Religious people

[antilife]

Religious people make me so mad. I just can't understand how they can say stuff like 'things happen for a reason' or that assisted suicide would be sinful. Oh yeah thank you so you think God wants me to suffer like this and be suicidal af for a reason? Which reason would that be? Only God should determine when you die wtf is this bullshit. I'm sorry if this is offensive for religious people but in my opionion it's complete bullshit.

 

[Darkover]

religion is a cult and a work of fiction and a mental illness their delusional, there is no god everything came into exist from nothing
thats the obvious conclusion there had to be a starting point some call this the creator but then you got to ask what created the creator
nothing created everything we see, there is no grand plan there is no plan, everything is lefted to chance i'm sure we will be able to destory everything there is and be nothing for all time

pay attention to your attention. Because you become what you pay attention to. What captures your attention controls your brain, and your life.

 

[WAITING TO DIE]

It is NEVER mentioned in the bible that suicide is a sin.
Suicide as a sin was only introduced into the Christian doctrine in the 6th century AD, a long time AFTER the bible was written.
So therefore suicide as a sin is a man-made concept.
In other words, religion is bullshit.
There is no bearded asshole in the sky called god.

 

[ringo99]

Humans instinctively fear the unknown and the idea of oblivion. The concepts of religion, sin, karma, afterlife, soul and a divine deity (or deities) are human inventions to assuage that fear and make us mindful of our actions. Of course like any invention it can be easily twisted to do harm and manipulate the gullible and naive. The truth is that no one alive has any idea of what happens after death and if they say they do they're either deluded or lying. I firmly believe that there is nothing after death. Even your consciousness won't survive in any definable format. All you leave behind are the consequences of your actions. Whether I die today or 40 years or so from now the end result is the same.

 

[Dying Knight]

I just can't understand how they can say stuff like 'things happen for a reason' or that assisted suicide would be sinful.

I think, their belief in a kind god is a variation of the Stockholm syndrome and they want to spread this syndrome to you.

Oh yeah thank you so you think God wants me to suffer like this and be suicidal af for a reason? Which reason would that be?

They don't care, they just believe that a valuable reason exists. And if you happen to ask too many questions, you're a bad guy for them.

 

[Forever Sleep]

It's kind of odd that the reverse isn't considered. Think of how many people's lives are artificially preserved. Some people wouldn't even exist in the first place if it weren't for things like IVF. Why don't they suppose God is super frustrated trying to kill us off with cancer, natural disasters, pandemics and we keep dodging the bullet? Of course, I've heard the argument that- 'No, that's still God's will because God allowed humankind to discover the cure for these things'. So where did Nembutal come from- the devil?

 

[FuneralCry]

I see religion as nothing more than a way to brainwash people, the anti-suicide religious drivel is best ignored, it's very insensitive how those people try and push their delusions onto others.
I could never believe in such a thing as religion, there is no purpose or meaning behind existence, I see existence as nothing more than a horrific mistake that causes so much harm and suffering. The only hell is this hellish world, I believe death to be the complete absence of everything, it's just a peaceful, eternal and dreamless sleep.

 

[Minsu]

It is NEVER mentioned in the bible that suicide is a sin.
Suicide as a sin was only introduced into the Christian doctrine in the 6th century AD, a long time AFTER the bible was written.
So therefore suicide as a sin is a man-made concept.
In other words, religion is bullshit.
There is no bearded asshole in the sky called god.

Well the Bible itself is man-made concept

 

[WAITING TO DIE]

Well the Bible itself is man-made concept

Exactly true.

 

[hermestrimegistus]

I've been judged harshly by an abrahamist before so I understand people being against religion as a whole but there are more religions than just the big 3. And not all of them are like this. I am of the belief that the biblical god is actually a god based upon child sacrifice and mental enslavement so this isnt coming from some old testament thumper. But lumping everyone together is not exactly fair. Not every belief system is the same and chastises like this. And you can argue that atheism is also a religion. Its still based on faith. No one actually knows for sure. And there are people who are basically evangelical atheists. But that doesnt mean that they should all be grouped together and invalidated as a whole. I think the problem is more piousness and bigotry and less about religion itself. But that's just me

 

[nood11]

I see three main belief systems in this world: theism, pantheism, and atheism. They obviously can't all be true. It's hard to believe there's a place of endless conscious torment for those who don't make it to heaven. A lot of people reject Christianity because of the traditional understanding of hell. I definitely don't like the idea of reincarnation, and I've never believed it's true. If atheism is true then there is no God and no afterlife. That makes this life totally pointless, and oblivion awaits after death. I wish somehow we could know for sure which one of these three is true, so we can plan accordingly.

 

[Dying Knight]

And you can argue that atheism is also a religion. Its still based on faith.

That's a plain misunderstanding of words. Religion is a belief in supernatural or transcendental things. In general, it's not even equal to theism - belief in god or gods. Atheism is the absence of belief in gods, it's not necessarily based on faith. Antitheism is ether a belief or a rationally reasoned point of view that a particular god or gods with the described attributes do not exist.

 

[hermestrimegistus]

That's a plain misunderstanding of words. Religion is a belief in supernatural or transcendental things. In general, it's not even equal to theism - belief in god or gods. Atheism is the absence of belief in gods, it's not necessarily based on faith. Antitheism is ether a belief or a rationally reasoned point of view that a particular god or gods with the described attributes do not exist.

You can be a deist without believing in religion. Not every belief system is the same. And some are based on belief in things that factual exist. Like there's sun worshippers. The sun's obviously real. And it does technically allow us to continue living. Not all religion is completely supernatural based. And atheism is still a belief system. I never said it wasn't rational, but it is still based on belief

 

[Dying Knight]

And atheism is still a belief system.

Yeah, absence of belief in real Santa Claus is also a belief system. Attempts to put atheism in one line with religion are so entertaining.

 

[StellaSomnus]

Religious people are sociopaths. They never considered the humane aspects of their views just to satisfy their imaginary friends.

Raised as a Muslim (but now an ex), suicide is considered to be a major sin. For what? I don't know. Same reason why I can't eat pork. I just can't because it's 'unholy' when scientifically speaking, though pork isn't the healthiest of option, it doesn't kill me to eat pork when prepared properly.

So I can't commit suicide because the Quran says that god is merciful. Sure, where is my mercy then? I am being tormented with bad luck and placed in a messy situation, and all the religious sociopaths have to say is "oh it's just a test from god". I'm not interested in taking these 'tests' that I have failed the 'test' so give me the good life I deserve, I don't care about these 'tests'.

 

[jar-baby]

And you can argue that atheism is also a religion. Its still based on faith.

I think it's a common misconception that atheism is always the belief that there is no god, when generally it's just the absence of belief in any gods.
Or as Dawkins put it— I'm an atheist in the same way as I am an a-leprechaunist and an a-fairyist and an a-pinkunicornist.

 

[Darkover]

No one actually knows for sure

nd atheism is still a belief system. I never said it wasn't rational, but it is still based on belief

i known for 100 percent certainty there is no

Turn it around. What if you had to believe in everything that cannot be disproven to exist? Point is, proving 100% that something does not exist is not possible (as I am willing to prove at the end of this post). So then you'd have to believe in Bigfoot, in Santa, in Shiiva, in Thor of Asgard and in every myth of creation ever presented to you, no matter how contradictory. Can you see how that would become a bit of a problem?

You would have to believe in every god of every religion known to mankind. Because they cannot be proven 100% not to exist either, and so again, with your infallible logic, "no one can really know."

Then you might respond "well ok, I meant only in the feasible god of course!" And there you have it. I do not find your god feasible. Not probable. Not likely. And for anything that I find so utterly unlikely, I need at least a tiny shred of evidence in the other bowl of the scale. And since the other bowl has been filled with nothing but blind faith for the last 2,000 years, I simply find no incitement to start believing in your god any more than in Hera or Atlas.

Remember this and do never forget it – if you are devoted to any religion and god, your stance on other gods is exactly the same as mine is on yours. In many ways, one could argue that, as a Christian, you have an atheistic view on other religions. And with your own logic, how is that possible?

How can you ever fully disprove the existence of Ganesha? And hey, Zeus! There is lightning and thunder to prove his existence! Well… Unless you believe in the scientific explanations of course, but then again, why would you cherry pick just that piece of science to trust?

Now, to send you off with a little fun challenge, I want you to disprove the existence of something for me, beyond the shadow of any doubt. If you can't, then you must believe in it. Ready?

Off the top of my head… Ok, here goes:

I claim that there is an object somewhere that has the shape of a benzene ring, about 16 cm in diameter. This object is not made by mankind, and if you touch it while you think hard about three dozen bananas (really visualize them, three dozen, no more, no less), the ring object will instantly turn into a portal to a dimension where every human being is seen as their true selves: cells in a four dimensional fishlike cloud that can only experience the flow of time by being connected to a three dimensional pocket universe where its cells are allowed to travel linearly through the fourth spatial dimension and thus experience that as "time" and "life". The only passage through our pocket reality and the other true reality (the one with the fishlike cloud god) is through that benzene ring shaped object.

I claim this to be The Truth, now give me your best shot at disproving it to 100%! I'm ready. Ready to shoot all your scientific reasons down with sheer conviction and belief. For 2,000 years if I have to. Bring it on!

 

[STTP]

It is NEVER mentioned in the bible that suicide is a sin.
Suicide as a sin was only introduced into the Christian doctrine in the 6th century AD, a long time AFTER the bible was written.
So therefore suicide as a sin is a man-made concept.
In other words, religion is bullshit.
There is no bearded asshole in the sky called god.

This - life stopped being worth living, and so the idea of suicide as a sin was necessary. The serfs must live, or work won't get done, and they realized their life was awful, cruel and disappointing. Christianity was both a comforting presence and a tool of oppression, as they were convinced suffering for 50 or so years on earth was just a price that needed to be paid, and it didn't matter because it's nothing compared to eternal bliss in heaven.

If you knew you would go to heaven if you killed yourself, there would be no reason not to escape your life as a serf. The church is crafty!!

Responding to the general topic, here: religion and its own theological implications gets really, really messy once you describe God as omnipotent.

Now, to send you off with a little fun challenge, I want you to disprove the existence of something for me, beyond the shadow of any doubt. If you can't, then you must believe in it. Ready?

Off the top of my head… Ok, here goes:

I claim that there is an object somewhere that has the shape of a benzene ring, about 16 cm in diameter. This object is not made by mankind, and if you touch it while you think hard about three dozen bananas (really visualize them, three dozen, no more, no less), the ring object will instantly turn into a portal to a dimension where every human being is seen as their true selves: cells in a four dimensional fishlike cloud that can only experience the flow of time by being connected to a three dimensional pocket universe where its cells are allowed to travel linearly through the fourth spatial dimension and thus experience that as "time" and "life". The only passage through our pocket reality and the other true reality (the one with the fishlike cloud god) is through that benzene ring shaped object.

I claim this to be The Truth, now give me your best shot at disproving it to 100%! I'm ready. Ready to shoot all your scientific reasons down with sheer conviction and belief. For 2,000 years if I have to. Bring it on!

I suppose working within the same exact framework would make this impossible - but I could simply leverage that I don't believe in a noumenon, and that this object does not truly exist until it exists within the phenomenal world, shaped by subjective human perception - since the concept of causality is only applicable to something that can be experienced (as itself is experiencing causality) there isn't a solid justification to declare it exists. To be fair, though, from any more genuine standpoint it very well may exist, and you could just as easily say it is a phenomenal object that can be seen and felt etc and I probably wouldn't have it in me to argue.
Has anyone here been to papua new guinea? Can anyone prove it exists? Haha
Good thought experiment :)

 

[cosifantutti]

Religious people make me so mad. I just can't understand how they can say stuff like 'things happen for a reason' or that assisted suicide would be sinful. Oh yeah thank you so you think God wants me to suffer like this and be suicidal af for a reason? Which reason would that be? Only God should determine when you die wtf is this bullshit. I'm sorry if this is offensive for religious people but in my opionion it's complete bullshit.

If you've never suffered you can easily find meaning in all things religious. 'things happen for a reason ' is wonderful for those who don't suffer. And although most people face some difficulties in our society (I live in Scotland) life throws enough good for people to cope with the bad.

We're told that life is a gift from God but a gift has no obligation to it. Unfortunately in the absence of assisted dying many are forced to turn to unassisted dying. Few people have any idea of the suffering of so many people.

 

[hermestrimegistus]

i known for 100 percent certainty there is no

Turn it around. What if you had to believe in everything that cannot be disproven to exist? Point is, proving 100% that something does not exist is not possible (as I am willing to prove at the end of this post). So then you'd have to believe in Bigfoot, in Santa, in Shiiva, in Thor of Asgard and in every myth of creation ever presented to you, no matter how contradictory. Can you see how that would become a bit of a problem?

You would have to believe in every god of every religion known to mankind. Because they cannot be proven 100% not to exist either, and so again, with your infallible logic, "no one can really know."

Then you might respond "well ok, I meant only in the feasible god of course!" And there you have it. I do not find your god feasible. Not probable. Not likely. And for anything that I find so utterly unlikely, I need at least a tiny shred of evidence in the other bowl of the scale. And since the other bowl has been filled with nothing but blind faith for the last 2,000 years, I simply find no incitement to start believing in your god any more than in Hera or Atlas.

Remember this and do never forget it – if you are devoted to any religion and god, your stance on other gods is exactly the same as mine is on yours. In many ways, one could argue that, as a Christian, you have an atheistic view on other religions. And with your own logic, how is that possible?

How can you ever fully disprove the existence of Ganesha? And hey, Zeus! There is lightning and thunder to prove his existence! Well… Unless you believe in the scientific explanations of course, but then again, why would you cherry pick just that piece of science to trust?

Now, to send you off with a little fun challenge, I want you to disprove the existence of something for me, beyond the shadow of any doubt. If you can't, then you must believe in it. Ready?

Off the top of my head… Ok, here goes:

I claim that there is an object somewhere that has the shape of a benzene ring, about 16 cm in diameter. This object is not made by mankind, and if you touch it while you think hard about three dozen bananas (really visualize them, three dozen, no more, no less), the ring object will instantly turn into a portal to a dimension where every human being is seen as their true selves: cells in a four dimensional fishlike cloud that can only experience the flow of time by being connected to a three dimensional pocket universe where its cells are allowed to travel linearly through the fourth spatial dimension and thus experience that as "time" and "life". The only passage through our pocket reality and the other true reality (the one with the fishlike cloud god) is through that benzene ring shaped object.

I claim this to be The Truth, now give me your best shot at disproving it to 100%! I'm ready. Ready to shoot all your scientific reasons down with sheer conviction and belief. For 2,000 years if I have to. Bring it on!

I'm not christian. I don't believe in the biblical god. I'm merely asserting that science and empiricism is faith based as well. I don't think there's anything wrong with that at all and I applaud rationalists for being so steadfast in their beliefs. Most of the time theyre logical. Its just also dogma. And hypocritical to lump all religions together. Just like it would be to do that to atheists. I'm not trying to prove or disprove anything to you

 

[Minsu]

Religious people are sociopaths. They never considered the humane aspects of their views just to satisfy their imaginary friends.

Raised as a Muslim (but now an ex), suicide is considered to be a major sin. For what? I don't know. Same reason why I can't eat pork. I just can't because it's 'unholy' when scientifically speaking, though pork isn't the healthiest of option, it doesn't kill me to eat pork when prepared properly.

So I can't commit suicide because the Quran says that god is merciful. Sure, where is my mercy then? I am being tormented with bad luck and placed in a messy situation, and all the religious sociopaths have to say is "oh it's just a test from god". I'm not interested in taking these 'tests' that I have failed the 'test' so give me the good life I deserve, I don't care about these 'tests'.

True. Was is hard to ditch your religion?

 

[Worndown]

Not to be rude, but overly religeous people have stepped back from some realities. They detach themselves from some descisions and need for action. They live in a "happy place" that does not exist.
Most of life just happens. It can be harsh. That is where we live. Try to ignore them just as they ignore you.

 

[kilowatt]

I respect all religions as an atheist myself but I believe people choose to have faith in god and heaven just so they don't feel as much grief when their close ones die. I too have a really bad experience with overly religious parents. I can't even begin to explain the rage 14 year old me felt when my mom found out I self-harmed and asked why I didn't think about how big of a sin it is and I don't appreciate god's gift enough, wishing she raised more religious kids.
However, this debate doesn't have much of an answer as religion is simply one's faith and usually can't be changed with a few points proving them wrong.

 

[STTP]

Not to be rude, but overly religeous people have stepped back from some realities. They detach themselves from some descisions and need for action. They live in a "happy place" that does not exist.
Most of life just happens. It can be harsh. That is where we live. Try to ignore them just as they ignore you.

This is a central concept in Kierkegaard's work which I adore, the leap of faith. You can't believe in god through logic alone, there is a necessary "leap" away from reason to understanding that religion is something "beyond" or "above" logic, something unknowable. Any attempts to "disprove" religion can also not really approach the leap of faith, just like this. So a religious person would say, absolutely!

 

[hermestrimegistus]

Yeah, absence of belief in real Santa Claus is also a belief system. Attempts to put atheism in one line with religion are so entertaining.

Empiricism is still a belief system. And there are many religions. I'm not a bible thumping christian. There's just a certain level of irony hypocrisy and lack of self awareness when people claim "I know this is true" and their main reason for it is "because I just know it" and they do the same thing religious zealots do. Whats next, the old flying spaghetti monster argument? A lot of atheists seem to enjoy to act like evangelicals and are just as pious and holier than thou. It's astounding

 

[DeepCD]

I feel that ... at the end of the day; it's really based on the culture you were raised in. and as your future progresses in life, depending on your circumstances and how open-minded you are, as well as the influences & curiosities along the way would determine your final belief system.

but with the resources we have today as well as within the last 10 years give or take. if you dig deep enough and you are really open-minded and curious, you should come to realize that all religions are just made up fantasies which have been altered over time and is used as a scare, control, hope tactic, & etc.. (of course people like Buddha was a real person, as well as others like the Scientology creator, & etc..)

as archaeologists and scientists uncover more evidence that makes the 3 main religions more like copycats of Egyptian beliefs as well as others, I feel that the people in power are no doubt trying to cover it up as much as possible. especially during these times when people are struggling financially, emotionally, and etc.. (not as if it hasn't already been like that), but more churches/religion organizations are opening by the masses so that people can find more "hope" as well as feel like they are part of a "community".

of course I could go on, but just saying what's on the top of my head at the moment with my current thoughts/beliefs. but I believe the video that is attached to this message makes sense to me even though I'm not any kind of astrologist, scientist, or archaeologist, etc .. but it does make sense to me as an average educated person.

would like to know what others think about this very short and quick summary video. if you dig deeper there is more detailed information. I haven't traveled the world to look at a lot of these places myself, but I have seen pictures and videos online from what I feel is legitimate resources.

 

[Kay_Philosopher]

 

[lwlaiet8887]

Religion is dumb if you think about it critically. Religous people are either, sadists bumbling idiots/fanatics, they believe in something so illogical and or uncouth. All 4 are possible. I think fantacisim/culture is the default human state. It's basically a collection of traditions that are passed down and become sacred due to their usage/belief and help as act in community.

 

[Kay_Philosopher]

Empiricism is still a belief system. And there are many religions. I'm not a bible thumping christian. There's just a certain level of irony hypocrisy and lack of self awareness when people claim "I know this is true" and their main reason for it is "because I just know it" and they do the same thing religious zealots do. Whats next, the old flying spaghetti monster argument? A lot of atheists seem to enjoy to act like evangelicals and are just as pious and holier than thou. It's astounding

This is patently true given the gnu Atheist movement circles and contemporary Atheistic conventional "scientists" who frequent this same pastiche view.
I am looking at you "Darth Dawkins". These guys lack philosophical knowledge and metaphysics to even begin to make a cogent and comprehensive argument against the existence of God.

 

[WAITING TO DIE]

This - life stopped being worth living, and so the idea of suicide as a sin was necessary. The serfs must live, or work won't get done, and they realized their life was awful, cruel and disappointing. Christianity was both a comforting presence and a tool of oppression, as they were convinced suffering for 50 or so years on earth was just a price that needed to be paid, and it didn't matter because it's nothing compared to eternal bliss in heaven.

If you knew you would go to heaven if you killed yourself, there would be no reason not to escape your life as a serf. The church is crafty!!

Responding to the general topic, here: religion and its own theological implications gets really, really messy once you describe God as omnipotent.


I suppose working within the same exact framework would make this impossible - but I could simply leverage that I don't believe in a noumenon, and that this object does not truly exist until it exists within the phenomenal world, shaped by subjective human perception - since the concept of causality is only applicable to something that can be experienced (as itself is experiencing causality) there isn't a solid justification to declare it exists. To be fair, though, from any more genuine standpoint it very well may exist, and you could just as easily say it is a phenomenal object that can be seen and felt etc and I probably wouldn't have it in me to argue.
Has anyone here been to papua new guinea? Can anyone prove it exists? Haha
Good thought experiment :)

Well said, and true.