Any drug to stop the heart?

[Alain]

Hi people!

Do you know about any drugs that would stop the heart if overdosed? I don't care about legality of the drug, I don't mind being high or not (but hey, why not having a good feeling?), but if some drugs can cause the pain heart to stop for good and without too much pain, it would be nice.

 

[Shoopie]

Any drug that stops the heart is going to be very painful I think.

 

[Alain]

Any drug that stops the heart is going to be very painful I think.

Really? My father had two heart attacks and he felt nothing. He just passed out.
I think some heart conditions are painful when it's caused by artery problems.

 

[Aliali1992]

KCL which is Potassium stops the heart in high doses....it is part of the lethal dose in some US states for this very reason. Other than that Digitoxin has a very thin therapetic margin and is highly toxic an the heart in high doses. To mention a few....Amiodaron and adinosin....a beat blocker and a calcium blocker (Metoprolol and Verpamil for example)are contraindiciert together because they can induce a blockade to the signal of the Sinus Knot that make the heart beat....of course all of those are neither reliable nor peaceful otherwise i would have used one of them long ago

 

[autumnal]

Really? My father had two heart attacks and he felt nothing. He just passed out.
I think some heart conditions are painful when it's caused by artery problems.

His particular heart attack probably progressed quickly to full cardiac arrest (and thus unconsciousness) before he was able to feel the pain, which is otherwise often present in varying degrees.

Hi people!

Do you know about any drugs that would stop the heart if overdosed? I don't care about legality of the drug, I don't mind being high or not (but hey, why not having a good feeling?), but if some drugs can cause the pain heart to stop for good and without too much pain, it would be nice.

Yeah as the other member responded, Potassium Chloride (and some other medications) can stop the heart. The problem is firstly that the experience is usually very painful, that's why it is only used after anesthetic and muscle relaxant in death penalty lethal injections. The other problem is that in pharmaceutical forms, it is restricted and difficult to obtain without a valid medical reason and prescription, which isn't helped by the fact that it has no recreational uses so there isn't any of it out on the illegal market for that purpose.

 

[SweetSpot086]

Digoxin + Propranolol

 

[Aap]

Yes

 

[laserfocus111]

Has anyone considered lignocaine (topical form) taken orally ? It has a rapid absorption and is moderately easy to obtain in some countries.

 

[last_tour]

If you can somehow induce the heart to stop (ventricular fibrillation, not really stopping but too weak to pump) not enough blood gets pumped to the brain and you will pass out. Only an AED can revive you. (EDIT: I almost forgot, theres a chance the heart could reboot itself so its not a guaranteed death depending on the dosage). Theres at least 2 methods in the PPH that rely on this mechanism and both are rated peaceful.

 

[Alain]

If you can somehow induce the heart to stop (ventricular fibrillation, not really stopping but too weak to pump) not enough blood gets pumped to the brain and you will pass out. Only an AED can revive you. Theres at least 2 methods in the PPH that rely on this mechanism and both are rated peaceful.

I didn't see anything like that in the pph. Unless it was about a drug you can't get easily. Can you tell me more about that?

 

[last_tour]

Well just looking though the PPH it uses the terms 'cardiotoxic' or anything with 'cardia-' but doesn't go into the specifics probably because the mechanism itself is a little complicated to understand and theres so many different terms for different ways the heart could malfunction. If you look at the medical reports related it does seem like death was due to a certain type of heart failure. Its a complicated topic because the heart itself is complex, i dont fully understand it, im not an expert, but I think the doctors knew about how the heart and drugs interacted and thats how they came up with those methods in the first place.

 

[Aap]

There are many...why are you looking for these? Are you trying to get around a finding of suicide, want to die of a heart attack, something nefarious, etc?

 

[laserfocus111]

My thinking exactly.

So heart medications like calcium channel blockers (e.g. verapamil), beta blockers (propranolol), Na/K atpase inhibitors (digoxin), sodium channel blockers (lignocaine) should help to slow down the heart and hopefully lead on to an arrhythmia.

The heart has a pacing mechanism in the sino atrial node so we need really strong stuff to override it. So we should try to block as many different kinds of pathways as possible. Simply relying on one pathway is a surefire method to failing an attempt.


Then the organs start shutting down due to reduced perfusion. We can consider an extra kick by causing some respiratory depression with barbiturates /opiates. If there's insulin available we can consider iv insulin to get into a diabetic coma. Should be relatively comfortable.

SN helps by causing methemoglobinemia so that the organs don't get their oxygen from the red blood cells.

Just ranting my 2 cents as I've been seeing alot of "will this combination work" kind of threads when most of the ingredients don't really target a specific end result that we are looking for.

At the end of the day we are talking about what kind of receptors will the drug target, the effects it should cause and how much dosing and route of administration.

 

[Alain]

There are many...why are you looking for these? Are you trying to get around a finding of suicide, want to die of a heart attack, something nefarious, etc?

I'm thinking about the night-night methode as it's painless. But it's hard to find a way to achieve it with no risk of doing it wrong. Stopping my heart would have the same effect but I didn't know if it was possible.

It seems it's not, or at least, not easily.

 

[last_tour]

My thinking exactly.

So heart medications like calcium channel blockers (e.g. verapamil), beta blockers (propranolol), Na/K atpase inhibitors (digoxin), sodium channel blockers (lignocaine) should help to slow down the heart and hopefully lead on to an arrhythmia.

The heart has a pacing mechanism in the sino atrial node so we need really strong stuff to override it. So we should try to block as many different kinds of pathways as possible. Simply relying on one pathway is a surefire method to failing an attempt.


Then the organs start shutting down due to reduced perfusion. We can consider an extra kick by causing some respiratory depression with barbiturates /opiates. If there's insulin available we can consider iv insulin to get into a diabetic coma. Should be relatively comfortable.

SN helps by causing methemoglobinemia so that the organs don't get their oxygen from the red blood cells.

Just ranting my 2 cents as I've been seeing alot of "will this combination work" kind of threads when most of the ingredients don't really target a specific end result that we are looking for.

At the end of the day we are talking about what kind of receptors will the drug target, the effects it should cause and how much dosing and route of administration.

thats right, I found a good video explaining how it can lead to sudden death: youtube.com/watch?v=ExmDJ7OfZaI
potassium deficiency and inhibiting potassium seems to be a what causes it for people without a genetic disorder.

I wonder if you can use common food and supplements found in stores that are known to inhibit potassium. Or try and induce a deficiency by avoiding potassium altogether to cause sudden death.

I also found this to be interesting: Study confirms QT-prolonging effects of grapefruit juice
www.heartrhythmjournal.com/article/S1547-5271(19)30368-6/fulltext

There are over 200 medications that prolong the QT interval, the time it takes for your heart muscle to recharge between beats. The list includes not only antiarrhythmic drugs, but also medications with no cardiac indications such as some antibiotics, antihistamines, and antipsychotic drugs. These drugs work mainly by blocking a specific "IKr" potassium channel on the myocardial (cardiac muscle) cell membrane, thus prolonging the repolarization in the ventricles of the heart. Abnormalities in the QT interval can also be caused by genetic conditions such as long QT syndrome

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

Chloroquine OD.

 

[Alain]

Chloroquine OD.

Yep very likely. But almost impossible to get. Anyway, it seems that there is no way to make the heart stop fast and easily by medication. So nigh-night will be my way.

 

[Sunset Limited]

Bupivacaine. It is the local anesthetic with the highest cardiac toxicity. According to experiments in rats and pigs, LD50 is estimated to be 1mg / kg in humans. This is a really powerful agent. It must be injected very quickly to cause acute bradycardia and cardiac arrest. It can mean a very fast death. It is sold as 20 mg / 10 ml vials for spinal injection. It's a gamble, though. If it doesn't work fast, it can be painful and very uncomfortable.

 

[Deformationalplagio]

Hi people!

Do you know about any drugs that would stop the heart if overdosed? I don't care about legality of the drug, I don't mind being high or not (but hey, why not having a good feeling?), but if some drugs can cause the pain heart to stop for good and without too much pain, it would be nice.

Minoxidil

 

[BridgeJumper]

Potassium chloride, but its difficult to find and painful
Propranolol causes dramatic heart rate drop that will make you die and its easy to get on prescription at least in my country

 

[laserfocus111]

Bupivacaine. It is the local anesthetic with the highest cardiac toxicity. According to experiments in rats and pigs, LD50 is estimated to be 1mg / kg in humans. This is a really powerful agent. It must be injected very quickly to cause acute bradycardia and cardiac arrest. It can mean a very fast death. It is sold as 20 mg / 10 ml vials for spinal injection. It's a gamble, though. If it doesn't work fast, it can be painful and very uncomfortable.

Hi, may I ask the dosage of bupivacaine you're intending to use?

 

[Aap]

Keep in mind there are many agents that can do this. None are peaceful if awake.

 

[laserfocus111]

Keep in mind there are many agents that can do this. None are peaceful if awake.

I'm intending to use IV midazolam and fentanyl in addition to lignocaine. Lignocaine goes in last, obviously. Not sure if this is a wise move. Am also trying to get my hands on bupivacane.

No chance of getting SN in this part of the world..

 

[Alain]

I'm intending to use IV midazolam and fentanyl in addition to lignocaine. Lignocaine goes in last, obviously. Not sure if this is a wise move. Am also trying to get my hands on bupivacane.

No chance of getting SN in this part of the world..

Is it easier for you to get fentanyl than SN? It looks like a very controlled substance in EU. Fentanyl alone can put someone down if you get enough of it.

 

[laserfocus111]

I have ways of getting it. Not enough fentanyl though, but I have plenty of injectable lignocaine/propranolol/verapamil

 

[AnxietyAttack44]

I wish i could go heart attack or cardiac arrest way no matter the pain. Already got heart problems, wish i could just speed it up. Would be a bit easier on my family as well. But those items are harder to get being far away from my doctors now

 

[Arrow]

His particular heart attack probably progressed quickly to full cardiac arrest (and thus unconsciousness) before he was able to feel the pain, which is otherwise often present in varying degrees.

true. i think cardiac arrest is painless but heart attacks are the ones that hurt.

 

[laserfocus111]

I'm wondering if the sensation of pain from the lack of cardiac perfusion can be avoided/reduced if we use the right kind and quantity of drugs to stop the heart (reduce cardiac output) as soon as possible.

With less oxygenation to the brain, the brain loses consciousness and the perception of pain is much less.

Any comments?

 

[AnxietyAttack44]

Im not sure how many people suffered it, but ill add up. I had heart attack few years ago, not cardiac arrest. It was bloody painfull and terrifying and slow.
Now i pray for it to happen again and finish me off, i wouldnt go to hospital.
Just so that i dont have to kill myself by my own hand id take that pain any time. Atleast itd be spontaneous, easier on family

 

[Sunset Limited]

Hi, may I ask the dosage of bupivacaine you're intending to use?

Hi buddy. I don't know if I want to add bupivacaine. There are too many drugs in the plan. If I add it there will be 120 mg as a bolus dose. If I choose infusion it will be 500 mg.