Discussion Does anyone know a lot of about the laws when it comes to suicide?

[Rukia]

Nobody got cops sent over to check on them for being on a website where suicide is discussed. They got the visit because of ordering illegal pharmaceuticals over the internet and customs intercepting the package. Simple as that.

Nobody yet...

 

[jake3d]

In a hurry to be first? Sorry, couldn't help it.

 

[dreamsofdestruction]

a 17 year old girl was sent to prison for 15 months for some text messages, telling someone to do what he has been saying he wants to do for 10000000 times already. https://www.cnn.com/2017/06/08/us/text-message-suicide-michelle-carter-conrad-roy/index.html

Carter: "So I guess you aren't gonna do it then, all that for nothing"
Carter: "I'm just confused like you were so ready and determined"
Roy: "I am gonna eventually"
Roy: "I really don't know what I'm waiting for. . but I have everything lined up"
Carter: "No, you're not, Conrad. Last night was it. You keep pushing it off and you say you'll do it but u never do. Its always gonna be that way if u don't take action"
Carter: "You're just making it harder on yourself by pushing it off, you just have to do it"
Carter: "Do u wanna do it now?"
Roy: "Is it too late?"
Roy: "Idkk it's already light outside"
Roy: I'm gonna go back to sleep, love you I'll text you tomorrow"
Carter: "No? Its probably the best time now because everyone's sleeping. Just go somewhere in your truck. And no one's really out right now because it's an awkward time"
Carter: "If u don't do it now you're never gonna do it"
Carter: "And u can say you'll do it tomorrow but you probably won't"
---
Carter: "You just need to do it Conrad or I'm gonna get you help"
Carter: "You can't keep doing this everyday"
Roy: "Okay I'm gonna do it today"
Carter: "Do you promise"
Roy: "I promise babe"
Roy: "I have to now"
Carter: "Like right now?"
Roy: "where do I go? :("
Carter: "And u can't break a promise. And just go in a quiet parking lot or something."

LOL, you don't think she did anything wrong there?

 

[Rukia]

In a hurry to be first? Sorry, couldn't help it.

Just asked a lawyer online...If it wont be too pricey I will buy his legal advice and share with you guys ...I will try to ask about other countries as well if for free but I doubt it :(

 

[Severen]

LOL, you don't think she did anything wrong there?

Nope. He obviously expressed to her 100000 times, he wants to CTB before that conversation. So this conversation is taken out of context. And it's not like, she is his commanding officer. He doesn't HAVE TO DO WTF SHE WANTS HIM TO DO. Nah, the prison system just wanted another customer and pro suffering people and dumb ass parents, needed a witch burned at the stake.

 

[dreamsofdestruction]

Nope. He obviously expressed to her 100000 times, he wants to CTB before that conversation. So this conversation is taken out of context. And it's not like, she is his commanding officer. He doesn't HAVE TO DO WTF SHE WANTS HIM TO DO. Nah, the prison system just wanted another customer and pro suffering people and dumb ass parents, needed a witch burned at the stake.

He obviously was doing badly, he still had reservations, she pushed him over the edge. Cool. Maybe you'll be lucky and find a nice girlfriend like that.

 

[Santiago]

Partly because most people outside of this forum rarely ever responds to the word suicide rationally but anything that deals with death or suicide is always emotionally charged and people aren't rational when it comes to certain topics. This is only the surface reason though because social pressures and religion also plays a big role in many people's thinking.

Partially agree with what RainAndSadness said. There are limitations to the first amendment. Quoting the Supreme Court: 'the question in every case is whether the words used are used in such circumstances and are of such a nature as to create a clear and present danger that they will bring about the substantive evils that Congress has a right to prevent'. Following those requirements however..one could argue telling somebody how to kill themselves is illegal aswell. Whether the court would come to that conclusion I don't know. I suppose there are some cases out there where this has happened. Don't feel like searching for them at the moment though.

Don't really agree that it's only people outside of this forum who react emotionally to the concept of suicide. It's also people on this forum. I rarely come across people who are able to talk about it from a rational point of view. People always tend to lean to one side. On here it is pro-suicide, out there it's mostly pro-life.

 

[Rukia]

Yes, giving support/assistance/ or manipulate someone to commit suicide, is a crime in most countries and states.

Just opened a thread for Polish ppl

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/lawyers-opinion-mainly-for-poles.19630/

 

[thedutchguy]

So basically like 75% of people here are criminals?

In the netherlands this site would be illegal

It's noted by law helping assisting with suicide jail cell and or fine (money high amount). And the law here is widely interpreted what is helping every judge can make his own mind on this what's is helping and what not

 

[Rukia]

In the netherlands this site would be illegal

It's noted by law helping assisting with suicide jail cell and or fine (money high amount). And the law here is widely interpreted what is helping every judge can make his own mind on this what's is helping and what not

But the problem is it doesnt matter where the site is located,...we are responsible in the countries we are in...I feel like a voice of one calling in the wilderness...
We could really be in troubles one day... And there is no mass deletion of the content with no exception as per rules stated...
Be very careful what you write here I repeat doesnt matter where the site is located and if helping CTB is allowed there...you can be prosecuted in your own country of origin...

 

[Alan James]

What makes me angry most of all is that these people sincerely consider themselves to be some kind of heroes saving others. Sometimes they brag about it.

Really want to help, don't want people to kill themselves? - give them money.

 

[Pilum Muralis]

In the US, there's a bill that, ironically, died in Congress.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/110th-congress/house-bill/940

It was reintroduced in 2011, but Was not enacted...
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/hr1183/text

The gist of the Bill (this summary is from the initial 2007 Bill) is:
Suzanne Gonzales Suicide Prevention Act of 2007 - Amends the federal criminal code to prohibit the use of any facility of interstate or foreign commerce to teach a person how to commit suicide, or to provide such person with material support or resources in committing suicide, knowing such person is likely to use such assistance to commit suicide. Imposes a fine and/or prison term of not more than five years for violations. Increases the prison term to any number of years or life if a violation results in a death.

 

[Rukia]

In the US, there's a bill that, ironically, died in Congress.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/110th-congress/house-bill/940

It was reintroduced in 2011, but Was not enacted...
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/112/hr1183/text

The gist of the Bill (this summary is from the initial 2007 Bill) is:
Suzanne Gonzales Suicide Prevention Act of 2007 - Amends the federal criminal code to prohibit the use of any facility of interstate or foreign commerce to teach a person how to commit suicide, or to provide such person with material support or resources in committing suicide, knowing such person is likely to use such assistance to commit suicide. Imposes a fine and/or prison term of not more than five years for violations. Increases the prison term to any number of years or life if a violation results in a death.

So helping with CTB by giving advice is legal for US citizens for now?
Beware Poles, it is not legit for us...and no fine possible...jail time...

 

[Pilum Muralis]

So helping with CTB by giving advice is legal for US citizens for now?
Beware Poles, it is not legit for us...and no fine possible...jail time...

I don't think it's outright legal, but because of our 1st amendment, it would be difficult to enforce. I haven't really found anything about this stuff, but I'm sure it's out there. We have states that already have physician assisted suicides, and many of the laws regarding suicides are just Common Laws. This bill, if it ever passes, would create a unified law across the US. Each state the same rule would apply, and it's defined that online giving assistance and/or support to someone suicidal could be prosecuted.

I did find a sight that gave legal advice, regarding inaction, at least in the US. However, you may still be liable in a civil matter.

Q: Is it illegal to watch someone commit suicide and do nothing?
A: Kevin Bessant / Law Office Of Kevin Bessant & Associates
A person does not have a legal duty to act on behalf of someone to prevent them from comitting suicide. So long as the person does not illegally contribute to the suicide or illegally assist in the carrying out of the suicide, that person should not be charged criminally


I hope this made sense. It's 4am and sorta in and out.

 

[Rukia]

I did find a sight that gave legal advice, regarding inaction, at least in the US. However, you may still be liable in a civil matter.

Q: Is it illegal to watch someone commit suicide and do nothing?
A: Kevin Bessant / Law Office Of Kevin Bessant & Associates
A person does not have a legal duty to act on behalf of someone to prevent them from comitting suicide. So long as the person does not illegally contribute to the suicide or illegally assist in the carrying out of the suicide, that person should not be charged criminally

The question is what does it mean to "illegally contribute to the suicide"?

 

[Pilum Muralis]

The question is what does it mean to "illegally contribute to the suicide"?

Coercing someone? Forcing them? I couldn't imagine it being something more than outright telling them to do it.

 

[RainAndSadness]

LOL, you don't think she did anything wrong there?

What she did was wrong. When his boyfriend left the truck and made the decision against suicide, she told him to go back into the truck and kill himself. That's encouragement, by every definition, as she made the decision for his boyfriend. We can't have people telling other people to commit suicide. Nobody should have the right to make this decision for you. That's simply psychological abuse at this point. And if you need to be pushed to suicide, then you aren't ready yet - simple as that.

 

[Rukia]

Coercing someone? Forcing them? I couldn't imagine it being something more than outright telling them to do it.

The big question is: is giving advice "know-how" or even "cheering" not "contributing"...

BTW it is an important thread, maybe should be a sticky...

Thanks once again @Severen

 

[Pilum Muralis]

I'm wondering about civil liability, now. We've had parents in our country, sue an entire school district over their daughters suicide, because they claimed the school didn't do anything regarding her being bullied.
Would members be held liable for "assisting" other members that ctb, if they're relatives sued? It's difficult, if not impossible I'm sure, due to jurisdictions. We're a sue happy country.

 

[Rukia]

I'm wondering about civil liability, now. We've had parents in our country, sue an entire school district over their daughters suicide, because they claimed the school didn't do anything regarding her being bullied.
Would members be held liable for "assisting" other members that ctb, if they're relatives sued? It's difficult, if not impossible I'm sure, due to jurisdictions. We're a sue happy country.

Yup, thats another problem:(

I fear the assurance that we are indestructible here is all based on the fact that it is in the Internet where ppl think are anonymous and other reason is that ppl tend to think it depends on the site location...