Discussion [Theory] Perhaps prolifers are against CTB because it's 'cheating'

[TAW122]

This is something that occurred to me in the past and again, which may explain why they act the way they do. Remember back when one was in primary school, or even when one was a kid and participated in various activities, whether it be sports, games, or any activity that is competitive? At any rate, so in primary school, I'm sure most students had tests, exams, and assessments throughout their education. During tests and exams, it is often closed-book, closed-notes (and in today's age, no smartphones, laptops, or anything that could be used to gain an unfair advantage). So when a student violates that rule, the student gets a failing grade (zero) on the exam as well as disciplinary action for 'cheating'. Similarly, when it comes to games or other competitions, be it sports, video games, and/or other extra curricular or specific-interest activities, if a player does something that is not allowed or prohibited by the rules, it is considered cheating. For example, if a player is not supposed to use one's own hands to catch the ball in soccer (or football depending on the country one is from) unless said player is the goal keeper/goalie, and they do, it becomes a penalty and the ball goes to the other team and with enough fouls or so, the offending player is removed from the game or sits in the bench (or just suspended for the remainder of the match or game). There are many other examples I could use, but these are the ones that come to mind.

Using the 'cheating' analogy, perhaps this could explain the mindset of yet why prolifers are so against people who CTB. If one was to see life as some involuntary game that nobody chose to play, but was imposed upon (which is a commonly accepted view), then pro-lifers (the other players in this involuntary game) see that anyone who wishes to CTB as irrational because it is considered 'cheating' or getting an unfair advantage by trying to exit this involuntary game before certain conditions (again, set by the collective pro-lifers themselves) are met. These conditions are often difficult and narrow to achieve, which are either: terminal illness (which there are even some prolifers who don't agree, especially religious ones) or of old age (like over the life expectancy of an adult, nearing 80's or 90's).

Note: I do NOT endorse nor condone the actions of prolifers, and their propagation of suffering is never ok with our tenets and values.

With that said, does anyone think this is probably the mindset of many prolifers?

 

[LaVieEnRose]

They certainly believe that we should never balk at any adversity, that we should accept our lots and soldier through no matter how difficult it is. Fuck that.

 

[twinklywater]

This is very reasonable. There are definitely many factors that cause pro-lifers to think the way they do. This is a highly rational explanation for a portion of pro-life beliefs. Nice

 

[moya117]

Idk, but they keep saying that it's not the only way, maybe they hate that some people take the easiest way to escape, some of them even have this pride that they're more strong because they don't think about that easy way to just end the suffering, maybe...

 

[FuneralCry]

Yes I agree as suicide goes against their worldview that existence is always worth enduring no matter what, they don't want to accept that suicide is a perfectly logical option so they label it as "irrational" as they are blinded by delusions. And suicide certainly goes against the belief in society that continuing to exist is an obligation and that we must suffer no matter what, despite the fact that existence was so unfairly forced on us. But the fact is that some people have awareness to recognise that existence isn't worth it, and that the futile, unnecessary process that is life only leads to more suffering all for the sake of it.

 

[Forever Sleep]

Yes, I definitely think it plays a part. Especially when related to religious thinking. I get the impression that some people view all life's totally shitty and unreasonable lessons as valuable in some way because they make us stronger- or- whatever. Plus, I've heard the phrase that God won't give you more than you can handle type of thing. (Bollocks in my view- plenty of people are given more than they can handle- it's why they crack!)

There definitely seems to be this view that you HAVE to just keep struggling on through- no matter what- because- that's what God wants... Really? To learn what? Maybe my brain is too small to comprehend but I just don't see what lesson could be SO crucial that we all have to just suck it up till we get slaughtered naturally.

To me- this (Christian) God just wants obedience- only then do you get rewarded... Don't eat this or that, don't do this or that, don't wear this or that- oh- and will you sacrifice your own son for me? (Isaac.) Oh- you will? Great- actually- don't do that- I've changed my mind but I appreciate your dedication...

I think people also wear their own struggles and other people's triumph's as badges of honour. I can't exactly blame them for this. Someone who has lost it all- had the most terrible life circumstances but still manages to turn it around IS impressive. There's no denying that. What people do seem to deny though is choice. I'm happy for them but it doesn't necessarily mean I SHOULD feel obliged to put the same effort in. Even if my circumstances are easier- it's MY life. I get to choose what to do with it!

Plus- I reckon it is sort of seen as a team sport- you're letting the side down if you quit early. I think what people most fear is that it may give the green light for others to do it. I believe suicides can run in families. Once it becomes a reasonable option for one person- why not more? I suspect that's why they usually play the mental illness card so often in suicides- the whole- you can't be thinking clearly IF you are contemplating it. Immediately- they are trying to make it inadmissable for those left behind.

 

[Holu]

This is something that occurred to me in the past and again, which may explain why they act the way they do. Remember back when one was in primary school, or even when one was a kid and participated in various activities, whether it be sports, games, or any activity that is competitive? At any rate, so in primary school, I'm sure most students had tests, exams, and assessments throughout their education. During tests and exams, it is often closed-book, closed-notes (and in today's age, no smartphones, laptops, or anything that could be used to gain an unfair advantage). So when a student violates that rule, the student gets a failing grade (zero) on the exam as well as disciplinary action for 'cheating'. Similarly, when it comes to games or other competitions, be it sports, video games, and/or other extra curricular or specific-interest activities, if a player does something that is not allowed or prohibited by the rules, it is considered cheating. For example, if a player is not supposed to use one's own hands to catch the ball in soccer (or football depending on the country one is from) unless said player is the goal keeper/goalie, and they do, it becomes a penalty and the ball goes to the other team and with enough fouls or so, the offending player is removed from the game or sits in the bench (or just suspended for the remainder of the match or game). There are many other examples I could use, but these are the ones that come to mind.

Using the 'cheating' analogy, perhaps this could explain the mindset of yet why prolifers are so against people who CTB. If one was to see life as some involuntary game that nobody chose to play, but was imposed upon (which is a commonly accepted view), then pro-lifers (the other players in this involuntary game) see that anyone who wishes to CTB as irrational because it is considered 'cheating' or getting an unfair advantage by trying to exit this involuntary game before certain conditions (again, set by the collective pro-lifers themselves) are met. These conditions are often difficult and narrow to achieve, which are either: terminal illness (which there are even some prolifers who don't agree, especially religious ones) or of old age (like over the life expectancy of an adult, nearing 80's or 90's).

Note: I do NOT endorse nor condone the actions of prolifers, and their propagation of suffering is never ok with our tenets and values.

With that said, does anyone think this is probably the mindset of many prolifers?

I like my theory better. That they are fucking assholes and should be bitch slapped.

On a more thinky thonky note it's probably due to a general disconnect that they have in relation to their own mental states. They simply are incapable of sympathizing or empathizing with someone who believes the is no solution or hope. Whether due to their lack of mental illness or their unfamiliarity with the severe mental weight some people carry, they fail to see why an individual might be truly at the bottom. A lot of times, they will compare their own hardships to yours, whether be it loss or "depression" (Istg EVERYONE says they been depressed but fail to understand it's an actual mental illness) they believe that you should be able to persevere. As such, they tend to problem solve, and see any comfort or empathy provided from this forum as toxic, since in cases it reinforces the notion of giving in.

Ultimately I see every one of us as soldiers. Everyone here is fighting a battle, whether it be against their desire to CTB, a fight against their SI, or simply the mental backandforth we all go through. This forum is ultimately the frontlines on the war against suffering, so in that regard we be soldiers.

To me- this (Christian) God just wants obedience- only then do you get rewarded... Don't eat this or that, don't do this or that, don't wear this or that- oh- and will you sacrifice your own son for me? (Isaac.) Oh- you will? Great- actually- don't do that- I've changed my mind but I appreciate your dedication...

No hate to the religious types as I respect everyone's right to faith but fuck these "devout" Christians. Part of me wants heaven and hell to be real so that I can stomp gods face in.

 

[yive]

yes, it's true. i think some pro-lifers secretly envy us and think that this is "so unfair!111!" to them that we "just leave" when, for example, they have worked all their lives, suffered, and so on. and therefore they want to force everyone to suffer. so stupid!

 

[epic]

Some pro-lifers believe that when you CTB, you are abandoning the responsibility of taking care of your family and hence it's cheating . That's the "suicide is selfish" philosophy. They are concerned about your kids and your parents and how it will affect them. I get where they are coming from but it's still a very evil thing to say . People are not saying "no more" to their family/friends, they are saying "no more" to their endless suffering. We need a strong support system for kids of deceased parents instead of blaming decent parents .

 

[Homo erectus]

Yes, this has been my thought for a while. Life is a competition from birth. Suicidal people are basically losers. But they have to suffer the punishment, because It is part of the game. Lest the dynamics of the game would be different. It is like committing a crime in a foreign country. Usually the person get jailed first before being deported.

 

[Holu]

Yes, this has been my thought for a while. Life is a competition from birth. Suicidal people are basically losers. But they have to suffer the punishment, because It is part of the game. Lest the dynamics of the game would be different. It is like committing a crime in a foreign country. Usually the person get jailed first before being deported.

Even b4 birth too. Them sperm cells were competitive af