NEET is the natural human state

[sserafim]

You're supposed to hunt for food, search for water and shelter

And if you fail you just die and that's it

Not a constant grind of going to school for years or trying to move up in a career

That's why people are so unhappy these days

Life is a scam for most people

 

[iloverachel]

Even without the stress of work and financial problems, life will always be a hellish prison
Non existence will always be better than living in this torturous abomination

 

[damyon]

Hard to argue with that logic.

~~~
Life is a zero-sum game.

 

[derpyderpins]

Hard to argue with that logic.

Is it really? While I think it's an interesting starting point for conversation, I can think of at least a few questions considering it's absolutist and broad stroke:

• You "just die"? Wasn't it a very harsh existence and then a very slow and painful death, not a quick and simple process at all?
• What are "these days"?
• If the implication is that cavemen were less unhappy, how could that possibly be supported when the data we have on unhappiness (only tracked in the last 50 years or so) shows that most people are at least a little happy? How do we know the cavemen didn't hate their lives, too?
• If the claim about unhappiness is from a very modern standpoint (recent upturn in unhappiness post-covid) weren't there schools and careers long before that?
• If life is a "scam", who is scamming us?
• If we'd be happier out in the woods killing deer with our bare hands, why don't people - ya know - go do that?
• How does any of this support the hypothesis that NEET is the natural state of life?

In general I like the topic of how modern comforts are negatively affecting mental health, but boiling it down to "everything sucks because we're not living like wild monkeys therefore I conclude that doing nothing at all is optimal because life is a scam" is . . . well, let's call it an oversimplification.

 

[damyon]

Is it really? While I think it's an interesting starting point for conversation, I can think of at least a few questions considering it's absolutist and broad stroke:

• You "just die"? Wasn't it a very harsh existence and then a very slow and painful death, not a quick and simple process at all?
• What are "these days"?
• If the implication is that cavemen were less unhappy, how could that possibly be supported when the data we have on unhappiness (only tracked in the last 50 years or so) shows that most people are at least a little happy? How do we know the cavemen didn't hate their lives, too?
• If the claim about unhappiness is from a very modern standpoint (recent upturn in unhappiness post-covid) weren't there schools and careers long before that?
• If life is a "scam", who is scamming us?
• If we'd be happier out in the woods killing deer with our bare hands, why don't people - ya know - go do that?
• How does any of this support the hypothesis that NEET is the natural state of life?

In general I like the topic of how modern comforts are negatively affecting mental health, but boiling it down to "everything sucks because we're not living like wild monkeys therefore I conclude that doing nothing at all is optimal because life is a scam" is . . . well, let's call it an oversimplification.

You are posing the right questions. I like your line of thought.

However, in my message, I do not agree or disagree with the original author's idea. I state that the line of thinking is correct, given the assumptions posed by the original author.

~~~
My opinion on the topic: life stays the same, although the packaging and delivery have been constantly changing.

 

[final_countdown12]

You're supposed to hunt for food, search for water and shelter

And if you fail you just die and that's it

Not a constant grind of going to school for years or trying to move up in a career

That's why people are so unhappy these days

Life is a scam for most people

Would you go for hunt, search for water etc? Or would you still do nothing just thinking on CTB even in this stone age/ no-capitalism scenario?

 

[EyesOfNight]

If life is a "scam", who is scamming us?

The people that profit from us. The government, the corporations, the bosses, the landlords etc.

If we'd be happier out in the woods killing deer with our bare hands, why don't people - ya know - go do that?

Because the knowledge of how to do that has been (mostly) lost over time(for the majority of the population). It's also increasingly difficult to find a peace of wild land which supports such a lifestyle that isn't owned by anyone.

I don't have an opinion on this topic, just wanted to answer these questions •-•

 

[wisteria3]

Is it really? While I think it's an interesting starting point for conversation, I can think of at least a few questions considering it's absolutist and broad stroke:

• You "just die"? Wasn't it a very harsh existence and then a very slow and painful death, not a quick and simple process at all?
• What are "these days"?
• If the implication is that cavemen were less unhappy, how could that possibly be supported when the data we have on unhappiness (only tracked in the last 50 years or so) shows that most people are at least a little happy? How do we know the cavemen didn't hate their lives, too?
• If the claim about unhappiness is from a very modern standpoint (recent upturn in unhappiness post-covid) weren't there schools and careers long before that?
• If life is a "scam", who is scamming us?
• If we'd be happier out in the woods killing deer with our bare hands, why don't people - ya know - go do that?
• How does any of this support the hypothesis that NEET is the natural state of life?

In general I like the topic of how modern comforts are negatively affecting mental health, but boiling it down to "everything sucks because we're not living like wild monkeys therefore I conclude that doing nothing at all is optimal because life is a scam" is . . . well, let's call it an oversimplification.

I agree, the original argument is far from irrefutable. Just wanted to point out a few pieces of evidence, although I'm far from an expert and this evidence could be flawed. I'm just repeating studies and anecdotes cited by others :) First, there have been studies on people who still live hunter-gatherer lifestyles today that showed virtually no signs of mental illness (also missing are lots of physical illnesses that we deal with today). Despite leading way harder lives, they are less mentally ill than us. These studies suggested that their non-inflammatory diets, constant physical activity, sunlight exposure, and constant interaction with other people protect them from depression, among other things.

I also was reading a book that was considering whether hunter-gatherers were happier. It argued that the best way to determine "happier" is to give people the choice between two options and see what they choose. Historically, they said that people who were removed from hunter-gatherer life and put into civilization always longed to return to their former lives. On the other hand, people who were removed from civilization (I think usuallly kidnapped, lol) and brought into hunter-gatherer life almost always preferred the latter even if they initially went back to normal life. Like I think they found normal life extremely lonely and depressing, and then chose to go back to the wildnerness. I don't remember the book exactly but that's the best I remember it.

So I don't think mental illness is "modern" like last 50 years or so, but I do think it's modern like last several thousand years or so (basically a result of civilization and going against our evolution). But, obviously it's hard to know for sure, and of course civilization makes life way easier in general. There are tons of advantages and it is truly amazing what civilization has achieved, I'm not arguing for like anarchy or anything lol

 

[Agon321]

We live in the best period of our history.
This is a fact.
We have an incomparably more comfortable life than our ancestors.
We don't know what early people thought on a daily basis.
Our ancestors were constantly developing. This means that they were not entirely satisfied with their situation.
They made their lives easier by inventing new technologies.

Of course, the modern world has made us weaker than our ancestors. Sometimes much weaker.
Some of our instincts are dormant due to our lifestyle.
Our psyche is simply not adapted to the current speed of the world.

The problem is not the modern world.
The problem is, the wrong approach.
The pace of this world is very fast. Too fast.
We are attacked with information from all sides. We are overstimulated.
The system is poorly designed and support is limited.

On the other hand, we are still fighting for survival.
The scale has simply changed.
There was a time when you had to hunt something to survive.
Now you have to earn money at work to buy food.
We still fight, but in a different way.

We develop to live better.
That's why I don't agree that things were better in the past.
You don't need to romanticize the past.

Humanity must focus on development and not think that it was better to stay in caves.
If we had stayed in the caves, maybe now you would be dying in great agony from a disease that is not a problem now.

Of course, two different periods in the history of our species cannot be completely compared.
If you were born in the very long past, you would have a different perspective than you have now.

 

[derpyderpins]

The people that profit from us. The government, the corporations, the bosses, the landlords etc.

That's such a loose definition though lol. I technically have an assistant who works under me. . . am I a scammer? But I also have a boss. . . so I'm being scammed? If in my 60s I buy a second house and rent my current one at a reasonable rate, does that make me a scammer?

I get the point. I understand the machine concept and everything. I just try to push back on the absolutist language. Yes, there are people who take advantage of others and people with more power than others, but that does not mean all of existence is a scam. Calling it a scam is an excuse to not try and do anything. All of one's obstacles, flaws, and shortcomings are erased from the equation and need not be addressed if one can render the entirety of existence inconsequential through absolutist logic.

I agree, the original argument is far from irrefutable. Just wanted to point out a few pieces of evidence, although I'm far from an expert and this evidence could be flawed. I'm just repeating studies and anecdotes cited by others :) First, there have been studies on people who still live hunter-gatherer lifestyles today that showed virtually no signs of mental illness (also missing are lots of physical illnesses that we deal with today). Despite leading way harder lives, they are less mentally ill than us. These studies suggested that their non-inflammatory diets, constant physical activity, sunlight exposure, and constant interaction with other people protect them from depression, among other things.

I also was reading a book that was considering whether hunter-gatherers were happier. It argued that the best way to determine "happier" is to give people the choice between two options and see what they choose. Historically, they said that people who were removed from hunter-gatherer life and put into civilization always longed to return to their former lives. On the other hand, people who were removed from civilization (I think usuallly kidnapped, lol) and brought into hunter-gatherer life almost always preferred the latter even if they initially went back to normal life. Like I think they found normal life extremely lonely and depressing, and then chose to go back to the wildnerness. I don't remember the book exactly but that's the best I remember it.

So I don't think mental illness is "modern" like last 50 years or so, but I do think it's modern like last several thousand years or so (basically a result of civilization and going against our evolution). But, obviously it's hard to know for sure, and of course civilization makes life way easier in general. There are tons of advantages and it is truly amazing what civilization has achieved, I'm not arguing for like anarchy or anything lol

I'd be interested in knowing more about the book and the methods used. I'm sure there's some truth to it. It seems there are far more barriers to adjust to a modern society when not used to one. I think it's a very gray and complex issue, and we should be trying to work those positives from hunter-gather lifestyles into our modern way of living.

 

[sserafim]

We live in the best period of our history.
This is a fact.
We have an incomparably more comfortable life than our ancestors.
We don't know what early people thought on a daily basis.
Our ancestors were constantly developing. This means that they were not entirely satisfied with their situation.
They made their lives easier by inventing new technologies.

Of course, the modern world has made us weaker than our ancestors. Sometimes much weaker.
Some of our instincts are dormant due to our lifestyle.
Our psyche is simply not adapted to the current speed of the world.

The problem is not the modern world.
The problem is, the wrong approach.
The pace of this world is very fast. Too fast.
We are attacked with information from all sides. We are overstimulated.
The system is poorly designed and support is limited.

On the other hand, we are still fighting for survival.
The scale has simply changed.
There was a time when you had to hunt something to survive.
Now you have to earn money at work to buy food.
We still fight, but in a different way.

We develop to live better.
That's why I don't agree that things were better in the past.
You don't need to romanticize the past.

Humanity must focus on development and not think that it was better to stay in caves.
If we had stayed in the caves, maybe now you would be dying in great agony from a disease that is not a problem now.

Of course, two different periods in the history of our species cannot be completely compared.
If you were born in the very long past, you would have a different perspective than you have now.

Even your basic needs are not fulfilled today

Many copers would tell you that you are privileged to live in modern society and that at least your basic needs are met while kids in Africa starve, but let's analyze this load of bullshit.

Here is the chart of hierarchy of needs and I do not fully agree with it, I think that the average human naturally only cares about first few levels and indeed only fulfilling your basic needs is 90% of your happiness, anything above that is modern brainwashing but let's just look at it:

Let's analyze some of them:

Air - you breathe in polluted air so you are instantly not living in optimal state

Water - you drink cooked sewage water and it is very hard to get truly hydrating drinks such as good fruit juice, raw milk or blood

Food - you eat dogshit processed food and you can never be biochemically healthy and happy from this garbage modern diet

Shelter - many people are renting out places to live so they don't even have a home, but even if you do have your place you are still not living in natural environment, you are living in a prison box in big city where police knows where you live and can get to you in a matter of minutes

Reproduction - this is the absolute strongest instinct that every creature on Earth has imprinted in itself genetically. If you are a below average male, there are high chances that you are going to be an incel which essentially renders your entire life pointless and there is no way that you can be happy if you don't have sex.

I don't want to even get started on needs such as intimacy, sense of connection, etc. I think that they are even more important for human than food so if you lack them, it's over.

In the end you can just safely piss and shit away your modern garbage diet.

So most of us are already failing at the first step and it is simply impossible for us to have any happiness.

 

[wisteria3]

I'd be interested in knowing more about the book and the methods used. I'm sure there's some truth to it. It seems there are far more barriers to adjust to a modern society when not used to one. I think it's a very gray and complex issue, and we should be trying to work those positives from hunter-gather lifestyles into our modern way of living.

Agreed, I think the main takeaways for me are that the keys that made people happier were their constant sense of community (vs our obsession with independence) and the way exercise, healthy eating, etc were incorporated into their lifestyles. I know that everyone tells depressed people to exercise and eat healthy, but that's really hard to do when it's not seamlessly incorporated into our lifestyles. Instead it's an additional effort we have to make on top of our lifestyles, if that makes any sense. So that's what I mean when I say the mental health crisis is systemic.

By the way the book was about early history in general, that was just a short passage. They included anecdotes from people leaving for hunter gather lifestyles and vice-versa. Also, they included anecdotes from European settlers during the colonial era, who were shocked at how their own kids would choose to remain with their adopted indigenous societies while indigenous people given wealth/schooling in European society would always try to leave.

 

[derpyderpins]

I know that everyone tells depressed people to exercise and eat healthy, but that's really hard to do when it's not seamlessly incorporated into our lifestyles. Instead it's an additional effort we have to make on top of our lifestyles, if that makes any sense. So that's what I mean when I say the mental health crisis is systemic.

Absolutely. And we're not making it any easier to both live a productive life and provide for yourself while getting those other needs met. I hardly get to exercise now that I'm at a job where I'm working more hours. Of course, right? There are only so many hours in the day and I'm even more tired when I get home . . . which will only get worse as I get out of shape. These are cycles we could break.

So most of us are already failing at the first step and it is simply impossible for us to have any happiness.

You aren't most people assuming you represent yourself accurately on this site. You have plenty of resources available.

Air - you breathe in polluted air so you are instantly not living in optimal state

nitpick for most parts of the US since the clean air act. Buy a big Dyson Air Purifier.

Water - you drink cooked sewage water and it is very hard to get truly hydrating drinks such as good fruit juice, raw milk or blood

Buy spring water.

Food - you eat dogshit processed food and you can never be biochemically healthy and happy from this garbage modern diet

You don't have access to any type of whole foods/farmer's market?

Shelter - many people are renting out places to live so they don't even have a home, but eve if you do have your place you are still not living in natural environment, you are living in a prison box in big city where police knows where you live and can get to you in a matter of minutes

Renting a home with a roof, heating, and air conditioning is worse than living in a cave subject to the whims of weather and having to fight off wild animals and other competing humans?

Again, though, you have resources. Save up for an RV and go live out on the road visiting nature.

Reproduction - this is the absolute strongest instinct that every creature on Earth has imprinted in itself genetically. If you are a below average male, there are high chances that you are going to be an incel which essentially renders your entire life pointless and there is no way that you can be happy if you don't have sex.

Absolutely doesn't apply to you. (not that you don't have the instinct but the idea that you couldn't if you chose to act on it.)

I don't want to even get started on needs such as intimacy, sense of connection, etc. I think that they are even more important for human than food so if you lack them, it's over.

I'm really, truly, happy to see that you admit you need intimacy and a sense of connection. I very much believe that you can have them if you allow yourself to.

 

[Agon321]

Even your basic needs are not fulfilled today

Many copers would tell you that you are privileged to live in modern society and that at least your basic needs are met while kids in Africa starve, but let's analyze this load of bullshit.

Here is the chart of hierarchy of needs and I do not fully agree with it, I think that the average human naturally only cares about first few levels and indeed only fulfilling your basic needs is 90% of your happiness, anything above that is modern brainwashing but let's just look at it:

Let's analyze some of them:

Air - you breathe in polluted air so you are instantly not living in optimal state

Water - you drink cooked sewage water and it is very hard to get truly hydrating drinks such as good fruit juice, raw milk or blood

Food - you eat dogshit processed food and you can never be biochemically healthy and happy from this garbage modern diet

Shelter - many people are renting out places to live so they don't even have a home, but eve if you do have your place you are still not living in natural environment, you are living in a prison box in big city where police knows where you live and can get to you in a matter of minutes

Reproduction - this is the absolute strongest instinct that every creature on Earth has imprinted in itself genetically. If you are a below average male, there are high chances that you are going to be an incel which essentially renders your entire life pointless and there is no way that you can be happy if you don't have sex.

I don't want to even get started on needs such as intimacy, sense of connection, etc. I think that they are even more important for human than food so if you lack them, it's over.

In the end you can just safely piss and shit away your modern garbage diet.

So most of us are already failing at the first step and it is simply impossible for us to have any happiness.

I never wrote that modernity is good.
I wrote that the present is better than the past.

Relying on Maslow's pyramid is a very big simplification.
It's not that easy.

The fact is that humanity has made many mistakes.
Mistakes that we see the consequences of.
But it's not as bad as you make it out to be.
It's completely the opposite.
Most of our needs are met.
Quality is another matter.

Aren't you starving? Do you have anything to drink? Do you have a roof over your head? So your needs are met.
Most of your needs are met, so you now have plenty of time for this discussion.
In the past this would have been a problem.

The fact that we currently have shitty food is a consequence of the scaling of production and a flaw in the system.
But that doesn't mean you can't buy healthy food.
Of course you can.

This pyramid talks about procreation.
Exactly.
People were "creating" children and needed new ways to support those children.
The methods at that time were insufficient.

If things were good in the past, why did our ancestors develop? If they lived very well, they would most likely vegetate.
If there was no need for development, humanity would not develop.
Necessity is the mother of invention.

I'll say it again.
The problem is not modernity.
The problem is the mistakes we make.
Lots of mistakes.
Mistakes that cost us a lot.
We MUST develop, because that is what nature is all about.
Evolve or die.
I would like to remind you that we are animals and we are governed by instincts, for example the very well-known survival instinct.

Unfair distribution of resources? Who said the world is fair?
There has also been injustice in the past.
It will also exist in the future.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

We live in the best period of our history.
This is a fact.
We have an incomparably more comfortable life than our ancestors.
We don't know what early people thought on a daily basis.
Our ancestors were constantly developing. This means that they were not entirely satisfied with their situation.
They made their lives easier by inventing new technologies.

Of course, the modern world has made us weaker than our ancestors. Sometimes much weaker.
Some of our instincts are dormant due to our lifestyle.
Our psyche is simply not adapted to the current speed of the world.

The problem is not the modern world.
The problem is, the wrong approach.
The pace of this world is very fast. Too fast.
We are attacked with information from all sides. We are overstimulated.
The system is poorly designed and support is limited.

On the other hand, we are still fighting for survival.
The scale has simply changed.
There was a time when you had to hunt something to survive.
Now you have to earn money at work to buy food.
We still fight, but in a different way.

We develop to live better.
That's why I don't agree that things were better in the past.
You don't need to romanticize the past.

Humanity must focus on development and not think that it was better to stay in caves.
If we had stayed in the caves, maybe now you would be dying in great agony from a disease that is not a problem now.

Of course, two different periods in the history of our species cannot be completely compared.
If you were born in the very long past, you would have a different perspective than you have now.

Not necessarily. When we talk about how we are living in the best period of human history, we are usually talking about that from around the agricultural era to today. While I do agree that we shouldn't romanticize the past we also shouldn't be romanticizing the present either.

Most of our modern comforts are only afforded to a particular subset of the population (middle-class to the rich, those in developed countries, those a part of certain privileged groups, etc). Certain issues such as sexism are also more prominent today than they would been prior to the agricultural era.

The origins of sexism: How men came to rule 12,000 years ago

Human societies weren’t always male-dominated. The switch came when we became farmers – and that suggests ways to roll back towards a more equal system

www.newscientist.com

Along with that, our hunter-gatherer ancestors also dealt with less disease, more leisurely time, a lack of racism and queerphobia, strong social networks, etc. While past hunter-gatherer societies would have had their own set of hardships, there is a point to be made that, as you mentioned, the world we've created is evolving much faster than we are able to keep up.

Our ancestors weren't constantly developing out of a lack of satisfaction. They developed because as they gained knowledge they were able to find easier ways to do things. Even then, change and development is a slow process and our technological development as a species didn't start to speed up until long after the hunter-gatherer period. The changes that brought on the agricultural era were slow and we still don't have a clear reason as to why they even happened, with there being several different theories surrounding it (it might even be that all of them are right and apply to different parts of the world).

At the end of the day, we didn't develop to live better. We developed to live differently. We need to start trying to develop more in the direction of connection and stability, rather than focusing solely on technological growth. When people romanticize the past, they are romanticizing that connection and stability that once existed amongst our species that has long since been lost. If @sserafim were born the in past, she likely wouldn't mind because she would have no idea of what the future will be like. Even if she did she would probably prefer her time period (the past) since that's the environment she grew up in. This type of rhetoric sounds similar to when Westerners think that immigrants from developing countries see the West as better. Most immigrants usually prefer their native country and most plan on moving back after making a good sum of money.

 

[Dr Iron Arc]

You're supposed to hunt for food, search for water and shelter

And if you fail you just die and that's it

Isn't that like the opposite of being a NEET? How does staying home gooning to anime babes and whining on the internet comprise the natural human state?

Also I think even most NEETs could agree that they'd rather slave away at a computer than be exposed to the elements otherwise there'd be a lot more homeless people, although it's true that that population is increasing… Maybe it's just me, I would hate to have to hunt and/or gather my own food although I guess if I had died out sooner it wouldn't matter.

 

[final_countdown12]

I never wrote that modernity is good.
I wrote that the present is better than the past.

Relying on Maslow's pyramid is a very big simplification.
It's not that easy.

The fact is that humanity has made many mistakes.
Mistakes that we see the consequences of.
But it's not as bad as you make it out to be.
It's completely the opposite.
Most of our needs are met.
Quality is another matter.

Aren't you starving? Do you have anything to drink? Do you have a roof over your head? So your needs are met.
Most of your needs are met, so you now have plenty of time for this discussion.
In the past this would have been a problem.

The fact that we currently have shitty food is a consequence of the scaling of production and a flaw in the system.
But that doesn't mean you can't buy healthy food.
Of course you can.

This pyramid talks about procreation.
Exactly.
People were "creating" children and needed new ways to support those children.
The methods at that time were insufficient.

If things were good in the past, why did our ancestors develop? If they lived very well, they would most likely vegetate.
If there was no need for development, humanity would not develop.
Necessity is the mother of invention.

I'll say it again.
The problem is not modernity.
The problem is the mistakes we make.
Lots of mistakes.
Mistakes that cost us a lot.
We MUST develop, because that is what nature is all about.
Evolve or die.
I would like to remind you that we are animals and we are governed by instincts, for example the very well-known survival instinct.

Unfair distribution of resources? Who said the world is fair?
There has also been injustice in the past.
It will also exist in the future.

People tend to oversimplify everything and also tend to assume that the past is always better than the present (nostalgia feelings).

 

[derpyderpins]

Not necessarily. When we talk about how we are living in the best period of human history, we are usually talking about that from around the agricultural era to today. While I do agree that we shouldn't romanticize the past we also shouldn't be romanticizing the present either.

Most of our modern comforts are only afforded to a particular subset of the population (middle-class to the rich, those in developed countries, those a part of certain privileged groups, etc). Certain issues such as sexism are also more prominent today than they would been prior to the agricultural era.

The origins of sexism: How men came to rule 12,000 years ago

Human societies weren’t always male-dominated. The switch came when we became farmers – and that suggests ways to roll back towards a more equal system

www.newscientist.com

Along with that, our hunter-gatherer ancestors also dealt with less disease, more leisurely time, a lack of racism and queerphobia, strong social networks, etc. While past hunter-gatherer societies would have had their own set of hardships, there is a point to be made that, as you mentioned, the world we've created is evolving much faster than we are able to keep up.

Our ancestors weren't constantly developing out of a lack of satisfaction. They developed because as they gained knowledge they were able to find easier ways to do things. Even then, change and development is a slow process and our technological development as a species didn't start to speed up until long after the hunter-gatherer period. The changes that brought on the agricultural era were slow and we still don't have a clear reason as to why they even happened, with there being several different theories surrounding it (it might even be that all of them are right and apply to different parts of the world).

At the end of the day, we didn't develop to live better. We developed to live differently. We need to start trying to develop more in the direction of connection and stability, rather than focusing solely on technological growth. When people romanticize the past, they are romanticizing that connection and stability that once existed amongst our species that has long since been lost. If @sserafim were born the in past, she likely wouldn't mind because she would have no idea of what the future will be like. Even if she did she would probably prefer her time period (the past) since that's the environment she grew up in. This type of rhetoric sounds similar to when Westerners think that immigrants from developing countries see the West as better. Most immigrants usually prefer their native country and most plan on moving back after making a good sum of money.

Do you have that full article or a source that isn't behind a paywall? I'm very interested in this era of humanity before modern societies where the physically strongest did not hold more power and how that would work and how we know it was that way. Unless it's just that women were physically as strong or stronger then, in which case it's not so much "sexism" as the strong holding more power than the weak.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

Do you have that full article or a source that isn't behind a paywall? I'm very interested in this era of humanity before modern societies where the physically strongest did not hold more power and how that would work and how we know it was that way. Unless it's just that women were physically as strong or stronger then, in which case it's not so much "sexism" as the strong holding more power than the weak.

Hey, did you know that you can do this weird thing called turning off javascript? How about you, the guy who can't comprehend that gender and race are social constructs despite that being the consensus amongst scientists (I should know since I'm both studying psychology and biology and this was actually covered), don't spend your time talking about how sexism came about.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

Even without the stress of work and financial problems, life will always be a hellish prison
Non existence will always be better than living in this torturous abomination

I fully agree with this. Life will never be worth it for me. It's just that work makes it even less worth it for me but, even if I didn't have to work, I know I would still want to ctb because of how inherent suffering is to life. I will admit that, without work, I'll be suffering significantly less but, at the same time, I'd still be suffering enough to not want to live through life. Or, if I am not suffering intensely yet, I know that I can get completely fucked over by random chance at any time

 

[derpyderpins]

Hey, did you know that you can do this weird thing called turning off javascript? How about you, the guy who can't comprehend that gender and race are social constructs despite that being the consensus amongst scientists (I should know since I'm both studying psychology and biology and this was actually covered), don't spend your time talking about how sexism came about.

So we're just never going to be able to have a cordial interaction unless I agree with your bio and psych professors on that topic, huh? I seriously thought what you mentioned was interesting.

So we're just never going to be able to have a cordial interaction unless I agree with your bio and psych professors on that topic, huh? I seriously thought what you mentioned was interesting.

Eh, not that interesting. It doesn't say anything about equal power. It says the women would have a choice to stay with their family or go live with their partner's family but that doesn't explain why one group or the other would not have men in a greater position of power.

 

[EvisceratedJester]

So we're just never going to be able to have a cordial interaction unless I agree with your bio and psych professors on that topic, huh? I seriously thought what you mentioned was interesting.

I don't like you, so no.

 

[Hotsackage]

Ya kinda hard when you're brain doesn't function at a young age

 

[EvisceratedJester]

Ya kinda hard when you're brain doesn't function at a young age

What? What are you trying to say?/g

 

[derpyderpins]

I don't like you, so no.

Thanks for the honesty. I'll try to remember who you are this time so I don't bother you going forward.

 

[Hotsackage]

What? What are you trying to say?/g

To live a normal life, im speaking from experience here. Don't take it the wrong way

 

[EmptyHeaded]

Not necessarily. When we talk about how we are living in the best period of human history, we are usually talking about that from around the agricultural era to today. While I do agree that we shouldn't romanticize the past we also shouldn't be romanticizing the present either.

Isn't the difference in life expectancy already enough on its own to claim we have it better than at any other point in history?

 

[EvisceratedJester]

Isn't the difference in life expectancy already enough on its own to claim we have it better than at any other point in history?

The difference in life expectancy was due to child mortality rates and even then that doesn't automatically make the past worse. It's important to note that the child mortality rates would likely have been affected by increased exposure to diseases as humans started to live in permanent settlements, around animals, and around more humans. To add insult to injury, they also would have been exposed to human and animal waste (think feces), which would have worsened it. With that in mind, this doesn't apply as much to hunter-gatherer societies, who didn't have to deal with as much disease. Hence why so many indigenous people died when the Europeans started colonizing different countries. A lot of people a part of those societies were healthy to my knowledge.

Past societies also usually had stronger communities, they would have practiced certain things that have long since been forgotten by most in the modern world (such as elimination communication), had less pollution, etc. The point is, that modern society is better in some aspects and worse in others. Looking down on past societies only makes you just as ignorant as those who glorify them. It's better to appreciate past societies and what they did right or better than us, while also acknowledging their bad aspects.

 

[sserafim]

To live a normal life, im speaking from experience here. Don't take it the wrong way

Normal ≠ good. Why is there an expectation to conform to the norm?

 

[EvisceratedJester]

To live a normal life, im speaking from experience here. Don't take it the wrong way

Well, young people's brains do function perfectly fine and the points that the OP mentioned have also been echoed by many older adults, so, while likely unintentional, it does make your comment come off as a bit condescending.