Discussion Vandals destroy pro-life notes plastered on bridge

[TAW122]

In another thread over a year ago, I wrote about using pro-lifers tactics against them, and just combating the pro-lifers (anti-choice, suicide-preventionists, etc.) efforts to push their agenda to the greater public. I found some new articles talking about vandals tearing down those anti-suicide notes and what not. (Mini confession: It puts a smile on my face when I see that because there is too much pro-life spiel and mantra being thrown about in everyday society, thus something that challenges the status quo is always a refreshing scene ).

(Note: I don't encourage illegal activity or anything, but thought those articles would be an interesting read and discussion.)

Vandals Tear Down 'Notes Of Hope' On Foresthill Bridge, Scribble Hateful Messages

Vandals hit the Foresthill Bridge over the holiday weekend and tore down hundreds of notes left to try and prevent suicide.

sacramento.cbslocal.com

'If People Want To Go Kill Themselves They Can!' Vandal Destroys Notes of Hope

The notes were put up on the Foresthill bridge by a group that got permission from the county to help prevent suicide, but some people don't agree with the effort.

gooddaysacramento.cbslocal.com

I can see the motivation for the person hanging up those notes and what she was trying to accomplish. I know that while she has lost loved ones (according to the article), it still doesn't make it right to project her selfishness (of pro-life stance) to everyone else. I also get that she wishes to prevent impulsive suicides, but we have enough pro-life stuff circling about in society that it's (mostly) just virtue signaling. The man who tore down the notes is rather based and brazen for doing so and luckily, he isn't arrested or prosecuted for doing so.

Similarly, when I was still a graduate student (over 2 years ago), during the end of the semesters, I would oftenly see generic platitudes, uplifting notes, and other pro-life spiel being plastered around the halls, academic classrooms, library, campus buses, and just about everywhere that students congregate. I was tempted and thought about tearing down some of those notes, or just putting pro-choice stuff, philosophical questions (e.g. Why is life so valuable? What is the value of life? Why do people post platitudes? etc.) but ultimately refrained from doing so, mainly because of the risk of legal action, campus policies, and just because I don't want to burn bridges at that time. Keep in mind I am NOT pro-life nor do I endorse nor agree with the messages (of false hope and platitudes) being plastered about and around campus. I just didn't want to expose myself to being attacked by a pro-life majority and/or stir up trouble as a student.

What do you guys think about those articles? Also, on a final remark, ugh to the obligatory suicide prevention number being listed in one of the articles at the end!

 

[Ghost2211]

"Notes of hope". That's all they are. They mean nothing, and they help nothing. They are empty words to people they don't know, and they will give no sweat or tears to help. I can see why people tore them down.

 

[marcusuk63]

Greta won't be pleased , all those Plastic zip ties

 

[ScorpiusDragon]

In another thread over a year ago, I wrote about using pro-lifers tactics against them, and just combating the pro-lifers (anti-choice, suicide-preventionists, etc.) efforts to push their agenda to the greater public. I found some new articles talking about vandals tearing down those anti-suicide notes and what not. (Mini confession: It puts a smile on my face when I see that because there is too much pro-life spiel and mantra being thrown about in everyday society, thus something that challenges the status quo is always a refreshing scene ).

(Note: I don't encourage illegal activity or anything, but thought those articles would be an interesting read and discussion.)

Vandals Tear Down 'Notes Of Hope' On Foresthill Bridge, Scribble Hateful Messages

Vandals hit the Foresthill Bridge over the holiday weekend and tore down hundreds of notes left to try and prevent suicide.

sacramento.cbslocal.com

'If People Want To Go Kill Themselves They Can!' Vandal Destroys Notes of Hope

The notes were put up on the Foresthill bridge by a group that got permission from the county to help prevent suicide, but some people don't agree with the effort.

gooddaysacramento.cbslocal.com

I can see the motivation for the person hanging up those notes and what she was trying to accomplish. I know that while she has lost loved ones (according to the article), it still doesn't make it right to project her selfishness (of pro-life stance) to everyone else. I also get that she wishes to prevent impulsive suicides, but we have enough pro-life stuff circling about in society that it's (mostly) just virtue signaling. The man who tore down the notes is rather based and brazen for doing so and luckily, he isn't arrested or prosecuted for doing so.

Similarly, when I was still a graduate student (over 2 years ago), during the end of the semesters, I would oftenly see generic platitudes, uplifting notes, and other pro-life spiel being plastered around the halls, academic classrooms, library, campus buses, and just about everywhere that students congregate. I was tempted and thought about tearing down some of those notes, or just putting pro-choice stuff, philosophical questions (e.g. Why is life so valuable? What is the value of life? Why do people post platitudes? etc.) but ultimately refrained from doing so, mainly because of the risk of legal action, campus policies, and just because I don't want to burn bridges at that time. Keep in mind I am NOT pro-life nor do I endorse nor agree with the messages (of false hope and platitudes) being plastered about and around campus. I just didn't want to expose myself to being attacked by a pro-life majority and/or stir up trouble as a student.

What do you guys think about those articles? Also, on a final remark, ugh to the obligatory suicide prevention number being listed in one of the articles at the end!

These pro-life notes make me want to barf. The hilarious thing is that the vandals were at least honest in their "hateful" messages. One photo showed a message saying "No one cares." That's actually quite true; even the pro-lifers who act like they care won't go beyond calling the police and getting people hospitalized, just so they can pat themselves on the backs and tell themselves that they "saved a life."

 

[Deleted member 14386]

Isn't this super selfish? Who are you to know my circumstances and comment on them. I like that people are tearing them down lol, how about actually helping people rather than sticking up flyers.
Oh ffs of course there's a hotline at the bottom

 

[Shakespear's Brother]

"You matter, just have hope!" discourse rots brains.

We are passed the point where this shit has any positive effect on someone at risk. It's like background noise now.

People want to help? Stop with this performative bullshit and fucking get out there and advocate for solutions that build on solving the societal problems that cause people to want to kill themselves in the first place.

 

[TAW122]

These pro-life notes make me want to barf. The hilarious thing is that the vandals were at least honest in their "hateful" messages. One photo showed a message saying "No one cares." That's actually quite true; even the profilers who act like they care won't go beyond calling the police and getting people hospitalized, just so they can pat themselves on the backs and tell themselves that they "saved a life."

Absolutely, they are nothing more than ego-strokers. They have no accountability for their actions and the potential "harm" they cause to the truly suicidal.

Isn't this super selfish? Who are you to know my circumstances and comment on them. I like that people are tearing them down lol, how about actually helping people rather than sticking up flyers.
Oh ffs of course there's a hotline at the bottom

It is, that pro-lifer is just projecting her views to the people who go to the bridge. Also, yeah it seems like any article or content that is death related especially suicide related oftenly have some sort of suicide hotline number or tag at the end (or beginning/middle in some cases).

People want to help? Stop with this performative bullshit and fucking get out there and advocate for solutions that build on solving the societal problems that cause people to want to kill themselves in the first place.

Absolutely agreed! Also, to add to that, allow voluntary euthanasia for those who wish to go and/or cannot find a solution their problems after they have exhausted their options to recovery.

 

[Viola]

I personally doubt that 4 people changed their minds about jumping just because they saw the notes. I seriously don't believe that at all. Those people probably didn't have any serious intent in the first place. If I went somewhere to jump I'd jump I wouldn't read that stuff.
I mean look at the Aokigahara forest.. that has big signs up at the entrance saying 'your life is a precious gift' etc etc and how many people walk straight past those and ctb every year?
I guess it makes pro lifers feel good, and that's all.

 

[Deleted member 14386]

I guess it makes pro lifers feel good, and that's all.

That's it. They feel they've "done their part" and can't do anything else.
How about you pool a fund for mentally ill people! These nutters I swear

 

[s1mplem3]

What can I say? People must know truth, have choice and freedom.

 

[Alec]

Honestly I feel like the man who tore them down is someone who is struggling with suicide himself and is thinking about doing it, because he can see vast the bullshit. I hate how they call him a "vandal" it's such a bullshit!!! And it's funny how all those who want to "help" suicidal people just started attacking somebody who actually might be suicidal. "We care"?! I get it, you care, so what now? Does it fix our problems? Does it make it easier to deal with the constant pain of depression? Does it make it easier for us to hold a job while we are on fire? What exactly is your care supposed to do? How exactly is it supposed to make our existence easier? I would like answers on these questions.

I personally doubt that 4 people changed their minds about jumping just because they saw the notes. I seriously don't believe that at all. Those people probably didn't have any serious intent in the first place. If I went somewhere to jump I'd jump I wouldn't read that stuff.
I mean look at the Aokigahara forest.. that has big signs up at the entrance saying 'your life is a precious gift' etc etc and how many people walk straight past those and ctb every year?
I guess it makes pro lifers feel good, and that's all.

My thoughts exactly! I also while reading it thought that there's no way that someone who seriously wanted to jump and contemplated this for a long time was stopped by some notes. Completely agree with your every word

 

[flower]

I understand the sentiment of notes, but they're useless to anyone who is serious about ctb. If I was about to jump off a bridge and saw a note saying "you are loved" "you will be missed" or some bullshit like that it would just make me feel worse because they're not true.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

This is really the frontier for us: anti suicide prevention. It's taboo enough to arouse attention (which is exactly what we need), the only problem is how to organize suicidal people to go out and protest suicide prevention rallies.

 

[flower]

This is really the frontier for us: anti suicide prevention. It's taboo enough to arouse attention (which is exactly what we need), the only problem is how to organize suicidal people to go out and protest suicide prevention rallies.

We'd all struggle to get out of bed and need to lie down for a good cry half way through the rally

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Anti-suicide-prevention, anti-psychiatry, Anti-Pharma, anti-psychoreformation, anti-reintegration-at-all-costs, anti-mental-health-awareness, anti-paternalisation... All of these work against our best interests.
.

You have to see the reactions of people who know you 'suffer from' 'mental illness' when you openly attack these. It totally perplexes them and that shows you in who's interest these institutions really are; ding ding, not ours. You just need to take a look around the forum; almost everyone hates hotlines, pro-life-sentiments, paternalizing, psychiatry, sectioning, mental hospitals, medication; yes, some people are fond of their therapist, but probably because he or she is a good person and treats them like a fucking human being instead of a nutcase or criminal.

 

[itsmeagain]

In another thread over a year ago, I wrote about using pro-lifers tactics against them, and just combating the pro-lifers (anti-choice, suicide-preventionists, etc.) efforts to push their agenda to the greater public. I found some new articles talking about vandals tearing down those anti-suicide notes and what not. (Mini confession: It puts a smile on my face when I see that because there is too much pro-life spiel and mantra being thrown about in everyday society, thus something that challenges the status quo is always a refreshing scene ).

(Note: I don't encourage illegal activity or anything, but thought those articles would be an interesting read and discussion.)

Vandals Tear Down 'Notes Of Hope' On Foresthill Bridge, Scribble Hateful Messages

Vandals hit the Foresthill Bridge over the holiday weekend and tore down hundreds of notes left to try and prevent suicide.

sacramento.cbslocal.com

'If People Want To Go Kill Themselves They Can!' Vandal Destroys Notes of Hope

The notes were put up on the Foresthill bridge by a group that got permission from the county to help prevent suicide, but some people don't agree with the effort.

gooddaysacramento.cbslocal.com

I can see the motivation for the person hanging up those notes and what she was trying to accomplish. I know that while she has lost loved ones (according to the article), it still doesn't make it right to project her selfishness (of pro-life stance) to everyone else. I also get that she wishes to prevent impulsive suicides, but we have enough pro-life stuff circling about in society that it's (mostly) just virtue signaling. The man who tore down the notes is rather based and brazen for doing so and luckily, he isn't arrested or prosecuted for doing so.

Similarly, when I was still a graduate student (over 2 years ago), during the end of the semesters, I would oftenly see generic platitudes, uplifting notes, and other pro-life spiel being plastered around the halls, academic classrooms, library, campus buses, and just about everywhere that students congregate. I was tempted and thought about tearing down some of those notes, or just putting pro-choice stuff, philosophical questions (e.g. Why is life so valuable? What is the value of life? Why do people post platitudes? etc.) but ultimately refrained from doing so, mainly because of the risk of legal action, campus policies, and just because I don't want to burn bridges at that time. Keep in mind I am NOT pro-life nor do I endorse nor agree with the messages (of false hope and platitudes) being plastered about and around campus. I just didn't want to expose myself to being attacked by a pro-life majority and/or stir up trouble as a student.

What do you guys think about those articles? Also, on a final remark, ugh to the obligatory suicide prevention number being listed in one of the articles at the end!

See? I absoloutely agree with this, BUT!!! Here's the difference. You know how when you see a pro life note, you don't think anything of it? You just get annoyed and angry and whatnot? The thing is, they're only notes. Nobody is STOPPING you persay from jumping off the bridge. Anyone who is truly suicidal and ready to do it, will not care about these notes.

HOWEVER...

There are people who are impulsively suicide with amazing lives because they don't know any better. These notes may stop someone who had no history of suicidal thoughts or with great lives turn their own lives around.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

See? I absoloutely agree with this, BUT!!! Here's the difference. You know how when you see a pro life note, you don't think anything of it? You just get annoyed and angry and whatnot? The thing is, they're only notes. Nobody is STOPPING you persay from jumping off the bridge. Anyone who is truly suicidal and ready to do it, will not care about these notes.

HOWEVER...

There are people who are impulsively suicide with amazing lives because they don't know any better. These notes may stop someone who had no history of suicidal thoughts or with great lives turn their own lives around.

Troll much? You know I once had I life I enjoyed quite a bit and the last thing that would have occured to me walking over a bridge was to jump to my death. The fact that most users here have suffered unbearably for years and years and still can't overcome their survival instincts shoukd indicate to you that your idea of otherwise happy people suddenly out of nowhere impulsively jumping off of bridges is ridiculous.
.

And no, they are not only notes. They are an instrument of oppression; enforced glibness about serious matters. All they want is to keep you from jumping so they can keep milking you, that's why no one ever gives a shit about homeless people dying: nothing to squeeze out of them anymore. That, and they would have to take responsibility for all the suicides: doesn't shine a good light on a society in which huge swathes of 15 year olds jump off of bridges, does it?
.

That's where 'mental illness' comes to the rescue: the big ominous enemy, mental illness! Simple tactic to divert from the real issues - poverty, performance pressure, precarious working conditions, a culture of masturbatory desire and wish fulfillment, breaking down of social bonds, traditions, chemical waste everywhere causing the sixth mass extinction, the planet heating up, climate apocalypse, aggressive wars for resources in faraway countries, corruption, the fact that wages have been stagnant while GDPs have been steadily rising, inequality... All swished under the carpet by calling people's reactions 'distorted cognitions', 'mental illness'

 

[ScorpiusDragon]

Troll much? You know I once had I life I enjoyed quite a bit and the last thing that would have occured to me walking over a bridge was to jump to my death. The fact that most users here have suffered unbearably for years and years and still can't overcome their survival instincts shoukd indicate to you that your idea of otherwise happy people suddenly out of nowhere impulsively jumping off of bridges is ridiculous.
.

And no, they are not only notes. They are an instrument of oppression; enforced glibness about serious matters. All they want is to keep you from jumping so they can keep milking you, that's why no one ever gives a shit about homeless people dying: nothing to squeeze out of them anymore. That, and they would have to take responsibility for all the suicides: doesn't shine a good light on a society in which huge swathes of 15 year olds jump off of bridges, does it?
.

That's where 'mental illness' comes to the rescue: the big ominous enemy, mental illness! Simple tactic to divert from the real issues - poverty, performance pressure, precarious working conditions, a culture of masturbatory desire and wish fulfillment, breaking down of social bonds, traditions, chemical waste everywhere causing the sixth mass extinction, the planet heating up, climate apocalypse, aggressive wars for resources in faraway countries, corruption, the fact that wages have been stagnant while GDPs have been steadily rising, inequality... All swished under the carpet by calling people's reactions 'distorted cognitions', 'mental illness'

Preach!

 

[itsmeagain]

Troll much? You know I once had I life I enjoyed quite a bit and the last thing that would have occured to me walking over a bridge was to jump to my death. The fact that most users here have suffered unbearably for years and years and still can't overcome their survival instincts shoukd indicate to you that your idea of otherwise happy people suddenly out of nowhere impulsively jumping off of bridges is ridiculous.
.

And no, they are not only notes. They are an instrument of oppression; enforced glibness about serious matters. All they want is to keep you from jumping so they can keep milking you, that's why no one ever gives a shit about homeless people dying: nothing to squeeze out of them anymore. That, and they would have to take responsibility for all the suicides: doesn't shine a good light on a society in which huge swathes of 15 year olds jump off of bridges, does it?
.

That's where 'mental illness' comes to the rescue: the big ominous enemy, mental illness! Simple tactic to divert from the real issues - poverty, performance pressure, precarious working conditions, a culture of masturbatory desire and wish fulfillment, breaking down of social bonds, traditions, chemical waste everywhere causing the sixth mass extinction, the planet heating up, climate apocalypse, aggressive wars for resources in faraway countries, corruption, the fact that wages have been stagnant while GDPs have been steadily rising, inequality... All swished under the carpet by calling people's reactions 'distorted cognitions', 'mental illness'

Oh hon, I didn't mean it like that. I'm sorry, perhaps I worded it incorrectly. Let me rephrase this.

I know some people that have really good lives with everything going for them. They have one or two problems wrong, and they believe that suicide is the way out, even though these problems constantly resolve, and, when they do, they're better. I know a lot of people that have wanted to "Kill themselves" because of some grades, or their parents being mean, or things like that, and in reality, things are easily fixable and when the problem is fixed, they're a lot better.

I never troll on this site, sweetheart. This was just my thoughts. I'm willing to talk them over with you if you'd like. Please, I would like this to be a discussion. I'm not trying to hurt anyone!

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Oh hon, I didn't mean it like that. I'm sorry, perhaps I worded it incorrectly. Let me rephrase this.

I know some people that have really good lives with everything going for them. They have one or two problems wrong, and they believe that suicide is the way out, even though these problems constantly resolve, and, when they do, they're better. I know a lot of people that have wanted to "Kill themselves" because of some grades, or their parents being mean, or things like that, and in reality, things are easily fixable and when the problem is fixed, they're a lot better.

I never troll on this site, sweetheart. This was just my thoughts. I'm willing to talk them over with you if you'd like. Please, I would like this to be a discussion. I'm not trying to hurt anyone!

But isn't this the exact same paternalistic behaviour towards people that we experience from society? I'm not saying we should let 10 year olds kill themselves. But at a certain age we should let people decide for themselves where their thresholds are and what a dignified existence means to them.

 

[itsmeagain]

But isn't this the exact same paternalistic behaviour towards people that we experience from society? I'm not saying we should let 10 year olds kill themselves. But at a certain age we should let people decide for themselves where their thresholds are and what a dignified existence means to them.

Oh I agree. At a certain age, predicament... this stuff is completely understandable. I agree with you entirely. I was just saying like... Me personally? And a lot of people that have responded here have expressed distrust, anger, and amusement and apathy about these notes. I haven't seen some person say that because of these notes, they weren't able to commit.

But now that I think about it, the fact that society SHAMES people for suicide and calls it cowardly, these notes could be echoing those sorts of lessons, which makes people feel even worse and more trapped? Is that more among the lines you're trying to say?

 

[-Link-]

Yikes, some of the comments in this thread. This is some of the strongest vitriol I've witnessed on this site. I get it, especially given some recent occurrences here, but my goodness.

If notes on a bridge save even one life, then it seems like they are worth it. If something as simple as a note turns you around from the edge, then you are probably not ready to die.

Pro-choice, not pro-suicide.

The replacement notes that were left, "no one cares", "plz jump", "a bullet is faster"... I take a lot more issue with those than idle love notes. Those are disgusting. And to think these people live among us.

 

[itsmeagain]

Yikes, some of the comments in this thread. This is some of the strongest vitriol I've witnessed on this site. I get it, especially given some recent occurrences here, but my goodness.

If notes on a bridge save even one life, then it seems like they are worth it. If something as simple as a note turns you around from the edge, then you are probably not ready to die.

Pro-choice, not pro-suicide.

The replacement notes that were left, "no one cares", "plz jump", "a bullet is faster"... I take a lot more issue with those than idle love notes. Those are disgusting. And to think these people live among us.

I kind of think that too. A.n.kirillov has kinda a point though, how those notes can remind people about how shamed they are for doing what they're doing. I think? Hmm. Not sure.

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Yes shaming is a big issue but that's another topic.

What I am trying to say is that suicide-prevention is a selfish, misguided endeavour. The problem is not suicide, suicide is the solution to the problem and that's what suicide-prevention and 'mental health' awareness are trying to divert the attention from; the function they perform is to spare society at large to look at the problems it inherently creates, at the lives it shatters, the losers that are inevitable and are growing in numbers. They are saying suicide is bad and occurs because people are insane or ill while we mare saying suicide is the solution for material problems in the material world which befall an individual.

 

[itsmeagain]

Yes shaming is a big issue but that's another topic.

What I am trying to say is that suicide-prevention is a selfish, misguided endeavour. The problem is not suicide, suicide is the solution to the problem and that's what suicide-prevention and 'mental health' awareness are trying to divert the attention from; the function they perform is to spare society at large to look at the problems it inherently creates, at the life's it shatters, the losers that are inevitable and are growing in numbers. They are saying suicide is bad and occurs because people are insane or ill while we mare saying suicide is the solution for material problems in the material world which befall an individual.

That sounds like it may be more of a pro suicide ideal than a pro choice ideal. How do you see it?

 

[a.n.kirillov]

.

See, you can't even go public saying "suicide is a solution". But it is clearly a solution. I suffer, I can't fix my circumstances, so suicide is the solution to end my suffering. It's so common sense that it almost hurts explaining this to people.

 

[itsmeagain]

.

See, you can't even go public saying "suicide is a solution". But it is clearly a solution. I suffer, I can't fix my circumstances, so suicide is the solution to end my suffering. It's so common sense that it almost hurts explaining this to people.

Hey, I didn't say it wasn't a solution. I think that when you have no other choice, suicide is a solution for an utterly miserable constantly suffering time when everything has been tried and nothing works. But, you don't have to say that it's so common sense that it almost hurts explaining it to people. I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from. I don't know you, I don't know your struggles, and you're entitled to feel how you feel.

But on the other hand, thesame is true for me. Maybe we can speak a little bit more civily instead?

 

[a.n.kirillov]

That sounds like it may be more of a pro suicide ideal than a pro choice ideal. How do you see it?

Yes I see how it may have come across as such; I wanted to provoke you with this to show you how much ideology plays a role in this. Just stating the obvious that suicide is clearly not the problem for the person suffering but the solution to end the suffering is impossible. Society makes it clear that suicide itself is the problem; a problem for them.

I am absolutely not pro-suicide; but if someone is suffering I will not try to stop him to put himself out of the suffering and I won't paternalize him and tell him what is a life worth living and what isn't, what it is worth killing oneself over and what isn't.

That's what I was trying to say and I got heated I'm sorry if that came across as rude.

 

[itsmeagain]

I

Yes I see how it may have come across as such; I wanted to provoke you with this to show you how much ideology plays a role in this. Just stating the obvious that suicide is clearly not the problem for the person suffering but the solution to end the suffering is impossible. Society makes it clear that suicide itself is the problem; a problem for them.

I am absolutely not pro-suicide; but if someone is suffering I will not try to stop him to put himself out of the suffering and I won't paternalize him and tell him what is a life worth living and what isn't, what it is worth killing oneself over and what isn't.

That's what I was trying to say and I got heated I'm sorry if that came across as rude.

It's okay love. I understand. Sorry I jumped into your other response! I thought it was in the chain here. I apologize!

 

[a.n.kirillov]

Hey, I didn't say it wasn't a solution. I think that when you have no other choice, suicide is a solution for an utterly miserable constantly suffering time when everything has been tried and nothing works. But, you don't have to say that it's so common sense that it almost hurts explaining it to people. I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from. I don't know you, I don't know your struggles, and you're entitled to feel how you feel.

But on the other hand, thesame is true for me. Maybe we can speak a little bit more civily instead?

I didn't mean the people here, just the general public.

The attitude of "after everything has been tried and only ander these conditions which we dictate..." is exactly what I mean by paternalism.

I

It's okay love. I understand. Sorry I jumped into your other response! I thought it was in the chain here. I apologize!

yes we're talking over each other.