Discussion Hierarchy

[slyna]

The more I experience people the more I understand hierarchy is a big thing for most people. Like it's pretty disgusting how much they care for it. I see it everywhere in plenty of actions.

It's even a thing for the nerds when all they can do for hierarchy is to show others they KNOW something or knows it all.

Don't you hate it?

 

[Pluto]

It's a fundamental part of the human condition to form hierarchies. It's also an important part of many animal species (e.g. wolves) with whom we share the majority of our DNA.

I think it's possible for us to be more than this and to find a new way of living. But perhaps that is too idealistic.

 

[BeyondGoodNEvil]

its how life is.people want to strive to be above all else.life has always been a huge game where winners take it all.you think we would've gotten all this luxury of modern tech and comfort if we were all easily sympathetic to one another as a species.people will strive to be their best form they can and they want to show for it.

 

[slyna]

its how life is.people want to strive to be above all else.life has always been a huge game where winners take it all.you think we would've gotten all this luxury of modern tech and comfort if we were all easily sympathetic to one another as a species.people will strive to be their best form they can and they want to show for it.

What do you gain for trash talking other people? (For example)

 

[BeyondGoodNEvil]

what do mean.im just saying how things are.if their weren't hierarchies we wouldnt be in this stage of life beacuse if theirs no competition theirs no improvements regarding anything in life.

 

[Fakereality]

World is shitty place with no meaning most human beings try to find their meanings by forming hierarchy and treat each other like shit it's like a sadistic Pyramid structure where the top guy gets to bully the bottom ones and the bottom ones can bully the ones which are below them and so on people at the very top aren't satisfied with just being the top ones they want something more than that and that something comes in the form of a strange bond in which they give pain to the bottom ones it's like a form of bdsm on a global scale.
Some people hate this Pyramid hierarchy while most human beings just accept it since they have been born under it they cannot imagine a life without so they all formed such misconception that the world would be hell without it though that's my take on it.

 

[motel rooms]

It's possible to create better societies (it's obvious that it's better to be sick & unemployable in Sweden than in the US), but it's impossible to completely eradicate hierarchies/inequality. The strong will always take advantage of the weak, it's a law of nature. Is it unfair & ugly? Well, duh. Of course life is ugly & merciless.

 

[Deleted member 8579]

you think we would've gotten all this luxury of modern tech and comfort if we were all easily sympathetic to one another as a species.

A golden cage is still a cage. Modern technology is not a convenience, but a dependency.

if their weren't hierarchies we wouldnt be in this stage of life beacuse if theirs no competition theirs no improvements regarding anything in life.

Do you really believe Beethoven wrote his ninth or Gauß proved the Theorema Egregium because they were competing against someone?
It is true that most superficial advancements are due to competition, but most of the deep insights or artworks are due to men who wanted to prove something to themselves.

 

[BeyondGoodNEvil]

A golden cage is still a cage. Modern technology is not a convenience, but a dependency.

depends any ilness or anything your depended to medicine, other then that it is mostly convenience say you want to go to shop its easier to go by car.but u dont have to u can walk,cycle hell dont go to the shop hunt for your food.if your some form disabled then yeah sadly your depended to society but most people can adapt to any scenario they face.

Do you really believe Beethoven wrote his ninth or Gauß proved the Theorema Egregium because they were competing against someone?
It is true that most superficial advancements are due to competition, but most of the deep insights or artworks were created by men who wanted to prove something to themselves.

Your right about those topics artworks philosophy their all self reflections wanting to prove something to themselves.but still hierarchical they would be placed above a normal person casue their minds influence to the masses.people look up to them and they to start to wonder and create which in a sense creates competition not to beat them but to be in the same position as them.

 

[Deleted member 8579]

depends any ilness or anything your depended to medicine, other then that it is mostly convenience say you want to go to shop its easier to go by car.but u dont have to u can walk,cycle hell dont go to the shop hunt for your food.if your some form disabled then yeah sadly your depended to society but most

The problem is that there is no going back. People have grown accustomed to the amenities of modern life and would never willingly surrender it, and even if they wanted to, they couldn't. A lot of knowledge and many skills have been lost in the process of automatisation.
People have no patience. I once watched a "Columbo" episode where they spent a good three minutes showing him make a turn around in car, all in a single static shot. Nowadays you can't go a second without some franatic cut. A letter needed time to arrive, and that was okay. Since the advent of e-mail and smartphones, people suddenly have no time to wait for an answer anymore.

The worst part is that you have no choice; once the new technology becomes commonplace, you need to familiarise yourself with it.
To quote Kaczynski:

"A technological advance that appears not to threaten freedom often turns out to threaten it
very seriously later on. For example, consider motorized transport. A walking man formerly
could go where he pleased, go at his own pace without observing any traffic regulations, and was
independent of technological support-systems. When motor vehicles were introduced they
appeared to increase man's freedom. They took no freedom away from the walking man, no one
had to have an automobile if he didn't want one, and anyone who did choose to buy an automobile
could travel much faster and farther than a walking man. But the introduction of motorized
transport soon changed society in such a way as to restrict greatly man's freedom of
locomotion. When automobiles became numerous, it became necessary to regulate their use
extensively. In a car, especially in densely populated areas, one cannot just go where one likes at
one's own pace; one's movement is governed by the flow of traffic and by various traffic
laws. One is tied down by various obligations: license requirements, driver test, renewing
registration, insurance, maintenance required for safety, monthly payments on purchase
price. Moreover, the use of motorized transport is no longer optional. Since the introduction of
motorized transport the arrangement of our cities has changed in such a way that the majority of
people no longer live within walking distance of their place of employment, shopping areas and
recreational opportunities, so that they have to depend on the automobile for transportation. Or
else they must use public transportation, in which case they have even less control over their own
movement than when driving a car. Even the walker's freedom is now greatly restricted. In the
city he continually has to stop to wait for traffic lights that are designed mainly to serve auto
traffic. In the country, motor traffic makes it dangerous and unpleasant to walk along the
highway. (Note this important point that we have just illustrated with the case of motorized
transport: When a new item of technology is introduced as an option that an individual can accept
or not as he chooses, it does not necessarily remain optional. In many cases the new technology
changes society in such a way that people eventually find themselves forced to use it.)"

This is why I believe that modern technology is not a convenience, but a dependency. Just try to live in modern society without a computer, a smartphone and a car and see how far it will get you.

 

[BeyondGoodNEvil]

The problem is that there is no going back. People have grown accustomed to the amenities of modern life and would never willingly surrender it, and even if they wanted to, they couldn't. A lot of knowledge and many skills have been lost in the process of automatisation.
People have no patience. I once watched a "Columbo" episode where they spent a good three minutes showing him make a turn around in car, all in a single static shot. Nowadays you can't go a second without some franatic cut. A letter needed time to arrive, and that was okay. Since the advent of e-mail and smartphones, people suddenly have no time to wait for an answer anymore.

The worst part is that you have no choice; once the new technology becomes commonplace, you need to familiarise yourself with it.
To quote Kaczynski:

"A technological advance that appears not to threaten freedom often turns out to threaten it
very seriously later on. For example, consider motorized transport. A walking man formerly
could go where he pleased, go at his own pace without observing any traffic regulations, and was
independent of technological support-systems. When motor vehicles were introduced they
appeared to increase man's freedom. They took no freedom away from the walking man, no one
had to have an automobile if he didn't want one, and anyone who did choose to buy an automobile
could travel much faster and farther than a walking man. But the introduction of motorized
transport soon changed society in such a way as to restrict greatly man's freedom of
locomotion. When automobiles became numerous, it became necessary to regulate their use
extensively. In a car, especially in densely populated areas, one cannot just go where one likes at
one's own pace; one's movement is governed by the flow of traffic and by various traffic
laws. One is tied down by various obligations: license requirements, driver test, renewing
registration, insurance, maintenance required for safety, monthly payments on purchase
price. Moreover, the use of motorized transport is no longer optional. Since the introduction of
motorized transport the arrangement of our cities has changed in such a way that the majority of
people no longer live within walking distance of their place of employment, shopping areas and
recreational opportunities, so that they have to depend on the automobile for transportation. Or
else they must use public transportation, in which case they have even less control over their own
movement than when driving a car. Even the walker's freedom is now greatly restricted. In the
city he continually has to stop to wait for traffic lights that are designed mainly to serve auto
traffic. In the country, motor traffic makes it dangerous and unpleasant to walk along the
highway. (Note this important point that we have just illustrated with the case of motorized
transport: When a new item of technology is introduced as an option that an individual can accept
or not as he chooses, it does not necessarily remain optional. In many cases the new technology
changes society in such a way that people eventually find themselves forced to use it.)"

This is why I believe that modern technology is not a convenience, but a dependency. Just try to live in modern society without a computer, a smartphone and a car and see how far it will get you.

why did i read this but anyway environment cities/towns has changed to suit cars and all but still you can do what i have mentioned its not easy but it is an option.

 

[Superdeterminist]

I despise hierarchies and the defnse of them. People who embrace hierachies are always the ones at the top of said hierachies. Put them at the bottom of the hierarchy, and see how their tune changes. Nobody wants to be below someone else, that's the problem with hierarchies.

 

[motel rooms]

I despise hierarchies and the defnse of them. People who embrace hierachies are always the ones at the top of said hierachies. Put them at the bottom of the hierarchy, and see how their tune changes. Nobody wants to be below someone else, that's the problem with hierarchies.

I despise them too, but there's no such thing as a human population without a certain degree of inequality/hierarchy. Like I said, it's much better to live in an egalitarian Scandinavian country than in the US, but everywhere where there is variation there is always inequality. Some are born to sweet delight, some are born to endless night...