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Hi @Smellanie,
I am glad you considered the neighbors. Of all four walls, is there one behind which there are no residents? Can you choose to aim toward a path whereby the projectile would have to travel through multiple walls? I am no ballistics expert, but do not believe a 9mm could travel through a skull and more than two walls.
Does the abandoned property have a concrete wall you could sit back against? Perhaps lie on your back so the bullet goes into the ground?
My guess is that a 9mm aftermath would be minimal, especially compared to shotgun CTB. @Runrunaway , can you advise?
It all really depends, I would say it's unlikely especially if one uses hollow point rounds as hollow points expand upon contact of the area it hits. As for walls, I think for most rounds (depending on the wall of course) it doesn't overpenetrate unless it is an armor-piercing round, but for most cases that's irrelevant since most people who own guns either have FMJ's (Full Metal Jacket) or HP's (Hollow Points). For the last point, yes a 9mm would leave less of a mess as it's just one bullet penetrating the head/hit the brainstem whereas a shotgun cartridge contains many projectiles that spread out causing much more damage, especially at point blank range (buckshot and birdshot).
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While that may seem to be a way to do it, there is more room for error as any slight deviation from the angle may result in non-lethal damage and/or surviving. I believe there is better control if one can see where the angle of the gun is aimed at as well as having one's hands in front rather than behind.
Probably good enough but a shotgun would be much better. Bud Dwyer used a .357. You can see how well that worked. For all practical purposes the diameter of a 357 bullet is the same as the 9 mm. The .357 is a little more powerful though. Another thing to consider is the 357 is generally shot from a revolver which is what Mr Dwyer used, while 9 mm is generally shot from a semi-automatic. A revolver is a very reliable gun, especially for a novice, a person who hasn't practiced a lot, which i think would be the case with many here. You put bullets in a revolver (simpler and easier to do than with the auto), you pull the trigger, it shoots. It shoots no matter how you hold it. On the other hand there would be a slight chance that the semi-automatic might jam at the crucial moment, especially if you have a weak grip on it (Glocks are bad that way) , tho i think that would more effect the second shot, which in this case should be irrelevant, tho there have been cases where it wasn't. If that were to happen it would be psychologically devestating..
No, a 9mm is more than sufficient for a lethal wound, especially with hollow point rounds. While FMJ (full metal jacket) rounds could result in lethality, hollow points are better than FMJ because they expand and disperse energy about and around the affected area upon impact rather than just piercing through like a FMJ round would.
No, a 9mm is more than sufficient for a lethal wound, especially with hollow point rounds. While FMJ (full metal jacket) rounds could result in lethality, hollow points are better than FMJ because they expand and disperse energy about and around the affected area upon impact rather than just piercing through like a FMJ round would.
Actually, it is if you hit the brain stem directly. There hasn't been any stories of people hitting the brainstem, whether with a heavy or light caliber and survived or lived to tell about it. The people who failed via firearms are those who hit some other non-lethal part of the brain/body and were likely saved before they succumbed to death (either via bloodloss, trauma, or shock). The people who survived gunshot wounds oftenly aimed below the chin (which is a very, very bad idea and Hollywood movies are BS when it comes to reality, especially firearm suicides) and/or hit the frontal lobe of their brain (blowing out their reasoning, logic, and speech area of the brain, whereas life sustaining parts of the brain, the brainstem and the back of the brain are those that control bloodflow, heart, and breathing.)
So far, my plan has been in park/forested areas away from people, places. If you're taking the shot directly, you likely won't need a lot of room. I've also looked at laying sideways on the ground/bench and firing downwards towards the ground. No concern about any errant shots that way...
I've ruled out indoors or within my car due to clean up reasons (also if they have to sell my car, it can still be sold).
i really relate to this thread and people's concerns over harm to others. i live near an area where i can drive far away and likely not be found for awhile as well as avoiding people, so i'm fortunate in that regard. i haven't bought the gun yet due to lack of experience and wanting to research, but i'm gonna go with a revolver or handgun. if i aim for that brain stem ~ through the mouth and slightly upwards ~ and have little chance of discovery, i believe i'm good. god, i hope so. but, i mostly don't want to harm anyone else.
Actually, it is if you hit the brain stem directly. There hasn't been any stories of people hitting the brainstem, whether with a heavy or light caliber and survived or lived to tell about it. The people who failed via firearms are those who hit some other non-lethal part of the brain/body and were likely saved before they succumbed to death (either via bloodloss, trauma, or shock). The people who survived gunshot wounds oftenly aimed below the chin (which is a very, very bad idea and Hollywood movies are BS when it comes to reality, especially firearm suicides) and/or hit the frontal lobe of their brain (blowing out their reasoning, logic, and speech area of the brain, whereas life sustaining parts of the brain, the brainstem and the back of the brain are those that control bloodflow, heart, and breathing.)
Agreed, but you can be more sure of hitting the brainstem with something that makes a bigger hole, namely a shotgun. There is always the possibility of involuntary flinching, even in the mouth...
i really relate to this thread and people's concerns over harm to others. i live near an area where i can drive far away and likely not be found for awhile as well as avoiding people, so i'm fortunate in that regard. i haven't bought the gun yet due to lack of experience and wanting to research, but i'm gonna go with a revolver or handgun. if i aim for that brain stem ~ through the mouth and slightly upwards ~ and have little chance of discovery, i believe i'm good. god, i hope so. but, i mostly don't want to harm anyone else.
If you are going with a revolver (which is a handgun) get a larger calibre handgun, at least a .357 magnum, which is what Bud Dwyer used so effectively. I'd also recommend a longer barreled revolver so you can grip the barrel with your other hand, again what Mister Dwyer did. I think a shotgun is much better though, and usually less hassle to acquire.
Agreed, but you can be more sure of hitting the brainstem with something that makes a bigger hole, namely a shotgun. There is always the possibility of involuntary flinching, even in the mouth...
You are kind.
If you are going with a revolver (which is a handgun) get a larger calibre handgun, at least a .357 magnum, which is what Bud Dwyer used so effectively. I'd also recommend a longer barreled revolver so you can grip the barrel with your other hand, again what Mister Dwyer did. I think a shotgun is much better though, and usually less hassle to acquire.
For people who never fired a gun or aren't used to recoil and sound, yes, it's possible they could 'flinch' in anticipation of the shot, but if they shoot a few times at the gun range, then they would acclimate to the sound as well as the recoil of the gun. The bullet would have already left the barrel of the gun sooner than the actual recoil (like in 0.001 seconds).
As for a shotgun, yes, I do agree, it is much better and generally easier to acquire. The only downsides are the size and length of it, making transportation a bit more of a hassle (having a gun case and storing it especially if one doesn't live alone) whereas a pistol, handgun it is easier to put into a container that fits and do so. Also, there are some people who find that it is hard to position the shotgun in their mouth and pull the trigger. Either way, I'm ok with either the shotgun or pistol.
I'm envious of you Americans with access to guns. I'd use a .45. I would prefer a 12 gauge for maximum efficiency but it might too much for the people who have to dispose of my body.
Hello, I am planning to CTB via shotgun; I have purchased #00 buckshot ammunition, copper plated; the shotgun i have is 12 GA with an 18.5" barrel. My question being is that if copper plated ammunition is fine and if it is ok to point the gun at the temple as that is where i feel most comfortable with it being.
Hello, I am planning to CTB via shotgun; I have purchased #00 buckshot ammunition, copper plated; the shotgun i have is 12 GA with an 18.5" barrel. My question being is that if copper plated ammunition is fine and if it is ok to point the gun at the temple as that is where i feel most comfortable with it being.
Given that a shotgun is a longgun, it may be a bit difficult to angle it properly when aimed at the temple. With long guns, or any gun for the matter, I prefer through the mouth as it's easier for me to control and also less dense matter (bones) to go through before hitting the brainstem or near it.
While that may seem to be a way to do it, there is more room for error as any slight deviation from the angle may result in non-lethal damage and/or surviving. I believe there is better control if one can see where the angle of the gun is aimed at as well as having one's hands in front rather than behind.
I have .38 cal. smith and wesson revolver but I know from target shooting and MANY people on the web who tried using a gun and survived with half a head....seems like it better be a shot gun or another method.
I have .38 cal. smith and wesson revolver but I know from target shooting and MANY people on the web who tried using a gun and survived with half a head....seems like it better be a shot gun or another method.
A shotgun may be better, but only if using the correct ammo (00 buckshot, slugs, #2 birdshot, #0 birdshot, BB birdshot). This is because if you use insufficient ammo you would likely survive with a lot of serious injuries and high possibility of permanent damage.
As for people who have failed, it is likely they aimed at the wrong spot (never aim below the chin!) and/or they used the wrong caliber for it. Another factor is anticipating the shot and they flinch, causing the barrel to miss the mark and hit somewhere where it only results in a serious injury but with a high chance of survival.
I'm only going to comment by saying whatever you do, don't use or view that crappy rendering as having any real accuracy regarding any anatomic landmarks.
A shotgun may be better, but only if using the correct ammo (00 buckshot, slugs, #2 birdshot, #0 birdshot, BB birdshot). This is because if you use insufficient ammo you would likely survive with a lot of serious injuries and high possibility of permanent damage.
As for people who have failed, it is likely they aimed at the wrong spot (never aim below the chin!) and/or they used the wrong caliber for it. Another factor is anticipating the shot and they flinch, causing the barrel to miss the mark and hit somewhere where it only results in a serious injury but with a high chance of survival.
Right.....the flinching and/or trouble pulling the trigger pressure can aim the gun in the wrong direction. People just need to know the way it is done in movies does NOT always work.
Given that a shotgun is a longgun, it may be a bit difficult to angle it properly when aimed at the temple. With long guns, or any gun for the matter, I prefer through the mouth as it's easier for me to control and also less dense matter (bones) to go through before hitting the brainstem or near it.
Given that a shotgun is a longgun, it may be a bit difficult to angle it properly when aimed at the temple. With long guns, or any gun for the matter, I prefer through the mouth as it's easier for me to control and also less dense matter (bones) to go through before hitting the brainstem or near it.
Also is it feasible to aim behind the ear with my shotgun instead of the place i mentioned earlier (the temple). Either way I am pretty sure i am going to blow my brains out no matter where i aim.
Also is it feasible to aim behind the ear with my shotgun instead of the place i mentioned earlier (the temple). Either way I am pretty sure i am going to blow my brains out no matter where i aim.
That whole Adam Lanza/Sandy Hook story was pure fiction. And why would you want to try crazy contortions like pointing a gun to the back of your own head, tho i suppose it would work with a handgun, pulling the trigger with your thumb, but there's avery high likelihood of just badly wounding yourself. People are telling you the right way to do it if do it you must, and that is in the mouth pointing slightly upwards.
I'd still like to know if anyone besides me ever heard of the claim that if you can manage to do it while your mouth is full of water - and I'm not sure how that would work - your whole head will explode.
I agreed with that PP that said technically "any" gun would do. Hell yeah if you aim the muzzle right at the skin of your skull and blast it.
I used to look down on handgun and revolver, but look at this baby. This is a .500-Smith-Wesson-Magnum. With the bullet this size, aim point blank at your head, you would go. I saw a Youtube of someone test this with a watermelon, which bigger and heavier than a human head, guess what, it literally blast that watermelon to pieces.
Too bad I already have a tactical shotgun, or else this one it good too.
The video with a .500 S&W Magnum is definitely overkill and it is a handcannon because of the large caliber and huge recoil from the shot. I would not go as far as to suggest that because unless someone has strong and steady hands, wrists, it may be more trouble than it's worth. A 9mm, .357 magnum, #00 buckshot would be more than sufficient.
Hey guys I have read over this thread before but I'm still left with many questions. I would be combining fire arm with n or sn for extra effect. I just have very small weak hands. I gather from reading that recoil isn't an issue here but in past i have struggled to rack the slide or pull a trigger due to bad hand strength. Handgun I can hide is my only option. And I gather from reading I should stick to hollow point bullets? Anyone have and advice on what type or caliber I need I'm very clueless? Would 9mm be better or a 375 revolver type...again apologies im clueless. I'm.scared my very weak hands will ruin this for me. Pm me if you rather. Thank you.
Hey guys I have read over this thread before but I'm still left with many questions. I would be combining fire arm with n or sn for extra effect. I just have very small weak hands. I gather from reading that recoil isn't an issue here but in past i have struggled to rack the slide or pull a trigger due to bad hand strength. Handgun I can hide is my only option. And I gather from reading I should stick to hollow point bullets? Anyone have and advice on what type or caliber I need I'm very clueless? Would 9mm be better or a 375 revolver type...again apologies im clueless. I'm.scared my very weak hands will ruin this for me. Pm me if you rather. Thank you.
You mean a .357 revolver, which is what Budd Dwyer used. Perhaps you've seen the video. Yes a .357 revolver would be good, not one of the ultra compacts but a bigger gun with a 4 or 6 inch barrel, and yes hollow point bullets...you just ask for "defense ammo", as opposed to practice ammo. There is no slide to rack on a revolver, and if you cock the revolver's hammer (that's called shooting it "single action") the trigger pull is very light and easy. You should know, however, that guns and ammo are scarce right now, much of it sold out.
You mean a .357 revolver, which is what Budd Dwyer used. Perhaps you've seen the video. Yes a .357 revolver would be good, not one of the ultra compacts but a bigger gun with a 4 or 6 inch barrel, and yes hollow point bullets...you just ask for "defense ammo", as opposed to practice ammo. There is no slide to rack on a revolver, and if you cock the revolver's hammer (that's called shooting it "single action") the trigger pull is very light and easy. You should know, however, that guns and ammo are scarce right now, much of it sold out.
Thanks for your helpful reply. Yes .357 revolver that's what I meant. Well shit.. I guess I should have figured this stuff would be scarce with covid. I was really just trying to get a backup method to ensure I'm 100% gone I have my main method.
Thanks for your helpful reply. Yes .357 revolver that's what I meant. Well shit.. I guess I should have figured this stuff would be scarce with covid. I was really just trying to get a backup method to ensure I'm 100% gone I have my main method.
You mean a .357 revolver, which is what Budd Dwyer used. Perhaps you've seen the video. Yes a .357 revolver would be good, not one of the ultra compacts but a bigger gun with a 4 or 6 inch barrel, and yes hollow point bullets...you just ask for "defense ammo", as opposed to practice ammo. There is no slide to rack on a revolver, and if you cock the revolver's hammer (that's called shooting it "single action") the trigger pull is very light and easy. You should know, however, that guns and ammo are scarce right now, much of it sold out.
This is correct and also the last sentence is true too, depending on where you live in the US. I live in the Southeastern part of the US and due to the pandemic, the riots around various parts of the country, and of course, this being an election year (2020), firearms are becoming more difficult to acquire due to people buying them up very quickly. Even local and small shops are having difficulties keeping up with the demand.
Depending on how the election goes, there may either be a panic buy (fear of new gun control restrictions and/or bans) or even a drop in demand. There is no definite timeline of when the pandemic will end though, I suppose it depends on how the cases fare (whether there is a continued surge or resurgence) and whether an "effective" vaccine is available for the masses.
The video with a .500 S&W Magnum is definitely overkill and it is a handcannon because of the large caliber and huge recoil from the shot. I would not go as far as to suggest that because unless someone has strong and steady hands, wrists, it may be more trouble than it's worth. A 9mm, .357 magnum, #00 buckshot would be more than sufficient.
As a gun noob who has never fired a gun in my life (yeah, I'm not proud of it), if I were to use a .357 magnum, would I need practice with it at a range before ctb for it to work, or could I safely do it as soon as I have it?
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