I consider to buy some stocks as ETFs

[noname223]

I wish darkrange55 was still here to help me. I liked this thread.

Managing money for rich families AMA

I've worked in finance in investment banking, hedge fund, prop trader, venture capital and family offices (A family office basically a group of the best of the best wealth management advisors and traders to deal with everything). Plus commercial real estate brokerage specializing in hotels. And...

sanctioned-suicide.net

I want to invest 5000 Euros and 150 Euros monthly. (roughly 1/3 of my savvings). I got some nursing care money (because someone in this forum gave me the hint) I get roundabout 350 Euros monthly and I don't need the money for consumption. My dad thought ETFs might be a good choice. I read some articles thus far. I could invest more money. My dream would be to buy me a small apartment with this money in 20 years. Maybe I only need a portion of this money from my ETF investment.

And I think I will go save with a highly diversified ETF. Either a vanguard ETF or MSCI world. I want to re-invest the accumulated interest. And it should be a passive ETF with less fees.

I read online broker have less fees. However, I am a complete layman and it is way too risky for me making these transactions. I will go to my bank. I was there once and they wanted to sell me dog shit which would have ruined me. Gladly, I saw through it.

This time I will read some articles before I go there. I want an ETF saving plan. And one where the bank does not get a bonus. I will let them give me the contract and information to think it through. They are pretty skilled at selling shit.

I think it is risky because I am a noob. But it is probably better invested than keeping it on my bank account.

 

[Angst Filled Fuck Up]

Well you'd be buying at a market top in all likelihood. That's okay if you're in it for the long haul, but if you want to see quick returns, you might be disappointed.

In America we have something called an IRA, which is a retirement-based, diversified basket of stocks that you can buy for a maximum of $7000 per year. That's what I do and it's generally safe because at an average gain of 8% per year you can pretty much set it and forget it. There's also a penalty to withdraw early (before age 59.5), so it keeps most people on the right path over years and even decades.

I don't know if Europe has some equivalent, but I would say first try to gauge what your goals are, and go from there. Think about timeframes, specifically when you want to be able to cash the money out, and how long you're able to let that money compound on itself. Factor taxes in too of course.

 

[noname223]

Well you'd be buying at a market top in all likelihood. That's okay if you're in it for the long haul, but if you want to see quick returns, you might be disappointed.

In America we have something called an IRA, which is a retirement-based, diversified basket of stocks that you can buy for a maximum of $7000 per year. That's what I do and it's generally safe because at an average gain of 8% per year you can pretty much set it and forget it. There's also a penalty to withdraw early (before age 59.5), so it keeps most people on the right path over years and even decades.

I don't know if Europe has some equivalent, but I would say first try to gauge what your goals are, and go from there. Think about timeframes, specifically when you want to be able to cash the money out, and how long you're able to let that money compound on itself. Factor taxes in too of course.

Thanks a lot. I would be open for more helpful replies like this one from others.

 

[derpyderpins]

Thanks a lot. I would be open for more helpful replies like this one from others.

His response was very good. The difference in tax structure and investment account options between countries will be pivotal. For example, even within IRAs in America there is a variant called a Roth IRA where you pay no taxes when taking money out, instead paying them when depositing. When you are low income, you can contribute a certain amount per year without incurring the upfront charge as well. I did this for my first few years out of law school when my income was low, and now I have a nice little stash there growing that will be tax-free when I withdraw. I do have it in ETFs a good bit (along with bit of HODL'd gamestop for the lols), and I let my "guy" pick which ones. I'm fine with going more aggressive with risk/upside because this is my rainy day long-in-the-future fund, so a down year will even out.

Angst is right that it feels like a big financial move to the downside globally is coming. The problem is it has felt like that for years now. The derivatives bubble is way bigger than anything we saw in 2008 but it seems like institutions have gotten better at pushing the crash down the road, so who knows how long it will be until a bottom.

My mom has been going on about an ETF (or similar) she invested into that guarantees at least 0% return for the year, but caps max gains at something like 9 or 10%. Something like that could ease your mind about a potential move to the downside.

One more thing I'll add is that the accounts that succeed the most (on average, not highest upside) are ones that just get left alone. Pick some stuff and let it sit there 20 years and all the waves tend to even out to a good gain.

 

[noname223]

His response was very good. The difference in tax structure and investment account options between countries will be pivotal. For example, even within IRAs in America there is a variant called a Roth IRA where you pay no taxes when taking money out, instead paying them when depositing. When you are low income, you can contribute a certain amount per year without incurring the upfront charge as well. I did this for my first few years out of law school when my income was low, and now I have a nice little stash there growing that will be tax-free when I withdraw. I do have it in ETFs a good bit (along with bit of HODL'd gamestop for the lols), and I let my "guy" pick which ones. I'm fine with going more aggressive with risk/upside because this is my rainy day long-in-the-future fund, so a down year will even out.

Angst is right that it feels like a big financial move to the downside globally is coming. The problem is it has felt like that for years now. The derivatives bubble is way bigger than anything we saw in 2008 but it seems like institutions have gotten better at pushing the crash down the road, so who knows how long it will be until a bottom.

My mom has been going on about an ETF (or similar) she invested into that guarantees at least 0% return for year, but caps max gains at something like 9 or 10%. Something like that could ease your mind about a potential move to the downside.

One more thing I'll add is that the accounts that succeed the most (on average, not highest upside) are ones that just get left alone. Pick some stuff and let it sit there 20 years and all the waves tend to even out to a good gain.

Also thank you for your helpful reply.

You are both right that the stock markets are pretty high. This is why I consider that my first investment is rather low 2000 Euros. And maybe I invest 150 Euros per month. Not everything at the same time.

My mom is in favor of a fixed-term deposit account. I have no clue whether that a wise choice. I will evaluate my decision for how honest the bank accountant is. Last time she wanted to sell me shit. A product of her bank which would only have been good for her. I will think about some questions with which could assess whether she really wants to help me with my investment or whether she only cares about the profits of her bank. I don't know the alternatives of investments.

I will ask her which ETFs she recommends. (then I will compare it with German recommendations for ETFs) Last time someone there said ETFs are nothing for beginners which was a massive red flag for me. I will ask whether her bank or she gets a bonus if I buy the ETFs she recommends. Whether there is a conflict of interest. I will ask how much the fees are for buying the ETF and whether it might be smarter to add money yearly and not monthly or half a year. Whether she thinks it is a good time point for investing. Whether it is better to invest one big investment or rather slowly growings amounts. I think the latter is better. How big the risk is to lose all. How big the rate of return is (I think 9% would be very good). I read there was a downturn for 15 years. I ask her without telling her that this is a fact whether this actually can happen. That I have to hold it very long in order not to lose money.

I wish @DarkRange55 was here. I would translate the possible contract for him with DeepL. Maybe I should wait until he returns. Lol.

I sometimes think about our discussion on Trump. I think Kamala won the debate against Trump. But I also think that Vance won the debate against Walz which was a big disappointment for me. I really like Walz and I really hate Vance. Whether these debates will have any big impact on the election is a different question. I rather doubt it.

 

[derpyderpins]

Whether these debates will have any big impact on the election is a different question. I rather doubt it.

VP debates typically don't move the needle much afaik, but this one might. I don't think it's a stretch to say that in isolation - ie, if someone was viewing the debate who did not know either of them or their history - Vance presented himself well and "won" the debate. Reason being a lot of undecideds in each of Trump's elections have voted against him on character and stability concerns, so if they buy Vance's pitch that he has good character and is stable it could move the needle more than VP debates usually do. I don't think Walz was bad - maybe not perfect but there have certainly been worse performances - but I can't identify what votes he may have picked up. He didn't lose any, which VPs have done (Sarah Palin comes to mind), so that's a positive.

 

[noname223]

Well the plan is ruined early. We get 332 Euro nursing care money monthly because I found out about it. My mom promised me it is my money and she won't touch it. I told her I want to go to my bank for investment plans and that I want to spend 2000 Euros and 100 Euros monthly on ETFs. She asked me but how do you get the 100 Euros monthly? I told her well the nursing care money. She went pale because her lie was revealed. Seemingly, she wants to spend all that money. Some weeks ago she went for a trip and did not tell me a word about it. I ask me whether she financed it with the nursing care money. What a lying bitch. But I cannot do anything against it. She ruined my life once with child abuse. She is about to ruin it twice.

At the same time I could not save all this money anyway. Except if I got enough for a small apartment. If you are unemployed in Germany you are allowed to own 15.000 Euros before you get welfare. Very soon this amount of money gets lowered by the new government sadly.

Again I don't know what the future holds. If I decide to kill myself with the SN stored under my bed one reason less to feel guilty towards my mom. I feel low key betrayed.