Discussion Do you think there should be an obligation for suicidal people to try medication and/or therapy?

[TAW122]

As far an obligation, it's a bit of a grey area, though in my opinion, if it comes with patient autonomy and honoring patient wishes in the end (reasonable standards, NOT the indefinite loop of endless treatments, goalpost shifting, and deception, false hope, lies, etc.), then it would make sense.

More specifically, suppose an otherwise relatively healthy individual (maybe in their young adult age, be it 20's or 30's, maybe even middle age, like mid 40's or 50's) with not a lot of impediment to their day to day ADL (Activities of Daily Living), but their mentally suffering immensely (and while it is murky and harder to quantify than say a physical ailment - where it is more observable and measurable), suppose they put in a request/application for medically assisted death. I think if the provider or the program says has a waiting period, requires some documentation that the person has tried some therapies and medications (attempts to fix their situation) and with no improvement say after a year or so, then is given the green light and throughout the process, everything is documented and reaffirmed (to ensure the patient did NOT change their mind) and then finally given the green light, it would actually help the person be more at peace. Perhaps it may even allow a person to continue living a bit longer, knowing that their continued sentience is of their choice and not something that is imposed and required of them (which is sadly the reality we live in, in present day).

Finally, I do agree that patients should NOT be forced to try medication and therapy against their will, as that has more harm than good overall. A patient wanting to be better because they want to would yield better outcomes than one who is compelled to do so by the government, their peers, or even some institution or medical establishment. My example I gave was something along the lines of reasonable compromise, concession, and something that I think would act as a safeguard against impulsive decisions, while still honoring the bodily autonomy of the individual.

 

[Chinaski]

As far an obligation, it's a bit of a grey area, though in my opinion, if it comes with patient autonomy and honoring patient wishes in the end (reasonable standards, NOT the indefinite loop of endless treatments, goalpost shifting, and deception, false hope, lies, etc.), then it would make sense.

More specifically, suppose an otherwise relatively healthy individual (maybe in their young adult age, be it 20's or 30's, maybe even middle age, like mid 40's or 50's) with not a lot of impediment to their day to day ADL (Activities of Daily Living), but their mentally suffering immensely (and while it is murky and harder to quantify than say a physical ailment - where it is more observable and measurable), suppose they put in a request/application for medically assisted death. I think if the provider or the program says has a waiting period, requires some documentation that the person has tried some therapies and medications (attempts to fix their situation) and with no improvement say after a year or so, then is given the green light and throughout the process, everything is documented and reaffirmed (to ensure the patient did NOT change their mind) and then finally given the green light, it would actually help the person be more at peace. Perhaps it may even allow a person to continue living a bit longer, knowing that their continued sentience is of their choice and not something that is imposed and required of them (which is sadly the reality we live in, in present day).

Finally, I do agree that patients should NOT be forced to try medication and therapy against their will, as that has more harm than good overall. A patient wanting to be better because they want to would yield better outcomes than one who is compelled to do so by the government, their peers, or even some institution or medical establishment. My example I gave was something along the lines of reasonable compromise, concession, and something that I think would act as a safeguard against impulsive decisions, while still honoring the bodily autonomy of the individual.

Jesus man it's christmas day stop doing this just for today, have a drink, put a record on

 

[Manfrotto99]

Maybe. These things are used to help create opportunity for change in people which can be helpful in some circumstances and you may never know until you give it a go. However, they are based on the generalised assumption that all people can create opportunities in life to survive and succed under any circumstances and all we need to do is become more self aware, work on ourselves and change our mind set or numb our emotions so we can cope. But doess that make life worth living? I guess it depends on the individual, but being obliged to do these things can put unreal expectations on people and often set them up for more failure.

 

[Ijustcantanymore]

People with cancer can refuse treatment which results in death without having to do those things. Not sure why suicidal/mentally ill people should be treated differently.

Just as with physical illnesses, recovery is not always possible. And those with mental conditions or suicidality that can't be cured shouldn't be forced to endure this existence a moment longer than is necessary.

 

[CutToRelease]

People with cancer can refuse treatment which results in death without having to do those things. Not sure why suicidal/mentally ill people should be treated differently.

Just as with physical illnesses, recovery is not always possible. And those with mental conditions or suicidality that can't be cured shouldn't be forced to endure this existence a moment longer than is necessary.

Good example

 

[escape_from_hell]

For nearly half a century the ADVANCED SUPER SCIENTIFIC^TM treatment for mental health issues was shoving an ice pick up someone's nose and stab-raping their brain to mush until they shut the eff up and be a good person.

Think about how many people made rich livings, retired in prestige etc. from a career of this, and were considered big warriors of 'science' fighting some kind of legitimate medical battle for the well-being of humanity.

Lobotomies.
This is not ancient history.

They are no more wiser or informed on how to deal with mental health issues and continue to rely on voodoo. Do not mistake the social credentialing system for something reflecting genuine knowledge about the mechanics of the universe. Only the mechanics of bullshitting. Why require everyone be bamboozled by bullshit artists to maintain their own sovereignty? We are fighting bullshit every day.

 

[wanttodie456]

I mean, I'm all for respecting a person's autonomy, but I feel like if there's a treatment that's not particularly invasive that could work for them, they should definetly give it a try.

 

[needthebus]

if someome is temporarily depressed, it can distort their thoughts, so yes

it's like if somone got a fever, became delirious, and wanted to try to drink gasoline because they thought it would give them superpowers, that would be bad and their delerium shoukd be treated

that's why if suicidality is merely a temporary response to distorted thinking people should get help

this is why making suicide illegal sucks. there should be a process so that some people are able to commit suicide and some people get help

most psychiatric treatment is hog wash and it would be better if treatment was a life coach who urged people to exercise, talked with them, etc. SSRIs are barely better than a placebo. Still, just time often resolves some depression.


instead it's just "get back to work wage slave, take these pills, and apologize to jesus for lowering our company profits"

suicide is usually hard and awful but for some people it makes sense, because they avoid a lot of almost certain suffering.

 

[maniac116]

I'm almost 69 years old. I've been suicidal off & on since my youth but ctb to me is an absolute last, last resort.
I've got chronic pain, lost my throat to cancer, fought hepatitis C, ulcerative colitis & am now losing teeth do to chemotherapy.
I made 2 ctb attempts that weren't well thought out about 12 years ago.
Sometimes I don't know why I keep going, but I do.