Discussion My Islamic friends say every self deletion case will endure eternal torment

[MeowTheFlemishCat]

My religious friends usually tell me every self deletion case will result in them suffering excruciatingly for eternity.

What do you guys think about this?

 

[KillingPain267]

Well, how do ctb bombers justify it then? Just tell them it's for a holy cause. I'm a Christian and they ssy the ssme things, especially Catholics. I don't buy it though because both great characters like Saul and Samson did it when all battle was lost and they are described as believers who earned resurrection (due to their faith).

 

[aslank98]

I think your islamic friends are brainwashed from religion. I also think the response you'll get here will be biased.

I personally think that you came here confused most likely against your own will and you have the personal right to leave on your own terms when you are ready.

You don't owe anybody shit, not your "friends" ' family or whatever flavour of "god" you might believe in.

You could get murdered tomorrow, hit by a car, mauled by a crazy dog.

Death is coming for all of us whether we like it or not, the idea that suicide is any different from the scenarios I listed above is absolutely nonsense.

 

[Darkover]

crazy people everywhere delusional much

 

[Agon321]

How do they know this? ;).
Exactly.

Generally speaking, I am not a religious person. Currently, I do not follow any religion because none suits me.
In my opinion, all of them are naive, weak, pointless, provide very poor rewards, etc.

Your friends are religious people, so it's normal that their perspective on the world will be different. They must have a different perspective, otherwise their faith would make no sense.

The other question is, should you or I care? I do not think so.

I am not going to care about the opinion of any religion and/or person.
Nobody came back from the afterlife.
We have absolutely no reliable knowledge on this subject.
We only know what is happening to our biological body. Only this.

Religions give us the illusion of an answer to this question.
That's just how I see it.

Maybe after CTB I will end up in eternal hell...or maybe not.
Who knows? ;).

 

[Unknown21]

My religious friends usually tell me every self deletion case will result in them suffering excruciatingly for eternity.

What do you guys think about this?

As an ex Muslim it's completely true, All religions strongly discourage suicide.

 

[Superdeterminist]

Ask them to prove it.

 

[losing hope]

I'm an ex Muslim (now Buddist) and I ask myself what kind of a god is going to send Alan Turing to hell; https://www.computerhistory.org/tdih/june/7/

Thee main reason muslims believe that, is because apparently Allah gives life, so he is the only one who should take it away. Does that mean doctors who perform mircle life saving operations are also going to hell then for interfering with Allah's plan in a positive way?

 

[AdamOndiAhman]

My religious friends usually tell me every self deletion case will result in them suffering excruciatingly for eternity.

What do you guys think about this?

reality is most likely to be the opposite

 

[Ashu]

My religious friends usually tell me every self deletion case will result in them suffering excruciatingly for eternity.

What do you guys think about this?

Normtards. Just say yes yes you're absolutely right, and hurry on your way.

 

[KuriGohan&Kamehameha]

Earnestly, if a particular religion was in possession of the truth about how the universe works, I don't think there would be hundreds of different theological texts and beliefs systems out there all subscribing to different ideas. Allah is about as real as Goku or Goldilocks and the three bears to me personally.

 

[Coconut blue]

I seriously can't get at all the take Abrahamic religions have on suicide. If god is omnipotent, omniscient, and merciful why would he even give life to someone he knows is going to ctb and end up in hell suffering for eternity? Is he sending these ppl to hell bc he chooses to? then i'd say he's a cruel tyrant who creates life for the sake of watching humans suffer, not someone i want to be with in heaven until the end of time. or is it a natural law or whatever that ppl who die from suicide have to go to hell? if that's the case the whole assumption of an all powerful god, which judaism/Christianity/islam is based on, falls apart
also, most people who commit suicide do so because they're suffering from some type of mental illness and can't find a way out. i won't call that "self deletion". its similar to dying by any other kind of physical illness and doesnt say anything about your personal integrity or moral character.

 

[ijustwishtodie]

They're wrong because allah doesn't exist in a similar way that jesus doesn't exist. There is no hell or eternal torment as depicted in religion. Come on, doesn't the idea of facing eternal torment because you killed yourself seem plausible to you in any way? Why would somebody as omnipotent as god care about mere humans killing themselves to begin with? Obviously other humans care about you killing yourself as they want to control you and ctb is the only way to not let them control you. Things like this makes religion look so clearly man made to me

 

[LaVieEnRose]

Earnestly, if a particular religion was in possession of the truth about how the universe works, I don't think there would be hundreds of different theological texts and beliefs systems out there all subscribing to different ideas. Allah is about as real as Goku or Goldilocks and the three bears to me personally.

On the other hand @Goku Black definitely is as real as they come

 

[Davey36000]

Well ur friend is wrong because nothing is permanent.

 

[Lost Magic]

Have your Islamic friends died? Of course, not. Are you Islamic yourself and believe in whatever teachings Islam belives in? You have to answer these questions on a deeper level and then you will find your own answers.

 

[Raindancer]

The Abrahamic religions believe that life is a gift and only God has the right to take that away. In the Christian religion, we believe Jesus took our place, took on our sin, so we can be righteous when we are in front of a Holy God. If we believe the gospel, and give our life to Christ, our sins are forgiven. That does not mean everything suddenly is resolved and our lives are rainbows and butterflies. I have struggled with this greatly but believe the amount of suffering that someone endures to get to the point of wanting to take their life is just sometimes too great. I believe God understands this. Ideally, we are to lay everything at the cross and give Christ our burdens and that is what I try to do. Some days I make it on His strength, some days I don't. But for me and many well versed Christians I have studied do not believe if you kill yourself you automatically go to hell. I cannot comment on any other religion. I am aware the Islamic religion believes that but I have not read the Koran or studied it.

 

[BardBarrie]

My religious friends usually tell me every self deletion case will result in them suffering excruciatingly for eternity.

What do you guys think about this?

Good thing your Islamic friends have just as little authority on the topic of 'what happens after death' as anyone else.

Also, personally I'd question the morals of a creator who would eternally torture a creation for not being able to cope with living in a world designed by said creator.

 

[jar-baby]

If god is omnipotent, omniscient, and merciful why would he even give life to someone he knows is going to ctb and end up in hell suffering for eternity? Is he sending these ppl to hell bc he chooses to?

The Islamic worldview makes it seem like we're essentially just players in a grotesque orchestration that God set up because he was bored (or something). OP could also for instance try asking his friends, if Allah thinks some deaths are "wrong", why He was cool with creating animals that murder other animals.

(not that there's any point using rationale to try to sway a dogmatist).

 

[Coconut blue]

The Islamic worldview makes it seem like we're essentially just players in a grotesque orchestration that God set up because he was bored (or something). OP could also for instance try asking his friends, if Allah thinks some deaths are "wrong", why He was cool with creating animals that murder other animals.

(not that there's any point using rationale to try to sway a dogmatist).

according to Islam, isn't the way it works being everyone goes to hell and allah will choose to save some muslims he believes are deserving? why would i even join a cult like group if membership isnt a ticket to the heaven they promise?

 

[Ambivalent1]

Have you read the Quran? It's nonsensical and was randomly cobbled together back when the surahs were written on leaves.

 

[Mirrory Me]

Well, how do ctb bombers justify it then? Just tell them it's for a holy cause. I'm a Christian and they ssy the ssme things, especially Catholics. I don't buy it though because both great characters like Saul and Samson did it when all battle was lost and they are described as believers who earned resurrection (due to their faith).

"... that is being justified as halal (legitimate) acts of shahada(martyrdom) in the name of the din (faith)."

https://www.esd.whs.mil/Portals/54/Documents/FOID/Reading%20Room/Joint_Staff/13-F-0117_DOC_06-course-materials-perspectives-on-Islam_and_Islamic_radicalism.pdf

 

[Havnis]

It's not for eternity just for period, I had thoroughly studied Islam.

Why would somebody as omnipotent as god care about mere humans killing themselves to begin with?

Because he loves us/them, god exists precisely because people believe on his existence. So there's no difference.

"... that is being justified as halal (legitimate) acts of shahada(martyrdom) in the name of the din (faith)."

https://www.esd.whs.mil/Portals/54/Documents/FOID/Reading%20Room/Joint_Staff/13-F-0117_DOC_06-course-materials-perspectives-on-Islam_and_Islamic_radicalism.pdf

the topic of the increasing use of suicide by Muslim terrorists that is being justified as halal (legitimate) acts of shahada (martyrdom) in the name of the din (faith)

Suicide is never been religiously permitted ever to my knowledge.

 

[Praestat_Mori]

Because he loves us/them, god exists precisely because people believe on his existence. So there's no difference.

That sounds somehow like the quantum effect that when nobody looks at a quantum particle it can be anything it can even not be there. So if nobody believes in god then he's not there and does not exist. When nobody was there to believe in him before everything came into existence then how could he create the world?!

If a god exists he certainly does not love me.

 

[Praestat_Mori]

@Havnis You seem to have knowledge but actually you, like anyone else, does not have any proof that a higher being exists at all (no offence here, everyone is free to believe whatever they want!).

But I have a serious question: If Islam is the "true religion" then how do you explain that it's not a general human instinct to follow all the rules automatically?

I hope you get the point of my question.

It's a human instinct to find the opposite sex and to procreate. But actually Islam prohibits many love relations? I think human instincts can sense much more what would be a beneficial gene mixture for the next generation than a religion that was invented by humans.

 

[ringo99]

It's not just islam. Almost every religion peddles the same bs. I choose to believe that there is nothingness after death. Our consciousness is tied to our living body and mind and once they're gone our consciousness ceases to exist

 

[fedupwithlife]

It's not for eternity just for period, I had thoroughly studied Islam.

There are verses in the Quran that state that the non muslims will be in hell for eternity
"Abiding therein forever, they will not find a protector or a helper." Ahzab:65
Sounds pretty cruel to me

 

[dreamscape1111]

There's no such thing as punishment, it's only an imagined idea invented by people who obviously don't understand God.

God needs nothing, It Is literally Everything, including Nothing, which makes It One and therefore totally Complete.

It can't die, since God has no form and imagines all forms (i/we/you) in Its unlimited Mind.

Your will for you is God's will for you, It doesn't care one way or another, we are just playing in a safe playground.

Parents teach us that love is conditional, but that's not True Love, which is totally unconditionally, not exceptions, no exclusions, since God Is One.

"God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in him."
~ 1 John 4:16

There are no judgments in God's world, since It Is the world of the Absolute, there's no difference between anything.

"I do not love 'good' more than I love 'bad.' Hitler went to heaven. When you understand this, you will understand God."

~ God, Conversations with God, Book 1

There's no getting to Heaven, only a knowing that you're already there. You can't get where you already are.

You are not afraid of hell. You are afraid of the idea of it. That is why you are also afraid to let go of the idea of Christianity. Christianity and hell are both the same idea. Liberate yourself.


That makes the fear you have irrational and unfounded, see?

You've just adopted on faith a concept of hell from an outside source, and now you worry about what could happen if it is let go of. Notice that at some point you didn't have such a belief.

Whatever you are must exist prior to mind activity.


It isn't grounded in anything more than stories you were indoctrinated with as a child.

It's child abuse, really.

There is zero emprical evidence that God sends non-Christians to hell. And it makes no sense why God would do such a silly thing. Do dogs go to hell for not being Christians? Lol. Are we to believe that all the aliens around the universe go to hell because they aren't Christians? This is a cartoonishly biased notion.

If you really believe in a loving God, then such a God would forgive you for mistaken beliefs, not punish you for it.

Just know you are Loved, always, all-ways.


For the Love of God, please listen to this book, it is directly channeled from actual God, pure Infinite Unconditional Love, (not the wrathful, jealous asshole invention made up by religions):

 

[jar-baby]

according to Islam, isn't the way it works being everyone goes to hell and allah will choose to save some muslims he believes are deserving? why would i even join a cult like group if membership isnt a ticket to the heaven they promise?

It's generally believed that if you're a believer, your sins will eventually be forgiven and you'll get to go to heaven. Only non-believers go to hell forever.

 

[anagram]

Islam is mind control