Oh my god LETS ROLL
You paint Ukraine as this peaceful utopia, how come the government was killing innocent people in donetsk and luhansk for the last 8 years?
Ukraine has never been a utopia, far from that. There was a civil war in Donetsk and Luhansk for 8 years, indeed. We didn't call it that simply because admission that there is a civil war would require state-wide marital law with all the shitty consequences. If we go in detail this post will be 3 miles long. But the abridged version is this: actions of Ukrainians army really harmed the civilians. Actions of their opponents, local self-proclaimed republics actively backed by Russia also really harmed the civillians. Both sides made life shit for the civilians. The total count of civilian casualties in DNR-LNR military conflict is 25 people killed and 85 injured in 2021 alone, not all of them were killed by the Ukrainian side, the killings were all accidental some were one sides fault, some the others, some we don't even know. Killing 25 civilians is awful. However, the total count of civilian casualties in this war in 6 DAYS is already over 2000 civilians killed. I realize that any war is awful, but the things that are happening now are, to put it mildly, an escalation.
How did the war start? Well, to put in simply some random people with AK-47s went and took over city administrations and declared that they are now in charge. Some locals thought they are great guys and agreed with their ideas. Most were just terrified. I know because I personally know 6 formally internally displaced people that fleed from there to my city because my city is close. I know first person accounts. The government moved in the army to kick the guys with AKs out of there, because well, if you take over the government building with weapons and declare that now your city is independent with you as a leader, the government will send military to get you, that is the logical conclusion. Ukrainian military attacked, the "new government" fought back, Russia supplied the "new government" with enough weapons to hold back Ukrainian army, military action went on and on and on for 8 years, civilians suffered. Should've Ukrainian army removed their military and just let those areas secede to stop bloodshed? Maybe, but that is debatable. There were civilian casualties, but right now I have a person I know that moved to my city from Luhansk in 2015 to avoid the military conflict, and then in 2020 she moved back because things were looking up and she wanted to go home! And things were looking up, up until the last few days. I talked to her on the phone yesterday. The situation is super dire. A LOT worse than before she fled the first time when the conflict was local.
TL DR: There was a conflict. The reasons are complicated and both side's fault. But things that are happening now are much worse, for everyone, including the people inside of Luhansk (and most likely Donetsk too).
Are you are aware of what NATO has done to countries like Libya and Yugoslavia?
Please explain how this is relevant in a reasonable manner.
For Ukraine to guarantee neutrality from NATO. BUT. It's not like Ukraine would be a NATO member tomorrow if he didn't attack. NATO simply refused to promise Putin that they will never ever under any circumstance accept Ukraine. In simple terms it went somewhat like this:
Russia: NATO, promise me you'll never accept Ukraine (or Georgia)
NATO: Fuck off, those are independent countries, it's not like you decide.
Russia: Promise
or else.
NATO: LOL. Our "or else" is bigger then yours, you don't want to mess with us.
Russia: Goddamn it. Ukraine, promise me you'll never apply to NATO
Ukraine: Fuck off we're an independent country, you don't decide
Russia: OR ELSE.
Ukraine: Are you threatening us? Do we need to weaponise just in case of or else?
Russia invades from all directions and starts targeting civilians...
There is also another layer to this, which are the Budapesht agreements and nuclear weapons. Ukraine gave Russia it's nuclear arsenal and promised not to get new nukes if Russia protects it's territorial integrity (i.e. makes sure no one bites off a piece of Ukraine for themselves) as a bigger and stronger ally. In 2014 Russia annexed Crimea, essentially because it could. It was thankfully more or less peaceful, most local population really didn't care either way (I know people that live there too). Would you say Russia upheld it's side of agreement? But it didn't stop at Crimea. Remember Russia supplying weapons (and troops too) to parts of Ukraine that declared themselves independent. That is support of another modification of Ukraines territory, this time a violent one. Russia denied it's involvement in spite of overwhelming evidence of the contrary. But then on February 23 they openly recognised that those territories are not Ukraine, essentially openly admitting that they supported the republics all along. To which Ukraine responded with "you know since you are clearly not only not protecting us like you promised, but actively harm us and threaten us with worse, nothing stops us from getting our own nukes again". Zero actual actions or even plans of obtaining nukes were made it was just a hypothetical. But that was another thing that triggerred Russia.
Here's one countries actions fueled by capitalism, more deaths than communism's entire history.
You don't care about Putin's demands, so you don't care about peace. What a humanitarian you are. Putin and Russia are not stopping until some of their demands are met and assurances are in place that convey to Russia they will not be interfered with by the West and NATO.
Why don't you go throw Putin in a sewer, do that and ill move to North Korea lmao.
There are many discussions regarding whether USSR was the true empire of pure evil and a hell on Earth, or the land of milk and honey. Even from people here that actually remember it. From what I gather it was neither.
But USSR and communism vs capitalism are irrelevant to Putin vs Ukraine and the rest of the world. Putin is not a communist, or socialist, or interested in restoring USSR in any capacity other than expanding his power to what a Gensec of USSR would have. He is only allied with China because China is the only country Russia is afraid of, due to it's massive population, military prowess, close proximity and a conflict of interest (China is super densely populated and suffers from it and Russia has a shitton of near empty land right next to China). Putin is a very obvious corrupt capitalist and Russia isn't as bad as, say UAE, in this regard, but it also has a small percentage of population that is obsentively rich and powerful at expense of millions of poor people. Ukraine is not remotely communist either, but communism has nothing to do with this war. Furthermore, Putin shows blatant disregard for economically disadvantage people in his own country.
Was it strategically reasonable for Russia to apply pressure on Ukraine to prevent it from either entering NATO or getting nukes? Maybe. But both were merely a hypothetical possibility in a distant future and out of all of instruments of pressure Russia picked the biggest overkill possible barring actual use of nuclear weapons. What is happening here is cruel and inhumane to all Ukrainian people that took no part in whatever unrelated war crimes NATO commited elsewhere, and for most of whom the only difference between NATO and Russia is that Russia likes using threats against Ukraine in particular to get what it wants. And, as we see now, spares no resources to make those threats a reality. And Putin's decisions are also cruel towards his own people, both the economically disatvantages and soldiers that die here.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
