Can healthy people understand how it feels to be suicidal or severely depressed?

[noname223]

I have read something like that in a book (Infinite Jest). The person was in a mental health hospital and described their feelings of depression and suicidality to a professional. It was written that the psychiatrist was self-aware that he did not exactly knew how the depression would feel like. It was written that this is told to them during their training.

This evoked a question for me. Were my therapists self-aware they did not exactly know how it feels to be in my shoes? I am not quite sure about that. I think some of them were bigheaded (I hope that is the right word) and assumed to know how it feels to be depressed. I mean it is their job to observe depressed people and they probably have read myriad of books about it. Some of them seemed to be quite skilled and they were competent doctors.

However every individual is different. A generalization is dangerous. There are so many different forms of depression. Sometimes I think it is weird that all these different symptoms are assigned to this one illness.

I recognized that I am quite a complex human being as many of you. Good professionals can look behind the facade. Some of my therapists were too superficial and incompentent. Others were really supportive and gave new coping skills. I think to fully understand a person there is a very close bond needed. I sometimes have the feeling the mental health systems are too greedy to make that possible. Many are forced to leave their therapists without really wanting to do so.

Still I think it is pretty difficult for a heathly person to grasp how it feels like to be severely depressed or suicidal. Though I really think there are some people who are capable of doing that. I think about very very skilled people with a lot of education and empathy. I sometimes listen to lectures and some professors were pretty on point with their descriptions. ( Though for example Jordan Peterson knows depression and suicidality due to his own illness.)

What are your experiences? Can someone who never was suicidal or severely depressed understand how it feels to be in our shoes? And if so to what an extent?

 

[headspin]

I have read something like that in a book (Infinite Jest). The person was in a mental health hospital and described their feelings of depression and suicidality to a professional. It was written that the psychiatrist was self-aware that he did not exactly knew how the depression would feel like. It was written that this is told to them during their training.

This evoked a question for me. Were my therapists self-aware they did not exactly know how it feels to be in my shoes? I am not quite sure about that. I think some of them were bigheaded (I hope that is the right word) and assumed to know how it feels to be depressed. I mean it is their job to observe depressed people and they probably have read myriad of books about it. Some of them seemed to be quite skilled and they were competent doctors.

However every individual is different. A generalization is dangerous. There are so many different forms of depression. Sometimes I think it is weird that all these different symptoms are assigned to this one illness.

I recognized that I am quite a complex human being as many of you. Good professionals can look behind the facade. Some of my therapists were too superficial and incompentent. Others were really supportive and gave new coping skills. I think to fully understand a person there is a very close bond needed. I sometimes have the feeling the mental health systems are too greedy to make that possible. Many are forced to leave their therapists without really wanting to do so.

Still I think it is pretty difficult for a heathly person to grasp how it feels like to be severely depressed or suicidal. Though I really think there are some people who are capable of doing that. I think about very very skille people with a lot of education and empathy. I sometimes listen to lectures and some professors were pretty on point with their descriptions. ( Though for example Jordan Peterson knows depression and suicidality due to his own illness.)

What are your experiences? Can someone who never was suicidal or severely depressed understand how it feels to be in our shoes? And if so to what an extent?

I don't think people can really understand, who are healthy. How could they? My therapy right now seems repetitive and useless, but I keep going. It was so hard to find one who takes new patients...he says the same things every week. The words feel empty and like what he is paid to say...."you will get through this" blah blah blah. I have battled this on and off for over 20years. I am done. My life got destroyed last year in a manic episode with psychosis. Its all fucked. I am hanging on by a thread. No one "gets it" in my life. No one can really help.

 

[summers]

I never understood what a deep, crippling depression was or was like until I watched Melancholia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melancholia_(2011_film)

The person I was with asked me to watch it because it would help me understand how she felt. Omg, I haven't cried that much in such a long time. I couldn't even talk. It broke my heart that someone I cared for ever felt like that.

So I think people who have never been depressed can go beyond sympathy to empathy. I think the same is true of people who have never been suicidal. Especially if someone is badly injured or suffering from a progressive illness, there are plenty of non-suicidal people who honestly say they would kill themselves.

 

[onlyanimalsaregood]

I have read something like that in a book (Infinite Jest). The person was in a mental health hospital and described their feelings of depression and suicidality to a professional. It was written that the psychiatrist was self-aware that he did not exactly knew how the depression would feel like. It was written that this is told to them during their training.

This evoked a question for me. Were my therapists self-aware they did not exactly know how it feels to be in my shoes? I am not quite sure about that. I think some of them were bigheaded (I hope that is the right word) and assumed to know how it feels to be depressed. I mean it is their job to observe depressed people and they probably have read myriad of books about it. Some of them seemed to be quite skilled and they were competent doctors.

However every individual is different. A generalization is dangerous. There are so many different forms of depression. Sometimes I think it is weird that all these different symptoms are assigned to this one illness.

I recognized that I am quite a complex human being as many of you. Good professionals can look behind the facade. Some of my therapists were too superficial and incompentent. Others were really supportive and gave new coping skills. I think to fully understand a person there is a very close bond needed. I sometimes have the feeling the mental health systems are too greedy to make that possible. Many are forced to leave their therapists without really wanting to do so.

Still I think it is pretty difficult for a heathly person to grasp how it feels like to be severely depressed or suicidal. Though I really think there are some people who are capable of doing that. I think about very very skilled people with a lot of education and empathy. I sometimes listen to lectures and some professors were pretty on point with their descriptions. ( Though for example Jordan Peterson knows depression and suicidality due to his own illness.)

What are your experiences? Can someone who never was suicidal or severely depressed understand how it feels to be in our shoes? And if so to what an extent?

I think it's as we say and like everything in life, only those who go through things can fully understand how the other feels and what it's like to go through, in this case, depression.

People with empathy may also be able to put themselves in the other person's shoes and imagine what it will be like, but only to a certain extent because they have never experienced it.

People who have assisted and accompanied a family member or friend who was depressed at some point in their lives can get a closer look even though they have never experienced depression.

And psychiatrists have the theoretical knowledge, they know what it is on paper, they have the tools to help us but I don't know to what extent they can even know or imagine what it will be like to have depression.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Surely some probably can because if they were truly healthy then they'd likely also be open-minded and empathetic enough to be able to see that someone is suffering. Plenty of them wouldn't have to go through such suffering themselves to be able to see that it's hard to deal with.

 

[summers]

I think it's as we say and like everything in life, only those who go through things can fully understand how the other feels and what it's like to go through, in this case, depression.

People with empathy may also be able to put themselves in the other person's shoes and imagine what it will be like, but only to a certain extent because they have never experienced it.

People who have assisted and accompanied a family member or friend who was depressed at some point in their lives can get a closer look even though they have never experienced depression.

And psychiatrists have the theoretical knowledge, they know what it is on paper, they have the tools to help us but I don't know to what extent they can even know or imagine what it will be like to have depression.

I agree. I think even if two people suffer from depression, their experiences can be so varied that neither truly understands what the other is going through.

Suicide, can be more of a one and done response to some trauma. Someone crashes a motorcycle and winds up paralyzed may commit suicide even if they were never suicidal before. That's why I think people can understand and relate to being suicidal a lot more easily than depression.

 

[symphony]

I don't think they can.

Evidence:

• I consider myself highly empathetic and had mentally ill friends, but until I experienced it myself I was sorely misinformed
• The sorts of things I hear from the most well-educated, experienced, well-intentioned mental health professionals, including:
  • Not understanding why I would really truly chronically want to die (even with knowledge of my suffering)
  • Insisting that deep down some part of me must really actually want to live
  • Suggestions of the form "why don't you just do X" (like it's actually that easy for me to "just go for a walk", or even that I could reasonably expect doing so to be helpful or find the energy and motivation to do so)

 

[indigomoon]

I have read something like that in a book (Infinite Jest). The person was in a mental health hospital and described their feelings of depression and suicidality to a professional. It was written that the psychiatrist was self-aware that he did not exactly knew how the depression would feel like. It was written that this is told to them during their training.

This evoked a question for me. Were my therapists self-aware they did not exactly know how it feels to be in my shoes? I am not quite sure about that. I think some of them were bigheaded (I hope that is the right word) and assumed to know how it feels to be depressed. I mean it is their job to observe depressed people and they probably have read myriad of books about it. Some of them seemed to be quite skilled and they were competent doctors.

However every individual is different. A generalization is dangerous. There are so many different forms of depression. Sometimes I think it is weird that all these different symptoms are assigned to this one illness.

I recognized that I am quite a complex human being as many of you. Good professionals can look behind the facade. Some of my therapists were too superficial and incompentent. Others were really supportive and gave new coping skills. I think to fully understand a person there is a very close bond needed. I sometimes have the feeling the mental health systems are too greedy to make that possible. Many are forced to leave their therapists without really wanting to do so.

Still I think it is pretty difficult for a heathly person to grasp how it feels like to be severely depressed or suicidal. Though I really think there are some people who are capable of doing that. I think about very very skilled people with a lot of education and empathy. I sometimes listen to lectures and some professors were pretty on point with their descriptions. ( Though for example Jordan Peterson knows depression and suicidality due to his own illness.)

What are your experiences? Can someone who never was suicidal or severely depressed understand how it feels to be in our shoes? And if so to what an extent?

In my experience….. no.

 

[Krieger]

Nope. The amount of ignorance I've heard from normal people is too much

 

[Ashu]

No more than we can understand how it feels to be a normtard.

 

[UndoUndoUndo]

They cannot and they don't want to go down that path. At most they think "I hope this shall pass" or "I wish I didn't have to deal with situation." This is why the advice to tell someone that you need help doesn't always work, unless you're from a rich family that can get you all the help you need. I certainly was honest to many people and found myself blocked on social media.

 

[MellowAvenue]

It's all circumstantial. While the odds are almost definitely low, I do think it's possible for 2 people, with one having recovered to the point where they could be described as healthy and the other currently struggling, to have similar enough situations that they actually get each other pretty well. Otherwise though I really do think it's difficult for a healthy person from a totally different situation to really understand the other, even if the other person may have had ideations or depression themselves.

 

[WhiteGown]

Most people don't have compassion or empathy so are unable to even try to understand a depressed persons state of thinking

 

[Apathy79]

You need similar experience to draw on. Your example of Jordan is apt. He can probably get it because he's been there. Not because of his training.

If you're suicidal and talking to a therapist who has never been suicidal, they're not going to get it, no matter how intelligent, trained or well intentioned.

It's like getting what its like to be a fish. You can learn about it and describe it well enough to write a thesis but you'll never get it.

 

[Divine Trinity]

Could anyone here who is not diagnosed Autistic or Scyzophrenic understand the daily experiences of people who are? I can't, it doesnt matter how much I read about it or talk to people that have it. Intellectually understanding something is limited by the fact you have to focus on said topic, while depression or psychosis comes and goes in cycles.

 

[Treeline589]

no

 

[shouldntbe]

Psychiatrists and the like aren't trained to empathize with your situation.

 

[Graham]

No

 

[Niko66]

They can't.

 

[Arrow]

you probably can't ever really understand unless you have been through it yourself. they might have an intellectual understanding but that's different from knowing something based on experience.

 

[CTBgenuine]

I have read something like that in a book (Infinite Jest). The person was in a mental health hospital and described their feelings of depression and suicidality to a professional. It was written that the psychiatrist was self-aware that he did not exactly knew how the depression would feel like. It was written that this is told to them during their training.

This evoked a question for me. Were my therapists self-aware they did not exactly know how it feels to be in my shoes? I am not quite sure about that. I think some of them were bigheaded (I hope that is the right word) and assumed to know how it feels to be depressed. I mean it is their job to observe depressed people and they probably have read myriad of books about it. Some of them seemed to be quite skilled and they were competent doctors.

However every individual is different. A generalization is dangerous. There are so many different forms of depression. Sometimes I think it is weird that all these different symptoms are assigned to this one illness.

I recognized that I am quite a complex human being as many of you. Good professionals can look behind the facade. Some of my therapists were too superficial and incompentent. Others were really supportive and gave new coping skills. I think to fully understand a person there is a very close bond needed. I sometimes have the feeling the mental health systems are too greedy to make that possible. Many are forced to leave their therapists without really wanting to do so.

Still I think it is pretty difficult for a heathly person to grasp how it feels like to be severely depressed or suicidal. Though I really think there are some people who are capable of doing that. I think about very very skilled people with a lot of education and empathy. I sometimes listen to lectures and some professors were pretty on point with their descriptions. ( Though for example Jordan Peterson knows depression and suicidality due to his own illness.)

What are your experiences? Can someone who never was suicidal or severely depressed understand how it feels to be in our shoes? And if so to what an extent?

One can be "healthy" and experience depression and suicidal thoughts.... Its not a them vs us situation. Being on this website doesn't give any one of us the higher ground on self destruction

 

[Niko66]

One can be "healthy" and experience depression and suicidal thoughts.... Its not a them vs us situation. Being on this website doesn't give any one of us the higher ground on self destruction

I am pretty sure being depressed to a point of suicidal thoughts is not being "healthy" under almost any definition. It's like saying you can have a failing organ and be "physically healthy".

 

[CTBgenuine]

I am pretty sure being depressed to a point of suicidal thoughts is not being "healthy" under almost any definition. It's like saying you can have a failing organ and be "physically healthy".

Suicidal doesn't automatically mean you're depressed!

 

[Niko66]

Suicidal doesn't automatically mean you're depressed!

I mean yeah? But you said one can be healthy and be depressed and have suicidal thoughts. That's what I replied to.

 

[CTBgenuine]

I mean yeah? But you said one can be healthy and be depressed and have suicidal thoughts. That's what I replied to.

There is a spectrum to depression. If you have severe depression where you don't bathe, socialise, have friends and are unable to carry out day to day activities then you're clearly not healthy.
Many people have depression and CAN maintain all of the above!

 

[Niko66]

There is a spectrum to depression. If you have severe depression where you don't bathe, socialise, have friends and are unable to carry out day to day activities then you're clearly not healthy.
Many people have depression and CAN maintain all of the above!

I guess we just have different ideas of what being healthy is. I can do all the above a majority of the time but would certainly not call myself healthy.

 

[outatime_85]

I think everyone has the ability to self-destruct.

Those who seem healthy and have their lives together have something messed up in their world.

Everyone has a breaking point. None of us are unfeeling terminators, so I don't think so-called "healthy" people can escape this world without having to endure some bout of depression or SI.

They will just hide it better or take care of it in ways others may not have the ability to.

That being said, I will paraphrase a quote from the 2003 movie In Hell:
Most of us know that the mask that is hidden behind is fake. Sooner or later, it shatters, and that is when you find out who people really are.