Discussion What do you think are the STRONGEST arguments AGAINST suicide?

[lacrimosa]

1st Argument: The future remains to be seen and we can contribute to that future in a positive way by manifesting our destiny. We could possibly be on the verge of a breakthrough, right before we discover something that hasn't been discovered yet and this can contribute to alleviating suffering of others, thus giving us a reason to live.

It could be a song, or a poem, or anything really that could inspire the next genius or average person to keep going, despite their suffering. This could create a domino effect that could spread amongst the populace.

For example, you hold the door open for someone, and in turn they help someone else, etc. They made a movie about this with the kid from The Six Sense where he creates a system of helping others to alleviate suffering and spread positivity. I think it was called Pay it Forward.

2nd Argument: Utilitarianism - "Utilitarianism is a theory of morality that advocates actions that foster happiness or pleasure and oppose actions that cause unhappiness or harm. When directed toward making social, economic, or political decisions, a utilitarian philosophy would aim for the betterment of society as a whole." - Investopedia

If you want to alleviate suffering, your suicide would cause the opposite effect that utilitarianism causes. It wold devastate your family and friends and have an overall negative impact on their mental health and they would have a hole in their heart that they would fill with greed, malice, and all sorts of negative emotions until they finally exhaust themselves and are a shell of their formal self. This harm would have a negative domino effect and cause more unrest and evil in the world.

 

[sserafim]

I've often wondered what it is that makes some people take this very seriously and others not so much. It seems at least partially explainable by MBTI personality theory (yes yes, with all the usual caveats about how MBTI is "pseudoscience"). Are you and @ijustwishtodie both INTPs? I'm INTJ so I have Se in my stack, even though it's my weakest function. This is the function that experiences the real world through the physical senses; in its extreme it's a "thrill-seeking" function. I wonder if this is what has helped me follow through with planned attempts.

I think he's ISTP? I'm not sure actually. @ijustwishtodie what type are you?

 

[ijustwishtodie]

I think he's ISTP? I'm not sure actually. @ijustwishtodie what type are you?

I'm ISTP

 

[SilentSadness]

The only one that makes sense to me is that we can never be sure of the consequences of our actions, we don't know what happens after we die or if we try to kill ourselves. Arguments like "it might get better" definitely don't hold water because without a reason for it to get better it's just gambling.

 

[Alexei_Kirillov]

1st Argument: The future remains to be seen and we can contribute to that future in a positive way by manifesting our destiny. We could possibly be on the verge of a breakthrough, right before we discover something that hasn't been discovered yet and this can contribute to alleviating suffering of others, thus giving us a reason to live.

It could be a song, or a poem, or anything really that could inspire the next genius or average person to keep going, despite their suffering. This could create a domino effect that could spread amongst the populace.

For example, you hold the door open for someone, and in turn they help someone else, etc. They made a movie about this with the kid from The Six Sense where he creates a system of helping others to alleviate suffering and spread positivity. I think it was called Pay it Forward.

2nd Argument: Utilitarianism - "Utilitarianism is a theory of morality that advocates actions that foster happiness or pleasure and oppose actions that cause unhappiness or harm. When directed toward making social, economic, or political decisions, a utilitarian philosophy would aim for the betterment of society as a whole." - Investopedia

If you want to alleviate suffering, your suicide would cause the opposite effect that utilitarianism causes. It wold devastate your family and friends and have an overall negative impact on their mental health and they would have a hole in their heart that they would fill with greed, malice, and all sorts of negative emotions until they finally exhaust themselves and are a shell of their formal self. This harm would have a negative domino effect and cause more unrest and evil in the world.

Great write-up, thanks for your contribution. These both seem like fairly strong arguments to me, maybe B or A tier, even though it's very rare to hear about them (I swear, my own personal engagement with philosophy/epistemology/critical thinking/etc. has done way more for my "mental health" than any psychiatrist).

I'm ISTP

Is that from the cognitive functions test or the 16p test? ISTP is Ti-Se, which, on the face of it, wouldn't seem to make a lot of sense.

 

[-nobodyknows-]

I can't speak for anyone else, but if someone told me something like "I can't bear the thought of losing you" it'd probably make me change my mind unless I'm way off the rails. In fact, it has in the past.

Though of course the problem is that most people quickly realize how stupid something like that is and turn on it, which makes things so much worse.