What are your thoughts on the "suicide doesn't end the pain, it just passes it on to others" mentality?

[Oathkeeper]

I don't necessarily think it's "wrong", but I also don't think it's fair to expect somebody to suffer eternally just so that their loved ones don't hurt for a short period of time in comparison. Curious to see what others here have to say.

 

[sserafim]

I think that we shouldn't be expected to live for others. That in of itself is selfish. I think that suicide is the end of pain and suffering. People are being selfish when they expect us to live for them. I think that if your loved ones really cared about you, they would understand how much pain and suffering you were in, and accept your decision to ctb.

 

[SmollMushroom]

First of all the first part of the statement is arguable. Unless one believes in reincarnation, it does end the pain.
The fact that others will suffer is also arguable. Some people have literally nobody left, and if they have, they will eventually move on.
In the rare case that they can't move on, I still wouldn't blame it on the person who ctb'ed.
Everyone should be able to do what they want with their lives.

 

[sserafim]

First of all the first part of the statement is arguable. Unless one believes in reincarnation, it does end the pain.
The fact that others will suffer is also arguable. Some people have literally nobody left, and if they have, they will eventually move on.
In the rare case that they can't move on, I still wouldn't blame it on the person who ctb'ed.
Everyone should be able to do what they want with their lives.

Even if you are reincarnated it won't be *you* (the you of right now) who has to live again. It'll be you in another form.

 

[R_N]

Same could be said about death in general. We all die it is inevitable and it might hurt others when we do.

 

[realas]

I don't necessarily think it's "wrong", but I also don't think it's fair to expect somebody to suffer eternally just so that their loved ones don't hurt for a short period of time in comparison. Curious to see what others here have to say.

I don't think you understand how long it hurts others. My close friend killed himself a while ago and I still think about him almost every day. The pain doesn't go away. Keeping in mind that this was my friend, so I can't even imagine how parents would feel. But honestly if you're in enough pain it doesn't matter, imo

 

[tinyghost]

i suppose it ending the pain depends on your personal belief but theres no denying that what we are suffering through stops when we die. why should i have to suffer for someone else? of course when my best friend cbt'ed it was very traumatic and heartbreaking, and i never want that to happen to me again, so i can see how people have this view. it sucks that we haven't figured out as a society how to give people better lives and resources so they dont have to resort to cbt.

 

[unluckycatgirl]

I think if you made the choice to ctb then you should definitely be aware of some potential pain you'll cause beforehand. But if it comes down to you really making the choice you cross the line of caring for anything in most scenarios because it actually doesn't matter if you stop existing. So I think it's just a mental that gets you to reconsider or find purpose in others which isn't bad. For me personally I really don't care what happens to others after me and my perception ends I fade back into the matter I was made of and so will everybody else.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

I hate at how people extrapolate that statement to every single suicidal person as not everybody has any loved ones. It just invalidates these people more when, unfortunately, the lack of having loved ones to begin with is a reason for them having suicidal ideation to begin with

 

[tiger b]

I might sound cold on this, but it's ultimately for others to deal with their pain on this issue. The rights of choice should take priority
Ideally CTB could be done in a considerate way, but that seems to be made difficult to do in most scenarios.

 

[sserafim]

I might sound cold on this, but it's ultimately for others to deal with their pain on this issue. The rights of choice should take priority
Ideally CTB could be done in a considerate way, but that seems to be made difficult to do in most scenarios.

Yeah like I'm sorry but other people's feelings aren't my responsibility. It's my life, not theirs.

 

[Klophy]

Always hated that saying, I can see what they're trying to say but I always read it as them knowing you're under immense distress and are heavily suffering but it's better you than them.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

Yeah like I'm sorry but other people's feelings aren't my responsibility. It's my life, not theirs.

Touché and well said

 

[BlockHammer]

I dont really know how i felt about that statement but for me, it's sound like a form of gaslight. Like, if you want me to stay here then SOLVE my problem rather than just forcing me to stay in here, but on a certain degree they right. Perhaps there's some people that love you and seeing you in a condition like this makes them suffer, nevertheless even if that's true my pain would still be around

 

[betternever2havbeen]

I think it's invalidating, and pain doesn't get passed on like that. The grief someone feels after a loved ones suicide is pain in it's own right and I don't think it should be minimised but at the same time you can't say "oh well whatever you're going through if you CTB you just pass it onto your family" as that isn't true. We all have things causing us pain, whether it's clinical depression, anxiety, addictions or health issues, trauma, abuse etc. and none of these things get passed on to our families on our deaths. So it is the end of whatever was causing us pain. And grief is not supposed to last forever...whereas someone literally could be dealing with depression for the rest of their life in a worst case scenario.

Of course those left behind should be considered before anyone does anything (assuming there is anyone to leave behind and they are decent people) it's the reason so many of us are still here. And so many of us know we can be horrible to be around because of our depression, so we know we cause our families pain either way.

But no this kind of thinking is leaning too much towards the "suicide is selfish" train of thought for my liking. It's just people who have most likely never experienced suicidal thoughts saying these things I'd hazard to guess. People thinking they've come up with some amazing epiphany, and it's not helpful. Like who needs the guilt on top, depression usually comes with a decent helping of guilt already.

Edit-posted too soon.

 

[NocturnILL]

Idk maybe it's true or maybe it's something I've convinced myself but I feel overtime that pain that people will feel will inevitably subside. Not saying that people won't care or be affected by it but I think as time and their life goes by they won't suffer anymore. I think if they aren't able to process it and end up going downhill from there for the rest of their lives then sure it's very possible. My biggest worry is how it will affect my son and my animals. Will his life turn for the worst? How long would it take him to heal? Would he ever heal? Ugh I cry thinking about it always (tearing up now…) I also think about if my animals will live waiting for me. I know they'll be taken care of but will they wait for me specifically for a long time or move on quickly.

 

[ilikemoais]

it's not entirely wrong for me but its the same with death in general. You never know when u are going to die, ctb just make it quicker for us, death would come anyways at one point and same with the pain that death gives to others

 

[haibane]

The entire idea of « we HAVE to live cause it will make some people sad if we die » extremely egotistical . Nobody except me should have the right to decide what i can and cant do with my body. I dont HAVE to live for anyone as i didn't choose to be born in the first place.

 

[imonadeadline]

This is one of the things that keeps me from committing as I have a friend who knows about my plans and my deadline. We're only online friends and we've only met once but she gives me a lot of hope in life. I've always wanted to live for her and I know that that's toxic but it's something that keeps me going. Maybe it's partly because I'm still absolutely smitten with her but that's besides the point, it's not like that can go anywhere anyway.

She's told me before that she can't stop me if I ever do go through with it, but she's also told me that she'd cry. That's the last thing that I want to do. She's been through enough, and I want to protect her. I just can't keep holding on...

But I still try, I still try to hang on for her.

 

[MatrixPrisoner]

Well, then why not share the pain in the present and try and help me out of it while I am still here? A total of six childen in my family and I am the sole one stuck taking care of my elderly parents. I have sacrificed my life. Once my parents are gone, I'm gone. If my siblings feel pain, then too bad. Should have done something about while I was here.

 

[NewtBoy]

I can understand the sentiment, especially if the person has lots of loved ones. However, this simply leaves out the people with nobody left and no other options, and lacks empathy for those people. I do feel immensely for people who have lost loved ones to suicide, but I don't understand how they couldn't at least have the hope and understanding to believe that their loved one is at peace, and their suffering is over.

 

[SorrowfulDrugUser]

it's so hypocritical and lob-sided and quite frankly an Idea I've never been able to grasp. If every day I'm treated like utter dogshit by my peers, "friends", and other people of that sort. How in the fuck do you expect me to feel bad about making the conscious decision to take my own life? Nobody just wakes up one day and goes "Yup, I'm depressed, and want to kill myself, today's the day". Suicidal Ideation is something created over a long period of time, not an on-and-off switch. If there was anything I could say to my peers in who think this way (I know many people who do). My response to them is: "What did you expect when you treated me like sub-human trash?". If I ever committed suicide, I'm not gonna lie, I wouldn't feel a single drop of guilt. I'm the direct byproduct of the world around me, one which I'm not able to control, sorry not sorry, I can't say after years of depression I feel bad, I just can't. That mindset is simply so selfish, now that I made the conscious decision to want to end my own life, NOW is when you decide you care? Maybe you should've thought about that when treating me like trash, how it's effecting me, and what that could be doing to me. Instead, you wait until the final moment to pretend like you give a fuck? okay. Nice joke.

 

[sserafim]

The entire idea of « we HAVE to live cause it will make some people sad if we die » extremely egotistical . Nobody except me should have the right to decide what i can and cant do with my body. I dont HAVE to live for anyone as i didn't choose to be born in the first place.

Literally

 

[lionetta12]

I don't necessarily think it's "wrong", but I also don't think it's fair to expect somebody to suffer eternally just so that their loved ones don't hurt for a short period of time in comparison. Curious to see what others here have to say.

Idk all that pain and trauma I'm dealing with every day was caused by those people so I don't really care if they get sad or angry if I were to CTB. They are well aware of the damaged they have caused and that I'm suicidal specifically due to them, yet they continue to do things to push me over the edge. I honestly find it a bit offensive that people who are responsible for doing illegal things towards me and who have given me CPTSD dare to tell me that suicide is selfish and to «think about their feelings and the pain they will go through if I were to pass away» when they never thought about my feelings, wellbeing and my health that they've damaged.

 

[jbear824]

I think it's a way to guilt people in pain into staying alive purely for the sake of others.

 

[LaVieEnRose]

It's saying: I'm okay with the current status quo of suffering in the world, as long as it's not me who suffers.

 

[whateverr]

I don't necessarily think it's "wrong", but I also don't think it's fair to expect somebody to suffer eternally just so that their loved ones don't hurt for a short period of time in comparison. Curious to see what others here have to say.

I don't care. That's literally why I'm suicidal. If you still care then how are you suicidal? I don't get that shit.

 

[feannagan]

It ends my pain, and that is my concern. I despise the phrase. The only reason I have not taken my own life in 10+ years of being suicidal is that I don't want to inflict more grief on people I care about. I have personally experienced the devastating effects of losing friends to suicide, and I miss them every day. However, I hold no blame or anger towards them. They were in unbearable pain and chose the only solution they saw.

People may think they are being helpful by saying these things, maybe some people do find it helpful. The issue is that it doesn't lessen my desire to die; instead, it intensifies my guilt. Therefore, it doesn't actually provide any assistance. If there was a way to end my suffering without causing immense pain to my loved ones, I would take it. I have already attempted medication and therapy, yet I continue to suffer.

 

[Forever Sleep]

The thing is- we can't measure pain. Who's to say it's the same amount of pain that gets passed on? I think that's what they're trying to say- but- they simply have no idea. People could be devastated by it- certainly. It could in turn make them suicidal. They could come to accept it also.

I think we should try to live in a manner that causes less suffering to others- certainly. But- it cuts both ways. People are quite often in this position because they have been treated appallingly in the first place! Plus- how fair is it really to expect someone to keep living a life they find torturous because it will upset you if they don't? How much do these people expect their 'loved ones' to go through purely for their sake? By that point- that person isn't carrying on for themselves.

Personally- I'm trying to limit the effect mine might have. I've waited decades for the people who love me most to die first. I've pretty much become estranged from everyone else.

As a phrase- in some instances, I think it could well be true. Ultimately though- it likely wasn't that persons goal. They did it to escape the pain they could no longer bear. They probably hated it that it could cause suffering to others.

I ran a poll a while back and I think 80% of people here who participated wished they had never been born in the first place. That wasn't our fault. If you really want to blame people for passing on suffering to others- I think it's fairer to blame parents who initiate what could so easily become a horrendous experience for someone. True- I doubt they did it intentionally but- is it fair to enter someone into an experiment and then be angry and upset with them because they want to leave it?

Ultimately- a lot of relationships are forced on us- parents and family. Even friendships are unavoidable to some degree. The ideal I suppose would be to not be close to anyone. That way- it will upset people less but- again- those things are forced on us to some extent.

The only other alternative is to keep living- and people do... They hold on for years, sometimes decades. I doubt anyone praises them for that. They still call them selfish when they've finally had enough.

 

[WAITING TO DIE]

If they truly cared, then they would be happy that you are no longer suffering.
They have no problem putting pets out of their misery because they don't want them to suffer.
So what is so special about humans ?