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Red Scare

Red Scare

Wizard
Mar 1, 2022
647
you never took DMT? LSD? Psilocybin?
Yes, still don't believe in an afterlife. I am not sure how doing lsd would make you believe in an afterlife unless you mistook your hallucination as some kind of OBE, and evidence of some place existing that your consciousness goes to after death. This is absurd. Having hallucinations depends upon having a functional brain, so when you die there doesn't seem to be any reason to assume you go to a hallucinogenic psychedelic dream land.
OP, look up psilocybin which has been used with terminal cancer patients.
I have. They tripped out, on psychedelic drugs. Some of them believed their trips to be significant or that they had a spiritual experience. This is not evidence of anything. I also think it's highly unethical to give these drugs to cancer patients and allow them to delude themselves and think that it means they are going to die and go to heaven.

It is the same with therapists who are starting to give their patients mdma and shrooms. They allow their patient to believe when they have a so called spiritual experience, that it was actually them talking to Jesus or whatever. Sure these drugs can be therapeutic, but not like that. I think a therapist has a responsibility to explain to them it is a hallucinogen and they might hallucinate, but that it's not real. It's not ethical to let them believe they talked to Jesus, and become delusional.

Buddhism says that reincarnation is a misnomer, as we do not have a memory of our past lives (most of us) so even if the 'soul' reincarnates it doesn't mean much, as every life is a new storyline so to speak.
There has never been evidence of reincarnation, no reason to think we reincarnate at all. No evidence of a soul, or anything like that.
After death - the general stuff I read in the past talks about white light, being greeted, a life review...But the Tibetan Book of the Dead contains specific guidance on how to get a better reincarnation and get off the wheel of incarnation faster. My mum told me my late grandma saw a white light and family members who had passed on, greeting her as she was dying of cancer. She was in a hospice.
Again, there has never been any evidence that we reincarnate. Ever. There is no evidence to support the belief in reincarnation.

I find it more realistic to think that they were on drugs, or that the brain releases endogenous dmt. So maybe you go on one final trip, but then that's it. When the brain dies, consciousness ends.
There are documented cases of children remembering past lives and literature out there.
No there aren't. Children had vivid imaginations, there has never been any evidence that someone said they remembered something and described it in vivid detail, and then that was corroborated by scientific and historical evidence.
You want to possibly look up Dr Brian Weiss MD. He is quite comforting and his story is interesting. He was giving hypnotherapy to a patient when she 'regressed' into a past life memory that helped her feel better. He was a scientist and is one, and a doctor, and became convinced of the veracity of past lives and now teaches about them.
Hypnosis and so called recovered memories have been debunked by science over and over and over again. Look up false memory syndrome.
Scientists are beginning to agree that this whole world is a simulation - like a very sophisticated computer game.
No they aren't. There is no evidence that is the case.
That is what neuroscience and Hinduism teach us, as well as quantum physics.
False.
That this world is an illusion created by our minds, through the experience of the senses. It's a matrix of experience. E.g. the documentary with David Eagleman on the brain shows how the brain creates our experience of reality rather than vice versa.
But this does not negate that there is an objective reality that we each perceive and experience through the subjective lens of consciousness. Even if this were a simulation, the parameters of such are that it is indistinguishable from a material universe.
When climate change hits (sorry it's not cheerful!) then we will be the lucky ones as we have researched exit methods. Watching people die of thirst/starvation is less fun than exiting peacefullly.
That is the first thing you said I agree with.
Do remember tho if you try hard enough you will find scientists will tell you that you can change your gender 72 times a week and there's real sickos out there.
Careful. There are a lot of trans people here on this forum (including out site admin) and what you said might offend them.

But yes, there have also been scientists and doctors who once thought lobotomies were a good thing. That doesn't negate the fact that science and the empirical method is still the best method we have for answering questions and arriving at conclusions regarding our natural world.

All I've seen is you go on about is scientists, pre Galileo there was a set consensus that was monolithic then within a year a total 180 shift in the consensus.
That's how science works. People have hypotheses, and then when enough experimental data has been acquired, you can call that a theory. At any time though, more evidence could be found that overturns what we thought we knew, it's not a bad thing. It just means we are learning more.
I'm not sure there is scientific evidence 100% about any afterlife yeah but I don't think there is any 100% saying there's not either. Imo you saying there isn't an afterlife Is based off feelings of your own too as I can't see how it's proven one way or another. My feeling is always that there is an afterlife
There's nothing saying that this isn't a simulation, and you live in the matrix. There's nothing saying that god didn't make it all in 7 days, there's nothing saying this isn't all a turtles dream, floating threw outer space. There's no evidence it will all just end tomorrow without warning. There are a lot of things it could be, we could say what if this, what if that. In the end we rely on the evidence evidence, and so far all the evidence we have ever gathered is that we live in a material universe, the Big Bang happened, we evolved, and as far as we can tell no other universe or dimensions exist, or that consciousness depends upon anything but the brain. When the brain dies, consciousness ceases to be. How can you perceive anything without consciousness? There is no evidence we possess any kind of soul or spirit, and that consciousness depends on that instead of a brain, nor that this spirit leaves the body at the time of death to enter any afterlife.

This is not based on feeling, but on the available evidence.
 
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Mukey

Departure
Oct 18, 2021
58
That's kind of the point.

You're complaining about nothing. No one expects that your consciousness, which ends at death, will evolve again into more consciousness. This Is a straw man argument.
its not strawman because you are saying that its the same concept of not being born at all as opposed to being born after millions of years of unconsciousness. you obviously feel no sensation before you were born until you become conscious but when you die you will not feel anything at all so comparing the state of after death to being before you were born is futile.
 
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Red Scare

Red Scare

Wizard
Mar 1, 2022
647
its not strawman because you are saying that its the same concept of not being born at all as opposed to being born after millions of years of unconsciousness. you obviously feel no sensation before you were born until you become conscious but when you die you will not feel anything at all so comparing the state of after death to being before you were born is futile.
I think that is a distinction without a difference. Perhaps you just want to be argumentative.

When you are dead you will have no memory, no awareness, no consciousness of anything.

Before you were born you have no memory, no awareness, no consciousness of anything.

In either case, there is no "you". I don't see the difference between never having existed, and being dead and no longer existing. If you want to get metaphysical with it, you could argue that there is never really a "you" to begin with. See the video I posted earlier. Our whole idea of being conscious and having an identity, of there being a "you" is a farce to begin with.
 
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Shu

Shu

As above, So Below.
Jan 21, 2022
2,487
Or, you know, it's based on scientific reasoning and skepticism. There has never been any reason to assume there is an afterlife. Look at the person here saying that lsd and shrooms are somehow evidence. It's absurd. There has never been any evidence of an afterlife, and ancient people's only assumed there was because they couldn't scientifically explain things like hallucinations and weird dreams. They literally assumed that their consciousness must have gone somewhere else, and there you go. From there they expanded on that to believe that consciousness extends beyond death and that it "goes somewhere", but there has never been the slightest bit of scientific evidence to support that idea.

Earlier you said you believe in a kind of heaven. This has to be taken on faith. You can't possibly explain how that would scientifically exist. Where is this heaven. How is your consciousness sustained there without a brain? You don't know. It's an extreme leap of faith.
Why don't you just leave people alone and let them feel and think or believe what they want?



OP check out this book. It's really interesting.


 
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Red Scare

Red Scare

Wizard
Mar 1, 2022
647
Why don't you just leave people alone and let them feel and think or believe what they want?
The OP asked for scientific evidence. This is a discussion group, a forum for different people to share different ideas.

I am not trying to spoil anybody's fun here. We're having a serious discussion.
 
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Shu

Shu

As above, So Below.
Jan 21, 2022
2,487
The OP asked for scientific evidence. This is a discussion group, a forum for different people to share different ideas.

I am not trying to spoil anybody's fun here. We're having a serious discussion.
OP absolutely did ask for a "scientific" view or proof. I am sorry.





Maybe we choose to be in amnesia so we can get the fullness of the experience and learn as much as we can. Who knows. I don't know anything anymore. I know no-thing. I just know that I AM.
 
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hankbank3928

hankbank3928

Student
Dec 30, 2021
186
This isn't a critique of people on here, but I do think people are so adversely effected by their trauma of their life and issues that they can't see anything but nothingness when they're gone, or even want that as a way to escape.

All other forums I've been apart of, and other discussions it's usually 50/50. Seems like it's 90/10 here in favor of there's nothing after death, I think that's because of issues everyone has partly at least.
I've noticed the 90/10 thing as well. Consciousness existing outside of the brain is not such a huge leap. There's plenty of concrete evidence for a Creator.
 
T

ThePaleWhiteLight

Member
Mar 28, 2022
52
I noticed the 90/10 thing as well. Consciousness existing outside of the brain is not such a huge leap. There's plenty of concrete evidence for a Creator.

Eeeeh.

There is no evidence that any of the Creators worshipped on Earth are valid. The God of the Bible, after all, can be defeated by chariots of iron.

And the LORD was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron. Judges 1:19

I could absolutely countenance the possibility of some sort of God, but absolutely not an anthropocentric one - no God of Love, but a chaotic and inscrutible God.
 
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O

OldDrummer

Arcanist
Feb 4, 2022
435
Although I was raised Catholic, I saw through it at 12 and renounced it. I'm now in my early 50's and have been an atheist with Buddhistic beliefs ever since.

Although I don't believe in an all-loving magic friend in the sky, I do believe in reincarnation and the concept of karma. This is more based on the scientific work of Dr. Brian Weiss and Dr. Ian Stevenson, among others. It's not something widely researched as it's not conducive to having a successful career in academia.

Intent and karma are the keys. That's why I strongly advise those wishing to ctb not to do so based on taking revenge on others.

It's critical to make peace with the world before moving on as best you can.

Anyhoo, here's an interesting case...

 
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ThePaleWhiteLight

Member
Mar 28, 2022
52
The Buddhist teachings of reincarnation are very different from this though.
 
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hankbank3928

hankbank3928

Student
Dec 30, 2021
186
Yes, yes it is.

False. There is zero evidence.
The beginning and fine-tuning of the universe, consciousness, rationality, beauty, human dignity and worth, and free will. All support evidence for a God.
 
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C

cleveland2011

Member
Feb 12, 2022
46
I would like to know what is after death. This question terrifies me, and my life also terrifies me because I am disabled, suffering, and I see others having succeeded in their lives.

I have CTB means as I have 150mg of N and if that's not enough some SN could complete the deliverance cocktail.

I'm looking for books, testimonials, like the NDE, some kind of "scientific" proof that there is something good after death. We are going to die anyway, no one is immortal. After all, why do we have a conscience? How our consciousness was created before being born? We have no memory of before we were born, while life existed long before we were born. Why do we always have the same body and why are we not in another person's body (the soul remains a prisoner of its body)?

Homozygous twins (i.e. with the same genetic heritage) are different at the soul level, although their bodies are totally identical, and each keeps his body, without the spirit of a twin going into the other's body.

I thank this forum for existing, because people in my life are fed up with me talking about my craving for CTB.

Same situation as you. The illness is so severe. I had it all before it started.

All I can say is we don't know until it's over. There is evidence in both ways- nothing or something. I hope for the latter- I have always loved existence and doing things.

But now… the only thing that matters is I make a bowel movement after breakfast. And eat enough protein throughout the day. Without either, my suffering becomes something I cannot tolerate at all whatsoever.

But I know that suffering is going to get even worse. Where my stomach is going to stop working eventually, the brain is going to be completely destroyed. My only way out is out of this life.

And the afterlife in many suggestions (NDEs, mediums etc) seems so forgiving. The whole "love and peace thing" sounds perfect if it's true.

I think in severe disability where there is no possibility of an ending it's worth taking the chance. Esspecially if you think non existence is better than the hell you are currently suffering.

One last thing- my illness is neurological. It is at a point where it is now not fixable. But in the past, it was very fixable I just didn't get all the science behind it. When I would get better at times and I mean feeling GOOD for hours to days at a time, it was heavenly. And I'd imagine that's what the afterlife would be like.

It was way better than before being sick. So maybe it's just a reminder that there is a heavenly place (not heaven as I consider myself agnostic) for our souls to exist when we move on from this dungeon or suffering.
 
G

Graytaichi

Wizard
Feb 14, 2022
606
When u die u die. There is no such as afterlife. Its the same as sleeping eternity.

No more morning sun, fun, emotions ,etc
Same as reading a last few pages of a book.
 
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E

Eternal Oblivion

Student
Nov 23, 2021
195
You may be interested in reading the stories on NDRF. ORG.

It is a research foundation that studies NDES. They collect NDE stories from people around the world. I started reading some of the stories a few years ago after a friend of mine told me about it. It's very interesting. Most of the NDES people had were positive experiences. One notable thing is that many of these people were afraid of dying before they had their NDE. After the NDE, they were no longer afraid of dying. In fact many of these people were very mad that they were revived and brought back here. They wanted to stay there and said they look forward to going back someday.
I tried to go for that site " NDRF.ORG " but I couldn't, are you sure that's the right adress?
 
O

ornitier199

Arcanist
Mar 26, 2022
413
When u die u die. There is no such as afterlife. Its the same as sleeping eternity.

No more morning sun, fun, emotions ,etc
Same as reading a last few pages of a book.

Yeah.
And why fear death anyways? You know it comes one way or another. The difference here is:
When
 
Chiisai

Chiisai

To infinity and beyond!
Sep 1, 2021
754
I would like to know what is after death. This question terrifies me, and my life also terrifies me because I am disabled, suffering, and I see others having succeeded in their lives.

I have CTB means as I have 150mg of N and if that's not enough some SN could complete the deliverance cocktail.

I'm looking for books, testimonials, like the NDE, some kind of "scientific" proof that there is something good after death. We are going to die anyway, no one is immortal. After all, why do we have a conscience? How our consciousness was created before being born? We have no memory of before we were born, while life existed long before we were born. Why do we always have the same body and why are we not in another person's body (the soul remains a prisoner of its body)?

Homozygous twins (i.e. with the same genetic heritage) are different at the soul level, although their bodies are totally identical, and each keeps his body, without the spirit of a twin going into the other's body.

I thank this forum for existing, because people in my life are fed up with me talking about my craving for CTB.
Your fear is valid. Afterall, human psyche generally fear the unknown. However, no one can truly claim the answer to your question because all claims in sciences are all theoretical and for religion, its a matter of faith which you have two choices "believe it or dont". This type of question really doesnt have a certain answer so rather than confuse yourself with theories and doubts, why not listen to what your heart tells you with confidence? Im sure that will put you at ease to believe in what you want to believe.
 
Hercules

Hercules

Arcanist
Jan 31, 2021
408
I tried to go for that site " NDRF.ORG " but I couldn't, are you sure that's the right adress?
Sorry. I typed in the wrong address. I wasn't wearing my glasses. Here is the correct address

NDERF.ORG

I tried to make a link, but I am unable to for some reason .
 
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L

LittleJem

Visionary
Jul 3, 2019
2,669
Yes, still don't believe in an afterlife. I am not sure how doing lsd would make you believe in an afterlife unless you mistook your hallucination as some kind of OBE, and evidence of some place existing that your consciousness goes to after death. This is absurd. Having hallucinations depends upon having a functional brain, so when you die there doesn't seem to be any reason to assume you go to a hallucinogenic psychedelic dream land.

I have. They tripped out, on psychedelic drugs. Some of them believed their trips to be significant or that they had a spiritual experience. This is not evidence of anything. I also think it's highly unethical to give these drugs to cancer patients and allow them to delude themselves and think that it means they are going to die and go to heaven.

It is the same with therapists who are starting to give their patients mdma and shrooms. They allow their patient to believe when they have a so called spiritual experience, that it was actually them talking to Jesus or whatever. Sure these drugs can be therapeutic, but not like that. I think a therapist has a responsibility to explain to them it is a hallucinogen and they might hallucinate, but that it's not real. It's not ethical to let them believe they talked to Jesus, and become delusional.


There has never been evidence of reincarnation, no reason to think we reincarnate at all. No evidence of a soul, or anything like that.

Again, there has never been any evidence that we reincarnate. Ever. There is no evidence to support the belief in reincarnation.

I find it more realistic to think that they were on drugs, or that the brain releases endogenous dmt. So maybe you go on one final trip, but then that's it. When the brain dies, consciousness ends.

No there aren't. Children had vivid imaginations, there has never been any evidence that someone said they remembered something and described it in vivid detail, and then that was corroborated by scientific and historical evidence.

Hypnosis and so called recovered memories have been debunked by science over and over and over again. Look up false memory syndrome.

No they aren't. There is no evidence that is the case.

False.

But this does not negate that there is an objective reality that we each perceive and experience through the subjective lens of consciousness. Even if this were a simulation, the parameters of such are that it is indistinguishable from a material universe.

That is the first thing you said I agree with.

Careful. There are a lot of trans people here on this forum (including out site admin) and what you said might offend them.

But yes, there have also been scientists and doctors who once thought lobotomies were a good thing. That doesn't negate the fact that science and the empirical method is still the best method we have for answering questions and arriving at conclusions regarding our natural world.


That's how science works. People have hypotheses, and then when enough experimental data has been acquired, you can call that a theory. At any time though, more evidence could be found that overturns what we thought we knew, it's not a bad thing. It just means we are learning more.

There's nothing saying that this isn't a simulation, and you live in the matrix. There's nothing saying that god didn't make it all in 7 days, there's nothing saying this isn't all a turtles dream, floating threw outer space. There's no evidence it will all just end tomorrow without warning. There are a lot of things it could be, we could say what if this, what if that. In the end we rely on the evidence evidence, and so far all the evidence we have ever gathered is that we live in a material universe, the Big Bang happened, we evolved, and as far as we can tell no other universe or dimensions exist, or that consciousness depends upon anything but the brain. When the brain dies, consciousness ceases to be. How can you perceive anything without consciousness? There is no evidence we possess any kind of soul or spirit, and that consciousness depends on that instead of a brain, nor that this spirit leaves the body at the time of death to enter any afterlife.

This is not based on feeling, but on the available evidence.
lolllll. No offence. Just look up the evidence on reincarnation, Horatio.

Look. I don't mind atheists. Agnostics. Seriously, God made you too. Is there a God? Wateva. It's the Matrix. God just sits behind a whole load of computer screens. You ask God. Why suffering. It just is.

My stujpid housemate who is my ex's friend just threatened me with rape. Apparently it's a joke.

Apparently I can't sleep now as he is such a nasty man.

I'm scared to sleep. I leave tomorrow. Don't know where.

I don't think he is a rapist but I am getting out of here.

Can any man be a femniist. Doubt it.

watever.

anyway. bye for now.

Horatio :) I'm really grumpy but not with yo8u, with humanity.
 
L

LittleJem

Visionary
Jul 3, 2019
2,669
There is none
There is a lot. But you haven't looked it up!

I am really pissed off with someone threatening me with rape tonight, so don't want to row with anyone online. But am in a vile mood. Am really upset that anyone would say it's a joke to joke about rape. I've been sleeping in this arseholes bed. I trusted him .

I'll find the evidence another day.
 
L

LittleJem

Visionary
Jul 3, 2019
2,669
I told him, men get raped too. Particularly in jail or during war. rape convictions 6 per cent. It's not funny.
Horatio, Einstein invented the theory of relativity after a dream. The sewing machine also owes its existence to dreams.

Did you watch Inception? That's what this world is like really. A dream within a dream. Wait for the kick.
I'll just give one article, then get back to how to run away from men...https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/out-the-darkness/202112/evaluating-the-evidence-reincarnation
I'll just give one article, then get back to how to run away from men...https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/out-the-darkness/202112/evaluating-the-evidence-reincarnation
 
J

Journeytoletgo

Broken and hated 7-14 years long overdue
May 14, 2018
1,608
i dont like when people say that after death it will be like before you were born. like hello, you didnt have freakin conciousness before you were born so how the fk would you know. that is the difference, so no it is not like before you were born because you were already bound to become concious. when you die its nothing like that
So what do you think happens and I agree with you
 
Lost Magic

Lost Magic

Illuminated
May 5, 2020
3,206
Why not just admit you don't know fuck all about what is next and stop pretending otherwise. Humility is not a bad thing here. If you knew what happens after you died you would have solved life's greatest mystery. And to my knowledge, none of you have.
 
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Sunset Limited

Sunset Limited

I believe in Sunset Limited
Jul 29, 2019
1,352
Actually, I'm not afraid of dying. I know it's not me who's afraid and doesn't want it. It's my lower brain that pumps fear. It's hard to deal with. Having a peaceful method helps.