"Life Is Great. Life Gets Better. Look At The Bright Side"... What to say to these people?

[itsmeagain]

Everyone's heard this from optimists that have either gone through not that much trauma, or have been blessed with the courage or circumstance of things getting better to the point where they can't see or are so persistant about pushing the fact onto other people that it gets better. I know one person in my life whom I talk to in person who says this a lot, and I want to have an answer... but I don't want to say "Fuck you, no it doesn't, it never does." What responses that are polite do you normally give to people that can help them think about saying things like that to people that have been through the wringer?

 

[Throwmyselfaway]

Honestly those people I walk away from. Remember the old saying if you have nothing nice to say don't say anything at all? That's usually my case so I walk away. Otherwise I may say something super nasty

 

[avoid_slow_death]

You simply don't. Everyone has a different perspective on things and, despite what we may say, we view others problems through a bias filter that is woven from our own personal experiences.

 

[reapandsow918]

Those people are the type of people that don't suffer from depression or suicidal thoughts. So there's their credibility. They are not you, they don't know what you feel.

You put a fake smile so you won't get put in a psych ward and try to change the conversation.

 

[KN95]

Those people haven't ever experienced the utter hopelessness and misery like those who want to die have.

Damn, I envy those people.

 

[UpandDownPrincess]

When you are truly at your lowest point, there is nowhere to go but up. \_/ That's what they likely mean.

What they have not experienced is that the lowest is not just a point, but can be a long, lateral slog.\_______________________________________________________/

I try to remember that they are usually trying to help. If they had better words, they'd use them. It's not a personal attack (unless they're truly asshats) but an effort to help lift your spirits.

I try not to be angry with people who are genuinely trying to help. When I say that I wouldn't wish my suffering on my worst enemy, I mean it. I wouldn't wish it on someone who's just trying to help.

 

[faust]

Well, I would divide this into 3 levels as it is in games. Okay, starting from EASY level:

EASY:

"Sorry, I think our opinions differ so much that probably we won't understand each other if we continue discussion"
"I think you are right, but of course there are pitfalls and we cannot neglect them"
"This world made us different. This means that we can have different views and that is good. But how about... bla bla bla"

INTERMEDIATE:

"Honestly I don't think you are right in this situation, the light cannot exist without shadows and we were all born from chaos"
"You can always say that seeing copious harvest from your window, but the life may be a tragedy to those who see dark clouds instead of a sunshine"
"When you see the planes crashing, terrorists, famine, rapes worldwide, can you still say that life is amazing?"

HARD:

"If you think so, you are just a child of consumerism. Ignorant sheep which do not see what is on the other side of the field"
"If you believe life is something sacred, then the army is waiting for you. You will forget what is getting up at 12 o'clock, wear combat boots and hear the rumbling voice of a petty officer"
"Wait a sec, I will give you an address. This is a mental hospital, tell'em life is beautiful."

Okay, one more. Let it be extreme.

EXTREME:

"Well, you would better shut up before I started pushing in your mouth the reasons why you are wrong"
"I will now call a taxi, you punk go home and wash your mouth with the soap"
"Bud, if life was so cool to you, you would be now drinking expensive wine, eating lobsters and chilling on Bali instead of talking to me right now. Go get a job that you hate and then I will talk to you"
"See what, the universe exists almost 14 billion years. And this is the first time I hear such a bullshit from you. Is everything okay?"
"Do you know what is the difference between cow shit and bull shit?" -No - So if you don't fucking know anything about shit, why do you talk about life?

 

[KN95]

Well, I would divide this into 3 levels as it is in games. Okay, starting from EASY level:

EASY:

"Sorry, I think our opinions differ so much that probably we won't understand each other if we continue discussion"
"I think you are right, but of course there are pitfalls and we cannot neglect them"
"This world made us different. This means that we can have different views and that is good. But how about... bla bla bla"

INTERMEDIATE:

"Honestly I don't think you are right in this situation, the light cannot exist without shadows and we were all born from chaos"
"You can always say that seeing copious harvest from your window, but the life may be a tragedy to those who see dark clouds instead of a sunshine"
"When you see the planes crashing, terrorists, famine, rapes worldwide, can you still say that life is amazing?"

HARD:

"If you think so, you are just a child of consumerism. Ignorant sheep which do not see what is on the other side of the field"
"If you believe life is something sacred, then the army is waiting for you. You will forget what is getting up at 12 o'clock, wear combat boots and hear the rumbling voice of a petty officer"
"Wait a sec, I will give you an address. This is a mental hospital, tell'em life is beautiful."

Okay, one more. Let it be extreme.

EXTREME:

"Well, you would better shut up before I started pushing in your mouth the reasons why you are wrong"
"I will now call a taxi, you punk go home and wash your mouth with the soap"
"Bud, if life was so cool to you, you would be now drinking expensive wine, eating lobsters and chilling on Bali instead of talking to me right now. Go get a job that you hate and then I will talk to you"
"See what, the universe exists almost 14 billion years. And this is the first time I hear such a bullshit from you. Is everything okay?"
"Do you know what is the difference between cow shit and bull shit?" -No - So if you don't fucking know anything about shit, why do you talk about life?

You came up with this on your own? If so, bravo!

 

[avoid_slow_death]

Well, I would divide this into 3 levels as it is in games. Okay, starting from EASY level:

EASY:

"Sorry, I think our opinions differ so much that probably we won't understand each other if we continue discussion"
"I think you are right, but of course there are pitfalls and we cannot neglect them"
"This world made us different. This means that we can have different views and that is good. But how about... bla bla bla"

INTERMEDIATE:

"Honestly I don't think you are right in this situation, the light cannot exist without shadows and we were all born from chaos"
"You can always say that seeing copious harvest from your window, but the life may be a tragedy to those who see dark clouds instead of a sunshine"
"When you see the planes crashing, terrorists, famine, rapes worldwide, can you still say that life is amazing?"

HARD:

"If you think so, you are just a child of consumerism. Ignorant sheep which do not see what is on the other side of the field"
"If you believe life is something sacred, then the army is waiting for you. You will forget what is getting up at 12 o'clock, wear combat boots and hear the rumbling voice of a petty officer"
"Wait a sec, I will give you an address. This is a mental hospital, tell'em life is beautiful."

Okay, one more. Let it be extreme.

EXTREME:

"Well, you would better shut up before I started pushing in your mouth the reasons why you are wrong"
"I will now call a taxi, you punk go home and wash your mouth with the soap"
"Bud, if life was so cool to you, you would be now drinking expensive wine, eating lobsters and chilling on Bali instead of talking to me right now. Go get a job that you hate and then I will talk to you"
"See what, the universe exists almost 14 billion years. And this is the first time I hear such a bullshit from you. Is everything okay?"
"Do you know what is the difference between cow shit and bull shit?" -No - So if you don't fucking know anything about shit, why do you talk about life?

This is just pure gold. Love it. You are a brilliant wordsmith.

 

[itsmeagain]

T

Well, I would divide this into 3 levels as it is in games. Okay, starting from EASY level:

EASY:

"Sorry, I think our opinions differ so much that probably we won't understand each other if we continue discussion"
"I think you are right, but of course there are pitfalls and we cannot neglect them"
"This world made us different. This means that we can have different views and that is good. But how about... bla bla bla"

INTERMEDIATE:

"Honestly I don't think you are right in this situation, the light cannot exist without shadows and we were all born from chaos"
"You can always say that seeing copious harvest from your window, but the life may be a tragedy to those who see dark clouds instead of a sunshine"
"When you see the planes crashing, terrorists, famine, rapes worldwide, can you still say that life is amazing?"

HARD:

"If you think so, you are just a child of consumerism. Ignorant sheep which do not see what is on the other side of the field"
"If you believe life is something sacred, then the army is waiting for you. You will forget what is getting up at 12 o'clock, wear combat boots and hear the rumbling voice of a petty officer"
"Wait a sec, I will give you an address. This is a mental hospital, tell'em life is beautiful."

Okay, one more. Let it be extreme.

EXTREME:

"Well, you would better shut up before I started pushing in your mouth the reasons why you are wrong"
"I will now call a taxi, you punk go home and wash your mouth with the soap"
"Bud, if life was so cool to you, you would be now drinking expensive wine, eating lobsters and chilling on Bali instead of talking to me right now. Go get a job that you hate and then I will talk to you"
"See what, the universe exists almost 14 billion years. And this is the first time I hear such a bullshit from you. Is everything okay?"
"Do you know what is the difference between cow shit and bull shit?" -No - So if you don't fucking know anything about shit, why do you talk about life?

Thanks for these reples... these gave me some nice ideas for discussion <3

 

[faust]

You came up with this on your own? If so, bravo!

There is one thing I took from an old russian anecdote:
-Do you know who are political whores?
-How to say... Do you know, why ravens shit are drops and sheep's - of circular form?
-No, I don't know
- So you know nothing about shit, but getting into politics?

T

Thanks for these reples... these gave me some nice ideas for discussion <3

No worries, I can actually continue endlessly

 

[waterbottleman]

I've been saying that to myself for almost 10 years.

It hasn't gotten better lol

 

[faust]

I've been saying that to myself for almost 10 years.

It hasn't gotten better lol

It got even worse for me

 

[S1mpleme]

Just walk away from that assholes.

 

[waterbottleman]

It got even worse for me

My life in an external sense hasn't gotten worse, but the fact that it hasn't improved has caused me to lose all hope. So my perspective has definitely gotten worse. Not to mention 10 years of your life wasted with no improvement really sucks.

 

[faust]

My life in an external sense hasn't gotten worse, but the fact that it hasn't improved has caused me to lose all hope. So my perspective has definitely gotten worse. Not to mention 10 years of your life wasted with no improvement really sucks.

From my point of view, it cannot be a plateau. It might be a little fluctuation, but in all cases it is only improving or only getting worse.

 

[waterbottleman]

From my point of view, it cannot be a plateau. It might be a little fluctuation, but in all cases it is only improving or only getting worse.

I think you're right in a certain sense, if your life flat lines you perceive it to be a negative hence your life ends up getting worse. At least that is my perspective.

 

[Jean Améry]

a) What's your evidence?
b) Fuck off.

 

[Intelligent Ape]

Talking with these people - wasting time. They try to judge about things what can't understand - not their own lives.

 

[Hopeindeath!]

You could give them the simple answer of stating that life doesn't get better for everybody, and then list some examples of people whose lives didn't get better.

 

[IRIYAMA]

Personally I call them out and tell them they're fuckheads. Seriously unless they've been down or I'll or live with severe neuropathy or depression, it's near pointless trying to get them to understand this life..

when my family tells me to try something to distract
My response:

 

[porfin1234]

In my case they just say it's not that bad.
And have said it to me all m life.
Funny thing is they were right and now it's actually bad (career job on line).
So it's just gotten worse.
Self fulfilling prophecy at its best.

 

[TAW122]

I don't think there is a good response towards it, but a few options come to my mind are:

A) Just walk away and/or change the conversation (just like how people change conversations on various other topics).

B) (Pretend to) agree with them, also in hopes of them changing the topic or to shut them up.

C) Be a bit snide and curt, and say "Hey that's great, I'm happy for you." (hoping they would shut up and/or change the subject) Then either walk away or change the subject.

@faust Bookmarked your post because it contains a lot of good responses. I like some of your responses, they are witty and funny at the same time. I may even consider using some to people IRL (tweaked to my situation of course).

 

[Amossoma543]

Everyone's heard this from optimists that have either gone through not that much trauma, or have been blessed with the courage or circumstance of things getting better to the point where they can't see or are so persistant about pushing the fact onto other people that it gets better. I know one person in my life whom I talk to in person who says this a lot, and I want to have an answer... but I don't want to say "Fuck you, no it doesn't, it never does." What responses that are polite do you normally give to people that can help them think about saying things like that to people that have been through the wringer?

The problem with these people is that they rarely ever offer anything of substance. I think they mean well, but it's about as effective as "thoughts and prayers". We all have taken time to wait to see if things get better...and they often do get better. We can always find another reason to try out another day.

But there comes a point when you see that this pattern can just be repeated over and over again, all while *sometimes* having good moments, while still dreading those misery moments that will come. That's the rub. We all do this ritual of going through misery...waiting...experiencing an upswing in circumstances, a daily reprieve where we feel good...but always knowing the days are numbered and the misery will descend again, making you wonder why you waited at all.

A person can use this method for their entire lifetime, and perhaps even come back at the end with an old-age death and then reflect back, and at points like that, it's normal to by an optimist, to say comforting things, and say how you're glad you lived a full life. But...do we really want to keep playing this same pattern of events over and over again for decades?

For some people, the answer is just NO. I know things will get better, I know how to "look on the bright side"...I know that we all go through our ups and downs. But...are we willing to just keep repeating this very predictable pattern over and over until we realize we've spent another 10 years just wishing we'd gotten of the bus earlier? Maybe/maybe not.

I guess my point is that this isn't some novel approach, something nobody's ever thought of. I would say that for any person expressing a desire to die...that they've probably repeated this pattern over and over again already. And are we willing to just keep doing what everybody else is doing to make it through one more day?

I think a reasonable time comes when it's okay to say: enough! I've had enough of this...and I choose to put a stop to it for good.

 

[Sensei]

I don't know if this really applies to your situation. I suffer from bipolar disorder and when someone says or indicates that I don't need my medicines and simply need to shape up, I say something along the lines, "They have tried to to treat and cure bipolar disorder for about two thousand years, and psychiatrists and scientists all over the world are still struggling to solve this problem. It's amazing that you have managed to find such an easy solution to this problem and proven all experts around the world wrong. You should be awarded the Nobel prize in medicine."

 

[Soulless_Angel]

I hate those people even worse when they then claim they know EXACTLY what you are going through, and apparently have come out of it the other side,
One person I said Oh right, so I take you have stood on a bridge for over 8 hours in a pretty damned dark place, how did you over come that, she replied she hadn't been there but still knew how I was feeling,
It was a conversation I ended up walking away from, luckily it was a online convo, or I would have had to resist the urge to throw something at her!

these people don't understand the depths, we are in or have been in, they just want happieness and everything normal, they simply cannot understand the other side and chose to avoid it by ramming light at the end of the tunnel shit down our throat,
I used to want to debate them, now I ignore them, I simply don't have the strength or want to argue anymore

 

[Polly]

I've always been fond of "drop dead".

 

[Brick In The Wall]

There is no concession for someone with this line of thought. They usually don't even believe their own rhetoric. There's nothing wrong with wishing someone well. It's when you try to push your ideology on them that it can become a problem.

 

[faust]

I don't know if this really applies to your situation. I suffer from bipolar disorder and when someone says or indicates that I don't need my medicines and simply need to shape up, I say something along the lines, "They have tried to to treat and cure bipolar disorder for about two thousand years, and psychiatrists and scientists all over the world are still struggling to solve this problem. It's amazing that you have managed to find such an easy solution to this problem and proven all experts around the world wrong. You should be awarded the Nobel prize in medicine."

By the time I got to know it is bipolar disorder, it has somehow switched to schizoaffective depressive type. I have read myself more than 200 books about psychology and self-development. And guess what? With such a diagnose it is just a waste of time. And all of those motivational videos are not for us!

 

[purplemoon]

a very sweet and good person has often told me similar platitudes yet she gets to work from home the majority of the time, has a smart, strong good husband to protect her etc, and rarely has to interact with the outside world for more than a couple of hours at a time. She is a fantastic soul that i cherish but she doesn't understand the brutality of violence like i have experienced in life. Her reality has better supportive circumstances than mine.

So it becomes difficult to tell people that truly do not understand that they are wrong. They think it's as simple as just making your mind up to just "think positive", etc. Also it's not just damage from PTSD for example, or if someone is depressed...if they were in better circumstances in the first place, they probably would not have as much anxiety or depression or stress.

I think a lot of people with so-called "mental" conditions are nature's adaptations to an unpredictable environment possibly. If the environment was better/safer/nicer I think they would probably get a lot better congruently.

I would just respond politely something to the effect of...

"thank you for your encouragement and i appreciate your input'.

Rather than get into even a diplomatic debate of sorts, which would just upset you more.

Unless someone is demonstrating very clearly in their behavior that they want to actually listen to your story, and seek to learn your reasons, etc. it probably won't go too well.