Aren't you afraid of not existing forever after you ctb?

[Justanotherconsumer]

Listen it's only natural given our intelligence that we will ask those questions.
I am sure if dolphins had our capacity to think, they would askthe same questions I am raising here about eternity and the scaryness of not existing for all eternity.

In my religion, ("The scientific and peace of mankind") we view death as time travel, we have calculated the odds of our dna sequence to be 1 in every 14.069 billion years, and since in death there is no experience of time passage, once you die, it will be like instant rebirth 14 billion years later, so if we can advance mans scientific knowledge and keep him from destroying himself and the current knowledge along with him, the next rebirth should be on a planet 100's at a minimum, of light years away from earth, and the technology should be advanced enough to terraform a planet and make it for all intensive purposes "Heaven".

 

[Schopenhauer]

In the end, there's no formal argument that will be able to allay your concerns.

Regarding oblivion for all eternity, as Rhett Butler said "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn."

 

[Daystavro]

Good point. The real problem I think is the terminology people attach onto things like death=eternal oblivion. Sounds scary I'm sure to some. Death=sleep, there now is that really so bad? Especially never having to wake up feeling like shit in a shitty world and no nightmares to interrupt it. The lack of anything is what I'm fascinated with more than being dead with billions of other humans. Sounds claustrophobic.

That and the perceived "aloneness" of death.
In everything, when you are the only one it's very scary.
But if there are others with you it's automatically less scary.
It's like let's say you are the only one in your neighberhood who has a power outage versus every house in your neighborhood has a power outage.
So same with death, yes I am going to be dead forever but so does billions upon billions of others.
That's why I read a lot about people who ctb, it sounds weird but it relaxes me because it reminds me I am not the only one.
In my metaphor of the giant dark and airconditioned room, they are already there, I and everyone else who will ctb will join them.

 

[ChaosDergon]

Its hard for the mind to comprehend non-existence. Since existence is the only frame of reference we have and one cannot know what it like without consciousness. It would be a paradox to know. Its kinda like the idea of infinity and what that means is truly hard to imagine. You simplify, or just accept the idea and turn it into an abstract concept. Something easier for the mind to digest.
Though I do wonder at times what it would be like to not exist, I know I cannot actually experience non-existence and there is a bit of discomfort from that. But not existing also means, the pain and suffering will not exist. You may not be aware of peace, but at least you are not suffering because you are nothing.

 

[Suicideisnirvana]

No, i'm actually afraid of the opposite.

Not of a religious afterlife/karma (i have 0 fear of that since it doesn't exist, sure i can't prove it but i also can't prove the world isn't created by a malevolent turtle who uses humans to amuse his cat friends, doesn't mean i have to hold this scenario as possible), but since i believe that there is no "self", no particular stable hominculus "I" inside us, it means that there is no guarantee that other people born/existing won't also be "Me", because there is no specific particular "Me" in "Me" to begin with.

I'm talking about something akin to this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_individualism

Not existing is my idealistic/perfect scenario. I don't fear it, i crave it. I think only a misunderstanding of this scenario makes one fear it, the mind can't conceive it and imagines it as some "oblivion/blackness" while there is no oblivion/blackness because there is nothing to perceive, no boredom, no thing at all and NO PERCEPTION OF NOTHING. This scenario isn't scary at all, it's objectively not scary, it's only the erroneous way the mind perceive it that makes it look scary.

For instance, in your message you draw attention to the extent of time "Trillion years" but time doesn't exist with no perception/consciousness.

 

[diebartdie]

Watch this video on youtube about how insignificant we are compared to the size of the universe.
They mentioned in the video how tiny Earth is compared to the size of the universe. Think of Earth as just a light bulb inside of something the size of Earth.

I often why people even bother writing suicide notes.
How do you even know that Earth, as you know it, in it's current state, will continue to exist after you die?
You perceived things through electrical signals in your brain. Reality is what you brain makes of it.

 

[Daystavro]

No, i'm actually afraid of the opposite.

Not of a religious afterlife/karma (i have 0 fear of that since it doesn't exist, sure i can't prove it but i also can't prove the world isn't created by a malevolent turtle who uses humans to amuse his cat friends, doesn't mean i have to hold this scenario as possible), but since i believe that there is no "self", no particular stable hominculus "I" inside us, it means that there is no guarantee that other people born/existing won't also be "Me", because there is no specific particular "Me" in "Me" to begin with.

I'm talking about something akin to this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_individualism

Not existing is my idealistic/perfect scenario. I don't fear it, i crave it. I think only a misunderstanding of this scenario makes one fear it, the mind can't conceive it and imagines it as some "oblivion/blackness" while there is no oblivion/blackness because there is nothing to perceive, no boredom, no thing at all and NO PERCEPTION OF NOTHING.

You are right.
I think I fear eternal oblivion because when I think about it I immediately imagine me as a skeleton lying in the ground in total blackness for all eternity.
That's why it scares me so much.

 

[Suicideisnirvana]

You are right.
I think I fear eternal oblivion because when I think about it I immediately imagine me as a skeleton lying in the ground in total blackness for all eternity.
That's why it scares me so much.

Read this it may gives you reassurances : https://www.naturalism.org/philosophy/death/death-nothingness-and-subjectivity

Abstract : "This paper critiques the widespread secular misunderstanding of death as a plunge into oblivion. It uses a thought experiment about personal identity similar to those employed by British philosopher Derek Parfit in his tour de force Reasons and Persons. By degrees, the reader is supposed to see that the notion of a blank or emptiness following death is incoherent, and that therefore we should not anticipate the end of experience when we die. This conclusion has a bit of a mystical feel to it, even though the premises are naturalistic"

 

[Daystavro]

Thank you I will read it.
Hopefully it will change the way I look at death.

Because right now I imagine only being a skeleton and in complete darkness unable to move under 6ft of ground, in complete silence for all eternity.

 

[Justanotherconsumer]

Watch this video on youtube about how insignificant we are compared to the size of the universe.
They mentioned in the video how tiny Earth is compared to the size of the universe. Think of Earth as just a light bulb inside of something the size of Earth.

I often why people even bother writing suicide notes.
How do you even know that Earth, as you know it, in it's current state, will continue to exist after you die?
You perceived things through electrical signals in your brain. Reality is what you brain makes of it.

The note is for those left behind, we know the world
Continues to exist, the same way it exists for us after our parents die. Trust your senses, what you are seeing,touching,eating,smelling,hearing is real, and even if it wasent how could you tell the difference?

 

[diebartdie]

You don't know that.
When other people die, the world continues to exist from YOUR perspective.
When you die, it's a whole another story. Nobody can really answer that.

 

[Fucking loving it]

I am not afraid. I believe firmly I will be with my daughter. Also other ppl that are gone now.

 

[Justanotherconsumer]

You don't know that.
When other people die, the world continues to exist from YOUR perspective.
When you die, it's a whole another story. Nobody can really answer that.

We were born from our parents,and they in turn were born from there's, your children our born from you. Unless you are putting yourself as the only "real" experiencer, i don't understand the question.

 

[Idorus]

I mean that's what scares me the most about ctb.
That death is eternal, being dead forever.
Not for a trillion years.
Not for a quintillion years.
For EVER.

This is interesting. It reminds me of my sis saying at the Christmas table once "it's a really scary thought thinking we do cease to exist after death". I Always wondered about the difference in practicality on all levels of life compared to a 100% non-believer like I am now. The only actual reference I have is recalling the time I did believe myself but with a conviction nowhere as close as having in oblivion these days. I don't even have the smallest doubt it's all over after this.

What is sure is this: deep suffering doesn't leave the slightest room for questioning it all or any fear concerning it. All you want is leaving the pain behind in which you will succeed.

 

[Daystavro]

This is interesting. It reminds me of my sis saying at the Christmas table once "it's a really scary thought thinking we do cease to exist after death". I Always wondered about the difference in practicality on all levels of life compared to a 100% non-believer like I am now. The only actual reference I have is recalling the time I did believe myself but with a conviction nowhere as close as having in oblivion these days. I don't even have the smallest doubt it's all over after this.

What is sure is this: deep suffering doesn't leave the slightest room for questioning it all or any fear concerning it. All you want is leaving the pain behind in which you will succeed.

So you believe like me with conviction that there is no after life and we cease to exist.
But doesn't it scare you that it will be forever? 9

 

[ChaosDergon]

You don't know that.
When other people die, the world continues to exist from YOUR perspective.
When you die, it's a whole another story. Nobody can really answer that.

We are getting into the territory of solipsism with that question.
Honestly I tend to gravitate to solopsist Ideas a lot, though this might be because of me dissociating (derelealizing mostly, but occasional depersonlization) a lot. And if in those states for a long time, it gets hard to stay grounded and I start believing the only real thing is me. Everyone outside myself is just an illusion.

 

[Cee]

i can't even fully grasp the concept of eternity. no human really can, its just too insane to think about. time literally will never end. even if the earth is gone and theres nothing left, time will keep going. nothing will ever stop moving forward, its terrifying but eventually, at some point, there will be literally nothing left. i imagine death is just like how it was before being born, no consciousness, no being, no knowledge of having ever existed. its very very difficult to understand, but i like to try to think back to events before i was born, its comforting to find that i have no concept of memory of them. just like we werent aware of earth or the universe or humans before we were born, we wont be aware of them after we die. its a cycle that we are simply completing, whether we are reincarnated or not, this life for us will be permanently over, and we will never be the person we are now again. whether that scares you or comforts you is a personal feeling, i find it to be both at the same time. thats just my take on it anyway.

 

[Roph]

It doesn't scare me.
Not existing = Peace

 

[Idorus]

So you believe like me with conviction that there is no after life and we cease to exist.
But doesn't it scare you that it will be forever? 9

Yup, living with this conviction for over a decade now. I don't experience a conscious fear of the foreverrrr-thing tho.

 

[Zaynaldeen]

I actually believe in hell and paradise and I believe that those who commit suicide go to hell so I'm even more afraid of committing suicide, being able to commit suicide and not suffer any negative consequences seems amazing to me.

 

[Sayo]

I have been obsessed with and terrified by the infinite since I was three or four. I can't say that it's not frightening, but only in the sense very large and very small things are frightening. I think I have learned to intellectualise my terror through mathematics and cosmology. However, I do find the potential implications of relativity comforting, even if it has little direct bearing on the problem of death. Probably because I am also scared of time.

We are already amidst all kinds of eternities; our minds just deflect the thought. I think my problem with 'forever' is really just a problem with the uniqueness of individual sentience, personally. (Which is a finite thing!) I know reframing it that way doesn't make it go away, but it helps me understand that I do find some intrinsic value in my life as I choose mindfully to reject it.

 

[worldexploder]

Death will come for us all wether we CTB or not. I personally want nothingness. Nothing is nothing to be afraid of.

What is the worst thing that could come out of an enterity of non existance?

 

[Prime]

I have thought about it a lot. We, ordinary mortals, come from and eventually pass into the state of Non-existence. So what is the point of "living" in between? For instance, if your entire memory is wiped away at this very moment, will it matter to you then whether you had a nice or a terrible childhood? It won't !
Similarly whats the point in living a life when we come from and pass into non-existence? And if you say, well we live for others then who are these "others"? Ordinary mortals who share the same eventual fate as you! Sooner or later everyone will die and then they don't "remember" how their life was. So whats the point of living? Whats the point of doing anything? Reality is just a huge mathematical mess of physical laws and elementary particles and somehow through favourable accidents "life" is generated like a computer somehow develops a bug sometimes on its own. But in this physical reality, I believe everything happens for a reason(yeah I know theoretical physics) so how we live must affect what happens to us after we die. I may very well be wrong and it may be true that after we die its just lights out nothing anymore. But on the grounds I just laid down I can say there might be an afterlife. What would that be like? Who knows ! The reason a person catches the bus may decide how the afterlife is ?! Idk
Whatever the case may be - Pure non-existence or an afterlife - both are scary in their own way. Afterlife is scarier though.

 

[Sayo]

Death will come for us all wether we CTB or not. I personally want nothingness. Nothing is nothing to be afraid of.

What is the worst thing that could come out of an enterity of non existance?

Good response.

This is a pragmatic way of finding out one's feelings about life for everyone who doesn't prefer an afterlife.

 

[worldexploder]

Good response.

This is a pragmatic way of finding out one's feelings about life for everyone who doesn't prefer an afterlife.

Thank you.

 

[Daystavro]

Death will come for us all wether we CTB or not. I personally want nothingness. Nothing is nothing to be afraid of.

What is the worst thing that could come out of an enterity of non existance?

That's an interesting question when you phrase it like that that I never really thought about.
But I guess not being able to experience anything in general.
And in particular things like music, the taste of chocolate, a warm bath stuff like that.

Yes , you are not going to experience bad things (that we all here have plenty of I am sure and is why we want to ctb) like mental stress, regrets, mental anguish, depression, shame, disappointmemt, anger and so on.
But you will not experience neutral or good things like I mentioned above either ever again.
That is what you have to lose.

 

[Prime]

The Rig Veda says there is an afterlife. The Bible says there is an afterlife. The Geets says there is an afterlife. The Quran says there is an afterlife. Budhdhist scriptures also talk about afterlife.

How can everyone be wrong !

 

[worldexploder]

That's an interesting question when you phrase it like that that I never really thought about.
But I guess not being able to experience anything in general.
And in particular things like music, the taste of chocolate, a warm bath stuff like that.

Yes , you are not going to experience bad things (that we all here have plenty of I am sure and is why we want to ctb) like mental stress, regrets, mental anguish, depression, shame, disappointmemt, anger and so on.
But you will not experience neutral or good things like I mentioned above either ever again.
That is what you have to lose.

Thanks.

Don't worry...you won't miss the good things when your gone.

 

[worldexploder]

The Rig Veda says there is an afterlife. The Bible says there is an afterlife. The Geets says there is an afterlife. The Quran says there is an afterlife. Budhdhist scriptures also talk about afterlife.

How can everyone be wrong !

And all of their gods act like insane psychopaths.

 

[Prime]

I have been obsessed with and terrified by the infinite since I was three or four. I can't say that it's not frightening, but only in the sense very large and very small things are frightening. I think I have learned to intellectualise my terror through mathematics and cosmology. However, I do find the potential implications of relativity comforting, even if it has little direct bearing on the problem of death. Probably because I am also scared of time.

We are already amidst all kinds of eternities; our minds just deflect the thought. I think my problem with 'forever' is really just a problem with the uniqueness of individual sentience, personally. (Which is a finite thing!) I know reframing it that way doesn't make it go away, but it helps me understand that I do find some intrinsic value in my life as I choose mindfully to reject it.

Yes infinity and eternity seem frightening. The very idea of something that never ends is frightening and almost incomprehensible. But if we are not there to "experience" that infinity then it doesn't seem terrifying at all.
If you are a real number, then the infinite number line will seem frightening to you if you have to walk through it. But say you are an alphabet, I mean you are "something"(which is actually nothing) who does not belong to that real number line. Then there is no need to be afraid.