M

martinso67

All human rights are important
Feb 5, 2021
232
I read an article about some guy who is in a war zone and can't leave anymore. Borders were closed and no smuggling possible. He was sad that his life could not start because he can't leave the war zone anymore and he had to give up his job and stay in a European country. He studied and worked hard to get an engineering job in an European country, so that he can live there to marry and create a family. That's when in his opinion his life would start. It was his dream. Like the American dream.

For many people that's a nice life and worth living and struggling for. For me not. I think many. Not the majority. But for a a sizable amount. Their wish to cease to exist is because of their dependency of other humans and in practice the community and society. Being born as a human renders you dependent from birth to death on other humans. From being a toddler where you are solely dependent on your mum or a care giver to survive. To when being an adult where you are dependent on an employer and society to survive.

What you perceive as suffering is the consequence of human behavior. Society conditions you that you have free will and only are responsible for your life. Which for example animals do not have the conception of. They do not have the consciousness that they know that they will die in the future at the end of their life expectancy. But on the other hand animals do not have to depend for survival on their same species. They depend on nature in general. For example a bird, which I wish I was instead of being a human.

I know it sounds ridiculous to choose being a bird or an animal instead of human. But I am more free and I can live how I want. Animals do suffer, but they do not perceive it as something negative. That's why many animals do not fight off their suffering really. That's why you have animal farms, but not human farms.
I do not believe really in reincarnation. But when I was younger I thought that If I suicide myself, then I will be born as an animal. It deter me a little bit to take the step to end my life, because I was afraid I would be born in an abusive animal farm. Where humans cause me suffering for their economic needs.

To conclude, I think many humans would choose life over death if they are really independent. Technology tries to somewhat do that. Like with the internet, you do not need to depend on humans. You can buy, entertain, fulfill your sexual desires and more without needing other humans. You need to only use your mouse/finger and a keyboard.
But unfortunately technology cannot be really successful in replacing human dependency. AI is over hyped and a bubble. If not somewhat a scam. Like in the past when they said computers would destroy many jobs and society.
But it did not. It actually did create many jobs. Like AI would create jobs where you have to regulate or label AI content and products. Like now we have digital marketers and influencers (Youtuber, TikToker, etc.).
 
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an_alias

an_alias

milosh
Dec 21, 2020
107
i deeply feel for you, OP. for quite a while one of my least favourite things about being human is the fact that i am the amalgamation of everything i have ever seen (these things are all essential to the current me), and yet i produce so little. the world is so big. i depend on so much. i just feel like an embarrassment
 
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ijustwishtodie

ijustwishtodie

death will be my ultimate bliss
Oct 29, 2023
5,212
I mean, isn't depending on other humans, at least in the examples you gave, a way of suffering. They don't seem mutually exclusive to me. Also, I personally think that it's impossible to be independent. Even with the example of technology that you gave, it's not like you forged technology on your own. Other humans made the technology for us to use. And, as for fulfilling sexual desires on the internet, the only reason why they exist in the first place is because other humans placed them on the internet. I don't understand how technology makes you be independent in the way you describe it if technology is just the creation made by other humans
 
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Darkover

Darkover

Angelic
Jul 29, 2021
4,739
i agree humans are to dependent on others when you just want to be independent
soon long as you are brought to life dependent and not independent life will never be fair
i won't be happy into i'm able to live completely independently
remove all weakness remove all dependency become completely independent live forever take back my world
i wouldn't ever be happy here not while my happiness depends on the other's within my surroundings, in other words i need to be completely independent that means not having my happiness depend on the others.
i wish we was completely independent not needing someone to love
 
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S

Scythe

Lost in a delusion
Sep 5, 2022
546
Really sucks how society is structured in a way thay forces human communication and interaction. Aside from forcing you to depend on others since you need money and shit. Almost everything has to go through someone else. Although I do enjoy interaction, sometimes I wish I can be cut off from the world for a few days and it's really hard to do that. Sure I can go into the middle of the woods for a bit, but that's not something I can just do currently.
 
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J

J&L383

Wizard
Jul 18, 2023
629
Some thoughts worthy of consideration. However I would disagree that being dependent on others needs to be a source of suffering. Since caveman days humans have always been social beings and required socialization to survive, for example the hunters and gatherers couldn't do it without others, and then we progress to farming and then of course the industrial revolution (which kind of screwed it up in my view, with the pollution it created). Even if you can live alone you need at least one other person to procreate, otherwise the human population would never have got past Adam and Eve (the reference is figurative). As for me, I interact with others as little as I need to, mostly because I just feel that most people are annoying, but they probably feel that about me too.🤷‍♂️


Thank you for your thoughts, a great starting point for a long philosophical discussion!
 
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