When criminals are normal, but you're not

[permanently tired]

Ppl claim those who attempt suicide usually have a diagnosable mental disorder, but this doesn't satisfy the argument to intervene. Oftentimes, your sanity is intact and capable of understanding of the consequences of your actions. Ofc, exceptions exist (ie psychosis) where you cannot think properly. Exceptions aside, a comparison I thought of is how criminals are considered competent but not those who want to ctb. To proceed with a trial, the accused must be found competent that they were aware of their actions (murder included) of whatever supposedly happened. The person could be diagnosed with any number of disorders and it wouldn't change the fact that they knew what they were doing was wrong. When crimes against others occur then the person is competent, but when one wants to self exit then they're incapable of making decisions for their well-being? If I commit murder I'm perfectly sane, but turn a gun on myself and I'm crazy. Sounds like a bunch of bullshit to me . The implication that convicted murderers are considered more sane than me is ridiculous

 

[Forever Sleep]

Yeah, I absolutely agree. It's like the suicidal person is actually being treated like two people. The crazy, homicidal, mentally ill one wanting to kill off the 'genuine' person underneath. It's weird.

I suppose I'd like to hear it said definitively that the presence of suicidal thoughts automatically means someone is mentally ill and that all mental illnesses impair competency. In which case- WTF do we have to work? We should all be on benefits. If mentally ill people truly are that crazy, why do they expect us to still hold down jobs etc?

Maybe it's because some criminals (probably- in my view) fake remorse and dissociation. They didn't realise what they were doing. I suppose, if we are contemplating suicide and decide to go for it, we have accepted it as an ok option which- they really don't like.

I don't think they actually like to think that their loved one thought about it for a long time before they did it. Because, that means they made the conscious decision to leave them and hurt them. Even if that was an unwanted side effect- they had considered it. Perhaps it's less painful to them if they believe their loved one acted out irrationally in a moment of desperation/madness.

I agree though. I think it's actually pretty insulting when people paint suicidal people as irrational, crazy or vulnerable to the point of supposedly being brainwashed by somewhere like here- that they would refer to as a death cult. Like- do you really think your loved one was that mentally compromised and- if so- why didn't you intervene?

 

[brokeandbroken]

Ppl claim those who attempt suicide usually have a diagnosable mental disorder, but this doesn't satisfy the argument to intervene. Oftentimes, your sanity is intact and capable of understanding of the consequences of your actions. Ofc, exceptions exist (ie psychosis) where you cannot think properly. Exceptions aside, a comparison I thought of is how criminals are considered competent but not those who want to ctb. To proceed with a trial, the accused must be found competent that they were aware of their actions (murder included) of whatever supposedly happened. The person could be diagnosed with any number of disorders and it wouldn't change the fact that they knew what they were doing was wrong. When crimes against others occur then the person is competent, but when one wants to self exit then they're incapable of making decisions for their well-being? If I commit murder I'm perfectly sane, but turn a gun on myself and I'm crazy. Sounds like a bunch of bullshit to me . The implication that convicted murderers are considered more sane than me is ridiculous

I mean I was in medical school overseas (I'm American). Victim of crimes by the medical school, illegally forced out. I lost everything including my dream. 160k+ in debt.... The US government has done *nothing*. Yet they are giving 40-80+ million dollars per week to terrorists in Afghanistan including the bin laden family (who still want to give Americans). Or even the state dept bending over backwards for the traitor and pedophile Travis king. So on and so forth. I've posted proof before and can do it again if needed. I've had it confirmed from attorneys that there is crimes present etc... because it was in Poland it what have to be a Polish lawyer. Bottom line in this rant is people don't really give a shit about people. Criminals not criminals unless it effects them no one cares. Suicide makes people feel icky and uncomfortable so it's easier to say they are mentally ill so they feel better and don't have to do anything.

 

[Green_leaf]

When crimes against others occur then the person is competent, but when one wants to self exit then they're incapable of making decisions for their well-being? If I commit murder I'm perfectly sane, but turn a gun on myself and I'm crazy. Sounds like a bunch of bullshit to me . The implication that convicted murderers are considered more sane than me is ridiculous

It seems murder can be even more socially accepted than suicide. Just take a look at how some dictators have been praised throughout history...

 

[lost_ange2211]

Damn that feels so real, I agree. We're more criminal for committing suicide than them apparently.

 

[KillingPain267]

Suicidal people are seen as the worst criminals ever. Worse than murderers. It is due to Christian interpretation (wrong) in western culture.

 

[Green_leaf]

Suicidal people are seen as the worst criminals ever. Worse than murderers. It is due to Christian interpretation (wrong) in western culture.

Absolutely. It still pays off in our days, the idea that your life does not belong to you but God.

 

[Unsure and alone]

Being Christian doesn't mean you have to have certain views on Suicide.

Anymore than working at a crisis line means you have to actually care about the people you talk to .
Care about what the person will do yes .
Care about them no..

From my experience.
There's definitely bad apples in crisis support that only care about the textbook and what you will do
Not about you at all.

Yeah, I absolutely agree. It's like the suicidal person is actually being treated like two people. The crazy, homicidal, mentally ill one wanting to kill off the 'genuine' person underneath. It's weird.

That's an interesting point
Although they aren't wrong about a lot of times if you can get through the moment you are more likely to wait.

That said it doesn't make us any less competent
It doesn't mean suicidal people are irrational or crazy.

I suppose I'd like to hear it said definitively that the presence of suicidal thoughts automatically means someone is mentally ill and that all mental illnesses impair competency.

I think the reason they don't is both because even they know that's not the case and that would go against the narrative of there's hope .
You just need to reach out and get help.

In which case- WTF do we have to work? We should all be on benefits. If mentally ill people truly are that crazy, why do they expect us to still hold down jobs etc?

Maybe it's because some criminals (probably- in my view) fake remorse and dissociation. They didn't realise what they were doing. I suppose, if we are contemplating suicide and decide to go for it, we have accepted it as an ok option which- they really don't like.

Yeah pretty hard to function the worse it gets.
People would also probably fake it if they gave enough benefits to actually live on .
They won't though.

I don't think they actually like to think that their loved one thought about it for a long time before they did it. Because, that means they made the conscious decision to leave them and hurt them. Even if that was an unwanted side effect- they had considered it. Perhaps it's less painful to them if they believe their loved one acted out irrationally in a moment of desperation/madness.

Yeah. Another reason is dealing with the thought of I could have stopped it .

I agree though. I think it's actually pretty insulting when people paint suicidal people as irrational, crazy or vulnerable to the point of supposedly being brainwashed by somewhere like here- that they would refer to as a death cult.

I think they might have a point to some degree about suicidal people being more vulnerable in some ways.
But definitely not about the brainwashing

Like- do you really think your loved one was that mentally compromised and- if so- why didn't you intervene?

Yep. Spot on.