Legal ramifications for IC - possible life sentence

[SoftWorries]

In Canada you can be charged for criminal negligence causing death if you provide someone the drugs that they died with.

IC was operating out of Ontario where in 2019 someone was charged for selling fentanyl to a friend which ended in their death.

Can a Fentanyl Dealer be charged with Manslaughter? - Toronto Criminal Lawyers

Health Canada reports that over 10,300 Canadians died as a result of an opioid-related overdose between January 2016 and September 2018, and fentanyl

www.torontocriminallawyers.com

While assisting someone with suicide in Canada could lead to a 14 year incarceration he provided many people with it and is connected to multiple deaths. Likely the welfare checks that everyone is getting is going to be used against him in court especially if people have passed away.

If they charge him for drug trafficking and criminal negligence charges for each person who has died he will possibly be in prison for life.

It's sad thinking that IC's life is likely over and is at least permanently changed.

Edit: I incorrectly misstated his age.

 

[mypersonalhell]

I doubt he will get a life sentence for this, as it operates in a legal gray area (in the open for years) unlike fentanyl. But I agree that his life is basically over at this point.

 

[nosoul]

In Canada you can be charged for criminal negligence causing death if you provide someone the drugs that they died with.

IC was operating out of Ontario where in 2019 someone was charged for selling fentanyl to a friend which ended in their death.

Can a Fentanyl Dealer be charged with Manslaughter? - Toronto Criminal Lawyers

Health Canada reports that over 10,300 Canadians died as a result of an opioid-related overdose between January 2016 and September 2018, and fentanyl

www.torontocriminallawyers.com

While assisting someone with suicide in Canada could lead to a 14 year incarceration he provided many people with it and is connected to multiple deaths. Likely the welfare checks that everyone is getting is going to be used against him in court especially if people have passed away.

If they charge him for drug trafficking and criminal negligence charges for each person who has died he will possibly be in prison for life.

It's sad thinking that IC's life is likely over at 22 and is at least permanently changed.

He was only 22?

 

[Papilio_polyxenes]

To be perfectly honest, I question why he kept record of his purchasers' info, used his real name in correspondence, and didn't maintain much plausible deniability with his websites.

I also wonder if the "wellness checks" we are all going to be receiving aren't a result of cooperation with authorities to reduce his sentence.

He definitely doesn't deserve the harshest penalties - gun manufacturers or pharmaceutical companies aren't treated like this. But let's get real, he knew what he was distributing for profit and why desperate people like us wanted it. I know he's pro-choice, but these consequences were 100% predictable.

 

[Gonnerr]

He was only 22?

No from the picture i saw of him , he is like 60+

 

[Superdeterminist]

He is much older than 22. But I think that it's so unfair what they're doing to him. I hope he receives only a light penalty, if he must receive any.

 

[SoftWorries]

I doubt he will get a life sentence for this, as it operates in a legal gray area (in the open for years) unlike fentanyl. But I agree that his life is basically over at this point.

You're right that they might not press him for drug charges.

In the article I listed it said:

"The legal standard for manslaughter is the 'objective foreseeability of bodily harm', which may or may not include death. Given the known dangers of fentanyl, anyone selling fentanyl to another person is now deemed to be aware of its potentially lethal effect."

Since IC knew the purpose of selling the drugs he might face a harsher punishment than those providing fentanyl since death is not the primary objective in taking the drug. It's a secondary consequence.

They might go after him for manslaughter but there isn't a precedent for it in Canada. Still if he is charged 5-14 years for every death he assisted in it's possible he won't ever get out.

 

[Gonnerr]

I don't think he will do any time , he might use his product before going to jail.

 

[SoftWorries]

He is much older than 22. But I think that it's so unfair what they're doing to him. I hope he receives only a light penalty, if he must receive any.

Oh you're right. I misread the article on the arrest.

I wanted to provide some legal insight on how things work in Canada. He will likely get a long sentence unfortunately.

 

[OceanBlue]

I also wonder if the "wellness checks" we are all going to be receiving aren't a result of cooperation with authorities to reduce his sentence.

You think he gave us up to get out of trouble? Would be uncool since he wasn't careful himself, the buyers shouldn't be punished for that.. and idk how he stored those ID files.

He shouldn't have been giving advice so openly, but from the way he spoke it seems he's fed up with authorities, rebellious. He also overcharged for the product and packaging, so possibly not the most altruistic.

Regardless, the deathline he provided was important, wish they would just leave him alone.

 

[SoftWorries]

You think he gave us up to get out of trouble? Would be uncool since he wasn't careful himself, the buyers shouldn't be punished for that.. and idk how he stored those ID files.

He shouldn't have been giving advice so openly, but from the way he spoke it seems he's fed up with authorities, rebellious. He also overcharged for the product and packaging, so possibly not the most altruistic.

Regardless, the deathline he provided was important, wish they would just leave him alone.

He definitely did not give up the information to get out of trouble. The customers are not being charged with anything. Moreso the welfare checks they are doing are in part to create a case against him.

So perhaps he allowed them access to his files, perhaps they were able to get access when they took in his computer but none of that was done for criminal leniency.

 

[mypersonalhell]

You're right that they might not press him for drug charges.

In the article I listed it said:

"The legal standard for manslaughter is the 'objective foreseeability of bodily harm', which may or may not include death. Given the known dangers of fentanyl, anyone selling fentanyl to another person is now deemed to be aware of its potentially lethal effect."

Since IC knew the purpose of selling the drugs he might face a harsher punishment than those providing fentanyl since death is not the primary objective in taking the drug. It's a secondary consequence.

They might go after him for manslaughter but there isn't a precedent for it in Canada. Still if he is charged 5-14 years for every death he assisted in it's possible he won't ever get out.

It is an interesting case. Since they looked into him before and did not found anything illegal.

In the wake of Raju's death last year, Law told Surrey police that he would stop selling the substance "once his stock was depleted", but has carried on selling it. Surrey police said that, at the time, he was "not known" to be doing anything illegal.

The substance is reportable under the Poisons Act in the UK, meaning retailers must alert the authorities if they suspect it is being bought to cause harm to the buyer or others. However, the rules do not apply to firms outside the UK.

So it will be interesting to know if his own admissions is the thing that will convict him. After all the website did not mention the purpose.

But I dont think he will be punished harder then fentanyl sellers for that reason. Also because the stuff can be used for multiple end purposes.

You think he gave us up to get out of trouble? Would be uncool since he wasn't careful himself, the buyers shouldn't be punished for that.. and idk how he stored those ID files.

He shouldn't have been giving advice so openly, but from the way he spoke it seems he's fed up with authorities, rebellious. He also overcharged for the product and packaging, so possibly not the most altruistic.

Regardless, the deathline he provided was important, wish they would just leave him alone.

It is a legal multipurpose product, therefore he had to register it for tax / anti money laundering purposes. Seems like law enforcement just confiscated those records.

 

[Papilio_polyxenes]

He definitely did not give up the information to get out of trouble. The customers are not being charged with anything. Moreso the welfare checks they are doing are in part to create a case against him.

So perhaps he allowed them access to his files, perhaps they were able to get access when they took in his computer but none of that was done for criminal leniency.

I think his own words in the Times interview are damning enough to create a case against him. Man told his entire life story, boasted about the scale of his operations, and openly acknowledged his product was for CTB.

He seemed to lose sight of the fact that he was basically a drug dealer in the eyes of the state, not a "right to die" activist. Very careless for KL to make both himself and his records so accessible. We can't say with authority that this isn't about leniency - especially if he faced life in prison unless he cooperated.

As for "customers aren't being charged with anything," handling a wellness check wrong could absolutely land you in psychiatric hold. That can lose you a job or place of residence if you live with roommates/family.

Plus, American cops aren't known for exercising discretion and restraint towards mentally ill or disabled people.

 

[Deleted member 31858]

I still can't believe that someone who was just trying to help people get access to peaceful methods would have to go through all this, I know IC was too expensive compared to other vendors but the easy way to get it there was worth the money. I hope they are not so severe with him.

 

[zeenatax]

I don't think a solid case can be built against him. Government may put a lot of pressure to show they are doing something. He may plead guilty for lesser charges. A lot of cases have been brought against tobacco companies and guns manufacturers and sellers and the cases went nowhere. These are very hard to prove cases unless you specifically target through advertising and promotions.

Times is basically a UK tabloid. It used be a reputable paper but not anymore. UK tabloids are notorious for making up things. It is owned by Murdoch family who owns Fox News. His papers are well known for hacking famous people and even ordinary people. A lot times they have been sued and paid a lot of money to settle admitting knowingly reporting lies. No courts will allow these tabloid stories as evidence. Reading the article in Times you can tell half of it is made up. I don't think anyone is that stupid to say things like that.

If the teenagers were able buy the products they probably used fake ids. It is hardly sellers' fault. A lot of times the parents are the cause of teens mental health problems. Even today in the news a Montana politician said she would rather let her daughter to commit suicide rather than let her do a gender affirming surgery. She said she knows her daughter is suicidal but she called it an emotional manipulation. This kind of parents then shift the blame on others.

What surprised me is the scale of this Operation Welfare Check and coordinated timing. All over North America and Europe. I wish they would coordinate like this in real crimes. Well then real crimes are committed by powerful people and big corporations who are the paymasters of our politicians. The whole thing is a scar tactic.