KillingPain267

KillingPain267

Paragon
Apr 15, 2024
931
When someone is confronted with a suicidal person they often start acting as a desperate savior hero. There are two reasons for this:

1. They get relived trauma when confronted with death (since everyone learns that death is inevitable some time as a child but then suppresses it. It's the same if you say someone will die soon, people respond with "don't say that!" as if not saying it makes them immortal.
2. They want to play the hero savior of life (but just to brag of themselves) but don't know how or what else to say (since they themselves have suppressed the thought of death long ago and can't think logically about it)

Suicide preventionists are therefore actually very selfish. They "care" only for 4 reasons:

1. If you die earlier THEY might miss you (selfish reason) even though it should be about YOUR suffering
2. If you ctb, they feel like they failed as a savior to save life (and thus cannot brag about it)
3. Suicide reminds THEM of death and since everyone is traumatized by the thought, but most have suppressed it, so hearing about suicide makes them relive the trauma and absurdity that life will end for everyone sooner or later
4. Suicide shatters illusions about life, and proves that suffering is inevitable and sometimes to intense that death is more desirable than ongoing suffering (people don't like when their delusions are destroyed with logic and facts)

Notice ALL these reasons are selfish. So suicide prevention is NOT compassionate but actually a cruel violation of an autonomous human's right to choice.

If they want to play hero saviors, they should become firefighters or research medical cures. But if they really want to be unselfish sacrificer heros then they should spend their entire life researching actual cures for mental illnesses and chronic pains as well as poverty and bullying (because those are the main reasons some people want to die earlier). But we wouldn't do something hard, now would we?
 
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M

M48 Patton

Student
Jun 2, 2024
123
I think from my experience if counselling, therapy, medication and other forms of management or treatment don't work and suicide is still on that persons mind and their condition is terminal, chronic, life altering and debilitating I think suicide is a very valid response to what could be a very difficult situation.

I would very much like to live, but my quality of life is not where I want it to be, physically and mentally I'm in no way where I want to be. So I feel I need a way out.

I see suicide as an escape, a way to free your existence of pain. Not a solution I want but the only one I may have.
 
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Tesha

Tesha

Life too shall pass
May 31, 2020
900
Or maybe they can just see that the person still wants help, but hasn't tried or been able to access everything. The key to it not progressing to a 'saviour' situation is to know when the offer of help is no longer wanted - and then step back. Many suicidal people still want help initially.

Or perhaps, the 'helper' is as you say, selfish.

I don't think 'help' can be shoeboxed into a simple black and white assessment.
 
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Ash

Ash

What dreams may come?
Oct 4, 2021
1,758
Or maybe the helper has been suicidal in the past but isn't any longer and now has a fulfilling life that they enjoy, and now has a different perspective on matters of life and death.

Until someone invents foresight, it's all guesswork and there is no right or wrong answer. Nobody is selfish - and everyone is entitled to an opinion since the only facts are the ones in the past. Ultimately, we're the ones who should be allowed to make decisions about our lives but - and here's the big clause - only if we're able to make rational decisions. Coming across as perpetually angry and calling everyone selfish isn't a great way of showing that. Just my opinion, obvs.
 
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KillingPain267

KillingPain267

Paragon
Apr 15, 2024
931
I think from my experience if counselling, therapy, medication and other forms of management or treatment don't work and suicide is still on that persons mind and their condition is terminal, chronic, life altering and debilitating I think suicide is a very valid response to what could be a very difficult situation.

I would very much like to live, but my quality of life is not where I want it to be, physically and mentally I'm in no way where I want to be. So I feel I need a way out.

I see suicide as an escape, a way to free your existence of pain. Not a solution I want but the only one I may have.
Exactly. Well worded.
Or maybe the helper has been suicidal in the past but isn't any longer and now has a fulfilling life that they enjoy, and now has a different perspective on matters of life and death.

Until someone invents foresight, it's all guesswork and there is no right or wrong answer. Nobody is selfish - and everyone is entitled to an opinion since the only facts are the ones in the past. Ultimately, we're the ones who should be allowed to make decisions about our lives but - and here's the big clause - only if we're able to make rational decisions. Coming across as perpetually angry and calling everyone selfish isn't a great way of showing that. Just my opinion, obvs.
By preventionists I mean those who have never been suicidal and say suicide is never ever an option. Those people are egocentric and selfish because our lives and choices should not be theirs to decide. Anyone offering help by saying "try this FIRST" is fine in my book as long as they don't keep suicide off the table.
Or maybe they can just see that the person still wants help, but hasn't tried or been able to access everything. The key to it not progressing to a 'saviour' situation is to know when the offer of help is no longer wanted - and then step back. Many suicidal people still want help initially.

Or perhaps, the 'helper' is as you say, selfish.

I don't think 'help' can be shoeboxed into a simple black and white assessment.
By preventionists I mean those who have never been suicidal and say suicide is never ever an option. Those people are egocentric and selfish because our lives and choices should not be theirs to decide. Anyone offering help by saying "try this FIRST" is fine in my book as long as they don't keep suicide off the table.
 
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Roseate

Arcanist
Mar 24, 2021
456
Or maybe the helper has been suicidal in the past but isn't any longer and now has a fulfilling life that they enjoy, and now has a different perspective on matters of life and death.

Until someone invents foresight, it's all guesswork and there is no right or wrong answer. Nobody is selfish - and everyone is entitled to an opinion since the only facts are the ones in the past. Ultimately, we're the ones who should be allowed to make decisions about our lives but - and here's the big clause - only if we're able to make rational decisions. Coming across as perpetually angry and calling everyone selfish isn't a great way of showing that. Just my opinion, obvs.
But that's just not the case for everyone. I think they should understand that even tho life got better for them, it doesn't always get better for everyone and their ending isn't everyone's ending, you know? There isn't one ending for everyone cuz plenty of people die every day never knowing happiness or peace… some people life never got better in the end and they never got to truly experience all of life's beauty and they didn't even have to kill themselves for that to be their experience. And if someone says they're not interested, continuing to bother them is just straight harassment and I hate how we ignore harassment when we think we're "helping" when in reality were causing more harm than good. When I'm suicidal, I don't want to hear (this is an example) about how killing myself is a sin or how I'm going to hell or how I'm selfish or how it's wrong and my life is worth living. (cuz I'm atheist and if life is worth living wouldn't it be good? Wouldn't it be fair?) Some people however are begging for someone to hear them and to see them, and their plea shouldn't be ignored in fear but once the word not interested comes in, that should be the end of it. There is no hero, this isn't a comic book and there is no one in need of external rescue. If they're desperate to rescue they should foster children instead, not try to keep depressed and mentally exhausted people living in constant pain with no source of hope or support or help or guidance or happiness and joy.
 
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Ash

Ash

What dreams may come?
Oct 4, 2021
1,758
But that's just not the case for everyone. I think they should understand that even tho life got better for them, it doesn't always get better for everyone and their ending isn't everyone's ending, you know? There isn't one ending for everyone cuz plenty of people die every day never knowing happiness or peace… some people life never got better in the end and they never got to truly experience all of life's beauty and they didn't even have to kill themselves for that to be their experience. And if someone says they're not interested, continuing to bother them is just straight harassment and I hate how we ignore harassment when we think we're "helping" when in reality were causing more harm than good. When I'm suicidal, I don't want to hear (this is an example) about how killing myself is a sin or how I'm going to hell or how I'm selfish or how it's wrong and my life is worth living. (cuz I'm atheist and if life is worth living wouldn't it be good? Wouldn't it be fair?) Some people however are begging for someone to hear them and to see them, and their plea shouldn't be ignored in fear but once the word not interested comes in, that should be the end of it. There is no hero, this isn't a comic book and there is no one in need of external rescue. If they're desperate to rescue they should foster children instead, not try to keep depressed and mentally exhausted people living in constant pain with no source of hope or support or help or guidance or happiness and joy.
Did you read my whole post? I even said we should be allowed to make our own choices.

I just wanted to point out that some people have been suicidal and are now glad they didn't go through with it. They're as entitled to their opinion as you are.

Me, I'm just fed up of the assumption that we all speak with one voice - and getting shouted down for offering up different ways of looking at the world.
 
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