Nowhere is free from pro lifers, not even this website

[FuneralCry]

It seems as though in a world like this it is hard to escape from the pro life ideas that there is something positive about being alive and that life has some value and purpose and should be always lived. The fact that so many people deny the reality of this existence and do not accept how horrible life really is, is why we are trapped here and why euthanasia is not legal.

The idea of hope and that life will improve is a delusion, all humans have to look forward to is getting old and basically deteriorating until they eventually die. In this society, suicide is seen as irrational and thoughts of suicide are seen something that needs help and treatment when in reality wanting suicide can be perfectly rational, it is all that makes sense for me.
There is no cure or treatment for seeing what life really is, that it is a horrible, torturous experience.

Suffering has no point or purpose. What is the point to suffering just to die anyway. Life is unpredictable and uncertain and things could get worse at anytime. Our bodies can torture us with health problems and anyone could end up in the worst pain possible. Denying methods is so cruel. Death should be accepted in society and seen as a wonderful thing, it is freedom from everything that is wrong with life. It takes away all problems and prevents future suffering.

Sometimes even this website feels no different, it often feels pointless, it is just complicated suicide information that reminds me of how difficult suicide is and you read about people struggling to ctb, who are suffering so much being confused by this website with all the acronyms. Nobody should even have to research suicide on the internet in the first place, death should come easily and peacefully.

Even this website is not free from pro lifers, as well as other examples, there are those who want to 'gatekeep' suicide (only a certain age and amount of suffering) and those who push the idea that 'there is hope if you are young' 'things will get better' which can be invalidating and does not reflect the unpredictable and uncertain reality of existence. I have wanted to die for such a long time and yet things have only gotten worse. 21 years of existing is certainly more than enough for me, yet the fact that this life could continue for many more decades is horrifying. There is no peace or relief anywhere in a life like this and nowhere I belong apart from death. If only eternal sleep would come. Words cannot often describe my dislike of living.

 

[Mr2005]

You've got to have balance. All agreeing a meteor should hit the earth isn't very constructive.

 

[lights_are_on]

You are right, everyones different here. I feel I have beliefs too fucked up even for this place, lol. Everyone arrives at the decision to ctb in their ways so it makes sense, yknow. I have plenty of suicidal friends irl who think life's good in general, just that it isn't good for/to them. Whereas I just think life's shit objectively, less shit for this person, more shit for that person, the baseline is shit anyway. So why bother. I certainly won't

 

[Doombox]

To be honest I have wondered if the insistence of meto isn't just a way to complicate SN as a method so that people are less likely to impulsively take SN. I have no idea why a dopamine-receptor antagonist AE "works best" with SN. How convenient that it's also the hardest AE for many of us to obtain, leaving us stuck. Meanwhile it seems like a lot of people vomit anyway even after taking meto, so who knows? It's all so stupidly complicated.

 

[Rapière]

Having a positive or neutral outlook on life as whole and being suicidal aren't mutually exclusive. This isn't an Antinatalism or Promortalism forum, so I'm afraid you'll just have to deal with the presence of opposing worldviews.

Also, it's funny how you are redefining the term 'pro-lifer'. To my knowledge it was always used to describe people who want to force individuals to stay alive against their will and ban peaceful methods, but now you are using it to describe basically everyone who doesn't wear the same nightmare-googles as you do.

 

[lights_are_on]

You've got to have balance. All agreeing a meteor should hit the earth isn't very constructive.

Why? Life itself isn't balanced. It's more on the shit side. its just the truth. You can't drop a bunch of happiness on people but you surely can drop a bunch of bombs and blow their limbs off. Wheres the balance in that. Cute cat btw.

To be honest I have wondered if the insistence of meto isn't just a way to complicate SN as a method so that people are less likely to impulsively take SN. I have no idea why a dopamine-receptor antagonist AE "works best" with SN. How convenient that it's also the hardest AE for many of us to obtain, leaving us stuck. Meanwhile it seems like a lot of people vomit anyway even after taking meto, so who knows? It's all so stupidly complicated.

I think you are replying to the wrong thread

 

[HopefulButPrepared]

I am just torn on this whole issue. I believe that there is a way to live that results in a good life, or makes a better life more likely, and I don't think people can dispute this - and the stories in the bible are trying to teach everyone how to live a better life - but sometimes life is truly fucked, and it can be subjective due to differing personality traits, differing physical and mental pain thresholds, and all sorts of other shit - I agree that it's up to the individual, but I think it can be objective as well as subjective if it's time to give up or not. Maybe there is someone out there who could fix my pain, and if they can, then it is definitely not time to give up, subjectively, but if I never meet them or learn of this magical solution, then it's time to go - if I stick around I could win the lotto in 2 months, which would change a lot - I could buy enough pain meds to last me another 30 years, never have to work again, buy a disabled friendly bungalow - but if I killed myself next week I'd never get to win the lotto - I'm just talking shit now, but yer know, it's complicated - something good could be about to happen, but you didn't stick around long enough to let it - I don't mean 'you', I just mean people in general

 

[Mr2005]

Why? Life itself isn't balanced. It's more on the shit side. its just the truth. You can't drop a bunch of happiness on people but you surely can drop a bunch of bombs and blow their limbs off. Wheres the balance in that. Cute cat btw.

I think you are replying to the wrong thread

Thanks. You can drop a bunch of cute cats. Balance restored

 

[Doombox]

I think you are replying to the wrong thread

I was agreeing with FuneralCry that suicide is overly complex.

 

[lights_are_on]

I was agreeing with FuneralCry that suicide is overly complex.

Ah, I see. There was just this thread I've been reading about a person who's afraid they'll throw up SN, so I thought you were replying to that

 

[Doombox]

Ah, I see. There was just this thread I've been reading about a person who's afraid they'll throw up SN, so I thought you were replying to that

I had a feeling my reply might be confusing, but I didn't have it in me to make it more clear.

 

[chloramine]

It's not fair yeah. Being forced to live because other people don't deem your suffering 'sufficient' or because they believe suicide is just outright wrong isn't right.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

I'm just curious, if you care to answer, what is your situation FC? Are you confined to a bed? Obviously, you don't have to share if you don't want to, and maybe you have in the past on some other thread, but finding it is difficult because of the number of postings you've made.

 

[Euthanza]

Having a positive or neutral outlook on life as whole and being suicidal aren't mutually exclusive. This isn't an Antinatalism or Promortalism forum, so I'm afraid you'll just have to deal with the presence of opposing worldviews.

Also, it's funny how you are redefining the term 'pro-lifer'. To my knowledge it was always used to describe people who want to force individuals to stay alive against their will and ban peaceful methods, but now you are using it to describe basically everyone who doesn't wear the same nightmare-googles as you do.

Later when my time of decision has come, I want to be 100% the people in the same room with me or near me are all pro-choice, it means they should accept my decision because it's the least thing they can do to respect my existence.

You don't want to be in a failed attempt just because anyone gatekeeping has different opinion with you, am I right?

No, it's not funny, it's a terrible fact that pro-choice movement can be manipulated by pro-lifers and semi-pro-lifers by masking themselves with their own 'good intention' that is actually pure gambling.

What about patient first? What about their opinion about their own life? We're not talking as professional medics who are about to decide which suffering worth to be helped the way it can be pleasure to the helper.

 

[Superdeterminist]

As soon as suffering exists, life becomes as worthless and unrespectable as trash.

 

[Darkover]

the bible are trying to teach everyone how to live a better life

god if thats your reference on how to live a better than life than we are doomed

 

[LastFlowers]

Having a positive or neutral outlook on life as whole and being suicidal aren't mutually exclusive. This isn't an Antinatalism or Promortalism forum, so I'm afraid you'll just have to deal with the presence of opposing worldviews.

Also, it's funny how you are redefining the term 'pro-lifer'. To my knowledge it was always used to describe people who want to force individuals to stay alive against their will and ban peaceful methods, but now you are using it to describe basically everyone who doesn't wear the same nightmare-googles as you do.

I imagine 'pro-life(r)' may have a few different meanings depending on context.
I'm pretty sure OP still subscribes to the meaning most commonly expressed on this site.

I don't think it's very fair to lump Antinatalism with Promortalism, the former comes down to reducing and/or eventually eliminating suffering and applying a negative value to the selfish gamble with a possibility of said suffering, it also still respects consent, which the latter may not.
Either way, these philosophies are certainly not foreign ideas to much of the community, and they're rather appropriate to be included in discussion.
Still, I didn't quite see where OP clarified that their expectation was for the community to be either of those two things…

"Nightmare goggles"?
Isn't that a cruel way of putting it?
It implies that OP decided to wear a filter over their eyes when in fact, they are simply suffering of no fault of their own, while shackled to a miserable existence they had no say in.
Perhaps those with "rose-tinted goggles" retain a privileged ignorance that harms OP and others all the more, and not only in the way of pushing up against the right to die.

 

[Rapière]

@LastFlowers
You're getting things twisted. I'm not the one selling my worldview as the absolute truth, and slapping labels onto everyone who disagrees, she is. In the first sentence she openly states that she regards everyone who sees value in life as a 'pro-lifer', therefore lumping them together with those who wish to take peaceful methods away from us.

I stand by what I said regarding "nightmare googles". If having to read a few paragraphs about how SN works or having to memorize a few acronyms gives you a mental breakdown, that's clearly an issue on your part.

 

[watchingthewheels]

Sometimes even this website feels no different, it often feels pointless, it is just complicated suicide information that reminds me of how difficult suicide is and you read about people struggling to ctb, who are suffering so much being confused by this website with all the acronyms. Nobody should even have to research suicide on the internet in the first place, death should come easily and peacefully.

Even this website is not free from pro lifers, as well as other examples, there are those who want to 'gatekeep' suicide (only a certain age and amount of suffering) and those who push the idea that 'there is hope if you are young' 'things will get better' which can be invalidating and does not reflect the unpredictable and uncertain reality of existence. I have wanted to die for such a long time and yet things have only gotten worse. 21 years of existing is certainly more than enough for me, yet the fact that this life could continue for many more decades is horrifying. There is no peace or relief anywhere in a life like this and nowhere I belong apart from death. If only eternal sleep would come. Words cannot often describe my dislike of living.

This should not be some sort of surprise; these expectations don't match up with the mission statement of the forum. (And there is a "Recovery" section, so of course you're going to get "pro lifers" among the mix, here.)

"Please understand that the information offered on this site is for educational purposes only, and provided only by other users like you. We do not encourage, promote, advise, suggest, or aid suicide in any way or form; we only provide a space to talk about it. Be responsible, know the laws of your country, follow the forum rules, and know that the way you use any information posted on the forum is fully and solely your responsibility.

"If you are in need of help, or want to help others recover from depressive or suicidal thoughts, we encourage you to take a look at our recovery subforum and crisis resources. Please understand that no one on the site is a therapist or doctor; seek professional help if you want medical advice. Furthermore, if you feel the site is not good for your mental health discontinue visiting it immediately, and if you so desire you can moreover disable your account should you have one."

https://sanctioned-suicide.net/threads/rules-and-faq.4/

 

[Ash’Girl]

I think we are all here because in one way or another, we are experiencing or have experienced the absence of hope. Hope that there is something worth holding on to, hope that the scales will tip so the balance leans more towards some semblance of happiness in this life / existence. I can't berate people for finding that hope, whatever it looks like to the individual, anymore than I can those of us who can't find it. We're all on our own journey to either find a way to live a life that holds meaning for us as individuals, or find a way to end a life that holds little / none.

There are so many many here that what a meaningful life looks like, what hope looks like, what comes after, if anything, and what the end looks like is going to be different for everyone. Someone else's absence of hope will never match mine. Someone else's reason to fight will never match mine. We are different people with different things that hurt us or hold meaning to us.

If someone can find their way to hope, I celebrate that and wish them happiness. If someone cannot, I empathise and wish them peace. But it is their journey and ultimately their choice.

Not really sure on the classification of "pro life". I believe in the right of choice. Whatever that choice is.

 

[FuneralCry]

I'm just curious, if you care to answer, what is your situation FC? Are you confined to a bed? Obviously, you don't have to share if you don't want to, and maybe you have in the past on some other thread, but finding it is difficult because of the number of postings you've made.

I think that it is quite vague what 'situation' means but I mention a lot that I am trapped in this world because suicide is difficult for me, for many reasons, so I feel like I have no choice but to endure this life. That is the only reason as to why I am still alive. I don't want to live at all obviously, and I never really have done. I am not meant for life at all and I could never possibly want to live. It would be impossible. Thankfully I am not confined to a bed, but when things do get worse for me in the future, then I will have to find a way to leave no matter what.

 

[MisFortunate]

To be honest I have wondered if the insistence of meto isn't just a way to complicate SN as a method so that people are less likely to impulsively take SN. I have no idea why a dopamine-receptor antagonist AE "works best" with SN. How convenient that it's also the hardest AE for many of us to obtain, leaving us stuck. Meanwhile it seems like a lot of people vomit anyway even after taking meto, so who knows? It's all so stupidly complicated.

For me it's fasting, benzos and my big bottle of SN, that's it. No other add-ons. CTB is already so difficult. I have to stop overthinking everything because it's physically and mentally exhausting. At some point I just have to trust the process.

 

[Doombox]

For me it's fasting, benzos and my big bottle of SN, that's it. No other add-ons. CTB is already so difficult. I have to stop overthinking everything because it's physically and mentally exhausting. At some point I just have to trust the process.

Yeah I have benzos too. I've collected all kinds of weird stuff like a little bottle of mouthwash to rinse the SN taste away. Who knows if that works.

 

[Mocon33]

Having a positive or neutral outlook on life as whole and being suicidal aren't mutually exclusive. This isn't an Antinatalism or Promortalism forum, so I'm afraid you'll just have to deal with the presence of opposing worldviews.

Also, it's funny how you are redefining the term 'pro-lifer'. To my knowledge it was always used to describe people who want to force individuals to stay alive against their will and ban peaceful methods, but now you are using it to describe basically everyone who doesn't wear the same nightmare-googles as you do.

This is the way I see it also. You can support everyone's right to ctb (unlike a pro-lifer) while also encouraging other solutions whenever possible.

 

[Zzzzz]

I agree about hope. I'd say it's a delusion 95% of the time. People have a tendency to hope things will turn out better than they often do. Hope is most likely an evolutionary construct that tricks our minds into believing things that are not true. No one can provide evidence that a predatory dog-eat-dog world is, in any way, good or benevolent as a whole. Therefore it really is more compassionate to never have been born. Whenever people bring up abortion I tell them that I wish my mother aborted me. It would have been infinitely more benevolent than the life I have experienced.

 

[Euthanza]

@LastFlowers
You're getting things twisted. I'm not the one selling my worldview as the absolute truth, and slapping labels onto everyone who disagrees, she is. In the first sentence she openly states that she regards everyone who sees value in life as a 'pro-lifer', therefore lumping them together with those who wish to take peaceful methods away from us.

I stand by what I said regarding "nightmare googles". If having to read a few paragraphs about how SN works or having to memorize a few acronyms gives you a mental breakdown, that's clearly an issue on your part.

No one here is selling worldview, it's just venting.
The age limitation and suffering requirement, is real problem within some existing systems, the most liberal ones has their own flaws and it's not wrong to address it.

What if it's not goggles? What if the nightmare is real fact in daily life that it brought you recurring dreams?
I notice you twisted goggles with googles, that's two different things. I wish these nightmare realities are as easy as turning off goggles, but you know it isn't; Look up "gore website", they aren't new to this life, it has been documented.

 

[locked*n*loaded]

I think that it is quite vague what 'situation' means but I mention a lot that I am trapped in this world because suicide is difficult for me, for many reasons, so I feel like I have no choice but to endure this life. That is the only reason as to why I am still alive. I don't want to live at all obviously, and I never really have done. I am not meant for life at all and I could never possibly want to live. It would be impossible. Thankfully I am not confined to a bed, but when things do get worse for me in the future, then I will have to find a way to leave no matter what.

Sorry about being too vague, but all I meant about "situation", which you partly answered, was if you are bed ridden, if you have other ailments keeping you physically from ctb, if you're held against your will somewhere. I understand that you don't want to live in this world, anymore. You are always very clear about that. Is part of the reason, or, maybe, even all of the reason(s) that suicide is difficult for you have anything to do with religion? Is it against your beliefs to take your own life?

 

[Rapière]

I notice you twisted goggles with googles, that's two different things

English isn't my first language.

. I wish these nightmare realities are as easy as turning off goggles, but you know it isn't; Look up "gore website", they aren't new to this life, it has been documented.

Trust me, I am well aware of life's merciless brutality, which is exactly why I don't spend all day whining about minor inconveniances like acronym usage.

The reason we are having this debate in the first place is because it's assumed all humans share one world, when in reality we all live in our own world of sensory input, with sometimes only a very tiny percentage of overlap. OP and others are generalazing their emotions way too much, as if everyone who doesn't feel the same way about "the world" is just delusional. Why should your feelings of hope- and purposelessness be more valid than someone else's feeling of hope and purpose?

 

[Euthanza]

Why should your feelings of hope- and purposelessness be more valid than someone else's feeling of hope and purpose?

Because we're talking about someone's end of life choices.

May be in other forum, your opinion or anyone else's opinions are all valid, but probably better not in this anonymous suicide forum -most of people I see venting in this forum are also seeking validation or understanding which is hardly to get among the general population. Invalidating some one's reasons and feelings toward her/his end of life choice is second to worst system after criminalization of euthanasia and assisted suicide.

 

[Chinaski]

Because we're talking about someone's end of life choices.

May be in other forum, your opinion or anyone else's opinions are all valid, but probably better not in this anonymous suicide forum -most of people I see venting in this forum are also seeking validation or understanding which is hardly to get among the general population. Invalidating some one's reasons and feelings toward her/his end of life choice is second to worst system after criminalization of euthanasia and assisted suicide.

I don't think anyone is doing these things, imo the criticism made of the contents of the OP is entirely valid, it's a position regularly stated and the enthusiasm for pointing at pretty much everything and calling it "pro life" and stating that not being suicidal is inherently delusional is an unserious position, it's not couched in any reality. The OP regularly draws lines between who is in and who is out of the club on this forum based on their own criteria and it's correct that this is pushed back against, the fact that we all experience suicidal impulse does not mean we share the same (often inane) philosophies.

I would also be more inclined to take this recurring theme a smidgen more seriously if it was a position the OP held consistently, the below post literally defends an actual *pro-life troll* and encourages their thread listing positive things about being alive, something which should normally fit their criteria for expulsion, so it's reasonable enough that threads claiming not being suicidal is delusional and this forum is rife with pro lifers are not going to get universal agreement, primarily because it's just froth and something even the op will veer from when it's considered advantageous.

Just ignore the trolls on here. Unfortunately sometimes there are people like that on here. There is nothing wrong with your thread and it is a good idea for the recovery section. You are doing great trying to help people. I hope that you are able to enjoy the things you listed.