Venting I Am Going To CTB Because I Was Born Female

[Popipo]

Look. I'm a dysphoric trans man, and even I find what you wrote here insufferable. Genuinely, I rarely see other dysphoric trans men talk like this. Also, how does your warped worldview fit in trans women?? Many feel like shit on testosterone and much clearer and happier on estrogen lol

Most of what you wrote is bioessentialist, oversimplified, binary and inaccurate nonsense. You're only weak and unfunny etc because you let yourself be that way, not because you're a cis woman. There are weak unfunny men. Men feel fear, cry, etc. Your mindset is an embarrassment, not your hormones or whatever.

 

[todiefor]

This whole thread is just depressing. Whilst the post is quite black and white and simplified, OP clearly has a lot of internalised misogyny, and prob live in an extremely male dominated environment, many countries take this to the extreme. It's really sad but does reflect a lot of society's attitudes, any society today really. She wants to ctb because of it for crying out aloud. Is it entirely necessary to invalidate her struggles and make this about male struggles, and then devolve into a shit fight about your own feelings 10 posts later. Start your own thread about your own problems.

 

[OutOfThisBody]

Look. I'm a dysphoric trans man, and even I find what you wrote here insufferable. Genuinely, I rarely see other dysphoric trans men talk like this. Also, how does your warped worldview fit in trans women?? Many feel like shit on testosterone and much clearer and happier on estrogen lol

Most of what you wrote is bioessentialist, oversimplified, binary and inaccurate nonsense. You're only weak and unfunny etc because you let yourself be that way, not because you're a cis woman. There are weak unfunny men. Men feel fear, cry, etc. Your mindset is an embarrassment, not your hormones or whatever.

How can I keep living when people hate how I think, think what I think is insufferable and embarassing? How can I seek help when I will be met with hate and only feel embarrasment?

But read this and tell me if you think men can be weak -https://www.reddit.com/r/NoStupidQuestions/s/3KWVow20mr

 

[Harasaki]

I don't know in what circumstances you live in or what country, part of what you wrote is historically true but a lot of it is just feminist ideology and is totally biased towards how history happened. I won't get into details but there are historically good things about being a women and bad things about being a man like women never had to spend years on war sleeping on a muddy trench with dead bodies, rats and shit, pretty good huh?

As for women being physically weaker on average, it's true, but honestly in this day and age, does it matter? Never once in my life I had to get physical with someone so yeah I'm probably weaker so what? It literally has no impact in my life lol, it's irrelevant since I live in an alright country in a safe area, I doubt I'll need to physically deffend myself someday.

Also there are women that made scientific progress, you just don't know about them, did you know that the first person to ever program a computer was a woman? But bear in mind that the reason it was mostly men on science for most of history has to do with oppression indeed but it's also because women in average don't want to be on stem science but they'd rather be on other areas like psychology, that's dominated by women, and that's perfectly fine. I'm a woman on stem science and there's literally nothing stopping me, most of my coleagues are men, but I have male friends on phychology and most of their coleagues are women it's natural for men and women to have different interests on average.

Well, I guess the thing is, most of what you said, except if you live in a shit muslim country, is completely irrelevant in today's western society, I'd say being a woman today is way better than being a man as people are way more kind to me and understanding about my mental struggles than with the men in my family that are expected to be strong, but that's just my experience.

Anyways don't believe all things stupid feminists say.

 

[lawlietsph]

Holy shit. This is the first thread that makes me feel horrible - but not because of the op, more like because of the responses.
Look people, look what you do just now. THIS is the fucking reason for all the "who's better; men or women" competition, "who's more in pain? I am, no I am, NO you're not, NO I am!"
What the actual fuck...
Society made y'all fucking puppets, genders are turned against each other like never ever before. How fucking sad is this, I can't even begin to describe.
Look, just look what you all do. I have no idea who's had this wonderful idea of turning men and women against each other like they are deadly enemies, but that individual fucking succeeded.
This is the first time in this forum when I genuinely feel MORE suicidal because of the content I'm seeing. This is just horrendous, fucking hell I'm shocked and disgusted.

 

[Lookingtoflyfree]

I don't mean to belittle your experience and feelings, but I do want to share a male perspective that life isn't exactly so much better.

I think society and this life in general makes it hard for both men and women, not just women or men. Women are physically weaker than men and suffer mentally from their fluctuating hormones. It definitely limits what they are able to do and makes them feel at risk wherever they go. I can see that is why my mother relied on my father to give her good life, unfortunately she had a difficult one.

However most of society adapts to this difference and that's why historically men were the providers of the family and women gave birth and took care of the house and family. But now, the economy is so difficult that one person's income is not enough and requires both the husband and wife to work. In Asian culture, the man is still predominantly seen as the provider and most of the pressure is on him to provide a good quality of life to the family. If he doesn't, the blame goes to the man and he is deemed a failure and he can lose his family as a result. Men can't express their emotions and feelings as they would be seen as weak and as a result, they don't have any close relationships. It is easy to say, just open up, but society doesn't allow for it. That is why men are 3 or 4 times more likely to die by suicide than women. I think the male you are referencing is a very successful male, most average men have very difficult and depressing lives as well.

Not at all surprised with a man giving us a 'well actually' after a woman's post. FFS y'all can't just let a woman have her space huh? You're mansplaining being a man :D

Skimming the thread the multiple men arguing with the OP or repeatedly saying how men have it worse - I don't want to be a woman any more because I am tired of living on a planet where the men do this. Selfish creatures. You make our lives a living hell.

 

[Holu]

I appreciated reading your post, and seeing others respond similarity is quite perspective altering for me. I won't lie, at least on first read this came off as a very incel-esque, internalized misogynistic post, but I can see that there was at least an effort to look beyond that.

I'm sorry for your suffering, truly. And I do not intend to diminish or belittle your suffering or opinions. But I must mention a few things.

Firstly, on the topic of Chinese female infanticde, a large reason for this was family legacy and lineage, where the wife would join their husbands lineage upon marriage. You could argue they murdered female babies because they felt men were inherently superior, but I'd argue it was just the Chinese patriarchal culture, no different from matriarchal societies doing the opposite. Whether the underlying culture was caused by some inherent male dominance is debatable, but the actual practice of female infanticide was more likely driven out of desire to preserve lineage than it was out of direct misogyny. Moreover, similar to how some psychotic tradwives want women to be taken out of the workforce under the premise they would be happier, which as a result is unfair as it prevents women who want to work from working, the concept of massively killing female babies because it's the "rational thing to do" is absurdity because there are many women(and I'd argue more) who would want to be born. Yes ik given the nature of this forum that's not an ideology most people will have here, but based in the average persons reality id assume they are grateful for their birth.

Secondly, as a male, who is on the more introverted and self reflective side, and has dated a woman for 5 years before breaking up, I have never "liked" women because they are "naturally" submissive or do as I wish. As an adult, I'm able to seperate internal sexual desires/fantasies from my general interactions with women. I can understand how you have come to this conclusion possibly due to your life experiences, but I must reiterate that it is not the average truth for any man who was properly raised by their mother. Furthermore, if you have spent any amount of time on the internet, or around bdsm communities you would know how many men are submissive(even if there are more dominant males) and even outside of the sexual atmosphere, there are many marriages which are female dominated. The very popular saying of "happy wife happy life" is a testament to this. This isn't even mentioning the amount of divorces which are filed by women compared to men, which demonstrates female independence and self worth. In the end, it's preference, and preference varies, a lot more than I think you would expect. Not every relationship is founded on who would win in a strength and rape contest. There are so many factors which make women, especially stronger, educated, and more independent women appealing.

As for the Stone Age/presidency thing I do not see how this makes women valueless. In fact, the very act of stunting the developmental capabilities for women in education and politics moreso shows that we do not understand how valuable women truly are. Its the same way how white individuals have a head start on black or other minority groups in the western hemisphere. Just because we have had 45 white presidents and 1 black president in the USA doesn't mean that black people are somehow inherently genetically inferior. The same goes for women.

Additionally on the topic of men are more valuable because they are "brave and adventurous" and "fought in wars with other tribes" yes there was a biological aspect to this, but I'd argue that this in some ways demonstrates lower value. The soldier protecting the castle isn't more socially valuable than the queen within, he is the opposite. Reading some of the male response, this sentiment is still echoed by men who feel valueless chasing and competing with other men for a woman's affection. In the world of bees, males are the strong hunters, gatherers, and expeditionaries, but they are not more valuable than the queen whose job is quite literally child rearing. Even the act of capturing women as slaves for breeding purposes demonstrates this in a twisted way.

Finally, for the sake of my trans friends and the many wonderful trans souls I've had the pleasure of interacting with(most of which are MtF) I can't help but disagree with the sentiment that there isn't some inherent beauty of being a women, even if it means fragility or submissiveness. I originally thought this was an FtM post due to the nature of its title, which obviously it's not, but it still goes to demonstrate how our inherent nature can conflict with social gender rolls that are forced upon us.

Ultimately I wish you well in whatever path or decision you go. I can clearly see your hurting, and I'm sorry for whatever experiences and suffering you have gone through. As with everyone, I ask you to be more kind to yourself, even if you feel undeserving. Whether or not you feel men are better, you are still a conscious and sentient being, which warrants kindness and peace of mind.

To any woman who feels similarly to OP and went through the agony of reading my response feel free to correct or elebarate on this perspective, as I'm genuinely unfamiliar with hyper misogynistic women, so it would be enlightening and help me understand your beliefs.

 

[Lookingtoflyfree]

Look. I'm a dysphoric trans man, and even I find what you wrote here insufferable. Genuinely, I rarely see other dysphoric trans men talk like this. Also, how does your warped worldview fit in trans women?? Many feel like shit on testosterone and much clearer and happier on estrogen lol

Most of what you wrote is bioessentialist, oversimplified, binary and inaccurate nonsense. You're only weak and unfunny etc because you let yourself be that way, not because you're a cis woman. There are weak unfunny men. Men feel fear, cry, etc. Your mindset is an embarrassment, not your hormones or whatever.

Toxic to its core. You should be ashamed of yourself and mods will likely give you a warning.

The 'you're only weak', 'your mindset is an embarassment' and 'insuffferable' is cold and toxic. If you can't be civil go take your comments to another board. It takes nothing to be kind, yet you chose cruelty. Use this as a moment of reflection to ask why you're being toxic to a suicidal person.

I don't want to diminish your feelings as I can see you're hurting a lot and this clearly impacts your life deeply. I don't know your circumstances and your experience of life must have formed these strong beliefs you have, which is sad and worrying.

I will say, however, from my own perspective that it is quite shocking to read what you said about women being less than men, inferior in a lot of ways. That thought alone sounds like internalised misogyny. Women can do anything they put their mind to, people can do anything they put their mind to in general. Of course, each person's upbringing, culture and health will impact on that but, generally speaking, there's nothing stopping either a man or a woman from achieving their goals in western society.

Several of the people I admire are women with a lot of success in their life and they're not celebrities or strangers, but people from my own family or relatives of past friends, colleagues, etc. I'm myself a woman, my family was very poor and it was due to my mother's relentless work that we got into a better state of living. My mother was the driving force of everything good that we got in our life. If it would have been for my father, we would still have a very hard life because he never had the courage to try harder, to think outside the box, to work harder.

Gender means very little, it's the kind of person you are and your beliefs that will dictate what you can accomplish. Of course there are situations where it may be harder for one gender to thrive, due to sexism and being in a male dominated field for example, but that's a hurdle on the way that one can surpass. I've dealt with my fair share of sexism due to being a woman in a male dominated field, it was hard but I moved forward, achieved quite a lot of success in my career.

I'm really sorry you have these beliefs and this almost hatred for the female gender, it must be really hard to deal with and I wonder what happened for you to develop these thoughts and limiting beliefs. It's really serious... For me, being a woman is so nice. I'm not the most feminine person by far but I like being what I am. I find it really heart breaking to see how upset you feel by being a woman. I don't know you but I'm sure you're a wonderful person with a lot of capabilities. Like I said, I wonder what happened, how you developed these ideas?

I hope my post doesn't come across as dismissive as I really empathise with your suffering and truly think it is serious, just wanted to give my perspective, shining some light I guess. So sorry that this is such a painful thing for you, I'd be open to chatting with you if you feel like it could be useful for you?

the 'there's nothing stopping either a man or a woman from achieving their goals in western society' is this 'pull yoursellf up by your bootstraps, ignore sexism, racism, classism and misogyny and just WORK HARDER. It's absolutely dismissive. There's parts of the OP's post I don't agree with but the nitpicking and the submissiveness towards someone's lived experience is shameful. I'd love to find a board of people exploring CTB from empathy. This board ain't it.

 

[Holu]

Toxic to its core. You should be ashamed of yourself and mods will likely give you a warning.

The 'you're only weak', 'your mindset is an embarassment' and 'insuffferable' is cold and toxic. If you can't be civil go take your comments to another board. It takes nothing to be kind, yet you chose cruelty. Use this as a moment of reflection to ask why you're being toxic to a suicidal person.

I'm based so I will always come to the defense of a trans person, but I disagree it's toxic to its core. Both OP and the user your responding to are sharing their ideologies born of their experiences, those being similar in origin, but separate in execution. Perhaps I'm interpreting the "your weak" wrong but my understanding is that they meant "you see yourself as such because your choosing to". Yes while slightly offensive in nature, I don't think the intent was to be. I see it as more defensive, since OPs post is essentially dismissive of the entire Tmasc reality. The only real issue I have with the responder is the portion on hormones, which do genuinely have an impact, and saying E is easier than T is entirely dismissive of one's struggles as hormones and how we interact with them is to nuanced to be state one is harder than the other as a truth.

As for the other person you're responding to you are completely right lmao. The last thing we need in this forum is meritocracy, since it doesn't help just ignores problems.

 

[mpk]

Not at all surprised with a man giving us a 'well actually' after a woman's post. FFS y'all can't just let a woman have her space huh? You're mansplaining being a man :D

Skimming the thread the multiple men arguing with the OP or repeatedly saying how men have it worse - I don't want to be a woman any more because I am tired of living on a planet where the men do this. Selfish creatures. You make our lives a living hell.

You're missing the point. Most men are replying to OP, not because they want to dismiss her difficulties and experiences as a woman. OP has brought up her difficulties as a woman and then subsequently dismissed mens difficulties (saying she wish she was born a man and mens lives are easier) in one post.

I'm Asian and experienced racism as I moved from city to city. If I express my difficulties as an Asian and my experiences with racism, I would not then dismiss and overshadow other peoples difficulties by saying "white people have it easy in every way, i wish i was born white". You can imagine the reaction I would receive right?

Hope this clarifies things.

 

[hushpuppi-savastano]

I don't know what I did to deserve being born as a woman. Literally everybody hates women and likes to see them fail, be embarassed, and get hurt. Women are so weak compared to men and were dominated by men for most of human history. Being a man is so much better.

I wish my parents killed me as a baby, it would have been the rational thing to do. China has had a history of female infanticide for 2000 years and their society was not hindered by this. They recognized that men were more valuable than women and so they killed many of their female babies. They put us in piles of trash or drowned us or left us alone to starve.

I cant live this half-life anymore, being half as strong as men, half as funny, half as good at leading, crying more and being more emotional and scared. Look it up, all of these are proven. Its worse than being dead to live this way, its an embarassment.

Womens' hormones during their reproductive years even make them more likely to have depression and mood swings than men, while testosterone has an antidepressant effect and increases motivation and risktaking. Men are biologically more brave and adventurous. Living as a woman is full of pain, including every month just for existing.Because of this even simply existing in a womans' body is worse.

Men are able to do much more interesting things because they are much stronger. Puberty makes men stronger and gives women the ability to give birth. Given the chance, I would have chosen to become stronger.

Men evolved to be hunters, protectors, and warriors in hunter-gatherer societies while women were gatherers and reared children. Men fought all the wars with other tribes and women were kidnapped from their villages after a war and taken as property because they were helpless to defend against their invaders. I would have preferred to be a hunter/warrior, of course, and be built that way. Men have the honour of being able to say their bodies are built for fighting.

Sexism started because women weren't able to fight off men who wanted to control them. Why be alive in a body that is so risky?

People may say they like women but what they mean is they like women who do what they want and behave how they want. Men dominate in relationships and in bed, while women submit. I don't want to submit, but if I don't people say its unnatural and no one will want me. Maybe it is, considering what I wrote before. So I can never be in a relationship in this body in the way I want.

From the stone age to 1950 or so women were prevented from making scientific discoveries, leading, and making contributions to society, and our society made many advances. So how can we say that women are valuable? How can we say that patriarchy is not justifiied? We have never even had a president thats a woman before in the U.S., or a female prime minister in Canada. No one wants to elect one.

The saddest thing is sometimes i catch myself accepting how many things I cant do, accepting a life where I am unfulfilled and limited this way, where I can't take risks and have adventures and enjoy what I want, (Most of the things I want to do have men in the vast majority of participants, including reddit) and it makes me sad. This is why I'm going to commit suicide. I can't live in this small, sad life and body anymore. I can't sit here and rot for 60 years.

Soon I will be diving headfirst onto the sidewalk from a high building. My weak woman's skull will shatter quickly and easily and my brains will spill out onto the concrete.

I'm waiting until my birthday in a month, and in the meantime I will try to do all the things that I enjoy and are on my bucket list. Even this proves hard however knowing I am stuck in this embarassing body in the meantime. I can't even go out at night to look at the stars in case I get raped or attacked. And its dangerous to do things alone as a woman. If I get attacked, people will blame me, wondering how I could be so stupid to have been out alone, been out in a new place, etc. So, maybe I should end it quicker.

My only hope of living how I want is if reincarnation exists, but even if it doesn't I still prefer being dead to being alive like this.

TL;DR, All of this is to say, I can't take the limited existance of being a woman anymore and I am going to move onto the next life soon.

I think your real issue is poverty, physical strength in today's society no longer means anything.

 

[pyx]

i don't want to be rude, but wasn't there a woman's support thread which was made to circumvent issues of men replying to these vent threads with their unsolicited perspectives?

 

[day]

This thread has gone haywire. Any further misogyny, trans hate, or hate period after this comment will be swiftly removed and the poster will be issued a warning. OP is allowed to vent their opinion and should be able to do so without being attacked. If there's nothing supportive to say don't say it. I'll leave it at that.

Thread will stay open for reasonable replies.

 

[RainAndSadness]

That is why men are 3 or 4 times more likely to die by suicide than women.

Just wanted to point out that women have a higher suicide attempt rate. The only reason why the suicide rate of men is higher is because they're using more lethal means to commit suicide. But comparing the raw numbers like that doesn't really make much sense.

 

[Lookingtoflyfree]

You're missing the point. Most men are replying to OP, not because they want to dismiss her difficulties and experiences as a woman. OP has brought up her difficulties as a woman and then subsequently dismissed mens difficulties (saying she wish she was born a man and mens lives are easier) in one post.

I'm Asian and experienced racism as I moved from city to city. If I express my difficulties as an Asian and my experiences with racism, I would not then dismiss and overshadow other peoples difficulties by saying "white people have it easy in every way, i wish i was born white". You can imagine the reaction I would receive right?

Hope this clarifies things.

Men do have an easier life - men can experience stress and I'm not dismissing it, but men don't have to worry about personal safety, deal with a wage gap and toxic workplaces where women are insulted, ignored, mansplained and sexually harassed. The patriarchy is brutal.

I'm based so I will always come to the defense of a trans person, but I disagree it's toxic to its core. Both OP and the user your responding to are sharing their ideologies born of their experiences, those being similar in origin, but separate in execution. Perhaps I'm interpreting the "your weak" wrong but my understanding is that they meant "you see yourself as such because your choosing to". Yes while slightly offensive in nature, I don't think the intent was to be. I see it as more defensive, since OPs post is essentially dismissive of the entire Tmasc reality. The only real issue I have with the responder is the portion on hormones, which do genuinely have an impact, and saying E is easier than T is entirely dismissive of one's struggles as hormones and how we interact with them is to nuanced to be state one is harder than the other as a truth.

As for the other person you're responding to you are completely right lmao. The last thing we need in this forum is meritocracy, since it doesn't help just ignores problems.

I defend trans people but this person was being an asshole. Far more than slightly offensive. Intent doesn't matter - impact does. This forum is a dumpster fire because of responses like theirs.

 

[kinderbueno]

Men do have an easier life - men can experience stress and I'm not dismissing it, but men don't have to worry about personal safety, deal with a wage gap and toxic workplaces where women are insulted, ignored, mansplained and sexually harassed. The patriarchy is brutal.

As a woman I disagree, men have their own issues too such as not being able to show emotions due to it being frowned upon, and being told that crying makes them "weak". Also male victims of sexual abuse and rape in particular are often told that they're "lucky" and they should've just "fought back". There's also problems that affect both men and women such as unrealistic beauty standards set by society. I think it's unfair to say that men have it easier because they have very different issues compared to women. This is just my opinion

 

[Lookingtoflyfree]

As a woman I disagree, men have their own issues too such as not being able to show emotions due to it being frowned upon, and being told that crying makes them "weak". Also male victims of sexual abuse and rape in particular are often told that they're "lucky" and they should've just "fought back". There's also problems that affect both men and women such as unrealistic beauty standards set by society. I think it's unfair to say that men have it easier because they have very different issues compared to women. This is just my opinion

JFC. Literally nobody is saying that men don't have problems - there also have difficult gender norms.

This is also whatabout-ism. They absolutey have it easier in key areas like reproductive freedom and not worrying about being raped and murdered in public to the same extent.

This is part of the reason this thread is a dumpster fire. We should probably close the thread. A lot of you have shown your true misogynistic colors.

 

[OutOfThisBody]

In the world of bees, males are the strong hunters, gatherers, and expeditionaries, but they are not more valuable than the queen whose job is quite literally child rearing.

First I think you are confused about bees because the worker bees who guard the hive are all female actually. The drones only mate and die.

On how the queen is more valuable - yeah but I dont want to rear children so what the fuck am I supposed to do. I don't vibe with any activites assigned to women so what the fuck am I supposed to do. I want to hunt and do expeditions. Am I unvaluable now? These valuable women I guess are conventionally pretty and only like conventionally feminine things?

Also you say men protect women - yeah like that's happening. Men are a threat to women more than anything. You just said it when you mentioned women being kidnapped and raped. Being unable to protect yourself means you are vulnerable. No men are looking out for women, if they are, it's only because they want to protect their 'property' from other men.

Being weaker like this means you don't have anything to be proud about in your body, except that you can pop out babies if you are into that. Are women only valuable if they give birth, then? Men are twice as strong, where women only live 5 years longer than men on average, and this gap is closing. Really valuable right? Women are also over emotional from their cycles and cry easier, which is less valuable.