Discussion The debate of who is allowed assisted suicide

[IrRegularjoe]

I've noticed a common theme among right to die advocates. They insist that people should have the right to die yet always talk about being of sound mind. Or perhaps not for the mentally ill. I take offence when people differentiate between physical and mental suffering. There are no reasons to assume a person with a mental disorder cannot determine when their mental medical condition is to much of a problem to live with.
Secondly why are doctors constantly interfering with bullshit science. They have stockpiles of medication and neglect the patient with their medical knowledge. They never listen, suddenly their education and pills are more knowledgeable than you. They can't feel your pain. We've entered a world where I constantly hear psychiatrists preach about the science of their work. It makes me wonder which one has really gone mad. The doctor or the patient.

 

[rt1989526]

Psychiatrists are frauds who cause more problems than they cure. They are legal drug dealers.

 

[FriendofDeath]

I just watched something on Youtube about a Canadian who was fighting for his right to die. He was in great physical pain that was attributed to a mental syndrome. One of the stats they quoted was the number of those with mental illness that had been approved for euthanasia in Belgium and the Netherlands - 48. Of those, 11 elected not to go through with it. Sometimes it's just having the option that is enough to ease the burden, if that makes sense. Like many here who find their method and are prepared - it provides some peace. In this case, the guy questioned why he couldn't die with dignity. He didn't want to suicide, but he found no other option to ending his pain. I think his thoughts are echoed here often.

 

[sadghost]

I see this perspective being expressed a lot as well - you have the right to die if you are suffering but only if your suffering is physical. People with this perspective expect people who are greatly suffering mentally to go out of their way to ensure that they "cure" themselves through therapy and antidepressants, benzos, etc.

This neglects the fact that 1. Our mental health system is extremely flawed and 2. Suggests that mental suffering is an invalid reason to be allowed a peaceful exit.

Firstly, access to mental health supports is an issue. The price of therapy is a huge problem in and of itself. The standard here is like $100CAD per session. Then when you actually get some kind of support, it's really a gamble if it's going to help or not. Some psychologists just simply don't help at all or even make you feel worse. Any mention of suicide is immediately invalidated and dismissed because you are "not of sound mind."

Secondly, it is easy for people who have never experienced extreme emotional distress/mental illness/trauma to invalidate mental suffering

 

[Deardaddy]

He killed himself afterwards

He killed himself afterwards

 

[IrRegularjoe]

He killed himself afterwards

Yes, he was one of the few with mental illness that advocated for change. Our euthanasia laws in Canada are currently changing to a more open regime. They are removing reasonably foreseeable death. But excluding mentally ill people. Sadly his activism never comes up. The recent court case of a man with cerebral palsy is what got the reasonably foreseeable death part removed. Mental illness was a qualification in bill c-14, so when Adam Maier Clayton advocated for it to be removed he wasn't wrong but now the Canadian government has drafted bill C-7 which is highly unconstitutional. As you are not suppose to discriminate based on someone's diagnosis. It's a real shame.

 

[esse_est_percipi]

They have stockpiles of medication and neglect the patient with their medical knowledge. They never listen, suddenly their education and pills are more knowledgeable than you. They can't feel your pain. We've entered a world where I constantly hear psychiatrists preach about the science of their work. It makes me wonder which one has really gone mad. The doctor or the patient.

spot on

 

[Deleted member 19654]

I look at it this way: when it comes to euthanasia/assisted suicide, I think people have the right to choose to die if have a debilitating condition, physical or mental, that impacts upon their quality of life and there's a possibility of deterioration or if there's not going to be any improvement. It can depend on a few factors like the severity of the condition, how long they've had it etc. For example, there are different levels of depression and some lucky individuals are able to overcome it and continue to lead a normal life. When it comes to 'being of sound mind', I feel as if that could refer to impulsive decisions because it needs to be a well though out decision. If someone has only just recently become depressed/been depressed for a very short amount of time then I don't think assisted suicide should be made available for them. Or if someone has just been diagnosed with a physical condition but there's a possibility of improvement with treatment. There needs to be a bit of a waiting period to see how things develop.

I hope what I wrote makes sense and I didn't ramble too much or go off on a tangent. I'm too tired to proofread it.

 

[thereandgone]

When it comes to 'being of sound mind', I feel as if that could refer to impulsive decisions because it needs to be a well though out decision. If someone has only just recently become depressed/been depressed for a very short amount of time then I don't think assisted suicide should be made available for them. Or if someone has just been diagnosed with a physical condition but there's a possibility of improvement with treatment. There needs to be a bit of a waiting period to see how things develop.

Exactly. That will guarantee that the system can soak you of every last cent in your bank account before they approve you.

 

[FriendofDeath]

He killed himself afterwards

This is the guy I was referring to. He did all in his power to earn his right to die peacefully. Sad and compelling story.

 

[Deardaddy]

This is the guy I was referring to. He did all in his power to earn his right to die peacefully. Sad and compelling story.

Have you seen his other videos. His family is supportive of him as well. When u see an animal suffering in pain , the vet gave a dose to relieve the animal ,pets etc. Why would a cruel society stigmatized others choice. Why, because society is God damn evil.

 

[MeriDeath]

The mention of people with physical illness being more of sound mind than me is just ridiculous. I can talk for myself, I am very well and ok. Im not some psycho maniac and yes I have decided that its better for me to end this life So I dont suffer anymore. Thay doesnt mean im crazy. People tend to think everyone's life is beautiful and if you suddenly turn suicidal you are some mental who doesnt know ahit about life. I bet each and everyone here would pass for being of sound mind. Responsible, and self aware.

 

[TAW122]

I've noticed a common theme among right to die advocates. They insist that people should have the right to die yet always talk about being of sound mind. Or perhaps not for the mentally ill. I take offence when people differentiate between physical and mental suffering. There are no reasons to assume a person with a mental disorder cannot determine when their mental medical condition is to much of a problem to live with.
Secondly why are doctors constantly interfering with bullshit science. They have stockpiles of medication and neglect the patient with their medical knowledge. They never listen, suddenly their education and pills are more knowledgeable than you. They can't feel your pain. We've entered a world where I constantly hear psychiatrists preach about the science of their work. It makes me wonder which one has really gone mad. The doctor or the patient.

I do believe that yes, with medical professionals and doctors, yes their arrogance (again not all of them, but a fair amount of them) is quite repulsive and offensive to the people who want to die peacefully and with dignity. Having psychological and mental suffering, while more difficult to measure objectively and observe compared to physical suffering is still legitimate suffering. This is why I would like there to be a system where people are able to die, but screened to ensure that they aren't being coerced and are making the choice for themselves and themselves ONLY, then given a waiting period (doesn't have to be extremely long, but adequate) to ensure that they are 100% sure of their decision. After those two things check out, then patient will proceed to die with dignity.

I look at it this way: when it comes to euthanasia/assisted suicide, I think people have the right to choose to die if have a debilitating condition, physical or mental, that impacts upon their quality of life and there's a possibility of deterioration or if there's not going to be any improvement. It can depend on a few factors like the severity of the condition, how long they've had it etc. For example, there are different levels of depression and some lucky individuals are able to overcome it and continue to lead a normal life. When it comes to 'being of sound mind', I feel as if that could refer to impulsive decisions because it needs to be a well though out decision. If someone has only just recently become depressed/been depressed for a very short amount of time then I don't think assisted suicide should be made available for them. Or if someone has just been diagnosed with a physical condition but there's a possibility of improvement with treatment. There needs to be a bit of a waiting period to see how things develop.

I hope what I wrote makes sense and I didn't ramble too much or go off on a tangent. I'm too tired to proofread it.

I agree with a waiting period and I would support that in order to ensure that the person is really willing to go through and very unlikely to change his/her mind. CTB is not a reversible decision so one needs to be 100% sure that one will go before making the decision.

The mention of people with physical illness being more of sound mind than me is just ridiculous. I can talk for myself, I am very well and ok. Im not some psycho maniac and yes I have decided that its better for me to end this life So I dont suffer anymore. Thay doesnt mean im crazy. People tend to think everyone's life is beautiful and if you suddenly turn suicidal you are some mental who doesnt know ahit about life. I bet each and everyone here would pass for being of sound mind. Responsible, and self aware.

Agreed. I believe most of us here are more rational than the majority of mindless NPCs that inhabit this society, world that we live in.