Discussion [Theory] Perhaps pro-lifers fear "encouragement and incitement" (also debunking another argument)

[TAW122]

This is something that crossed my mind as a possible theory that might explain why pro-lifers hold their staunch values and maybe a majority of them are afraid of incitement and/or encouragement of others dying if they don't go against CTB. I believe that they are so entrenched in their views that they are in fact, so misguided to believe that one has to love life, support the right to live otherwise it is supporting the right to die. I suppose that religious indoctrination as well as the status quo (also rooted likely in religion if one goes far back enough) is to blame for such an irrational stance. Additionally, perhaps it could also be their own fear of mortality so much that they push out all logical and rational thinking and simply default to the stance of "death is bad no matter what, so therefore life must be an absolute positive."? As most of pro-choicers see it, we accept and recognize that death is just a part of life and that it is inevitable for all of us (pro-lifers, pro-mortalists, and pro-choicers alike), thus we don't fear it.

Also, to debunk such a claim, I would simply say that the pro-lifer claim is a false dilemma. This is because their stance of "if one doesn't agree and support that life is worth living, then one supports deaths" or a similar argument they make is "if you aren't against people who CTB, then you support people CTB'ing". Not only are those arguments false dilemmas, but they are also far from the truth and misrepresent the pro-choicer's stance. The pro-choicer's stance is that each individual should have the right to decide whether one wishes to continue living or to die on one's own terms. They (prolifers) misrepresent the pro-choicer's stance because they believe that if one isn't pro-life and against death, then one is pro-death. That is simply false because pro-choicers are NOT pro-mortalists (or pro-death) people. We pro-choicers respect each individual's decision to live or die (on one's own terms).

Does anyone think that this is a possible theory that might explain why (some) prolifers cling onto their views?

 

[vcnt]

Trying to come up with a theory about why other people might or might not have a certain way of thinking or stance is not only futile, just the same as you can never expect someone to 'truly' understand ones feelings for suicide nor can you ever expect to understand some random others reasoning for thought, but pointless.

 

[SilentSadness]

I think the pro life situation is simply a matter of natural selection. Those who believe life has no value tend to kill themselves and those that don't succeed are sectioned and silenced. Also, it seems conflicting to believe you enjoy life yet hold a stance that suggests life is negative, so a pro life position is mandatory to support that belief. It would be much better if I could just die and leave this mess behind for someone else to deal with.

 

[FuneralCry]

I just believe that pro life people simply don't wish to accept the fact that suicide is a perfectly rational option as the thought of death being preferable to life scares them and shatters their delusional beliefs that existence is always worth enduring. It's like they forget that we are all just destined to die anyway and whatever we go through in life will be long forgotten about someday and this is just the reality of this existence. Some people like to think that death is such a bad thing, but it really could never be. There are no disadvantages to being dead and the only harm lies in existence. Suicide is just avoiding delaying our inevitable fate so therefore there could never be anything wrong with deciding to exit at a time of our own choosing, it's a personal choice when to leave.

 

[leeloosnow]

I think that many people are raised in an environment which mandates conformity and submission to authority. Typically this mindset is so engrained from and early age that is becomes pervasive thru many aspect of adult life. For example religion, military, and workplace constructs punish those that ask uncomfortable questions, people like me that like to color outside of the lines. Change, in any aspect of life, is often uncomfortable and fear inducing, therefore many are hesitant to confront new ideas. They align themselves with certain identities and when that's questioned, it shakes up their core beliefs of who they are. This is true in many facets of life, and certainly is so for voluntary euthanasia. We are coached to believe that death is sad, terrible, that it is a loss and a tragedy. We make up pretty stories about sky daddies to console our fears of nonexistence when the fact of the matter is that is a state from which we came, and to which we will inevitably return. Sadly we as a society tout american exceptionalism therefore most are unaware of the harm they cause when imposing their beliefs on others, acting in blind confidence and nonchalance of the subsequent suffering they cause. It never ceases to confuse me how these same people will easily euthanize a beloved pet while letting grandma wither in pain and suffer a long terrible death from some terminal illness. And, sadly I believe there is little to no chance of changing the societal stance on this in a timely fashion, people have to see the benefits in order to slowly begin to accept that their precious rights actually apply to someone other than themselves

 

[TAW122]

I think the pro life situation is simply a matter of natural selection. Those who believe life has no value tend to kill themselves and those that don't succeed are sectioned and silenced. Also, it seems conflicting to believe you enjoy life yet hold a stance that suggests life is negative, so a pro life position is mandatory to support that belief. It would be much better if I could just die and leave this mess behind for someone else to deal with.

This is true from a evolutionary perspective and indeed, there is the paradox of pro-choicers in which I made a thread about last year. The people who want this choice (unless they don't CTB) would paradoxically end up not being able to continue to advocate it and/or continue fighting it especially when they exercise the right. It is possible that throughout history there are likely similar groups but have died out or extinguished from recorded time (due to their stance).

I think that many people are raised in an environment which mandates conformity and submission to authority. Typically this mindset is so engrained from and early age that is becomes pervasive thru many aspect of adult life. For example religion, military, and workplace constructs punish those that ask uncomfortable questions, people like me that like to color outside of the lines. Change, in any aspect of life, is often uncomfortable and fear inducing, therefore many are hesitant to confront new ideas. They align themselves with certain identities and when that's questioned, it shakes up their core beliefs of who they are. This is true in many facets of life, and certainly is so for voluntary euthanasia. We are coached to believe that death is sad, terrible, that it is a loss and a tragedy. We make up pretty stories about sky daddies to console our fears of nonexistence when the fact of the matter is that is a state from which we came, and to which we will inevitably return. Sadly we as a society tout american exceptionalism therefore most are unaware of the harm they cause when imposing their beliefs on others, acting in blind confidence and nonchalance of the subsequent suffering they cause. It never ceases to confuse me how these same people will easily euthanize a beloved pet while letting grandma wither in pain and suffer a long terrible death from some terminal illness. And, sadly I believe there is little to no chance of changing the societal stance on this in a timely fashion, people have to see the benefits in order to slowly begin to accept that their precious rights actually apply to someone other than themselves

This is indeed the reality of the world we live in. As for the last part, I believe this thread I made last year highlights all the problems and some (general) solution that needs to be applied or at least pointing out the direction in which one must approach in order for people to embrace and adopt voluntary euthanasia as a policy.

 

[QiTianDaSheng]

I told a friend of mine about SN (as he has often complained about lack of gun access in the UK) and linked the Stan piece.

Got to admit, I did feel unsettled by it. Like I was egging him on. It's not really a nice thing to actively promote.

Which is why suicidal people all try to keep each other from suiciding lol...