Everyone wants women. What about male connection and non-sexual intimacy?

[SuicideGrandEst]

Hi.

So have you noticed something if you've ever taken time to read the Partners threads in particular (the ctb one and the recovery one)? This is noticeable even in regular threads and posts where people talk about making friends, making connections or finding someone to talk with.

Well, I rapidly came to notice that almost everyone wants women (a female partner). That is, the majority of the posts either ask for a female exclusively or a female preferably. Then, in what seems to come in the second position, you have the posts saying gender doesn't matter.

So, what happens is: women want women, men want women. A question remains: who wants men?

I only bumped in one (a single post) of a male saying they'd prefer a male (no mention of homosexuality in said post... Btw, isn't the fact that I have to mention that already problematic? Think about it).

Anyway, even more incredibly, I noticed that even gay males ask for females...

So my point is: isn't this lack of willingness, this inability and this refusal to connect between males increasing their loneliness and suicidality?

We would think this place would be the best to break those barriers and to help fight against males discriminating against other males and that this place would provide empathy and understanding, but the contrary seems to be happening.

That is males who already feel lonely and rejected don't even really want to talk with and support other males, reproducing the very patterns their upbringing and society inflicted upon them and which may well have led here in the first place.

What do you think?

 

[lalaland2345]

This is totally my opinion but I think that women tend to be more nurturing and people really just crave a mother. I don't think it has anything to do with gender , as if a man came into your life and was supportive, loving and nurturing, it'd be the same.

There's also the unfortunate idea that men are inherently bad (due to all that we see in this world) and many are scared of men and prefer to be around women.

I really think how we're raised also matters. For example, many have had abusive parents and crave specific things in partners and/or non romantic relationships. They'll look for those things in the ppl they surround themselves with .

What I can say is that I have some great men in my life who would do anything for me and that I'd do anything for. I find that men are much easier to be friends with as well and tend to remind me of the joys of life, the fun of life , etc. more so than most women I know . Women tend to be more emotional due to our inability to stop caring about others LOL and that can lead to a lot of drama, etc. I love me a good man that's supportive and nurturing like my current bf. He's my support system, my best friend , and my everything .

 

[Konnsz]

Just for context,
I am Male, 23 usually perceived as an Incel.


I personally dont feel that is uncommon,

Men usually are absent of female connection and it is rather understandable that they want a female conecction when they are departing this world

I don't know about women, but I can perceive that they do not desire men as much as men desire women

I'm not currently looking for a CTB partner, but if wanted to die and I could choose to die with a cuddling or at least some basic minimum female interaction, that would be great and strongly preffered.

but again, I'm an Incel, so my views are screwed up
I already think no one wants men in this world so it's not a surprise for me

I must say even if I feel im not desired in any way other than my money-making capabilities, I am still looking for human connection.

 

[SuicideGrandEst]

I think that women tend to be more nurturing and people really just crave a mother.

That's exactly the conclusion I've arrived at: "everyone" is after a mother and yearns to retrieve that lost warm connection in the womb and the warmth of the arms of a nursing mother.

 

[sancsuinet]

yeah! i think your absolutely right. theres a culture around men where they can only share their emotions with their partners, and if they dont have one then theyre expected to just suck it up and endure. I'm from nz, and we have a saying "she'll be right", which perfectly encapsulates this idea of just leaving it alone, dont bring it up no one wants to here that, youre a pussy if you talk about your emotions. theres this taboo all around the world, i mean even with my own dad we didnt speak about what was going on, it was quiet, moving on. this is a result of stoicism and patriarchal ideals imo. obv im not a man, so i cant speak from that point of view, but i was raised around it and really picked up on it.

the other side is that men are statistically more likely to harm people than non men, so its easy and encouraged for non men to confide amongst themselves. this leaves no one reaching out to men as you pointed out. Theres many organisations including tough talk dedicated to destigmatising this conversation for men, because it is isolating and leads to a lot larger consequences.

 

[lalaland2345]

yeah! i think your absolutely right. theres a culture around men where they can only share their emotions with their partners, and if they dont have one then theyre expected to just suck it up and endure. I'm from nz, and we have a saying "she'll be right", which perfectly encapsulates this idea of just leaving it alone, dont bring it up no one wants to here that, youre a pussy if you talk about your emotions. theres this taboo all around the world, i mean even with my own dad we didnt speak about what was going on, it was quiet, moving on. this is a result of stoicism and patriarchal ideals imo. obv im not a man, so i cant speak from that point of view, but i was raised around it and really picked up on it.

the other side is that men are statistically more likely to harm people than non men, so its easy and encouraged for non men to confide amongst themselves. this leaves no one reaching out to men as you pointed out. Theres many organisations including tough talk dedicated to destigmatising this conversation for men, because it is isolating and leads to a lot larger consequences.

10000% agree with you!! I constantly urge my boyfriend to speak up about his feelings but he hates it. As a women, I wish there was a better way to teach men that we do want to hear them , and we do care for them. One of my brothers is adorable and opens up a bit more to me and my family, but most men are scared to do that .

I have a mother I work with and she tells me how she has no idea how her son is doing in life- how he avoids talking with her about deeper things. She yearns so badly for him to speak up , but tends to avoid doing so.

As you mentioned as well, most crime/violent acts are committed by men so people tend to just avoid men they don't know. Many feel safer around women as we are less likely to harm (of course, that's not true for all women).

Regardless, I'm happy to see that people are urging men to speak up and see emotions and vulernability as a strength. As I'm sure most people know, talking about things is difficult and it takes true strength to open up.

That's exactly the conclusion I've arrived at: "everyone" is after a mother and yearns to retrieve that lost warm connection in the womb and the warmth of the arms of a nursing mother.

You're on the mark there - I definitely agree. Most people see their mother as their best friend , such as myself, BUT my dad has taught me so much in life. He's taught me how to survive through struggle, how to be strong, how to make decisions for myself , taught me about finance, etc. that my mom tends to avoid talking about.

We need men and women in our lives but unfortunately many have had bad experiences with men and good experiences with the women in their lives and crave that feeling from others.

 

[SuicideGrandEst]

the other side is that men are statistically more likely to harm people than non men, so its easy and encouraged for non men to confide amongst themselves. this leaves no one reaching out to men as you pointed out. Theres many organisations including tough talk dedicated to destigmatising this conversation for men, because it is isolating and leads to a lot larger consequences.

Yes, this is a very good point too! Definitely. For instance, females would feel safer with other females. For sure. There's the violence danger, be it of sexual nature or not, but also just the discomfort of being hit on.
For instance, when I say I'd prefer a female, honestly it's not that I think a man can't understand me and that we can't share our experiences (I am even more masculine, with my body structure and yes, mentally). But it's just that "you never know" what a guy wants and if suddenly he won't decide you're game to him.
As a lesbian, this is even more complicated. First because, this is the last thing you'd want. Second, because the very fact of you being a lesbian exposes you to male fantasies and you can suddenly become a prize. So even if the guy wouldn't have been interested in you in the first place, well this can change the moment he learns you're a lesbian. As all types of prn just flash into his head and he may also think himself invested in a big mission to make you try the right...

 

[The anhedonic one]

I'm a male and hate most other males because they are either toxic alpha males, or just ooze toxic masculinity in general.
They usually lack empathy and intelligence and emotional depth and I just can't stand them.

 

[neveragreedtothis]

i find is super risky no offence

what's to say in the last minute the guy won't be like 'you're gonna die anyway, might as well f* me" and then withholding the CTB source and of course there's the necrophiliacs.

jesus the world is so fucked

 

[Fulminare]

I've connected with dozens of people from the partner thread (mostly men who post about wanting a woman to be by their side) and it's very dangerous, if you ask me.

Most of them want to get down and dirty before they pass away and picking a vulnerable, suicidal woman who is desperate to have a peaceful passing seems to be a good option to them. They will pay for the hotel room, even the flight, if necessary. It's sadly a good set up for human trafficking, homicide, rape, anything predatory and sadistic you can think of.

I don't want to say "every man in that thread is like this" because we all know that's not true. But it's still the main reason why many people seek out female ctb partners on there. Then there's also other women who prefer a female partner as well, but at this point they're hard to come by.

Not sure what my point is other than be careful!

 

[SuicideGrandEst]

I've connected with dozens of people from the partner thread (mostly men who post about wanting a woman to be by their side) and it's very dangerous, if you ask me.

Wow. So They told you they wanted to do it one last time, before they die? (And that it was the reason why they were seeking a female.)

Most of them want to get down and dirty before they pass away and picking a vulnerable, suicidal woman who is desperate to have a peaceful passing seems to be a good option to them. They will pay for the hotel room, even the flight, if necessary. It's sadly a good set up for human trafficking, homicide, rape, anything predatory and sadistic you can think of.

Wow. I've asked myself how many were actually into that. I saw a thread about two women (I think?) having been killed in such a way on here. I lost the thread and was never able to fully read it. If someone can link it.

I don't want to say "every man in that thread is like this" because we all know that's not true. But it's still the main reason why many people seek out female ctb partners on there. Then there's also other women who prefer a female partner as well, but at this point they're hard to come by.

Yes, I did notice almost only men were replying or writing to me, but it made sense to me since men are more likely to commit suicide.

 

[Goodgirlryeo101]

Your post remind of someone who used to refer to other females as men, I mean he would literally crop out a picture of myself and a friend at a festival saying oh she looks like "chimurume" aka a man and even said oh you are so stupid G I would never allow some who looks like avatar insult me, I would insult her back mind you when a lady said this guy that looked like a monkey the next thing he did was go behind that lady to a guy that she liked and spoke bad about her to him and went back to her and lied that it was me that did what he had done and not only that he also said he wanted to hunt his bestie avatar's bf on Facebook because he wanted her "kuti arambwe" and also "chishaye wekuchemera" and look for all of her friends and even add more lies with some truth hmmmm just because he wanted "kuchikaurisa" as he said.

He is always saying this person looks like this and that person looks like that but what about him as my mum said… I have over 10 screenshots of him mocking and making fun of 10 different people and their looks and yeah what a great person he is. If mr Brown was to find those collages you made of him calling him "chemhino" you will have beef knowing how short tempered he can be hahaha.

 

[gardenofaphrodite]

I wish I was able to be more comfortable around men. My closest friends have been men - but, I have had my worst experiences with men. I've been assaulted by men & women, but the times, & a specific time, was with a man. My own partner, it took me a long time to get comfortable with him, a really long time. Even now, I have some pretty bad night terrors about what a particular man did to me, & it effects me a lot sometimes, makes enjoying things hard.

I think with how parents are raising their kids now, men in the future will be kinder, less violent, & more open-minded & willing to express their emotions more. Previous generations were told to repress them, never talk about it, "man up" - which is toxic for everyone, & has lead to some men being angry, repressed, & sometimes violent towards others, especially women.

I also think people just find more comfort in women, I myself would prefer to be alone if it's ctbing, but I can see why someone would want to have a woman with them.

Not all men are bad or good, same with women - but I personally, have had far worse experiences around men, & thus I'm much more uncomfortable being around them alone. Even some women - I am uncomfortable being around with alone.

 

[BornHated]

Thing is, women are also used to lure other women into human trafficking- That thread is all sorts of dangerous, IMHO.

When someone deviates from that expected "nurturing woman/competitive or aggro male" behavior, they're gonna focus on hiding it better. Self-serving males find easy camaraderie among them and will pick on men who show more openly empathetic qualities. TBH, self-serving women will also do the same since early on they noticed the empathetic ones are more liked/tolerated by others, so they often target those (both male and other females) to bully for social clout. Authentically empathetic sorts need to find each other and band together to survive or fake all the way to death.

Sexual assault happens on men as well, and yeah, perpetrator is usually other men... we all know testosterone gives you more muscle by baseline across the whole body even if you don't particularly work out. But physical isn't the only form of abuse, and it's not the most damaging, actually. The mental trauma is, and women are just as capable of it in their own way
Wariness of men makes sense because of the immediate physical danger that can be posed from that, but the rest of it is the usual human manipulation tactics. Anyone does that.

The internet has helped people of all kinds, but I'm afraid we'd need to out-evolve certain things for this matter to truly resolve.

 

[SuicideGrandEst]

Your post remind of someone who used to refer to other females as men, I mean he would literally crop out a picture of myself and a friend at a festival saying oh she looks like "chimurume" aka a man and even said oh you are so stupid G I would never allow some who looks like avatar insult me, I would insult her back mind you when a lady said this guy that looked like a monkey the next thing he did was go behind that lady to a guy that she liked and spoke bad about her to him and went back to her and lied that it was me that did what he had done and not only that he also said he wanted to hunt his bestie avatar's bf on Facebook because he wanted her "kuti arambwe" and also "chishaye wekuchemera" and look for all of her friends and even add more lies with some truth hmmmm just because he wanted "kuchikaurisa" as he said.

He is always saying this person looks like this and that person looks like that but what about him as my mum said… I have over 10 screenshots of him mocking and making fun of 10 different people and their looks and yeah what a great person he is. If mr Brown was to find those collages you made of him calling him "chemhino" you will have beef knowing how short tempered he can be hahaha.

Seems you posted on the wrong thread. Not sure.

Sexual assault happens on men as well, and yeah, perpetrator is usually other men... we all know testosterone gives you more muscle by baseline across the whole body even if you don't particularly work out. But physical isn't the only form of abuse, and it's not the most damaging, actually. The mental trauma is, and women are just as capable of it in their own way
Wariness of men makes sense because of the immediate physical danger that can be posed from that, but the rest of it is the usual human manipulation tactics. Anyone does that.

Yes. Definitely. Was thinking about that one too. And as I read people saying they had positive experiences with women, especially their mums... well hell NO. I guess, knowing that women can be sooooo manipulative and narcissistic too helps me in my relationship to men. I just know they can be both very awful. My mom is certainly the reason why I'm here. She completely fckd me up.

The internet has helped people of all kinds, but I'm afraid we'd need to out-evolve certain things for this matter to truly resolve.

I'm not sure what you mean by that.

 

[Goodgirlryeo101]

Seems you posted on the wrong thread. Not sure.

No I'm very sure, i know of guys who says women look like men and your post reminded me of one of those guys (pardon me if I'm wrong), transgender or even compare them to animals and it is meant as an insult and it's something that they would say.

I wonder though where he would fit in since a few people have compared him to an animal, do you think they will be with a woman who others might say looks like a man. This whole thing of saying a biological female looks like a man is meant to be insulting I guess but I do know of men who struggle with their sexuality and some might even want to transition to be transgender and it's all very personal i suppose and I guess it's a free world and if men wants to date other men they should as people will always have something to say.

I also find this quite fascinating this guy always said I wanted to paint his name black and he was so angry and then doesn't understand why I'm angry that he is trying to ruin my name as well. People only enjoy it when they do bad to others and the don't like it if you say something as well.

 

[SuicideGrandEst]

No I'm very sure, i know of guys who says women look like men and your post reminded me of one of those guys (pardon me if I'm wrong), transgender or even compare them to animals and it is meant as an insult and it's something that they would say.

I wonder though where he would fit in since a few people have compared him to an animal, do you think they will be with a woman who others might say looks like a man. This whole thing of saying a biological female looks like a man is meant to be insulting I guess but I do know of men who struggle with their sexuality and some might even want to transition to be transgender and it's all very personal i suppose and I guess it's a free world and if men wants to date other men they should as people will always have something to say.

I also find this quite fascinating this guy always said I wanted to paint his name black and he was so angry and then doesn't understand why I'm angry that he is trying to ruin my name as well. People only enjoy it when they do bad to others and the don't like it if you say something as well.

I'm sorry, my dear. I don't know those people. I didn't mention transgender. I don't have an issue with gay. I am gay myself.
Also it's ok for women to look feminine, masculine, to have PCOS, to look like a man, to have a beard, whatever. It is all ok.
It is not ok to taunt, insult or bully people.
I hope you now feel better and that you'll overcome that negative experience. I send you lots of virtual hugs, if you accept them.

 

[Goodgirlryeo101]

taunt, insult or bully people.

I'm aware that's why I mentioned someone who has always taunted and make fun of others and that even this girl he had said looked like an animal was screaming saying he took it way too far and she was obviously hurt and upset.

Also it's ok for women to look feminine, masculine, to have PCOS, to look like a man, to have a beard, whatever. It is all ok.

I'm aware that it's okay but this guy uses it as a form of tormenting, bullying and mocking others he has been it since our teen years and now he is almost 35 years old and he is still at it.

He just changed his targets, that's all.

 

[Fulminare]

Wow. So They told you they wanted to do it one last time, before they die? (And that it was the reason why they were seeking a female.)



Wow. I've asked myself how many were actually into that. I saw a thread about two women (I think?) having been killed in such a way on here. I lost the thread and was never able to fully read it. If someone can link it.



Yes, I did notice almost only men were replying or writing to me, but it made sense to me since men are more likely to commit suicide.

It wasn't a straight up "let's fuck before we die" but statements such as "if I had a girlfriend then I wouldn't want to die", "let's meet up and book a hotel room for the two of us" and "I don't want to die a virgin". And when I declined any advantages, they simply ghosted me or made up an excuse to get out of it. Although the frequent ghosting on here isn't limited to gender, that's for sure.

 

[R.E.N.]

I think no one wants to talk about it that much and paint it as simply wanting a mother figure, but I feel it largely stands with male attraction. Males on that thread are looking for a last ditch attempt at feminine affection while women are likely concerned with ironically their safety; this all stems from male attraction and lust. I feel saying otherwise is just cope.

 

[TheNihilisticViking]

I hope people are actually aware that SS was literally created by two "guys" who described themselves as "in-cels" according to research I've done (it even says so on Wikipedia). Everyone wants someone who will "love" them and be "intimate" with them because that's normal biological animal behaviour (I'm trying not to be human exceptionalist here) and also it doesn't matter what gender or sexual orientation they are or describe themselves as. Even calling people "in-cels" is bullying if you ask me.

This is what I don't get/understand about humans to be honest because they create problems and then fix those problems with even more problems. All the additional problems in humanity would be fixed if people accepted people regardless of what they look like/their attractiveness and appearance, how old they are, how much money they have, what colour skin they have, what gender they are, what sexual orientation they are, etc, etc.

Humans messed up when they tried to distinguish themselves as being different to other wild animals (by making rules and regulations for things and not accepting harsh reality as it is or ending that harsh reality through whatever means necessary) and now we're paying the price for it.

An example of this would be making murder a crime if it's murdering humans, but murdering other animals for food is totally legal even though we're fully capable of only eating plants. What gives humans the right to eat other animals? Oh yeah... rules created by humans themselves. The irony in that!

Humans also lock animals away in zoos and humans walk past them, shout at them and even taunt the animals in those zoos on a daily basis. Yet humans whine and complain about rape, murder, etc. only if it is humans against humans? What about the animals being raped by other animals out there? Humans also keep trying to outrun the tide of extinction and it's eventually going to come for us whether we like it or not. Human exceptionalism is a real problem and it needs to be dealt with.

 

[Bunnybrains]

I am not a guy im nonbinary, that being said the idea of meeting up with a man feels like a ticket to getting raped. You cant see the likelyhood of that by someones eye color, actions, ect. I think maybe alot of guys have a similar thought. Not that many ppl meet up but thats my 2c

 

[Kerrtu]

So my point is: isn't this lack of willingness, this inability and this refusal to connect between males increasing their loneliness and suicidality?

I would think so, yes.

A very interesting post altogether, and many thoughtful responses.

There was a point when I was considering partnering with a male to CTB (I'm female). Ultimately what got to me was my own mind, thinking of the various scenarios that possibly could play out, etc. It wasn't an issue of gender - I have a hard time trusting people. Period.

I've been raped by a female, I've been raped by males. Some people cannot comprehend female/female rape. The woman lived the next floor up, she was a neighbor, though I kept my distance as I got a bad feeling from her off the bat. I was still married at the time, still trying to "recover" and was doing pretty well. I was back in school, studying to be a nurse. I wanted to, hoped to eventually become a psychiatric nurse practitioner with a focus on PTSD and interest in progressive treatments ie Ketamine, Psilocybin, etc.

Anyhow, the woman who raped me told me afterwards never to tell anyone what happened, especially not a man, as no man would ever want to touch me again. This all lead to my second attempt and ultimately the end of my marriage, and in a sense, my life. I felt dead on the inside. I barely ate, and I punished myself. I was doing great academically because I wouldn't allow myself to fail or accept anything less than an A. It was a grueling, demanding schedule and I pushed myself to a point beyond exhaustion.

Who could I tell? The police - no way. My husband? In retrospect yes, I could've told him. At the time I thought for sure he would find me disgusting and would think I wanted it. He wasn't quite comfortable with my being queer.

I was ashamed and gaslit.

That's another issue or misconception: being queer doesn't mean I'm DTF at anytime with anyone, or I'm checking out every person who walks by.

As a woman, it's particularly insidious to be raped by a woman. I imagine this to be the case with male/male rape as well. Rape by its very nature is horrific. It's an absolute shattering of any scintilla of trust, and arguably theft of one's soul. To this day, to this moment, I can't close my eyes and "go back there" without getting choked up. It happened in August of 2014. I can approach processing the male rapes, as I was physically abused primarily by males growing up, but the female rape? I blamed myself hard, knowing it wasn't my fault.

If I were to partner up for CTB at this time, gender wouldn't matter. I'd just want to be with someone who wouldn't rape me, and I can't rule that out with anyone anymore. All bets are off, basically. In writing this, I realize the core of my anger regarding rape is how utterly devastating it is. I'm angry that trust was stolen, and it hurt really, to write "all bets are off". I want to trust people, I would make a good CTB partner in the sense, I listen sincerely and only want to be of help. I wish I could CTB with even just one hand reached out to hold, or to give my hands to one who needs.

I'm sorry I went so long here.

Thank you @SuicideGrandEst for bringing this conversation to the forum.

 

[BornHated]

I would think so, yes.

A very interesting post altogether, and many thoughtful responses.

There was a point when I was considering partnering with a male to CTB (I'm female). Ultimately what got to me was my own mind, thinking of the various scenarios that possibly could play out, etc. It wasn't an issue of gender - I have a hard time trusting people. Period.

I've been raped by a female, I've been raped by males. Some people cannot comprehend female/female rape. The woman lived the next floor up, she was a neighbor, though I kept my distance as I got a bad feeling from her off the bat. I was still married at the time, still trying to "recover" and was doing pretty well. I was back in school, studying to be a nurse. I wanted to, hoped to eventually become a psychiatric nurse practitioner with a focus on PTSD and interest in progressive treatments ie Ketamine, Psilocybin, etc.

Anyhow, the woman who raped me told me afterwards never to tell anyone what happened, especially not a man, as no man would ever want to touch me again. This all lead to my second attempt and ultimately the end of my marriage, and in a sense, my life. I felt dead on the inside. I barely ate, and I punished myself. I was doing great academically because I wouldn't allow myself to fail or accept anything less than an A. It was a grueling, demanding schedule and I pushed myself to a point beyond exhaustion.

Who could I tell? The police - no way. My husband? In retrospect yes, I could've told him. At the time I thought for sure he would find me disgusting and would think I wanted it. He wasn't quite comfortable with my being queer.

I was ashamed and gaslit.

That's another issue or misconception: being queer doesn't mean I'm DTF at anytime with anyone, or I'm checking out every person who walks by.

As a woman, it's particularly insidious to be raped by a woman. I imagine this to be the case with male/male rape as well. Rape by its very nature is horrific. It's an absolute shattering of any scintilla of trust, and arguably theft of one's soul. To this day, to this moment, I can't close my eyes and "go back there" without getting choked up. It happened in August of 2014. I can approach processing the male rapes, as I was physically abused primarily by males growing up, but the female rape? I blamed myself hard, knowing it wasn't my fault.

If I were to partner up for CTB at this time, gender wouldn't matter. I'd just want to be with someone who wouldn't rape me, and I can't rule that out with anyone anymore. All bets are off, basically. In writing this, I realize the core of my anger regarding rape is how utterly devastating it is. I'm angry that trust was stolen, and it hurt really, to write "all bets are off". I want to trust people, I would make a good CTB partner in the sense, I listen sincerely and only want to be of help. I wish I could CTB with even just one hand reached out to hold, or to give my hands to one who needs.

I'm sorry I went so long here.

Thank you @SuicideGrandEst for bringing this conversation to the forum.

What you went through is incredibly fucked up. This is the third case of woman-on-woman sexual assault I know of, and it really brings to light that being a woman doesn't magically make you an empathetic little creature who should always be put with children. Thank you for bringing this to the conversation as well. Because while statistics do point to males usually being perpetrators, there is still a very real amount of women who would. It's frustrating when I see people who insist traditional gender roles should be the way things are- It's toxic to say empathetic men "don't provide," it's also horrible to insinuate that women cannot be dangerous since we can clearly see cruelty like this can happen and more.
Then again, these sorts of people usually hate women from what I've found, so they don't care about that form of collateral damage either and consider it an "Insult" to be successfully assaulted by one. They'd blame the victim anyways.

Besides the biology of the muscle mass thing, I also think that society influences it. Traditional male grouping focuses a lot on the vanity of how many women they can sleep with, so sex is a power move to them while it's an more shameful thing for women to do so in traditional society. I think that fuels a lot of the power fantasy there in both cases, actually.

Yes. Definitely. Was thinking about that one too. And as I read people saying they had positive experiences with women, especially their mums... well hell NO. I guess, knowing that women can be sooooo manipulative and narcissistic too helps me in my relationship to men. I just know they can be both very awful. My mom is certainly the reason why I'm here. She completely fckd me up.

Same case for me, yeah. My mother has almost no empathy and surviving her is a war every day, but my father was more nurturing even if he seemed traditionally masculine. They each hid those parts of themselves in different ways but you notice it when you observe the behavior patterns. I have friends who are women applause certain things when I tell them part of my mother's clearly bad behavior and I feel like this is part of the problem.
We always have to take extra care to analyze everyone we will interact with closely, we cannot trust stereotypes. Human brains can come in any combination of things regardless of gender, race, etc.

 

[Kerrtu]

What you went through is incredibly fucked up. This is the third case of woman-on-woman sexual assault I know of, and it really brings to light that being a woman doesn't magically make you an empathetic little creature who should always be put with children. Thank you for bringing this to the conversation as well. Because while statistics do point to males usually being perpetrators, there is still a very real amount of women who would. It's frustrating when I see people who insist traditional gender roles should be the way things are- It's toxic to say empathetic men "don't provide," it's also horrible to insinuate that women cannot be dangerous since we can clearly see cruelty like this can happen and more.
Then again, these sorts of people usually hate women from what I've found, so they don't care about that form of collateral damage either and consider it an "Insult" to be successfully assaulted by one. They'd blame the victim anyways.

Besides the biology of the muscle mass thing, I also think that society influences it. Traditional male grouping focuses a lot on the vanity of how many women they can sleep with, so sex is a power move to them while it's an more shameful thing for women to do so in traditional society. I think that fuels a lot of the power fantasy there in both cases, actually.

Same case for me, yeah. My mother has almost no empathy and surviving her is a war every day, but my father was more nurturing even if he seemed traditionally masculine. They each hid those parts of themselves in different ways but you notice it when you observe the behavior patterns. I have friends who are women applause certain things when I tell them part of my mother's clearly bad behavior and I feel like this is part of the problem.
We always have to take extra care to analyze everyone we will interact with closely, we cannot trust stereotypes. Human brains can come in any combination of things regardless of gender, race, etc.

Your compassion is very much appreciated. I wasn't sure I'd be able to post what I wrote but it was cathartic. Did I cry? Yes. But It's alright.

I wanted to add, in remembering the female rape in 2014, another thing she told me afterwards was that she had a black duffel bag in a closet in her apartment that contained sex toys, specifically dildos of various lengths, and that if anything were to happen to her, she asked for me to get rid of that bag because her mother would be so ashamed.

I was in shock at the time, and I only know this through looking back and talking or writing about it, which is difficult to do. But yes, it was a devious power play on her part, telling me about that bag. She was somehow trying to maintain a rope around me, for lack of a better term. And mentioning how her mother would feel ashamed meanwhile she had just raped me? A complete mind fuck.

This woman was/is self-admitted man-hating lesbian. The irony of which, she emulated men. Maybe she had a deep hatred and resentment she wasn't a man? I don't know, I could speculate in many directions.

About a year ago, I was outside standing by my partners car - we were about to cross the street to get to my apartment. A convertible was pulling up and stopped - I looked at the driver, who was quite close, and she reminded me so much of the woman who raped me. Same hair length and style, a kind of arrogance one immediately feels…I forget what the hell she asked me, but I looked at my partner with this face of horror. He knew exactly what was happening in my head and his mind was blown.

Again -

Thank you ♡

 

[Noi]

Just my 2 cents but most men I know (I too fall in this category) suck at listening to problems we can't solve. The thing is though, no matter what I try my suicidality is not a solvable problem, there's not a value you can plug into the equation that's my fucked up brain to make it magically work. Most men I've confided in this just got increasingly frustrated until they didn't want to hear about it anymore. On the other hand women, in my experience are much better at just listening and providing emotional support.

Even in light of this I'm not apprehensive about confiding in men. However if I was seeking explicitly emotional support or someone to confide in my experience would inform me that trying to find women would more likely yield the outcome I want.

 

[sancsuinet]

I've connected with dozens of people from the partner thread (mostly men who post about wanting a woman to be by their side) and it's very dangerous, if you ask me.

Most of them want to get down and dirty before they pass away and picking a vulnerable, suicidal woman who is desperate to have a peaceful passing seems to be a good option to them. They will pay for the hotel room, even the flight, if necessary. It's sadly a good set up for human trafficking, homicide, rape, anything predatory and sadistic you can think of.

I don't want to say "every man in that thread is like this" because we all know that's not true. But it's still the main reason why many people seek out female ctb partners on there. Then there's also other women who prefer a female partner as well, but at this point they're hard to come by.

Not sure what my point is other than be careful!

yeah, I personally have never been on the partner thread because it feels just so dangerous. im a young afab person, and even if i wasnt, these are strangers. regardless of gender, anyone could have the ability to assault and you wouldnt know because you dont know them. people lie, theyre particularly good at it.

 

[brutal]

Just for context,
I am Male, 23 usually perceived as an Incel.


I personally dont feel that is uncommon,

Men usually are absent of female connection and it is rather understandable that they want a female conecction when they are departing this world

I don't know about women, but I can perceive that they do not desire men as much as men desire women

I'm not currently looking for a CTB partner, but if wanted to die and I could choose to die with a cuddling or at least some basic minimum female interaction, that would be great and strongly preffered.

but again, I'm an Incel, so my views are screwed up
I already think no one wants men in this world so it's not a surprise for me

I must say even if I feel im not desired in any way other than my money-making capabilities, I am still looking for human connection.

I know what you're saying and I consider myself an incel I relate to everything you say.

 

[Techef]

most men I know (I too fall in this category) suck at listening to problems we can't solve

For most of my life I didn't know what it meant to actually listen. I would hear and gather information, then try to analyze and problem solve to suggest solutions. It took me a lot of my own suffering, as well as some kind souls helping me understand that what I was doing was not listening or truly empathizing. I'm not sure if I've gotten better at listening, since I became increasingly isolated (and now completely isolated) not too long after. But I now realize I hurt people and probably did more harm by offering to listen without actually listening than doing nothing at all.

 

[WorthlessTrash]

Men are imo the more toxic sex/gender (one of the lesser reasons why I hate being male, but still a reason nonetheless). People feel safer around women generally.