Nearly getting admitted with no suicidal ideation

[eg0deathf0rsure]

(apologies in advance if i've posted this incorrectly, new user here making their first post)

Something that I would like to ask: have you ever been admitted or threatened with admission to a psych ward with no suicidal ideation?

I ask this based on something that happened to me recently. I had an overdose on accident and asked to be taken to the hospital, which I was, but during my stay there I was threatened with being admitted to the psych ward despite never expressing any suicidal thoughts. I made it clear I overdosed because I was attempting to self medicate for my low mood - NOT because I had any intention to kill myself - and that I had no intention to overdose again based on how awful and frightening the overdose was. Despite saying this over and over and over, I nearly got admitted anyways. The thing was, I KNEW that the fuckers were taking notes on what I was saying because they kept bringing up a delusion I had offhandedly mentioned, meaning they HAD listened to me but had made the executive decision that I was lying about not being suicidal. Which, might I add, please don't ever pry into psychotics' delusions and continuously bring them up when they've made it clear the subject makes them uncomfortable. It was incredibly distressing, they told me if I didn't open up about my delusions it would "affect my assessment" aka they were threatening to admit me if I didn't open up about delusions. Just don't do that. Safe to say, they didn't actually care about assessing my current state of mind and whether I was actually suicidal or a risk to myself - all they cared about was my mental health history which they weaponised to consider me insane and a liar and I nearly got admitted based on that alone.

Other things happened too and, to be blunt, it was so humiliating and distressing of a process that I had actually wished I had stayed at home and risked dying of an overdose. I came out of the experience with more suicidal thoughts that I had going in. But that's enough of me venting.

Have any of you had experiences that were similar? Do you know someone else that had a similar experience? I know many people here are actively suicidal, but I'd be interested to hear if there was any point you weren't suicidal and nearly got admitted anyways. But hey, even if you haven't I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the topic.

 

[jodes2]

I was sectioned a bit over a year ago, I wasn't suicidal at that point. I'd mentioned that I'd been suicidal with strong plans in the past though. The thing is I was having delusions and saying some pretty weird shit. I'm glad they hospitalised me because I was beginning to really lose the plot. I thought I was being gangstalked and it was starting to affect my behaviour. They caught me just in time before I went completely off the rails. I think it was actually a really good judgement call of theirs, I'm still pretty impressed. In hospital it got really bad. I literally thought I was imminently going to be physically and mentally tortured by multiple governments in the cruelest way and it was the most terrifying thing. They compelled me to make medication, implying I'd be forced if I didn't take it willingly, but without actually saying it. I hate injections so I just took the pills. They didn't start working before I tried to kill myself in there, but I didn't have a lot to work with. I tried partial with my tracksuit bottoms around my neck, I managed to wedge one end with my other clothes and managed to pass out briefly. No-one noticed, but they took away my bag after 2 days anyway which did most of the propping up so I couldn't try again after that. Who knows, I might have actually killed myself in hospital if they hadn't taken my bag away. But that would have been a bad CTB, I was absolutely not in my right mind and the medication did wonders. I was discharged just 3 weeks later, the psychosis had largely gone, just some reminant associations that still disturbed me but they said they noticed a huge improvement and looking back I see it too.

 

[eg0deathf0rsure]

@jodes2 I'm glad to hear that hospitalisation worked out for you! Thank you for sharing. Paranoid delusions have got to be some of the worst delusions out there, so it's great to hear the medication helped. It's nice to know that despite the flawed system, it's still helped people. I sometimes forget that just based on people I've talked to and my own experiences. ^^;; I hope that with enough pressure on governments that one day we can have a system that is far more effective with less risk of making people feel worse than better.

 

[Ilan Alba]

When I was 12 I was admitted to a pediatric psych ward. I can't remember enough of what I was feeling at the time to say whether or not I actually needed it, but I raised a lot of red flags regardless. It was an okay experience and I remember liking the other people there.

 

[sheepgirl]

Ev

(apologies in advance if i've posted this incorrectly, new user here making their first post)

Something that I would like to ask: have you ever been admitted or threatened with admission to a psych ward with no suicidal ideation?

I ask this based on something that happened to me recently. I had an overdose on accident and asked to be taken to the hospital, which I was, but during my stay there I was threatened with being admitted to the psych ward despite never expressing any suicidal thoughts. I made it clear I overdosed because I was attempting to self medicate for my low mood - NOT because I had any intention to kill myself - and that I had no intention to overdose again based on how awful and frightening the overdose was. Despite saying this over and over and over, I nearly got admitted anyways. The thing was, I KNEW that the fuckers were taking notes on what I was saying because they kept bringing up a delusion I had offhandedly mentioned, meaning they HAD listened to me but had made the executive decision that I was lying about not being suicidal. Which, might I add, please don't ever pry into psychotics' delusions and continuously bring them up when they've made it clear the subject makes them uncomfortable. It was incredibly distressing, they told me if I didn't open up about my delusions it would "affect my assessment" aka they were threatening to admit me if I didn't open up about delusions. Just don't do that. Safe to say, they didn't actually care about assessing my current state of mind and whether I was actually suicidal or a risk to myself - all they cared about was my mental health history which they weaponised to consider me insane and a liar and I nearly got admitted based on that alone.

Other things happened too and, to be blunt, it was so humiliating and distressing of a process that I had actually wished I had stayed at home and risked dying of an overdose. I came out of the experience with more suicidal thoughts that I had going in. But that's enough of me venting.

Have any of you had experiences that were similar? Do you know someone else that had a similar experience? I know many people here are actively suicidal, but I'd be interested to hear if there was any point you weren't suicidal and nearly got admitted anyways. But hey, even if you haven't I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on the topic.

I've had many admissions and been sectioned numerous times including a CTO. But never been admitted without good reason - aka my life being at genuine risk. I've never been psychotic or manic so never been admitted for that. Where I live there are so few psych beds only people seriously unwell or at risk of serious harm or death will be admitted.

 

[Kurushii]

Back when I was in school, I was talking to my counsellor one day and they asked me how I was doing. I accidentally let my guard down and said I don't see a point in living life and they contacted mum about it and they said they would take me to the hospital. I knew I didn't want to be hospitalised at all so I was scared, but I managed to talk myself out of the situation. I was lucky I didn't end up going. I never tell anyone who can do anything like having me go to a psych ward about my wishing to ctb for mostly this reason (besides my partner). In my personal experience I'm glad I learned that I couldn't trust anyone early on about this topic. I just know that me going to a psych ward would be awful for me, and only serve to make my life worse.

 

[5417807]

The only time I was close to being admitted was when I needed emergency surgery and my mental health nurse was scared I'd become psychotic during recovery. Other than that I've told 100s of people with power over my care I've attempted or want to and they never hospitalised me. It's odd how the health care system works

 

[d3c96524be95]

I was admitted three times in a psych ward against my will. The first two times, I had some kind of intentions of killing myself soon, so although I cannot support forced admissions from a moral standpoint, I'd say the law was with them at least. On my third admission though, that was slightly different because while I did have suicidal ideation (I always had), there was no actual objective threat or evidence that I was going to kms anytime soon.

It was a very unfortunate conjuction of circumstances. One night, I was very down, very melancholic, and I sent a text message to my mother seeking for her help (which I really never do normally). The message was not threatening or anything, it might have been something ever so slightly worrying like "Mom, I'm feeling very low and depressed tonight.". A few seconds after that message was dispatched, my mobile carrier had an incident which made them unable to dispatch any SMS or phone call to me from that point on . My parents sent me countless messages, tried to call me dozen of times, but I was unable to receive any of them and I wasn't even aware that they were trying to contact me. I just thought my mom was sleeping, or hadn't seen or received my message, but in reality my parents were freaking out because they thought I had shutdown my phone just after sending them a "worrying message" to attempt to commit suicide when I really couldn't see they were trying hard to contact me. As they were hundreds of kilometers away, they called emergency services which, to my shock and surprise, knocked on my door and drove me to the emergency department of the nearest hospital. It's only once I was there, waiting for my turn, that all the messages and missed calls were dispatched on my phone and that I understood .

I tried to explain the situation to the psychatrist there, telling her I was indeed not feeling great, and I explained to her that I was not imminently suicidal at the moment, that I was only seeking for my parent's help, not refusing healthcare or treatments, and that it was a complete misunderstanding with my parents. But the machinery had already been set in motion. She didn't buy the carrier phone incident at all, said that I was minimizing, being delusional, refusing healthcare and trying to hide to her my imminent suicide plans. She wrote in her report that I was lying which was so dehumanizing. The fact that I have ASD may not have helped, but I understood at that moment that in my country, once you're brought to the emergency department with psych issue, there's no way out. They're just not taking any risk for them, they don't really care about patients in reality.

So I was then brought to the psych ward once again. This time on a specific regime that would only allow psychatrists from the ward to decide should they let me out or not. Said psychiatrists who would once again write in their reports that I was lying and being delusional without ever telling it to me face-to-face. This system and laws are mental. Probably way more ill than me in reality.

Apart from that event, I was threatened a few other times. One time, I was naive enough to talk to a doctor about my suicide thoughts (again, not imminent), and she almost forced me to go to some hospital to be "checked", which I did. The fact that I was going there willingly may have helped, but regardless, I understood that contrary to what the doctor had said to me, they had the possibility to imprison me whenever they wanted. So yeah, there I minimized a lot because otherwise, I'd have been imprisoned again.

 

[eg0deathf0rsure]

When I was 12 I was admitted to a pediatric psych ward. I can't remember enough of what I was feeling at the time to say whether or not I actually needed it, but I raised a lot of red flags regardless. It was an okay experience and I remember liking the other people there.

I'm glad you had a okay experience in the ward! Always a plus.

Where I live there are so few psych beds only people seriously unwell or at risk of serious harm or death will be admitted.

Other than that I've told 100s of people with power over my care I've attempted or want to and they never hospitalised me. It's odd how the health care system works

I think both these comments are really interesting, highlights how much variation there can be or what individual factors there can be. Makes me wonder about my own local hospital - they're always short on beds yet they insisted on trying to admit me, I'll be thinking about why that might be now. (thank you for your responses!)

Back when I was in school, I was talking to my counsellor one day and they asked me how I was doing. I accidentally let my guard down and said I don't see a point in living life and they contacted mum about it and they said they would take me to the hospital. I knew I didn't want to be hospitalised at all so I was scared, but I managed to talk myself out of the situation. I was lucky I didn't end up going. I never tell anyone who can do anything like having me go to a psych ward about my wishing to ctb for mostly this reason (besides my partner). In my personal experience I'm glad I learned that I couldn't trust anyone early on about this topic. I just know that me going to a psych ward would be awful for me, and only serve to make my life worse.

I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, but I'm glad to hear that you have a partner to rely on! It's always important to have someone you can trust, even if you're vigilant the rest of the time. I hope that you don't have the displeasure of getting admitted (not to say that it's 100% likely to be a bad experience but it can be pretty hit or miss). Thank you for sharing!

I tried to explain the situation to the psychatrist there, telling her I was indeed not feeling great, and I explained to her that I was not imminently suicidal at the moment, that I was only seeking for my parent's help, not refusing healthcare or treatments, and that it was a complete misunderstanding with my parents. But the machinery had already been set in motion. She didn't buy the carrier phone incident at all, said that I was minimizing, being delusional, refusing healthcare and trying to hide to her my imminent suicide plans. She wrote in her report that I was lying which was so dehumanizing. The fact that I have ASD may not have helped, but I understood at that moment that in my country, once you're brought to the emergency department with psych issue, there's no way out. They're just not taking any risk for them, they don't really care about patients in reality.

So I was then brought to the psych ward once again. This time on a specific regime that would only allow psychatrists from the ward to decide should they let me out or not. Said psychiatrists who would once again write in their reports that I was lying and being delusional without ever telling it to me face-to-face. This system and laws are mental. Probably way more ill than me in reality.

Apart from that event, I was threatened a few other times. One time, I was naive enough to talk to a doctor about my suicide thoughts (again, not imminent), and she almost forced me to go to some hospital to be "checked", which I did. The fact that I was going there willingly may have helped, but regardless, I understood that contrary to what the doctor had said to me, they had the possibility to imprison me whenever they wanted. So yeah, there I minimized a lot because otherwise, I'd have been imprisoned again.

I'm sorry that that happened to you, but it's greatly relieving for me to hear that I'm not alone in this!! It makes you wonder why they ask you anything when they're just going default to the assumption you're lying. It's SO dehumanising. When it happened to me, I had the unfortunate response that I got really worked up and upset which made me look even more 'insane' than they already thought I was. Even when I tried to tell them how upset they were making me, they completely ignored me and kept assuming I was lying about my lack os suicidality!! The stars must have fucking aligned because with some good luck I was able to get discharged with no admission to the ward, but it was such a bad experience that I don't think I can ever be honest with psych teams ever again - because it's evident that your own honest assessment of your mental health means nothing to them.

It's incidents like this that convince me that psychs shouldn't have the power to involuntarily admit people. For as many good stories I hear, there's just as many bad ones. Maybe if psych wards were consistently safe places for patients, then I wouldn't mind it. But with the way psych wards are currently, with the way that psychs will treat patients as completely irrational people who can't speak for themselves, for the amount of distress that the system puts people through; I can't support psychs having THIS much power over patients. Nobody should be made to feel 'naive' for opening up, nobody should be put into a position where they have to be hypervigilant about their suicidal thoughts- those are the symptoms of a system failing people. It's so disappointing, and I hope things will change for the better sooner rather than later.

 

[d3c96524be95]

It makes you wonder why they ask you anything when they're just going default to the assumption you're lying.

This. Every time, I had the sensation that it was rigged from the beginning. They made up their mind even before I had said anything. Psychiatrists have no incentive to not lock you up anyways. I'm very relieved it didn't go further for you though.

I can only speak for my country (France), but the way psychiatry is practiced is very unscientific and oppressive. They even invented a whole newspeak to not be perceived as evil. One should not say "asylum" but "hospital" because, you know, you'll see a "doctor" every so often who will put you under heavy iatrogenic medication and who will never be willing to take the responsibility to let you out until you're "stabilized" (which is just their word for "submissive" and "able to bullshit them long enough that their medication is efficient" and whatnot). One should not say "forced imprisonment"/"internment" but "hospitalization on a third-party demand" or "healthcare for imminent peril" depending on whether or not they can offload the responsibility of the imprisonment to a member of your family. One should not say "forced treatments"/"torture" but "healthcare"/"medication". And they will really insist very very hard that you use their terms and not the actual proper french terms for what you're enduring.

They'll often say most patients are there willingly, but if you discuss with other patients, you realize that the ones who are there "willingly" would have been detained regardless. By choosing the "consenting" way, they were able to loosen some rules, such as not having to wear the asylum pyjama 24/7 (under what scientific ground btw?), being able use their mobile phones, have permission to go out sometimes… That's not what I'd call "willingly".

Also, by the law, before your 13th day of your imprisonment you have to see a judge who will evaluate the legality of the restrictions. But this is also completely rigged. Judges are overwhelmed, so the 12 days delay can easily extend to a month and more. By this time, you'll be completely alienated and incapable of defending your cause because *all* patients are being put under heavy doses of Cyamemazine (or any strong neuroleptic, but Cyamemazine is the most common, I haven't met one patient not taking it). Between the time you were admitted and the time you actually see the judge, psychiatrists will have written dozens of consistent (yet untrue) reports, saying you're delusional, not consenting to treatments, constantly lying, and that makes the imprisonment legal. So even the judge thing cannot help you. You're deprived from liberty because psychiatrists feel the urge to be in control of your fate and abuse their excessive powers. You went in with depression, you get out with stronger depression, medications that make your life an even worse nightmare, and possibly PTSD. But that's healthcare®.

Sorry, that's probably way too much venting from me in your own thread, but I could really speak about that for hours. And I've not yet talked about the poor hygiene there, about how other patients will come in your room at night to rob you, and whatnot. This is definitely more about control and surveillance than it is about healthcare. I can understand that it is relieving for you to see others had similar experiences as yours, because that's exactly how I felt when I read about former psychiatry patients who endured the same things as me (or even worse). It's terrifying, but society just doesn't care about mentally ill people so I guess torturing us is fine.

 

[eg0deathf0rsure]

Sorry, that's probably way too much venting from me in your own thread, but I could really speak about that for hours. And I've not yet talked about the poor hygiene there, about how other patients will come in your room at night to rob you, and whatnot. This is definitely more about control and surveillance than it is about healthcare. I can understand that it is relieving for you to see others had similar experiences as yours, because that's exactly how I felt when I read about former psychiatry patients who endured the same things as me (or even worse). It's terrifying, but society just doesn't care about mentally ill people so I guess torturing us is fine.

First off, you don't have to apologise! I made this thread to hear about other's experiences - it's been comforting and informative to hear about your experience. Thank you for all that you've shared, I know how personal and frankly traumatising these experiences can be.

I can only speak for my country (France), but the way psychiatry is practiced is very unscientific and oppressive. They even invented a whole newspeak to not be perceived as evil. One should not say "asylum" but "hospital" because, you know, you'll see a "doctor" every so often who will put you under heavy iatrogenic medication and who will never be willing to take the responsibility to let you out until you're "stabilized" (which is just their word for "submissive" and "able to bullshit them long enough that their medication is efficient" and whatnot). One should not say "forced imprisonment"/"internment" but "hospitalization on a third-party demand" or "healthcare for imminent peril" depending on whether or not they can offload the responsibility of the imprisonment to a member of your family. One should not say "forced treatments"/"torture" but "healthcare"/"medication". And they will really insist very very hard that you use their terms and not the actual proper french terms for what you're enduring.

They'll often say most patients are there willingly, but if you discuss with other patients, you realize that the ones who are there "willingly" would have been detained regardless. By choosing the "consenting" way, they were able to loosen some rules, such as not having to wear the asylum pyjama 24/7 (under what scientific ground btw?), being able use their mobile phones, have permission to go out sometimes… That's not what I'd call "willingly".

Also, by the law, before your 13th day of your imprisonment you have to see a judge who will evaluate the legality of the restrictions. But this is also completely rigged. Judges are overwhelmed, so the 12 days delay can easily extend to a month and more. By this time, you'll be completely alienated and incapable of defending your cause because *all* patients are being put under heavy doses of Cyamemazine (or any strong neuroleptic, but Cyamemazine is the most common, I haven't met one patient not taking it). Between the time you were admitted and the time you actually see the judge, psychiatrists will have written dozens of consistent (yet untrue) reports, saying you're delusional, not consenting to treatments, constantly lying, and that makes the imprisonment legal. So even the judge thing cannot help you. You're deprived from liberty because psychiatrists feel the urge to be in control of your fate and abuse their excessive powers. You went in with depression, you get out with stronger depression, medications that make your life an even worse nightmare, and possibly PTSD. But that's healthcare®.

I'm not sure what it's like for all psych wards in my country, but the one I've been at wasn't much better. I was voluntarily admitted once, and it had ISSUES... Whenever they had more "inconvenient" patients they would make them take sedatives so they wouldn't have to deal with them. It is legal in my country to compel involuntary patients to take medication without informed consent, so they'll give platitudes like "this is just something that will calm you down" when really they're giving you medication that'll make you unable to think clearly if it doesn't outright knock you out. If you still don't take it they can find ways to make things worse for you, like prolonging your stay.

You have a set amount of time that's meant to be the "limit" to how long you're admitted, but it's bullshit. They have you do paperwork and put off meetings and when you finally get to a meeting they can just decide "this patient should stay here longer" and the patient can't do anything about it. There were people trying to get out for WEEKS that still hadn't been let out. Those people were involuntary patients but even I, a voluntary patient, could have had my stay prolonged if at any point a doctor had decided it was for "my own safety" that I should remain admitted. When it comes to the admission itself, it's exactly the same as you said. In many scenarios, a patient is at threat of being involuntarily admitted so they'll "consent" to being admitted. The only difference being staying involuntary means things are going to be worse off for you. They insist it's not imprisonment, but how could it be anything else when you're not allowed to leave when you want to (when you're MEANT to even)?

And you know, at the same hospital, I had experience with two different wards and OH BOY... The first ward I stayed at was for the "worse" patients, which actually had piss and shit stained lounges, nurses that wouldn't be around to give you your phone at the right times, not giving you any of the papers you're meant to have, no clocks, no information on what the schedule of the ward was meant to be... Then I got moved to the ward for the "better" patients, the difference was so stark it was hard to believe the first ward was right next door. It makes me so upset how patients can't even be guaranteed the same treatment at the SAME hospital. (this is all why i started panicking when i was threatened me with admission this most recent time!!) I have no clue how our government advertises the public psych wards here, I find it hard to keep track of official news, but I can say with certainty they're not that great - as far as I'm aware considering my own experiences and the experiences of my friends.

 

[d3c96524be95]

Thanks for sharing your tribulations. I relate a lot, but I went through and have read so much accounts on mistreatment in psych wards that I'm not even surprised… Still, it's sad to hear these are also common practices in other countries, in spite of WHO and CRPD guidelines, and in complete disregard of basic human rights. I learnt on this forum that some US citizen even have to pay "medical" bills after being tortured in psych wards… That is so ridiculous.

Would it be too intrusive to ask you the country where that took place? (Feel free to ignore this question if you're not comfortable answering it.)