Discussion ctb by train

[Squidbits]

I use a subway to get to work every day. I think a lot about jumping in front, but I never do, because I know theyre moving too slow when theyre pulling into stations. it would just be a messy maiming before anything else.

I do however know of an above-ground station about an hour away from me. Amtraks go through there and Ive seen them pass by before. they're fast. fast enough to make it quick.

I know it'd be unfortunate for the conductor but I dont currently have access to any other methods that would make ctb instantaneous and most likely successful. was wondering if anyone else here had considered this method.

 

[SanguineHare]

I wouldn't do this method just because of the ptsd it causes to the person driving the train.

 

[WilNord]

Reliable way is to put your head on the tracks so they decapitate you, if you jump into a train while it's coming to a stop you might just become paralyzed. You should follow where the tracks go and lay your head on tracks far from the platform to maximize success

 

[Someone123]

I use a subway to get to work every day. I think a lot about jumping in front, but I never do, because I know theyre moving too slow when theyre pulling into stations. it would just be a messy maiming before anything else.

I do however know of an above-ground station about an hour away from me. Amtraks go through there and Ive seen them pass by before. they're fast. fast enough to make it quick.

I know it'd be unfortunate for the conductor but I dont currently have access to any other methods that would make ctb instantaneous and most likely successful. was wondering if anyone else here had considered this method.

The most informative post I have seen on here is from a former train driver who drove for a long time and pewrsonally hit 13 people, 9 of whom died- one took four days to die. Of the survivors some had missing limbs and a variety of other serious injuries, including possible brain damage. So there is about a 1/3 chance of surviving with a combination of amputations, brain injuries, etc- you may want to search by train and try to find his posts- he had several, but people don't becessarily die right away even if they die. The downside risk is so bad that I wouldn't do it.

 

[FuneralCry]

To me train sounds like an awful way to go, and I believe you have to be pretty desperate to choose that method. I would not choose it myself personally though.
The fact that it could traumatise someone else is not what puts me off it. The problem is the society that denies the peaceful methods and the option of euthanasia. Some people feel like they have no other choice to end their suffering

 

[Ligottian]

In the USA, when there is a commercial train suicide, the train company stops the train from further movement until the entire crew can be replaced. Or at least that is what I've read. So it's probably safe to assume PTSD is a real thing for them in those cases.

 

[Crazy4u]

this is not a good method. No good can come out of it. Please reconsider

 

[eguiö]

Reliable way is to put your head on the tracks so they decapitate you, if you jump into a train while it's coming to a stop you might just become paralyzed. You should follow where the tracks go and lay your head on tracks far from the platform to maximize success

Usually this shouldnt work since there are things in front of the wheels that will push you and you will become a mangled mess afterwards.

 

[WilNord]

Usually this shouldnt work since there are things in front of the wheels that will push you and you will become a mangled mess afterwards.

Guess it depends on the train model. All the photos of people doing this ended up with their head completely gone and nothing else, although almost all of these took place in India and Russia, one was in America but happened 2009

 

[LingeringUnreal]

I can't think of train suicides without remembering this donkey getting exploded by one (mild gore but very short). Seems to be a lot of factors involved - does the train have time to slow down, is it around a corner, what part of your body is actually on the track, what model of train.....too many factors for me personally (not to mention having some innocent bystander assist your ctb), though when it works it really works.

 

[Chinaski]

I wouldn't do this method just because of the ptsd it causes to the person driving the train.

This is often put forward whenever the train method is discussed and imo it is unhelpful. I would not choose this method either for different reasons but it is unfair to people who post on this forum to routinely throw this back at them.

Most ctb methods will sadly traumatise someone - the person who finds a hanged body is unlikely to forget it. A chambermaid stumbling across a blue SN corpse is not likely to feel good about it. Yes train drivers will probably be traumatised by these events, but it's strange to me how they are regularly elevated to a protected species on here compared to others, to the point where it's used to dismiss a very effective method in a judgemental way.

 

[SanguineHare]

This is often put forward whenever the train method is discussed and imo it is unhelpful. I would not choose this method either for different reasons but it is unfair to people who post on this forum to routinely throw this back at them.

Most ctb methods will sadly traumatise someone - the person who finds a hanged body is unlikely to forget it. A chambermaid stumbling across a blue SN corpse is not likely to feel good about it. Yes train drivers will probably be traumatised by these events, but it's strange to me how they are regularly elevated to a protected species on here compared to others, to the point where it's used to dismiss a very effective method in a judgemental way.

I don't think it is unfair to realistically remind people that it will traumatize someone not expecting it.
I imagine finding a hung body or a blue corpse is less traumatic but that is a me thing. Mainly because whoever found my body in that case would likely be expecting it. As opposed to the train driver just trying to make a living. Plus finding a body from the methods you mentioned is much less gory.

 

[Chinaski]

I don't think it is unfair to realistically remind people that it will traumatize someone not expecting it.
I imagine finding a hung body or a blue corpse is less traumatic but that is a me thing. Mainly because whoever found my body in that case would likely be expecting it. As opposed to the train driver just trying to make a living. Plus finding a body from the methods you mentioned is much less gory.

This is kind of the point, it's not up to us to minimise or deny the trauma suffered by others, a traumatised chambermaid is not likely to be consoled by the notion that train drivers have it worse. I mean l don't disagree that it would potentially traumatise people, but then most suicides do in some shape or form, and at no point did the op ask an ethical question but a practical one, which is probably why it was posted here and not Quora.

 

[SanguineHare]

This is kind of the point, it's not up to us to minimise or deny the trauma suffered by others, a traumatised chambermaid is not likely to be consoled by the notion that train drivers have it worse. I mean l don't disagree that it would potentially traumatise people, but then most suicides do in some shape or form, and at no point did the op ask an ethical question but a practical one, which is probably why it was posted here and not Quora.

I get your point. I just don't agree with it. I think part of CBTing responsibly is considering every aspect of it so I chimed in. I personally plan to do my best to minimize any harm for whoever finds me and make it an easy clean up for them.

 

[Pluto]

Yes train drivers will probably be traumatised by these events, but it's strange to me how they are regularly elevated to a protected species on here compared to others, to the point where it's used to dismiss a very effective method in a judgemental way.

Train drivers have the advantage that they are paid generously in part due to this issue, plus are given some training to prepare them. They also have some support in the aftermath - time off and counselling. Like police officers, this is a part of the job.

Of far greater concern is a mess of blood and guts in a public place that could be seen by any number of people, including children. That is where the risk of causing trauma is a legitimate concern to anyone with any moral compass. It's also possible to inconvenience tens of thousands of commuters, if that counts for anything.

 

[Chinaski]

Train drivers have the advantage that they are paid generously in part due to this issue, plus are given some training to prepare them. They also have some support in the aftermath - time off and counselling. Like police officers, this is a part of the job.

Of far greater concern is a mess of blood and guts in a public place that could be seen by any number of people, including children. That is where the risk of causing trauma is a legitimate concern to anyone with any moral compass. It's also possible to inconvenience tens of thousands of commuters, if that counts for anything.

Again, the suggestion here is that those who choose this method are devoid of that moral compass - this is not the place for such a judgement or character assessment, which was not called for in this thread by the op. If the method is not for you that's fine, it's not for me either, but there are many forums out there to talk in condemnatory language about people who choose what is an effective method and it surprises me that it takes place here.

Further, inconvenience to commuters does not count for literally anything, imho.

 

[YourNeighbor]

Again, the suggestion here is that those who choose this method are devoid of that moral compass - this is not the place for such a judgement or character assessment, which was not called for in this thread by the op. If the method is not for you that's fine, it's not for me either, but there are many forums out there to talk in condemnatory language about people who choose what is an effective method and it surprises me that it takes place here.

Further, inconvenience to commuters does not count for literally anything, imho.

Couldn't agree less. There are shitty ways to kill oneself, and then there are very shitty ways. Suicide by cop is in the latter category because one is compelling another to become the method; similarly, jumping in front of a train is wrong, as is jumping into traffic or off a tall building onto a busy sidewalk (all these examples might also endanger others, to a greater or lesser extent).

A maid that comes across a corpse in a hotel may be traumatized, but at least she will not have to consider herself connected to an instrumentality that took another's life. That is a major qualitative distinction.

And inconvenience to commuters probably should count for something, though given how self-absorbed one attempting suicide is likely to be, it's fair to assume that's not a consideration. Out of hundreds/thousands of commuters, some may be en route to important irreplaceable events, even to be present at births or deaths of family. We'll never know, but it makes no sense to assume all commuters are engaged in mundane and unimportant matters.

 

[Chinaski]

Couldn't agree less. There are shitty ways to kill oneself, and then there are very shitty ways. Suicide by cop is in the latter category because one is compelling another to become the method; similarly, jumping in front of a train is wrong, as is jumping into traffic or off a tall building onto a busy sidewalk (all these examples might also endanger others, to a greater or lesser extent).

A maid that comes across a corpse in a hotel may be traumatized, but at least she will not have to consider herself connected to an instrumentality that took another's life. That is a major qualitative distinction.

And inconvenience to commuters probably should count for something, though given how self-absorbed one attempting suicide is likely to be, it's fair to assume that's not a consideration. Out of hundreds/thousands of commuters, some may be en route to important irreplaceable events, even to be present at births or deaths of family. We'll never know, but it makes no sense to assume all commuters are engaged in mundane and unimportant matters.

I have my own views on this method and reasons why l would not choose it, this is not the issue - l don't state them because l genuinely don't think this is place for saying "you are a shitty person for choosing this effective and quite common method", and in this instance the OP did not ask for a moral assessment on the method of their choosing.

If we're to discuss the train method in a thread devoted to it l will happily put my reasons why l personally would not choose it, l personally know two people who did suicide this way, but I'd be very mindful to avoid condemnatory language and making severe character assessments of those who prioritise it's effectiveness, l think it's a particularly slippery slope and one we are definitely best avoiding.

 

[Pluto]

Presumably if anyone proposed a CTB method of joining ISIS and becoming a suicide bomber, the bulk of replies would focus on the ethics of killing innocent people rather than the effectiveness of IEDs.

There is a grey area when it comes to the train method. Jumping in front of traffic carries a fairly high probability of injury to an innocent party so would raise more concern again. It is probably appropriate that glaring ethical issues be raised in addition to clinically appraising the effectiveness of a given method. It is not an attack on anyone's character, merely pointing out factors that they may have overlooked. But no harm in agreeing to disagree.

 

[Chinaski]

Presumably if anyone proposed a CTB method of joining ISIS and becoming a suicide bomber, the bulk of replies would focus on the ethics of killing innocent people rather than the effectiveness of IEDs.

No because homicide and suicide are two very different things.

To reiterate, if this thread was a "thoughts on moral implications of train ctb" the individual objections would be fair enough but the condemnatory language towards those who don't meet your own high ethical standards regarding effective ctb methods would still be uncalled for. The point I'm making is that there is a difference between saying "l personally would not choose this method" and "anyone who chooses this method is a shitty person".

 

[YourNeighbor]

I have my own views on this method and reasons why l would not choose it, this is not the issue - l don't state them because l genuinely don't think this is place for saying "you are a shitty person for choosing this effective and quite common method", and in this instance the OP did not ask for a moral assessment on the method of their choosing.

If we're to discuss the train method in a thread devoted to it l will happily put my reasons why l personally would not choose it, l personally know two people who did suicide this way, but I'd be very mindful to avoid condemnatory language and making severe character assessments of those who prioritise it's effectiveness, l think it's a particularly slippery slope and one we are definitely best avoiding.

No one is accusing anyone of being a shitty person for considering the train method--ostensibly anyone considering this method is quite desparate and not motivated by a desire to harm others. That does not mean it is inappropriate to point out the morally questionable aspects of this method, in addition to its practical shortcomings.

There is a lot of consideration here of choice, appropriately so. Directly involving others in the act of taking one's life, without giving those others any choice in the matter, violates the principle of choice at a very basic level.

 

[rottenteeth]

This is a tough choice....being desperate to CTB yet worried about others emotional and mental health.

 

[SanguineHare]

No because homicide and suicide are two very different things.

To reiterate, if this thread was a "thoughts on moral implications of train ctb" the individual objections would be fair enough but the condemnatory language towards those who don't meet your own high ethical standards regarding effective ctb methods would still be uncalled for. The point I'm making is that there is a difference between saying "l personally would not choose this method" and "anyone who chooses this method is a shitty person".

Literally no one said OP is shitty. To remind someone how their actions effect another living being isn't a bad thing either. I never condemned OP for their choice. You compared train drivers as a protected class because I think it is wrong to scar them. As a whole I think we should desire to not traumatize people through our actions. Train conductor or not. I wouldn't think less of anyone who did the train route if it negatively impacted the mental health of the person driving our train . But we have to be accountable for our actions as people. I myself as an individual could never forgive myself knowing I possibly horrified someone and drove them to the same points as me.

 

[Chinaski]

No one is accusing anyone of being a shitty person for considering the train method--ostensibly anyone considering this method is quite desparate and not motivated by a desire to harm others. That does not mean it is inappropriate to point out the morally questionable aspects of this method, in addition to its practical shortcomings.

There is a lot of consideration here of choice, appropriately so. Directly involving others in the act of taking one's life, without giving those others any choice in the matter, violates the principle of choice at a very basic level.

When people couch their arguments against it in terms like "anyone with a moral compass (would not do it)", as we've seen in this thread, this is unambiguously condemnatory language, as is describing it as a "very shitty method" on the same lines, the implication being that it's fine to assess the suicidal individual as someone of questionable moral and ethical standards. My own view is that when someone begins a thread saying "I'm considering the train method" it's quite jarring to see regular responses about the driver when, as we should probably understand on here, people who do this are desperate enough to prioritise the possibility of an instant exit above all else. I dare say they are probably unbothered by the prospect of making people late for work too.

The OP stated they have no alternative means of a quick ctb and when people on here state that they are considering this unpleasant but effective method l don't think it's correct for users of this forum to make them feel as if they are lesser people for doing so, if we're going to start guilt-tripping or character-assessing users for not choosing our own preferred method we're not much use imo.

Literally no one said OP is shitty. To remind someone how their actions effect another living being isn't a bad thing either. I never condemned OP for their choice. You compared train drivers as a protected class because I think it is wrong to scar them. As a whole I think we should desire to not traumatize people through our actions. Train conductor or not. I wouldn't think less of anyone who did the train route if it negatively impacted the mental health of the person driving our train . But we have to be accountable for our actions as people. I myself as an individual could never forgive myself knowing I possibly horrified someone and drove them to the same points as me.

This last sentence in particular kind of evidences the point. You yourself as an individual could never... well so what? I personally could never hang myself knowing it could be a loved one who stumbled across my swinging corpse, but it's an effective method and people get desperate enough to consider it, if their need to ctb outweighs this aspect for them then it's not for me to condemn.

The point is who are we to judge on this basis, and every time someone pops up in a thread from someone considering this effective method to talk it down in accordance with their own ethical standards is, by implication, passing shade over the person considering it.

 

[Toonloon]

I thought about it. But likelihood of surviving too high. I don't want to survive and be disfigured along with being left disabled. Dependent on someone forever because I couldn't finish the task would be my hell on earth.

 

[YourNeighbor]

When people couch their arguments against it in terms like "anyone with a moral compass (would not do it)", as we've seen in this thread, this is unambiguously condemnatory language, as is describing it as a "very shitty method" on the same lines, the implication being that it's fine to assess the suicidal individual as someone of questionable moral and ethical standards.

I'm not speaking for others, but I only addressed the method as being shitty not anyone who would consider it merely for considering it. I think that was the general gist of other comments too, but others speak for themselves.

We have to be able to separate criticism of acts from criticisms of people. I would hope that this community would continue to discourage anyone from pursuing a method that directly and unwittingly involves another in a decision to suicide.

 

[Chinaski]

I'm not speaking for others, but I only addressed the method as being shitty not anyone who would consider it merely for considering it. I think that was the general gist of other comments too, but others speak for themselves.

We have to be able to separate criticism of acts from criticisms of people. I would hope that this community would continue to discourage anyone from pursuing a method that directly and unwittingly involves another in a decision to suicide.

If one were to say, "what you are doing is a very shitty thing, nobody with a moral compass would do it" you are criticising both the act and the individual. I would hope that this community would refrain from imposing a damning moral and ethical hierarchy of effective and not uncommon suicide methods according to individual positions.

 

[callme]

If one were to say, "what you are doing is a very shitty thing, nobody with a moral compass would do it" you are criticising both the act and the individual. I would hope that this community would refrain from imposing a damning moral and ethical hierarchy of effective and not uncommon suicide methods according to individual positions.

The moral compass is as shitty as the political compass anyway, only two axes.

 

[Squidbits]

I'm really sorry about bringing this up. I didnt intend for this to devolve into a huge debate… I know this method is controversial. I'm not even sure if I'll ever use it, either. it's just something I noticed is available to me and was somewhat considering.

 

[PeacefulTonic]

I'm really sorry about bringing this up. I didnt intend for this to devolve into a huge debate… I know this method is controversial. I'm not even sure if I'll ever use it, either. it's just something I noticed is available to me and was somewhat considering.

There's nothing to be sorry about. I'd say it's much better for the forum to have healthy debates, as opposed to it being an echo chamber