Discussion Philosophy of suicide?

[SpacexJunkie]

I understand that most people in this forum believe suicide is a good action? Does anyone who believes in this think there is any immoral ways to commit suicide? does anyone think there should be an age limit or mental capacity limit, atleast on encouraging suicide? or do you think it should be freely discussed and open to all? do you believe these types of forums encourage more suicide and sometimes can bring more sadness to ones life than if they never interacted with this site? Or do you think that sites such as this are necessary because these people are suffering in your opinion "too much" and will find the information somewhere else anyways? similar to how drug dealers say that drugs can't be eradicated they will only make them illegal and less accessible?

I am going to be going to bed soon so I will probably respond in the morning or if I wake up during the night.

 

[FuneralCry]

I don't understand the people who believe it's their place to decide if other people should have the right to cease existing or not, the reality is that nobody is obligated to continue suffering in this existence they were so cruelly burdened with in the first place.

To force life here in the first place and to wish to make existence into a prison where one cannot easily and peacefully escape on their own terms is what is immoral to me, it disgusts me how many humans see futile and unnecessary suffering as something to be prolonged at all costs even if the person wants to die.

If one wishes to continue existing they never should have any right to force their worship of this cruel and harmful existence onto other people.
Pro-life people are the only ones who create sadness with how they so cruelly try and prevent people from finding true peace from this torturous existence there was never a need for in the first place.

The right to die is a human right and the option to instantly and peacefully cease existing should always be there for all humans, I see it as the most important right having the option to permanently escape from this harmful burden that was forced onto us.

My view is that it's preferable to cease existing regardless of the circumstances, the only relief for me lies in permanently being free from the curse that is existence, I believe that existence is something that is best erased.

Sites like this are in absence of the lack of support for the right to die in this disgustingly anti-suicide society, and will always need to exist as long as people cannot easily die in peace.

Suicidal people deserve a place to vent and have their decisions respected without the interference of insensitive pro-lifers who are incapable of minding their own business. Not everyone even wants to exist and that will always be a valid way to feel.

 

[R_N]

Forcing people to live is no better than being accepting of suicide.

No one here is forcing others to die tho so it is not even comparable.

I personally don't feel good when others have/want to go through process of dying regardless if it is suicide or not. But I don't want to force others to do what I want them to. It is not my business to control other peoples lives.

 

[SpacexJunkie]

I don't understand the people who believe it's their place to decide if other people should have the right to cease existing or not, the reality is that nobody is obligated to continue suffering in this existence they were so cruelly burdened with in the first place.

To force life here in the first place and to wish to make existence into a prison where one cannot easily and peacefully escape on their own terms is what is immoral to me, it disgusts me how many humans see futile and unnecessary suffering as something to be prolonged at all costs even if the person wants to die.

If one wishes to continue existing they never should have any right to force their worship of this cruel and harmful existence onto other people.
Pro-life people are the only ones who create sadness with how they so cruelly try and prevent people from finding true peace from this torturous existence there was never a need for in the first place.

The right to die is a human right and the option to instantly and peacefully cease existing should always be there for all humans, I see it as the most important right having the option to permanently escape from this harmful burden that was forced onto us.

My view is that it's preferable to cease existing regardless of the circumstances, the only relief for me lies in permanently being free from the curse that is existence, I believe that existence is something that is best erased.

Sites like this are in absence of the lack of support for the right to die in this disgustingly anti-suicide society, and will always need to exist as long as people cannot easily die in peace.

Suicidal people deserve a place to vent and have their decisions respected without the interference of insensitive pro-lifers who are incapable of minding their own business. Not everyone even wants to exist and that will always be a valid way to feel.

I kinda agree to a certain extent, but I believe if you hate life to that degree of hatred, then why would you do things like bring more kids into this world? or even animals. if you deem existence itself as a bad thing, then why do these people deserve to make more humans and then just abandon them and make they're existence sadder? we can always play the blame game but if we are all here participating then aren't we just as bad as the person who started the issue for not trying to fix the mistake? atleast not bring more people into the world of "suffering"?

Forcing people to live is no better than being accepting of suicide.

No one here is forcing others to die tho so it is not even comparable.

I personally don't feel good when others have/want to go through process of dying regardless if it is suicide or not. But I don't want to force others to do what I want them to. It is not my business to control other peoples lives.

I agree, if someone is in hospice or similar, and clearly struggling to even exist, then thats when they need to be sent to the next life, but I do think it can get tricky especially when we live in a world where not everyone can say what they want, some just wont out of fear, other have an ego, and then other people literally are in coma's etc. and cant talk. what do you do with these people?

 

[AllCatsAreGrey]

When it comes to suicide I'm pro-choice. I wouldn't say that it's necessarily good. More so, the issue is that the individual has to come to their own decision what "good" is for them.

A big part of being able to make an informed choice is access to information. The fact is that a peaceful bus ticket is *very* hard to come by. This pushes people to ineffective and violent methods, increasing their suffering.

On a personal level, I have found that being here has greatly reduced my anxiety around suicide. Having attempted four times in my life it's a subject that's always in the back of my mind, but I've been unable to discuss it directly before SaSu. For me this has been helpful in forming my personal triggers for suicide, triggers that I feel are ethical. This has greatly reduced my fear of impulsively making the choice with little info. This site has been a big part of my recovery - more helpful than therapy has been in managing ideation.

 

[cosifantutti]

If people were allowed to choose when to go then suicide would give way to assissted dying. If this was part of our society then I think people would see it from a different angle. I'm not saying people would feel fine about someone dying but if a person chooses to die peacefully nobody would experience the dreadful trauma that is associated with suicide.

 

[SpacexJunkie]

When it comes to suicide I'm pro-choice. I wouldn't say that it's necessarily good. More so, the issue is that the individual has to come to their own decision what "good" is for them.

A big part of being able to make an informed choice is access to information. The fact is that a peaceful bus ticket is *very* hard to come by. This pushes people to ineffective and violent methods, increasing their suffering.

On a personal level, I have found that being here has greatly reduced my anxiety around suicide. Having attempted four times in my life it's a subject that's always in the back of my mind, but I've been unable to discuss it directly before SaSu. For me this has been helpful in forming my personal triggers for suicide, triggers that I feel are ethical. This has greatly reduced my fear of impulsively making the choice with little info. This site has been a big part of my recovery - more helpful than therapy has been in managing ideation.

I agree with this, I think it should be a choice, and we need some exceptions given the right context, I think we should be more open to these ideas, but I do think that there are things like mental capacity and age that play a role. most people idolize prominent figures of history, these people never would have been seen the way they are seen now if they had succumbed to depression etc, I guess im just optimistic hoping people can try to succeed the same way most in history were dealt shitty hands but eventually won somehow along the way.

If people were allowed to choose when to go then suicide would give way to assissted dying. If this was part of our society then I think people would see it from a different angle. I'm not saying people would feel fine about someone dying but if a person chooses to die peacefully nobody would experience the dreadful trauma that is associated with suicide.

I agree assisted suicide should be more common, and actually encouraged in some cases, specifically hospice type of situations where these people can't hardly exist without pain. however I think it's also everyone ultimate choice, but how do we let people like minors who can't make good decisions about what to eat or wear kill themselves, what about people with mental disabilities, etc. it just walks a fine line of indoctrination if you ask me.

 

[cosifantutti]

When it comes to suicide I'm pro-choice. I wouldn't say that it's necessarily good. More so, the issue is that the individual has to come to their own decision what "good" is for them.

A big part of being able to make an informed choice is access to information. The fact is that a peaceful bus ticket is *very* hard to come by. This pushes people to ineffective and violent methods, increasing their suffering.

On a personal level, I have found that being here has greatly reduced my anxiety around suicide. Having attempted four times in my life it's a subject that's always in the back of my mind, but I've been unable to discuss it directly before SaSu. For me this has been helpful in forming my personal triggers for suicide, triggers that I feel are ethical. This has greatly reduced my fear of impulsively making the choice with little info. This site has been a big part of my recovery - more helpful than therapy has been in managing ideation.

I find that being open about it here takes away some of the pressure. Until a few months ago I had an obsessive fear of suicide. Now I see it as something that I might do. I'm concerned about the pain and the effect on family but I don't see it as something terrible. I don't feel as much a victim as I did

 

[SpacexJunkie]

I find that being open about it here takes away some of the pressure. Until a few months ago I had an obsessive fear of suicide. Now I see it as something that I might do. I'm concerned about the pain and the effect on family but I don't see it as something terrible. I don't feel as much a victim as I did

I want everyone to feel as if they can come to me with any questions or thoughts, I think this place is neccessary aswell, I believe there should probably be restrictions, but there already are, there is an 18+ box on the website etc, I just think it should probably be regulated more so that people who are more vulnurable don't make life altering decision until they actually hit a maturity of seeing life for what it is, we floating on a rock in nothingness lmao, I just don't think kid's should see this type of stuff to be honest, I don't even know the conversation I would have with my nephews etc if they were on this site, but I mean im here so who am I to judge.

 

[derpyderpins]

I understand that most people in this forum believe suicide is a good action?

I don't think most people here are anti-life in that way. Suicide is an option that shouldn't be a forbidden topic. For me, personally, I think a large portion of suicides are "bad," being the category of "I'm normally fine and happy but this bad event happened and I'm unable to cope so I'm going to ctb." That's bad. However, I feel that if one is more like "I have been struggling a long time, tried many different treatments and strategies to improve my mental health/quality of life, none have worked, and there aren't any foreseeable changes that will alleviate my suffering," I believe suicide can be a valid consideration. I think for those people, it's likely better if they can have a painless suicide than try an unreliable method and end up alive but physically fucked up.

does anyone think there should be an age limit or mental capacity limit, atleast on encouraging suicide? or do you think it should be freely discussed and open to all?

I don't think there should be assisted suicide for those under the local age of consent. I discourage young people from committing suicide because they have large changes to go through both externally and internally, so they might as well experience that and make sure it's not better.

do you believe these types of forums encourage more suicide and sometimes can bring more sadness to ones life than if they never interacted with this site? Or do you think that sites such as this are necessary because these people are suffering in your opinion "too much" and will find the information somewhere else anyways? similar to how drug dealers say that drugs can't be eradicated they will only make them illegal and less accessible?

I'd have ctb if it weren't for the original /ss on reddit. What a forum like this does is give you honesty and true empathy.

To the suicidal, life is a negative. You have to be in a very, very bad place to actually want to kill yourself, and way way worse to actually overcome your survival instinct. It's not just the blues. It's not feeling kinda down. The goal of the suicidal is to end their suffering, and someone who comes to talk to them who has completely written off suicide and predetermined it to be off-limits and not an option is taking their only guaranteed path to alleviate suffering off the table. It's not a conversation. It's a lecture.

"I want to kill myself." "No you can't!" "Why?" "Suicide is never the answer." "Why?" "Because life has inherent value..." "My life has no goodness or value." "well, it could." "But it doesn't." "Things might get better." "Sure seems like they probably won't." "They will, I'm sure." "No you're not. You're not sure. You are lying. You don't know. For plenty of people it never gets better." "It's a permanent solution to a temporary problem." "...good? Who wants a temporary solution ever? (Also, you're speculating by calling it temporary. You don't know."

There's no connection. So, when I hung up with the suicide hotline after realizing they had nothing helpful at all to say and I bs'd and told them I was better yada yada, I went up to the roof to jump. My legs over the edge, 100+ foot drop to concrete, I posted to /ss. What I got wasn't "NoOoO doN'T you're a good person I care about you please noooooo!" I got "hey, I don't know you. I don't know what you're going through. I know this is a very hard decision. I hope it's the right one, and I'm rooting/praying for/thinking of you and wishing you the best possible outcome, whatever that may be." I was overwhelmed by the true, actual empathy, and although I was still miserable, I calmed down to a point where I couldn't beat the survival instinct anymore. THAT's the good of a forum like this where you can have an honest conversation without being shut down for actually saying what you're thinking.

 

[SpacexJunkie]

I don't think most people here are anti-life in that way. Suicide is an option that shouldn't be a forbidden topic. For me, personally, I think a large portion of suicides are "bad," being the category of "I'm normally fine and happy but this bad event happened and I'm unable to cope so I'm going to ctb." That's bad. However, I feel that if one is more like "I have been struggling a long time, tried many different treatments and strategies to improve my mental health/quality of life, none have worked, and there aren't any foreseeable changes that will alleviate my suffering," I believe suicide can be a valid consideration. I think for those people, it's likely better if they can have a painless suicide than try an unreliable method and end up alive but physically fucked up.




I don't think there should be assisted suicide for those under the local age of consent. I discourage young people from committing suicide because they have large changes to go through both externally and internally, so they might as well experience that and make sure it's not better.


I'd have ctb if it weren't for the original /ss on reddit. What a forum like this does is give you honesty and true empathy.

To the suicidal, life is a negative. You have to be in a very, very bad place to actually want to kill yourself, and way way worse to actually overcome your survival instinct. It's not just the blues. It's not feeling kinda down. The goal of the suicidal is to end their suffering, and someone who comes to talk to them who has completely written off suicide and predetermined it to be off-limits and not an option is taking their only guaranteed path to alleviate suffering off the table. It's not a conversation. It's a lecture.

"I want to kill myself." "No you can't!" "Why?" "Suicide is never the answer." "Why?" "Because life has inherent value..." "My life has no goodness or value." "well, it could." "But it doesn't." "Things might get better." "Sure seems like they probably won't." "They will, I'm sure." "No you're not. You're not sure. You are lying. You don't know. For plenty of people it never gets better." "It's a permanent solution to a temporary problem." "...good? Who wants a temporary solution ever? (Also, you're speculating by calling it temporary. You don't know."

There's no connection. So, when I hung up with the suicide hotline after realizing they had nothing helpful at all to say and I bs'd and told them I was better yada yada, I went up to the roof to jump. My legs over the edge, 100+ foot drop to concrete, I posted to /ss. What I got wasn't "NoOoO doN'T you're a good person I care about you please noooooo!" I got "hey, I don't know you. I don't know what you're going through. I know this is a very hard decision. I hope it's the right one, and I'm rooting/praying for/thinking of you and wishing you the best possible outcome, whatever that may be." I was overwhelmed by the true, actual empathy, and although I was still miserable, I calmed down to a point where I couldn't beat the survival instinct anymore. THAT's the good of a forum like this where you can have an honest conversation without being shut down for actually saying what you're thinking.

I agree with this sentiment, nobody should be jailed for words period. If you feel some way imo freedom of speech is a given, no matter what you say, however I do think that once you call to action or incite an attack, or start the attack yourself, you should be handled appropriately.

I very much agree that the people on this website will not necessarily judge you, as they are here for the same reasons, but they try to be more compassionate and understanding because they also deal with the same fears of being sent away, and having someone else further make it seem like your choices don't affect you, because they don't really give you a choice, it's forced rehab basically. I take the same stance with drugs, if someone wants to shoot up heroin, good for them, but I also believe everyone has a right to privacy which this site does the best, its private so whos gonna come after you, where irl you talk about these things your privacy can be invaded and basically conquered by law.

 

[CrazyDiamond04]

I understand that most people in this forum believe suicide is a good action? Does anyone who believes in this think there is any immoral ways to commit suicide? does anyone think there should be an age limit or mental capacity limit, atleast on encouraging suicide? or do you think it should be freely discussed and open to all? do you believe these types of forums encourage more suicide and sometimes can bring more sadness to ones life than if they never interacted with this site? Or do you think that sites such as this are necessary because these people are suffering in your opinion "too much" and will find the information somewhere else anyways? similar to how drug dealers say that drugs can't be eradicated they will only make them illegal and less accessible?

I am going to be going to bed soon so I will probably respond in the morning or if I wake up during the night.

I don't think suicide is ever a "good" action. It's an action that I think people should be allowed to take but I would consider it to be good. I think there are several immoral ways to commit suicide. Murder-suicides, mass-murder suicides, unnecessarily traumatizing people with your death, etc. I think the age limit for suicide should be whatever the age of majority is in the state/country that you live in. I also think that there needs to be safeguards for people who are extremely mentally handicapped or elderly to ensure that they aren't being taken advantage of. As for encouraging suicide, it's also kind of a grey zone. I generally agree that talking about suicide should fall under the context of free speech but this starts to get muddy when talking about encouraging certain populations who are more vulnerable. I think that it should be illegal to coerce somebody who is mentally handicapped into suicide. I don't believe that this forum really influences suicide in a significant way.

 

[sserafim]

I understand that most people in this forum believe suicide is a good action? Does anyone who believes in this think there is any immoral ways to commit suicide? does anyone think there should be an age limit or mental capacity limit, atleast on encouraging suicide? or do you think it should be freely discussed and open to all? do you believe these types of forums encourage more suicide and sometimes can bring more sadness to ones life than if they never interacted with this site? Or do you think that sites such as this are necessary because these people are suffering in your opinion "too much" and will find the information somewhere else anyways? similar to how drug dealers say that drugs can't be eradicated they will only make them illegal and less accessible?

I am going to be going to bed soon so I will probably respond in the morning or if I wake up during the night.

I don't think that suicide is moral or immoral. I also don't think that suicide is good or bad. Suicide just is. I think that suicide is an end to pain and suffering, as well as an escape from the problems and hardships endured in life. Suicide is an escape from life. The "good" part about suicide is that it allows an end to suffering, and I honestly don't see any "bad" things about it. Life is not a "gift" or "sacred". In fact, having to live is the main cause of suffering. If you never existed, you would never suffer. Living on despite your struggles does not make you more virtuous or "stronger" than someone who commited suicide. Sometimes it's wiser to just quit rather than fighting and continuing on.

I think that people should have the freedom to end their own lives, as they are the ones living it. No one else should interfere with or prevent peoples' right to die (as long as they're an adult). However, I do think that there should be an age limit to suicide. I think that once you're an adult (18+) you should have the freedom to commit suicide. After all, it's your own life.

 

[umopep!sdn128]

Personally, I think that suicide is a brave and reasonable act, because it aims to end suffering, which is quite logical. You should not impose thoughts of suicide on those who want to live, but you cannot force a person to get rid of thoughts of suicide. I do not consider suicide or any of its methods immoral, even if they may harm some people who do not want to commit suicide. This is a person's choice, in the end, and his right to manage his life in such a way, for which no one should condemn him. Regarding age, this is a difficult question. Thoughts of suicide can probably occur at any age, but I still believe that the legal age to commit suicide should be 18 years old. This doesn't mean you can't try sooner. It's just that if you can still try to explain something to the child, ask him to think about his intention, then the adult is already fully responsible for his actions and most likely the decision to commit suicide did not arise out of nowhere. I'm glad this site exists. It does not encourage you to commit suicide, but here you can freely talk about suicide, which in ordinary society is considered something reprehensible. But suicide as a phenomenon has always been and is, so we cannot pretend that it does not exist. People (adults) should have every right to a painless and reliable suicide, since no one should be forced to suffer, it is against morality.
I hope I answered all questions in sufficient detail.

 

[Blue Elephant]

"I want to kill myself." "No you can't!" "Why?" "Suicide is never the answer." "Why?" "Because life has inherent value..." "My life has no goodness or value." "well, it could." "But it doesn't." "Things might get better." "Sure seems like they probably won't." "They will, I'm sure." "No you're not. You're not sure. You are lying. You don't know. For plenty of people it never gets better." "It's a permanent solution to a temporary problem." "...good? Who wants a temporary solution ever? (Also, you're speculating by calling it temporary. You don't know."

Wow! You can see indoctrination when there is a total lack of intelligence and empathy. You can see intelligence, you can see logic and understanding in one side of the conversation and you can see stupidity and copy/pasted answers in the other side. These people are not there to help us, they are there to create more pain. Incredible!

Thank you @derpyderpins for sharing this with us!

I was overwhelmed by the true, actual empathy, and although I was still miserable, I calmed down to a point where I couldn't beat the survival instinct anymore. THAT's the good of a forum like this where you can have an honest conversation without being shut down for actually saying what you're thinking.

I am overwhelmed as well by the empathy, the understanding and the knowledge that people on this website have. I'm happy to be here! I will still CTB (I see it as a logical and natural thing to do) but for now I'm happy that I'm spending quality time having good conversations with smart people. You don't find many of these in the world.

 

[fishlover]

i dont think there should be morality or ethics tied to suicide. no matter who you are, your age or whatever else, if you want to die then you should be able to. your life is the one thing you truly own- if youre not happy with it then you should have every right to do with it as you please. dying is a human right.