Is the slipknot identical to the traditional hangman's knot?

[Suizident]

Hello,

Could it be that the slipknot is largely identical to the traditional hangman's knot, except that the slipknot
has significantly fewer wraps (1-2) than the hangman's knot (12-13 or more)?

Here is the slip knot:

Here is the traditional hangman's knot (Wikipedia):



-----



If my assumption is correct:

- Why is it advantageous to use fewer turns? Apparently, the noose tightens faster/better?


(I have already gathered from the collection threads that slipknots and nooseknots are better suited for strangulation
than a traditional hangman's knot, and I accept this).



-----
Many thanks and best regards,
Suizident

 

[Eriktf]

im not 100% sure on this but i have tied a hangmans knot many times, mybe 5-10 turns would be ideal but not 100% sure

type of rope would effect it

 

[Suizident]

I should perhaps mention what my question in the opening post is getting at:

If I am correct, and the slip knot is a hangman's knot with only two turns, then I am tying the slip knot correctly. :) Otherwise, there is something wrong with my slip knot.

I'm only asking because, on the other hand, I'm surprised if the slipknot differs from the hangman's knot only in the number of turns. Since the slipknot is recommended for hanging/strangulation by compressing the carotid arteries (along with the noose knot), but the hangman's knot is not recommended.

Off-topic:
I have since found out that the main functional difference between the slipknot and the noose knot is that the slipknot can be untied relatively quickly by hand, whereas the noose knot is more difficult to untie? According to this, the slipknot would always be more suitable for hanging/strangulation by compressing the carotid arteries, also because of SI? (unless you want to leave a back door open...)

 

[Eriktf]

I should perhaps mention what my question in the opening post is getting at:

If I am correct, and the slip knot is a hangman's knot with only two turns, then I am tying the slip knot correctly. :) Otherwise, there is something wrong with my slip knot.

I'm only asking because, on the other hand, I'm surprised if the slipknot differs from the hangman's knot only in the number of turns. Since the slipknot is recommended for hanging/strangulation by compressing the carotid arteries (along with the noose knot), but the hangman's knot is not recommended.

Off-topic:
I have since found out that the main functional difference between the slipknot and the noose knot is that the slipknot can be untied relatively quickly by hand, whereas the noose knot is more difficult to untie? According to this, the slipknot would always be more suitable for hanging/strangulation by compressing the carotid arteries, also because of SI? (unless you want to leave a back door open...)

its not the same, hangmans do tighten and lock

both both will work

your first pic are not a slip knot

Slip Knot

The Slip Knot is one of the most frequently tied knots - being used in knitting as the first loop when casting on – where it is called a slip knot but frequently tied as a noose.

www.animatedknots.com

 

[Suizident]

Thanks for the explanation!!!

Otherwise, the mistake could have led to a fatal error!!!


Hmm, I guess I'll stick with the slipknot? I'm still not quite sure what the difference is between that and a slipknot.

 

[Eriktf]

a slip knot are much more simple to make but will work
hangman are a little more complicated to tie and will make it a little harder to abort a partial since it locks but all in all it doesn't matter that much

i would go for a hangman's just because i could tie it blindfolded so why not

 

[Gustav Hartmann]

I should perhaps mention what my question in the opening post is getting at:

If I am correct, and the slip knot is a hangman's knot with only two turns, then I am tying the slip knot correctly. :) Otherwise, there is something wrong with my slip knot.

I'm only asking because, on the other hand, I'm surprised if the slipknot differs from the hangman's knot only in the number of turns. Since the slipknot is recommended for hanging/strangulation by compressing the carotid arteries (along with the noose knot), but the hangman's knot is not recommended.

Off-topic:
I have since found out that the main functional difference between the slipknot and the noose knot is that the slipknot can be untied relatively quickly by hand, whereas the noose knot is more difficult to untie? According to this, the slipknot would always be more suitable for hanging/strangulation by compressing the carotid arteries, also because of SI? (unless you want to leave a back door open...)

You are comletly right, a slip knot is a hangmans knot with only one turn. The more turns, the more friction in the knot what will prevent the noose from completly tightening. But in terms of pressure on the neck this is marginal.

 

[Forveleth]

That "slip knot" picture you posted is not how to tie a traditional slip knot. Slip knots are tied by making a loop and pulling part of the rope back through (similar to how you tie shoes). What you have there is a type of "slip knot" commonly used for fishing.

For some education:
Slip knots (and their twin the noose knot) are made to constrict and hold things under pressure. These knots are good for partial or full suspension. A hangman's knot, however, is meant to be strong and hold under immense pressure. It is used for long drop or "execution" hanging. Its job is to withstand the forces of a body falling in order to snap the neck. Two very different uses.

The traditional hangman's knot usually has only 7-8 turns.

The difference between the slip knot and noose knot is which end of the rope tightens the loop. A noose knot will tighten when the long or "standing" end is pulled which the slip knot tightens when the tail end is pulled. For partial or full suspension, you will most likely want the noose knot as the long end of your rope will be attached to your anchor. That way it tightens when you put your weight on it.

 

[AreWeWinning]

That "slip knot" picture you posted is not how to tie a traditional slip knot. Slip knots are tied by making a loop and pulling part of the rope back through (similar to how you tie shoes). What you have there is a type of "slip knot" commonly used for fishing.

For some education:
Slip knots (and their twin the noose knot) are made to constrict and hold things under pressure. These knots are good for partial or full suspension. A hangman's knot, however, is meant to be strong and hold under immense pressure. It is used for long drop or "execution" hanging. Its job is to withstand the forces of a body falling in order to snap the neck. Two very different uses.

The traditional hangman's knot usually has only 7-8 turns.

The difference between the slip knot and noose knot is which end of the rope tightens the loop. A noose knot will tighten when the long or "standing" end is pulled which the slip knot tightens when the tail end is pulled. For partial or full suspension, you will most likely want the noose knot as the long end of your rope will be attached to your anchor. That way it tightens when you put your weight on it.

This ☝

In addition:

A Noose Knot with two turns is called a Poacher's Knot, which is also suitable.

Also, important: always add a stopper knot in the tail end of the Noose Knot, as close to the Noose Knot as possible. Without a stopper knot, it can slip. It's a very good idea to add a stopper knot to the Poacher's Knot as well. (Or to any knot for that matter.)

Regarding the Hangman's Noose, I wouldn't use it. Based on my tests, it's so stiff that it doesn't tighten well under load, or doesn't tighten at all. It's adjustable, but once under load, it just jams up straight away.

 

[Gustav Hartmann]

This ☝

In addition:

A Noose Knot with two turns is called a Poacher's Knot, which is also suitable.

Also, important: always add a stopper knot in the tail end of the Noose Knot, as close to the Noose Knot as possible. Without a stopper knot, it can slip. It's a very good idea to add a stopper knot to the Poacher's Knot as well. (Or to any knot for that matter.)

Regarding the Hangman's Noose, I wouldn't use it. Based on my tests, it's so stiff that it doesn't tighten well under load, or doesn't tighten at all. It's adjustable, but once under load, it just jams up straight away.

Iran hanged thousends of people by use of the hangman´s noose and only one person survived, because he was taken too early from the gallows.

 

[Worndown]

Here are two pictures.
#1 shows how to tie a small, fixed loop.
#2 shows how it gets used.
Slides easily, easy to tie.

 

[Gustav Hartmann]

Here are two pictures.
#1 shows how to tie a small, fixed loop.
#2 shows how it gets used.
Slides easily, easy to tie.

View attachment 176266View attachment 176267

This is for sure most secure knot and noose, you can also put the horizontal beam of your gallows in this noose.

 

[JesiBel]

Well, in the end everyone is free to use the knot they prefer.

I would use a knot that easily adjusts itself when applying weight (to achieve better, more even compression), and that slides easily, without getting stuck.

Like the Noose knot with stopper knot (also known as Arbor knot), it's simple, easy and it does its job.

As for untying the knot... before any attempt you have to be 100% sure of your actions. I'm looking for a knot that facilitates the death mechanism, not one that allows me to "save myself".

 

[Suizident]

a slip knot are much more simple to make but will work
hangman are a little more complicated to tie and will make it a little harder to abort a partial since it locks but all in all it doesn't matter that much

i would go for a hangman's just because i could tie it blindfolded so why not

The hangman's knot for strangulation (tying off the carotid arteries) is discouraged in the major hanging threads here in the forum. The videos also suggest that unconsciousness occurs later with the hangman's knot than with the slipknot or the noose knot.

Ultimately, it is also misleading that the forum and the internet in general refer to "hanging" (which normally leads to a broken neck) even when they actually mean strangulation (tightening of the carotid arteries).

Also, important: always add a stopper knot in the tail end of the Noose Knot, as close to the Noose Knot as possible. Without a stopper knot, it can slip. It's a very good idea to add a stopper knot to the Poacher's Knot as well. (Or to any knot for that matter.)

Good idea. For simplicity's sake, perhaps a completely "normal" knot (what is it called, actually) as a stopper knot?

Here are two pictures.
#1 shows how to tie a small, fixed loop.
#2 shows how it gets used.
Slides easily, easy to tie.

View attachment 176266View attachment 176267

So, in addition to slip knots and noose knots, is this another variation of a self-tightening slip knot?

I would use a knot that easily adjusts itself when applying weight (to achieve better, more even compression), and that slides easily, without getting stuck.

So, a noose knot (arbor knot)?

 

[Eriktf]

we can discuss all day about what knot to use but if you tie you knots correctly then it do not matter that much

get a good anchor point, good rope and tie some kind of a noose that wont get undone then your good to go

so far i seen: hangman's knot, slip knot, noose knot, overhand loop knot and we can probably come up with a alot more and all would be just as good

some will need a stopper knot but they are all more or less the same

do whatever knot you want then test your setup if everything looks good then it is good

 

[JesiBel]

So, a noose knot (arbor knot)?

Yes, if you add a stopper knot to the Noose knot it is called an Arbor Knot:





Adding a stopper knot gives more security to the Noose Knot.