Normies are dumb to critical thinking and logic, but not dumb to parroting platitudes and upholding status quo.

[TAW122]

This thread is partly based on my anecdotal and life experiences when it comes to interactions with normies and people in general. I know it sounds like an oxymoron that normies are dumb and are not dumb. What I'm referring to is how normies don't really care about the truth and/or logic, but instead just spews off whatever is popular or the status quo.

During my lifetime, I've experienced where normies are not dumb when it comes to knowing (even intuitively) what is appropriate and what is not. They definitely have enough common sense to understand basic logic, but (surprisingly!) they don't apply that when it comes to looking at the truth and/or examining their beliefs. This is particularly true when I have observed how most people respond and parse topics such as the right to die. It is as though they simply just ignore logic and/or anything that could challenge or even shatter their beliefs, thus they are being disingenuous. But they aren't really stupid in terms of IQ and ability to think! Look no further than many of the topics and threads on Reddit regarding the right to die (especially all the frustration and tedium that existentialgoof has to put up with), they certainly ignore logic and reasoning whenever it isn't convenient for them!

We know that normies aren't actually dumb in the IQ sense when it comes to many other topics and social issues as they will fervently defend it to the bitter end. Take societal issues about inequality, minority rights, womens' rights, and many more. Many of these advocates seek to defend whatever position they have to the bitter end, and even go as far as to try to use big brain logic to defend their position. This alone would be evidence that the normies are definitely capable of critical thinking and reasoning, even if they don't show it, but because the right to die is so repugnant towards them and also possibly shattering the status quo (and their narrative of life is always good, life is sacred), they would do just about everything, including ignoring logic and acting dumb to uphold their atavistic views! They suddenly just ignore (and don't care) about the truth!

I don't know if anyone else has experienced this before, but I certainly have it is quite frustrating to know that normies are capable of being logic and have critical thinking, but they selectively decide not to. Not because they are incapable of doing so, but because they want to cling onto validating their atavistic beliefs and are afraid that the truth will break their view or the status quo. I don't think this is necessarily a good thing because it halts societal progress towards making a world that is more tolerable as well as infringing upon the rights of those who don't fit the status quo. What do you all think? Does anyone have similar experiences with normies?

 

[xinino]

Normies are based with their ignorance superpowers.
I pretended to be an optimistic normie in blissful world, but I failed on the second day. I reckon that doomerism is inherently embedded in my soul.

 

[escape_from_hell]

I do not know the root cause but have experienced similar and can offer some thoughts on several forces that may be at play.

I agree that 'normies' are not dumb. The mind is however is a multi-layered thing and different domains may have strengths and weaknesses, such as some having strength in mathematics but having difficulty learning foreign languages or vice versa. However, I understand your observation that some are failing to apply obvious strength in logic to an area where it should directly translate (within the same domain), suddenly having blinders on. You mentioned disingenuousness, which is clearly part of it. It does run deeper. Why the blinders? My guess is that it is protection from the pain in actually going through the undeniable steps of logic in realizing and affirming such truths. It might seem they surely must know the truth given their faculties, but to understand anything the information must still be observed and processed to be realized and internalized.

They are at a fork in the road where one branch is a winding loop full of wonders and time to whistle and chat, but that loop keeps coming back to the same fork. That loops starts getting more and more boring, and we are all getting more and more tired as we keep marching down that promising lane despite knowing it leads only back to the fork. Yet, when they look down the other branch, they see unwelcoming, jagged, and hellish terrain leading straight to a cliff from which there is no return. They keep choosing the loop. To them, it is crazy to even view the other branch as a viable path. To us, it is loopy to keep choosing the loop.

There are also highly intelligent, perspicacious individuals incapable of decoding social interactions and performing suavely in social settings. Again, different faculties. But that social world and the ever-revered (why?) entity of culture processes information separately from the individual. Even the most socially clueless amongst us can sense the taboo pretty quickly. We sense it quickly because we can directly observe the difference in reception between spicy commentary and truly verboten thoughts. Keep in mind that different people will have different social circles with different thresholds in additional to the general public/lawful/country level of enforced culture. So fear is a factor and these social networks are complex. You can watch someone go on an unpopular tirade about some topic, maybe even something like a racist rant or a tear-down of a popular figure and suffer some consequences--maybe a scolding, shame on social media, loss of friends. So that will be a deterrent. However, watch someone say something like "I just can't take it anymore, I don't think I can go on living anymore" and watch an armada of emergency vehicles come up, cops barking orders at the person and tazing the shit out of them, cuffing them and hauling them to a hospital, they are imprisoned in a ward for days to weeks with dangerous people, force fed shit food and hardcore drugs the whole time, and their name is forever tarred they get a huge hospital bill and even certain rights might be taken away like gun rights in the USA. The normie is not gonna put forth even the most modest critical thinking toward such a treacherous path until they find themselves in exorbitant suffering on the daily for a long time, like many of us.

And one final factor I think may be at play. The high. The vibe. Keeping the party going. Now a drug fiend is not always a dumb person unable to do the basics. They are often aware they have a problem. But they must go through the slow spiral. They might even be aware that some self-justification is self-deception, like "you've earned it today, just one more hit" type of stuff. There are different levels at which one grapples with the problem and either quits, finds the miraculous healthy balance, or keeps spiraling. But some things just feel good, and that is its own undeniable reality. So, while the normie is able, they will keep sweeping the problem aside as long as they are still getting theirs, as long as they are still high as fuck. Why would they want to stop the party on the fourth drink several bumps in right as the molly is kicking in and a hot person is grinding all up on them? They know there might be a crash, but that is far in the back of their mind. Why would they decide, "you know, let's just get this over with now, turn the lights on, stop the music, give me the STD blisters and the hangover headache and feel like shit right now please." So, while they are able, they will keep the party going and I cannot blame them.

So, let's say they are having a fine meal at a fancy restaurant with a hot date and they are spending big bucks on it. Suddenly some trashy assholes show up with dogs and their dog takes a big shit on the floor next to the table. One of their worst enemies shows up with a hotter date and sits at the table next to them and starts talking smack and bullying them. A group of homeless people show up tableside smelling strongly of urine and vomit and beg them for money. While they have the means and power they won't be dealing with this problem. They'll head for a better restaurant, they'll pay a nice tip to the server to clean up the dog shit or ask the manager to escort the bully out and shoo the homeless away. They know homelessness is a big problem, a failure and shame of civil society, that they have enemies that mock them and are superior to them, that there are assholes who will not clean up their dog shit and leave it to be their problem. These are hard truths they know they cannot fix. But they cannot face them either. So they will keep the party going as long as the means is there. Sometime the money may run out, the hangover will set in, they themselves are homeless, they get their ass kicked by the bully, whatever the case...and even then? The mind is more at ease thinking things will get back to normal, thinking it's just a setback, it is worth enduring to triumph in the end.

Edit: When you start talking about right to die you are that homeless person at the fancy dinner table, you are that drug withdrawal, you are that dog shit, you are the hangover and STD blisters. Best you are out of sight out of mind. Better yet, out of mind = cannot possibly be real. Just look at how taboo the topic is--SaSu forums blocked in several countries, the search results censored--all without regard or half a fuck of consideration given to 'freedom of speech' and so on. The topic of not being tortured to the last possible second is nearly relegated to darknet crime status. I agree it is bizarre and frankly evil.

 

[GreenOctober]

When it comes to potentially reworking a system in place it makes people panic. But the current system was made by asking questions and thinking about answers in the first place.

 

[sserafim]

When it comes to potentially reworking a system in place it makes people panic. But the current system was made by asking questions and thinking about answers in the first place.

Wdym? I don't think that they thought the answers through, nor did they ask the right questions

 

[GreenOctober]

Wdym? I don't think that they thought the answers through, nor did they ask the right questions

They might've not thought very well… but any system that was made was made with purpose. They just didn't do it with a lot of compassion.

 

[TAW122]

Normies are based with their ignorance superpowers.
I pretended to be an optimistic normie in blissful world, but I failed on the second day. I reckon that doomerism is inherently embedded in my soul.

I think that there are quite a few people out there that do have perspectives of doom and pessimistic reality, especially the younger generation (like Gen Z and Gen Alpha or so, even some people who are millennials as well), so I don't think doomerish is as uncommon. However, with that said, I think as issues in our present day continue to worse, there may even come a point where normies can no longer ignore the truth and/or blindly cope by sweeping things under the rug. Reality will rear it's ugly face regardless of how much suppression the collective does.

I do not know the root cause but have experienced similar and can offer some thoughts on several forces that may be at play.

I agree that 'normies' are not dumb. The mind is however is a multi-layered thing and different domains may have strengths and weaknesses, such as some having strength in mathematics but having difficulty learning foreign languages or vice versa. However, I understand your observation that some are failing to apply obvious strength in logic to an area where it should directly translate (within the same domain), suddenly having blinders on. You mentioned disingenuousness, which is clearly part of it. It does run deeper. Why the blinders? My guess is that it is protection from the pain in actually going through the undeniable steps of logic in realizing and affirming such truths. It might seem they surely must know the truth given their faculties, but to understand anything the information must still be observed and processed to be realized and internalized.

They are at a fork in the road where one branch is a winding loop full of wonders and time to whistle and chat, but that loop keeps coming back to the same fork. That loops starts getting more and more boring, and we are all getting more and more tired as we keep marching down that promising lane despite knowing it leads only back to the fork. Yet, when they look down the other branch, they see unwelcoming, jagged, and hellish terrain leading straight to a cliff from which there is no return. They keep choosing the loop. To them, it is crazy to even view the other branch as a viable path. To us, it is loopy to keep choosing the loop.

There are also highly intelligent, perspicacious individuals incapable of decoding social interactions and performing suavely in social settings. Again, different faculties. But that social world and the ever-revered (why?) entity of culture processes information separately from the individual. Even the most socially clueless amongst us can sense the taboo pretty quickly. We sense it quickly because we can directly observe the difference in reception between spicy commentary and truly verboten thoughts. Keep in mind that different people will have different social circles with different thresholds in additional to the general public/lawful/country level of enforced culture. So fear is a factor and these social networks are complex. You can watch someone go on an unpopular tirade about some topic, maybe even something like a racist rant or a tear-down of a popular figure and suffer some consequences--maybe a scolding, shame on social media, loss of friends. So that will be a deterrent. However, watch someone say something like "I just can't take it anymore, I don't think I can go on living anymore" and watch an armada of emergency vehicles come up, cops barking orders at the person and tazing the shit out of them, cuffing them and hauling them to a hospital, they are imprisoned in a ward for days to weeks with dangerous people, force fed shit food and hardcore drugs the whole time, and their name is forever tarred they get a huge hospital bill and even certain rights might be taken away like gun rights in the USA. The normie is not gonna put forth even the most modest critical thinking toward such a treacherous path until they find themselves in exorbitant suffering on the daily for a long time, like many of us.

And one final factor I think may be at play. The high. The vibe. Keeping the party going. Now a drug fiend is not always a dumb person unable to do the basics. They are often aware they have a problem. But they must go through the slow spiral. They might even be aware that some self-justification is self-deception, like "you've earned it today, just one more hit" type of stuff. There are different levels at which one grapples with the problem and either quits, finds the miraculous healthy balance, or keeps spiraling. But some things just feel good, and that is its own undeniable reality. So, while the normie is able, they will keep sweeping the problem aside as long as they are still getting theirs, as long as they are still high as fuck. Why would they want to stop the party on the fourth drink several bumps in right as the molly is kicking in and a hot person is grinding all up on them? They know there might be a crash, but that is far in the back of their mind. Why would they decide, "you know, let's just get this over with now, turn the lights on, stop the music, give me the STD blisters and the hangover headache and feel like shit right now please." So, while they are able, they will keep the party going and I cannot blame them.

So, let's say they are having a fine meal at a fancy restaurant with a hot date and they are spending big bucks on it. Suddenly some trashy assholes show up with dogs and their dog takes a big shit on the floor next to the table. One of their worst enemies shows up with a hotter date and sits at the table next to them and starts talking smack and bullying them. A group of homeless people show up tableside smelling strongly of urine and vomit and beg them for money. While they have the means and power they won't be dealing with this problem. They'll head for a better restaurant, they'll pay a nice tip to the server to clean up the dog shit or ask the manager to escort the bully out and shoo the homeless away. They know homelessness is a big problem, a failure and shame of civil society, that they have enemies that mock them and are superior to them, that there are assholes who will not clean up their dog shit and leave it to be their problem. These are hard truths they know they cannot fix. But they cannot face them either. So they will keep the party going as long as the means is there. Sometime the money may run out, the hangover will set in, they themselves are homeless, they get their ass kicked by the bully, whatever the case...and even then? The mind is more at ease thinking things will get back to normal, thinking it's just a setback, it is worth enduring to triumph in the end.

Edit: When you start talking about right to die you are that homeless person at the fancy dinner table, you are that drug withdrawal, you are that dog shit, you are the hangover and STD blisters. Best you are out of sight out of mind. Better yet, out of mind = cannot possibly be real. Just look at how taboo the topic is--SaSu forums blocked in several countries, the search results censored--all without regard or half a fuck of consideration given to 'freedom of speech' and so on. The topic of not being tortured to the last possible second is nearly relegated to darknet crime status. I agree it is bizarre and frankly evil.

This is actually an excellent analogy! It makes very much sense and spot on! You are also correct with regards to the topic of the right to die as well as SaSu itself, it is being censored and blocked in various different countries and that the right to die topic is so taboo in mainstream society that barring very few exceptions (the terminally ill and irremediable illnesses, severe physical debility, etc.), almost no one can even access such services in the countries in which assisted dying is legal.

When it comes to potentially reworking a system in place it makes people panic. But the current system was made by asking questions and thinking about answers in the first place.

This is true too, we did not get to where we are in present day had there not been those who challenged the status quo or forced society to come to terms with various societal and systemic issues (civil rights for minorities, marginalized groups, women's rights, LGBTQIA rights, and many more).

 

[Chinaski]

Normies are neurotypical and also NPCs, this is why they do dumb things like ask me to stop playing my computer game because it's my turn to take the rubbish out even though l never asked to be born in the first place