NYT story megathread

[lostundead]

I've never once seen it happen here. Which doesn't mean it never has of course. But got any proof? Even a memory of what exactly you've seen said that you'd consider encouragement?

I haven't seen any active encouragement either but you don't have to look far to find examples of someone shaming someone else because they didnt go through with their announced suicide.

 

[D&D]

This will probably piss some people off, but it's the truth.

I feel like the article made some good points. Especially the part about encouraging people. No one should ever be encouraged to take their life.
I've been here for a couple years now, and while it doesn't happen often, it has happened and the mods need to step up and do a better job at getting rid of those users who do. It makes us all look bad.

It's one thing to share information with people on how to obtain drugs needed for a peaceful exit, but it's another thing entirely to encourage them to go through with it and I feel like some users here don't understand that at all.

WITH THAT SAID I've also seen a lot of users on here tell people to not do anything impulsively and to carefully think before acting.

What you said does not piss me off. Sure, they are some good points in the article. And you, as anyone else, is of course free to say it.

What piss me off is that a paper such as NYT publishes a poorly researched, one-sided peace, despite almost endless resources at their disposal! That is what pisses me off!

 

[WrongPlaceWrongTime]

What piss me off is that a paper such as NYT publishes a poorly researched, one-sided peace, despite almost endless resources at their disposal! That is what pisses me off!

As if MSM would ever listen to our side without adding their own spin to it.

 

[Flippy]

if it wasn't for this site I would've taken a paracetamol overose lol

Well if nothing else, that's one good reason for SS to exist! That could have been horrible :-0

 

[deflationary]

I haven't seen any active encouragement either but you don't have to look far to find examples of someone shaming someone else because they didnt go through with their announced suicide.

Really? Never seen that either.

 

[D&D]

As if MSM would ever listen to our side without adding their own spin to it.

We shall see about that!

 

[Itsallover123]

Interest is already dying down… this feels very representative of how people "care" about those in need. They hear about it and are shocked and sad for a while and then they move on, forgetting they ever knew about this. They offer no real support or answers despite how "outraged" they are because in reality: they don't care about the people. They care about the symbolism, how this site goes against their brainwashed beliefs.

 

[Flippy]

Really? Never seen that either.

There have been some members who were coming close to shaming others saying they aren't serious because they haven't "done it yet". As far as I remember the response was quite overwhelmingly negative towards them saying this. I don't want to dig up that particular thread as the person who posted it received enough flack for it and I don't want to stir things up again.

 

[Itsallover123]

There have been some members who were coming close to shaming others saying they aren't serious because they haven't "done it yet". As far as I remember the response was quite overwhelmingly negative towards them saying this. I don't want to dig up that particular thread as the person who posted it received enough flack for it and I don't want to stir things up again.

I know exactly who you're talking about. They said they would do it yesterday so I looked up their thread today but couldn't find it. I believe they didn't go through with it and deleted their account lol. People like that are always projecting their own insecurities. One of their early posts was about how scared they were to do it. How ironic.

 

[Flippy]

I know exactly who you're talking about. They said they would do it yesterday so I looked up their thread today but couldn't find it. I believe they didn't go through with it and deleted their account lol. People like that are always projecting their own insecurities. One of their early posts was about how scared they were to do it. How ironic.

I think we are perhaps talking about the same one, but there was another a while back along similar lines and the response was the same. I kinda rolled them into one to be vague enough to prevent any further "shots" being fired. While I disagree with what they said very strongly. I try to keep in mind that they are still probably a damaged human being and don't want them to feel worse, potential perpetuating the cycle so to speak.

 

[Chinaski]

Really? Never seen that either.

One thing which happens quite regularly is the "goodbye thread turning into research" manoeuvre, whilst it may not be outwardly encouraging folk to ctb it is certainly not a good look for this site when the response to death consists of "what does it taste like, does it hurt, have you turned blue" etc.

I will also state, and I've got to be careful how l put this, that l understand *why* people would want this place shut down, and l understand *why* grieving relatives feel the need to put the blame somewhere, and l feel it also does us little good as a community when the response to this negative publicity is "fuck you pro life scum", or some meandering furious essay or YouTube clip to that effect. We need to be a bit more mature about how we treat suicide and how it affects not just us but others too. It is possible to do this whilst still maintaining that it is the choice of the individual as to whether they choose to die, or indeed to live imo.

Finally, the points in the article re the predator in Scotland are sadly facts, they are real life events which happened to people from this site. It's truly stomach-churning stuff and it was frankly difficult to read and digest, whilst this kind of thing can happen on any website, for example a dating app or whatever, the facts remain that these events happened via this site and are going to be reported on in this way. This is also going to motivate people to want this place shut down and we'll have to accept why they feel that way.

 

[Callie Arcale]

If half of the money and energy put into such and similar self-exonerating propaganda is used to understand the real issues

You hit the nail on the head. If only…

 

[Chinaski]

As an addendum to my above post it appears the predator pleaded guilty to charges relating to the above last week; it's probably fair to assume that his arrest was the instigator for this piece and publication was delayed until pleas, in order to not prejudice any trial. It's therefore safe to assume these people have been monitoring this website for many months, so imo be careful who you befriend.

 

[Flippy]

As an addendum to my above post it appears the predator pleaded guilty to charges relating to the above last week; it's probably fair to assume that his arrest was the instigator for this piece and publication was delayed until pleas, in order to not prejudice any trial. It's therefore safe to assume these people have been monitoring this website for many months, so imo be careful who you befriend.

Quite possible, maybe probable :-/

 

[avoid_slow_death]

Can't access the article myself. Wants ne to subscribe and no. I certainly don't want to give them a damn penny if they simply want to sensationalize this site into something it certainly is not.

From what I have gathered thus far, it seems a former member basically painted a picture of the site as a cult with head admin as leader. This idea is obviously far from the truth and is simply a way to ostracize further people whom have already been cast aside by society for not conforming to the shallow and destructive social norms that are the reason a vast majority of us came here in the first damn place.

None of this is helpful to people in our situation at all. In fact, it multiplies the problems we face by endangering a precious and resourceful community that helps many of us. So what's the message here? Conforming? Suffering? Bury yourself in meaningless pursuits that simply exabberate societal problems by ignoring them? How is this helpful in any way?

 

[intheweeds]

I will also state, and I've got to be careful how l put this, that l understand *why* people would want this place shut down, and l understand *why* grieving relatives feel the need to put the blame somewhere, and l feel it also does us little good as a community when the response to this negative publicity is "fuck you pro life scum", or some meandering furious essay or YouTube clip to that effect. We need to be a bit more mature about how we treat suicide and how it affects not just us but others too. It is possible to do this whilst still maintaining that it is the choice of the individual as to whether they choose to die, or indeed to live imo.

Well said. Also don't forget about the time some users of the forum terrorized a grieving family: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/were-on-the-news.33224/post-613637 and I even mentioned back then that maybe the mods should do something: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/were-on-the-news.33224/post-613649

I love this forum, and this place has been a safe haven for me to vent and talk about some dark thoughts that I otherwise would be left alone with, but, again, the mods need to do a better a job.

 

[Catloaf]

This place is the only thing that keeps me sane.

 

[LastLoveLetter]

"For many people, suicidal thoughts will eventually pass, experts say. Treatment and detailed plans to keep safe can help. But clinicians and researchers warn that people are much more likely to attempt suicide if they learn about methods and become convinced that it's the right thing to do. The suicide site facilitates both."

As with many articles that discuss suicide, the New York Times once again perpetuates the perspective that suicide is "a permanent solution to a temporary problem." The media constantly clings to the conclusion that suicidality is an ephemeral absurdity regardless of the circumstances. Those who desire death are deemed ill, illogical, impulsive or incapable, rather than autonomous adults with the capacity to make their own choices.

An uncomfortable truth is that chronic suicidality exists - it is not always a fleeting bout of despair that will dissipate with time. I have been suicidal since the age of four. I'm thirty now. I have tried many different treatments, both medication and therapy. Nothing has helped. Both have been focused on symptom reduction, not on the complex causes that underpin my desire to die. Trauma-informed interventions are also woefully insufficient, rife with gaslighting, platitudes and victim-blaming.

There are those who can recover and overcome their suicidality. I do not dispute that. But it is ignorant and shortsighted to suggest that this is true for everyone, that we are all just vulnerable people without mental capacity who merely need to hold on for that elusive "light at the end of the tunnel." I have read many, many stories on this forum of those who have tried talking therapies and other treatment options, to no avail. What are we expected to do? Just hold on and live because society dictates we should? Call a helpline to hear another "suicide prevention" script that we have all heard a million times? Kill ourselves quietly on our own so that others aren't made to feel uncomfortable?

I'll tell you what has helped me immensely: This site. I am alive because of SS. I am alive because I have acquired the means to die on my own terms when I feel ready, which is a huge weight lifted. I am alive because this is the only place where I have encountered like-minded individuals with similar stories and circumstances. I am alive because I feel accepted and supported. I have been listened to and understood without being bombarded with platitudes or institutionalised against my will. I have had my autonomy and choices validated, no matter what I decide to do with my life. I have made friends and built meaningful connections with some members here, people I am very grateful to know.

I am alive because my life circumstances have begun to improve. However, had I never found SS, I wouldn't have lived long enough to see these improvements. I would have thrown myself in front of a train like I had originally planned, and either died or survived with horrific, permanent injuries. I am so glad now that I didn't resort to this. But crucially, no-one should have to do that. No-one deserves to live a life of suffering in secrecy, resorting to frightening, painful and unreliable methods to end their struggles. Every autonomous adult capable of making an informed choice should be able to access peaceful, reliable methods. Voluntary euthanasia should be a fundamental human right so that we can all die on our own terms. That would make websites like this obsolete, but evidently the anti-choice MSM aren't prepared to acknowledge that.

Does this mean I am no longer suicidal and will lead a long life? No. I am still suicidal and there is still a high likelihood that I will eventually die by my own hand. My illnesses are incurable and I would still rather die on my own terms when I feel the time is right, rather than deteriorate for decades. My life has certainly been extended somewhat, and I hope I can have some good memories before I go, but I ultimately still want to decide how and when I die. Why is that so unacceptable? We are all thrust into an existence none of us ever asked for, so why can't we decide when we want it to be over? Why must society be so focused on quantity of life over quality? I would much prefer to have a couple of happy years than to suffer in pain for decades and die from circumstances beyond my control.

Instead of suicide being a dirty secret, here we can have an open, nuanced dialogue about dignity in death, something that is glaringly absent in the MSM and society. We deserve to be heard, listened to and understood, not conveniently swept under the carpet and censored. I think this is the only platform I have actually felt listened to without an anti-choice rhetoric being shoved down my throat.

People who come here join of their own volition. No-one is forced to be here. A more pressing issue than the forum is why those who have passed felt the need to access SS to begin with and what contributed to their suicidality, and what can be changed so that people are not brought to this point in the first place. I empathise with those who are grieving for their loved ones and I understand why they are angry and need someone or something to blame, but further censorship, demonisation of the members here and adding more stigma to an already taboo topic is not the answer.

Until dignity in dying is a human right around the world and the underlying causes of suicide are adequately addressed (gaps in provisions of health services and improving care quality, affordable housing, healthcare and food, community support, listening to people and providing practical support, better abuse prevention initiatives, addressing discrimination of marginalised groups and much, much more), there will always be a place for platforms where these issues can be discussed candidly and without stigma. With suicide being actively censored on many popular social media platforms, communities like SS are desperately needed. It's an important space and for some of us, the only space we have.

 

[Silenos]

Gonna kill myself for the memes. Thanks for the exposure NYT.

 

[Flippy]

"For many people, suicidal thoughts will eventually pass, experts say. Treatment and detailed plans to keep safe can help. But clinicians and researchers warn that people are much more likely to attempt suicide if they learn about methods and become convinced that it's the right thing to do. The suicide site facilitates both."

As with many articles that discuss suicide, the New York Times once again perpetuates the perspective that suicide is "a permanent solution to a temporary problem." The media constantly clings to the conclusion that suicidality is an ephemeral absurdity regardless of the circumstances. Those who desire death are deemed ill, illogical, impulsive or incapable, rather than autonomous adults with the capacity to make their own choices.

An uncomfortable truth is that chronic suicidality exists - it is not always a fleeting bout of despair that will dissipate with time. I have been suicidal since the age of four. I'm thirty now. I have tried many different treatments, both medication and therapy. Nothing has helped. Both have been focused on symptom reduction, not on the complex causes that underpin my desire to die. Trauma-informed interventions are also woefully insufficient, rife with gaslighting, platitudes and victim-blaming.

There are those who can recover and overcome their suicidality. I do not dispute that. But it is ignorant and shortsighted to suggest that this is true for everyone, that we are all just vulnerable people without mental capacity who merely need to hold on for that elusive "light at the end of the tunnel." I have read many, many stories on this forum of those who have tried talking therapies and other treatment options, to no avail. What are we expected to do? Just hold on and live because society dictates we should? Call a helpline to hear another "suicide prevention" script that we have all heard a million times? Kill ourselves quietly on our own so that others aren't made to feel uncomfortable?

I'll tell you what has helped me immensely: This site. I am alive because of SS. I am alive because I have acquired the means to die on my own terms when I feel ready, which is a huge weight lifted. I am alive because this is the only place where I have encountered like-minded individuals with similar stories and circumstances. I am alive because I feel accepted and supported. I have been listened to and understood without being bombarded with platitudes or institutionalised against my will. I have had my autonomy and choices validated, no matter what I decide to do with my life. I have made friends and built meaningful connections with some members here, people I am very grateful to know.

I am alive because my life circumstances have begun to improve. However, had I never found SS, I wouldn't have lived long enough to see these improvements. I would have thrown myself in front of a train like I had originally planned, and either died or survived with horrific, permanent injuries. I am so glad now that I didn't resort to this. But crucially, no-one should have to do that. No-one deserves to live a life of suffering in secrecy, resorting to frightening, painful and unreliable methods to end their struggles. Every autonomous adult capable of making an informed choice should be able to access peaceful, reliable methods. Voluntary euthanasia should be a fundamental human right so that we can all die on our own terms. That would make websites like this obsolete, but evidently the anti-choice MSM aren't prepared to acknowledge that.

Does this mean I am no longer suicidal and will lead a long life? No. I am still suicidal and there is still a high likelihood that I will eventually die by my own hand. My illnesses are incurable and I would still rather die on my own terms when I feel the time is right, rather than deteriorate for decades. My life has certainly been extended somewhat, and I hope I can have some good memories before I go, but I ultimately still want to decide how and when I die. Why is that so unacceptable? We are all thrust into an existence none of us ever asked for, so why can't we decide when we want it to be over? Why must society be so focused on quantity of life over quality? I would much prefer to have a couple of happy years than to suffer in pain for decades and die from circumstances beyond my control.

Instead of suicide being a dirty secret, here we can have an open, nuanced dialogue about dignity in death, something that is glaringly absent in the MSM and society. We deserve to be heard, listened to and understood, not conveniently swept under the carpet and censored. I think this is the only platform I have actually felt listened to without an anti-choice rhetoric being shoved down my throat.

People who come here join of their own volition. No-one is forced to be here. A more pressing issue than the forum is why those who have passed felt the need to access SS to begin with and what contributed to their suicidality, and what can be changed so that people are not brought to this point in the first place. I empathise with those who are grieving for their loved ones and I understand why they are angry and need someone or something to blame, but further censorship, demonisation of the members here and adding more stigma to an already taboo topic is not the answer.

Until dignity in dying is a human right around the world and the underlying causes of suicide are adequately addressed (gaps in provisions of health services and improving care quality, affordable housing, healthcare and food, community support, listening to people and providing practical support, better abuse prevention initiatives, addressing discrimination of marginalised groups and much, much more), there will always be a place for platforms where these issues can be discussed candidly and without stigma. With suicide being actively censored on many popular social media platforms, communities like SS are desperately needed. It's an important space and for some of us, the only space we have.

Brilliant! NYT take note! This is real writing!

 

[Chinaski]

Well said. Also don't forget about the time some users of the forum terrorized a grieving family: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/were-on-the-news.33224/post-613637 and I even mentioned back then that maybe the mods should do something: https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/were-on-the-news.33224/post-613649

I love this forum, and this place has been a safe haven for me to vent and talk about some dark thoughts that I otherwise would be left alone with, but, again, the mods need to do a better a job.

Jesus. I wasn't around when that took place but going by their posts in that thread, the "jean4" character strikes me as exactly the kind of person that can be damaging to a forum like this one - this is the nature of such a forum, it doesn't just attract the desperate and helpless but the voyeuristic, the exploitative, the predatory types too and l think a lot of public focus is on the conduct of the latter types rather than the former.

 

[Flippy]

Jesus. I wasn't around when that took place but going by their posts in that thread, the "jean4" character strikes me as exactly the kind of person that can be damaging to a forum like this one - this is the nature of such a forum, it doesn't just attract the desperate and helpless but the voyeuristic, the exploitative, the predatory types too and l think a lot of public focus is on the conduct of the latter types rather than the former.

I'm not exactly sure of the circumstances, but jean4 seemed to be unceremoniously booted from the forum.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

Hello journalists.

Speaking as an incel myself and not for the rest of the site or anyone else, I say you should let me have the chance to kill myself peacefully and quietly instead of forcing me to fruitlessly attempt to fix all my flaws. Maybe then there wouldn't be so many other people who identify as an incel making it other peoples' problems. This is not a threat, merely a hypothesis.

Let me say it again another way: if society isn't going to tolerate incels or any other types of misfits then fine. Just don't take away the very things that would make it easier for us to get out of your hair. I mean wouldn't it be nice if anyone who had committed such terrible acts in the name of their own loneliness had simply ended it all without wrecking any other innocent lives? You already think that even people like that who stay alive and don't bother anyone are better off dead so why not let them have the required access to resources that make it easier for themselves?

Using the fierce boogeymen of incels to degrade this website is always ironic to me since I think many can agree that things would be so much better if some incels had just ended their own lives quietly before harming innocents. For many of us, we're so entrenched in our mindsets that there's no going back anyway. There's no way out. No amount of intervention will truly make this problem go away while we are living so just let us do the right thing and remove ourselves from society singlehandedly. I can guarantee that we're better off dead even for the few who might grieve us, think of the many more who are grieving over the innocent lives lost to senseless acts of desperate loners with nothing else going for them.

Sincerely,

A piece of shit who needs to die

 

[WrongPlaceWrongTime]

NYT article is worrisome. NYT is basically making me advance CTB date before SS is shut down.

Is SS existence at risk?

If by any chance SS is shut down in current form and SS twitter account is shut down too, how do we reach @Marquis and other admins for any possible alternatives they might create for SS ?

They should send you any information on backups to your email, if you have news/update emails enabled

 

[Rayzieka]

I feel infuriated...
I and I'm sure many other people need this forum. Not to ctb but to at least finally not feel alone.
I'd never seen genuine support in my life until I found this forum...
I honestly can't imagine what I'd do now without the ability to read the posts from everyone here and actually relate and empathize.
It feels like they think everyone here wants each other to die.. That's literally the farthest thing from what I've experienced and seen here.
The people here just have the understanding and ability to support each other that no other place I've seen have. Genuine advice and real sympathy.
I know its a touchy topic but I wish people would open their minds.. Even when it comes to people's right to do what they want with their own lives.

 

[healthrecovery]

The view rate is diminishing already..sanctioned suicide had its short moment of fame. Of course all these people were under the illusion that everyone here wants to kill themselfs..they want to eat popcorn and see people jump off bridges "look at that bro". They probably envisioned snuff movie style executions and grotesque bloody stories about it

 

[existtosuffer]

If you have a problem with this website, then your real problem lies within Mental Health services.

None of us chose to inherit mental illnesses, and we're usually the ones who get ignored when awareness for mental health is discussed.

Until you find actual cures for these problems, then suicide will always be the next best thing, because it's a permanent solution to a permanent problem.

 

[PeacefulTonic]

how many guests did we get on one average day? never bothered to check before

Somewhere around 150-300 on average depending on the time of day

 

[Elegy]

Far as I got. However I may consider further advancing, if NYT is willing to interview Me. Hear my sad story.
Share my woes with the world.

You know who is willing to interview a crazy guy like me?
Documentary filmmaker, Susan Smiley is who.

I called her when I was living in the woods, hallucinating, and her producer did want to meet, to discuss schizophrenia, homelessness, and other topics.
Susan's documentary, titled "Out of the Shadow", touched me profoundly.
I did not follow through on that interview, because, I did not want to be the poster child for insanity and poverty.
Anyway if you get the chance, it's a really good and sad heartbreaking docu. 'Out of the Shadow' by Susan Smiley

 

[Crazy4u]

The article is not very accurate. Suicidal thoughts are not temporary or short term. Suicidal people can have these thoughts for a long time