FuneralGrey]

It's interesting how the writer of the headline needed to make it as sensationalist as possible. A man charged with selling a "lethal substance" that caused "2 deaths". They don't even want to mention assisted suicides until after you click - just vilify someone who's genuinely helping others and shock people for more clicks.

My feeling too. I genuinely thought we were past sensationalist articles about suicide – pro-lifers especially should want to keep the name of SN a secret and not draw too much attention to an effective method of suicide, you would think.

 

[oneeyed]

Month long investigation... investigation started on March 31st... IC had been up for 2 years and only now KL is getting busted...

The difference in time could be the police gathering evidence so the conviction could stick. Then of course I'm sure the volume of sales increased as more people were informed of this method of ctb. Then you have two deaths connected to consuming sn and apparently he was "consulting" people. That was probably the straw that broke the camels back, knowingly selling it to people who will use it to ctb is a crime itself. Doesn't look good for him but Canada's legal system is also a joke so we'll set what happens next.

 

[glitterypearls]

I agree he was doing good work, but he obviously took it too far. Selling SN is one thing (totally legal), but offering consultations crosses a line, legally speaking, especially since it sounds like he wasn't being selective about who he gave advice to.

what type of advice or consultation he was giving people?

I do agree it's unfair though. we no longer have a peaceful method that won't get the police on you. hoping in few months it will all calm down and we can buy it peacefully again. tho it doesn't look like it.

It's really sad to me how they will ban a peaceful method meanwhile you can go to youtube right now and look up on how to tie a noose for full hanging with 1.8M views and all of the comments saying how they will use it as a way to CTB. why didn't the media talk about that? why didn't they delete the video? but no hanging isn't peaceful so they don't really care.

 

[unnormal9]

This is absolutely horrible. He did nothing wrong, SN is a lot less messy than jumping or other agonizing methods.

 

[CentreMid]

I do agree it's unfair though. we no longer have a peaceful method that won't get the police on you. hoping in few months it will all calm down and we can buy it peacefully again. tho it doesn't look like it.

I mentioned this is another thread, but with the increased public awareness, it's likely that other provinces will follow suit in terms of SN investigations, which could eventually lead to a nation-wide ban. I don't like to be pessimistic about the future and accessibility of suicide, but given the state of the world and the direction we're headed, I wouldn't be surprised if this is how things will end up. I agree, it's truly unfortunate as this will only drive people to use less humane methods.

 

[leloyon]

Poor guy, I hope he gets acquitted and walks free. He just did what was right.

 

[unnormal9]

"The mental health and well-being of our communities is our main priority."

No, it is ABSOLUTELY NOT. This faux facade must stop.

 

[NearlyIrrelevantCake]

what type of advice or consultation he was giving people?

Undercover journalists contacted him asking to buy the product and asking for help and he gave them clear instructions for how to use SN to CTB.

He's pretty fucked from that alone, he has no plausible deniability for what people were using the SN for.

 

[iamalreadydead]

fucking world we live in man where it's illegal to just fucking help people

 

[LaVieEnRose]

No, it is ABSOLUTELY NOT. This faux facade must stop.

Yeah the system doesn't give a shit.

 

[glitterypearls]

I mentioned this is another thread, but with the increased public awareness, it's likely that other provinces will follow suit in terms of SN investigations, which could eventually lead to a nation-wide ban. I don't like to be pessimistic about the future and accessibility of suicide, but given the state of the world and the direction we're headed, I wouldn't be surprised if this is how things will end up. I agree, it's truly unfortunate as this will only drive people to use less humane methods.

we are going to go back to the basics. guns and hanging because you aren't allowed to die peacefully in your bed or room anymore. you have to look like the "typical image" of a person who ended their life and "traumatized" who would find them and hanging or gun does that then they blame the person for picking this method when we always tried to find peaceful method but they always take it away.

Undercover journalists contacted him asking to buy the product and asking for help and he gave them clear instructions for how to use SN to CTB.

oh damn.. that was a huge mistake. what was he even thinking? anyone who buys SN to CTB already knows how to use it

 

[ge0rge]

he deserves it in full. how many people did he get into trouble with his boasting and bragging and sloppy work ethic? how many people risk eviction or even more stress and humiliation? he cared about his money, not the wellbeing of his customers. the ebay guy didnt get sentenced or investigated, neither did CCS or XYZ or ABC.

he's a pig and i hope that he rots

 

[Rocket]

I'm sorry so many are going through trauma. Mentioned in another topic that in the US, like most countries I'm aware of, possessing this product is NOT illegal. It's a curing salt used by thousands of businesses.

Attached is a fact sheet from the American Meat Association about it and for irony, they talk about health benefits --

Is it true that nitrite actually may have health benefits? Evidence is mounting that nitrite actually does have numerous health benefits. Studies have shown that nitrite is part of the body's healthy nitrogen cycle. The body converts nitrate to nitrite to regulate blood pressure, promote wound healing, destroy pathogens in the gut and even to prevent preeclampsia during pregnancy. Scientists at the National Institutes of Health over the last several years have announced a number of studies that document the health benefits of nitrite. These scientists have concluded that nitrite is a potential new treatment for organ transplantation, heart attacks, sickle cell disease, and leg vascular problems. Dr. Mark Gladwin of NIH's National Heart, Lung and Blood Institute, whose lab uncovered nitrite's value as a medical treatment, told reporters in September 2005, "The idea it's bad for you has not played out… We think we stumbled into an innate protection mechanism." Gladwin said NIH believes so strongly in its promise that it is seeking a pharmaceutical company to help develop it as a therapy.

Having this product is not possessing drugs of any kind. If visited, if people tell LE that it's been gotten rid of, and (if necessary) that they're doing fine, there's nothing more to talk about.

It's terrible that KL said so much. There's a good reason it's strictly enforced here not to reveal supplier names and details. It wasn't like the reporter had to coerce it out of him, the posted phone call in one of the articles made it clear KL knew exactly what was going on and gave advice on how to use the product. That put every one of his customers at risk. Suppliers have a duty to shut up and keep their business confidential. Inviting somebody in his car (even if he didn't know it was a reporter) and explaining things is a fatal error.

LE have the names of buyers of this product and it's all to build a case against KL. The article mentions, "The Police say some 1,200 packages believed to be linked to the companies associated with Law have been shipped to over 40 countries". That's what they are focused on, not end users. "Law is expected to appear in court for a bail hearing on Wednesday", so we'll know more about the charges later.

There are no laws preventing the ordering or possession of a legal product. Having a LE visit is scary but buyers haven't done anything wrong. In my opinion, there's no need for a lawyer or extra conversation, it's not like defending a drug charge or any crime. It will be hard for anyone to be calm until things settle down. but the investigation has moved along pretty quickly.

Wanted to send love and some reassurance that buyers didn't do anything wrong.

 

[tiredofbreathing]

How could he get in trouble tho if he didn't intend them to take there life??

 

[NearlyIrrelevantCake]

How could he get in trouble tho if he didn't intend them to take there life??

He gave detailed instructions to undercover journalists for how to kill themselves with SN. Surely that couldn't have been the first time he did that, there's probably recorded e-mails or chats somewhere where he did the same with legitimate people who wanted to CTB. Giving those instructions to a suicidal person is a crime.

 

[Pidgeons_Sparrows]

Undercover journalists contacted him asking to buy the product and asking for help and he gave them clear instructions for how to use SN to CTB.

He's pretty fucked from that alone, he has no plausible deniability for what people were using the SN for.

Hes stupid. Just shouldnt have given consultations and instead been adamant on the ""its for food"" cover up.

 

[ge0rge]

the posted phone call in one of the articles made it clear KL knew exactly what was going on and gave advice on how to use the product.

do you have a link to this specific article? i am curious about the phone call

Hes stupid. Just shouldnt have given consultations and instead been adamant on the ""its for food"" cover up.

not only was he stupid, he was smug, too. a logo with the letters S and N sticking out? who tf even KNOWS that abbreviation except people on here? to him it was all just a masturbatory cheeky little enterprise, very thinly veiled

 

[tiredofbreathing]

He gave detailed instructions to undercover journalists for how to kill themselves with SN. Surely that couldn't have been the first time he did that, there's probably recorded e-mails or chats somewhere where he did the same with legitimate people who wanted to CTB. Giving those instructions to a suicidal person is a crime.

Oh. I didn't realize he actually did that far. Is the IC guy btw or different guy?

 

[NearlyIrrelevantCake]

Oh. I didn't realize he actually did that far. Is the IC guy btw or different guy?

IC.

If you read the article in the OP, it names IC as well as several other companies he owned that supplied SN.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

He gave detailed instructions to undercover journalists for how to kill themselves with SN. Surely that couldn't have been the first time he did that, there's probably recorded e-mails or chats somewhere where he did the same with legitimate people who wanted to CTB. Giving those instructions to a suicidal person is a crime.

I don't think giving instructions is a crime as such but rather knowingly providing the necessary materials.

 

[GasMonkey]

The consultation service was for his inert gas implementations (escMode) mostly, @Bengal got one of those consultations for his setup.
I don't think people used that service much for SN.

 

[novem]

this forum is under scrutiny
it is bad!!!!!
need to do something about it.
surces are disappearing too quickly

 

[Deleted member 31858]

Honestly, this is very unfair to me. K was helping a lot of people and I really don't think he was giving advice on the use of SN, just the advice on his other page because everything related to the use of SN can be found here by researching ourselves without asking IC, I feel bad for him, for everyone who has been getting checkups, for those who couldn't get their SN and there is no other source in their country

 

[Rocket]

ge0rge, the original discussion of the phone call is in the Times of London article (paywall) (Link anonymized at https://dereferer.me/) https://dereferer.me/?https://www.t...ison-investigation-canada-hotel-chef-289vwpqp:

He asked us to call his mobile phone and was "looking forward" to speaking to us. Just over a minute into the call he began describing how to take his poison in order to die. During the 28-minute phone call, Law said Britons were some of his most "frequent buyers", adding: "It will be literally in the hundreds. And they've all received it. We have had many, many customers in the UK who have purchased it." He also said that "many, many, many, many" had died. "People in the UK have died, people in the US have died, people in Canada have died, and other parts of the world," he said.

Here's the first Times tweet that has some of the phone call with KL:

The Times and The Sunday Times @thetimes Apr 26
Law told an undercover reporter posing as a suicidal buyer how to take the substance to best ensure death and boasted that some people had told him that he was doing "God's work"

The three part podcast starts here and has more of his phone call:

The Times and The Sunday Times @thetimes Apr 26
Part One of Poison - a new three-part investigative podcast with
@JamesSBeal on #StoriesOfOurTimes out now. Listen here:

A 28 minute phone call, inviting a reporter in his car, answering questions at the mail center while having armloads of packages... along with the tracible packages, he really did not do himself any favors. Unfortunately, they probably have everything they need to prove their case. This is about whether KL knowingly helped people with a non-intended purpose of the product.

This isn't about the buyers over liability or any crime -- it's a legal product that's used by countless businesses and home chefs.