Discussion Is death the end?

[telemark05]

While I was very depressed and suicidal I started diving into spirituality and that stuff. I have become pretty convinced that there must be something to the universe. The world is very mystical and almost magic in a way if you really think about it. I don't believe that the big bang suddenly created the universe from nothing because something can't just come from nothing. There has to have been something before that, and before that, and before that in an infinite loop. So I think that the universe is infinite which kinda terrifies me. Does that mean there are infinite possibilites and outcomes, and that I am forever stuck in this universe because I came out of the world and not into it? Then how can people say for certain that death is the end when everything im made of comes from the universe itself. Why would I not come back again as something else in a million years? There's so much we don't know or can explain. The only thing we know for certain is your own existence and that you can't remember anything before this life, but most people don't even know who they are and only rely on labels, thoughts and upbringing etc. But if you ask yourself "Who am I?" you realize you're something much deeper than that. It's scary and relieving depending on how you look at it. I just can't stop thinking about this. Im very open minded so please share your thoughts if you agree or not.

 

[dontletthembribeyou]

I don't think it's possible to know for sure either way. Those who claim to be certain that there is no life after death are making the same fundamental error as those who feel certain that there is some kind of afterlife. Personally, I believe hope we get reincarnated. I love the world and I want to live a good life, it's just that the life I'm living right now is unsalvagable

 

[SignatureRequired]

If you're familiar with the theory that the universe will at some stage suffer from heat death; basically all the black holes with grow so large and merge into one giant black hole. In a way, with nothing to compare this black hole to, it essentially becomes nothing due to it being the only thing there is. I feel that in this state, it is unsustainable, and it must explode at some point (perhaps eons?). Essentially, creating a brand new big bang.

Now whether or not this big bang is unique in comparison to the one before is a different story. Perhaps it is the same, and this exact movement of matter has happened thousands of times before, and that would mean each action has happened the same way ever since the start of the universe. If the way the big bang explodes is unique, then this is all completely different to what came before. Maybe there wasn't any such thing as life previously?

Anyway, I am still trying to understand how this ties into my other beliefs, but I feel like it makes too much sense, even if science hasn't fully concluded it.

 

[DivineSpark]

I like to think life on our planet has purpose, that we are not merely just cosmic accident.

 

[Hollowman]

Yes

 

[Apathy79]

Agree with you that death won't be the end. My near death experience convinced me of that. It's fascinating to think about, but there's no answers at the end, only one way to find out for sure!

 

[telemark05]

Agree with you that death won't be the end. My near death experience convinced me of that. It's fascinating to think about, but there's no answers at the end, only one way to find out for sure!

Wow, that's interesting. Could you tell me more about your near death experience?

 

[FuneralCry]

I certainly do believe so, I believe death to just be non-existence where this existence I always saw as the most terrible, cruel mistake is finally all gone and forgotten about and all I hope is to be unconscious for all eternity, I just want to never suffer ever again, for me non-existence really is all that's positive and is all I see as desirable. I'd just always prefer to peacefully not exist than suffer so unnecessarily in this cruel, torturous existence where there is no limit as to how much one can suffer that I never would had chosen and would never wish for, all I wish is for peace from the abomination of existence, I just want to never suffer again.

 

[Apathy79]

Wow, that's interesting. Could you tell me more about your near death experience?

I was in a car accident. Got severe whiplash and went unconscious. Next thing I knew I was looking down at the accident from above. Like I was floating above it. I could see the accident, the cars backing up, the police and ambulance arriving, my body being pulled out of the car, someone trying to revive it. One striking element was I didn't care about my body. It was no different to me than anything else in the scene. Also the feeling itself was blissful. When I returned to the body, it was a disappointment. And not because I was suicidal at the time either - far from it - I liked life - but it was nothing compared to that state.

All of which convinced me that will likely be the first thing that happens when I die, but it still leaves a monumental unknown beyond that.

 

[Parnate]

I want this to not be the end. I want another life , a better life, a beautiful life.

 

[SVEN]

Many theorise, however I greatly doubt anyone can produce demonstratable evidence one way or the other.

 

[intr0verse]

I have no reasons to believe otherwise; yeah, i think death is the end of all experience.

 

[angelalexandra]

while i think its most likely that one simply returns to oblivion when they die, the nature of conciousness is a very strange thing, and it wouldnt be surprising to me if one experiences something post-mortem. having DID has given me and my alters some intresting ideas about its how it forms and where it goes, as silly as they may be.

 

[Andrew10]

Not for me, there is no end to my life because I never had one

 

[ThatRussianDude]

We are biological robots. What happens when robots are destroyed/break up? - nothing, its software stops working.

 

[quietwoods]

It's probable that we just return to nothing, nonexistence.

But existence, the universe, and consciousness are things that are poorly understood, if understood at all.

Consciousness and self-awareness really shouldn't be possible. It's unexplained and likely always will be. So I am open to the idea that there's something more complex at play.

 

[Darkover]

I have become pretty convinced that there must be something to the universe. The world is very mystical and almost magic in a way if you really think about it. I don't believe that the big bang suddenly created the universe from nothing because something can't just come from nothing. There has to have been something before that, and before that, and before that in an infinite loop. So I think that the universe is infinite which kinda terrifies me. Does that mean there are infinite possibilites and outcomes, and that I am forever stuck in this universe because I came out of the world and not into it? Then how can people say for certain that death is the end when everything im made of comes from the universe itself. Why would I not come back again as something else in a million years? There's so much we don't know or can explain. The only thing we know for certain is your own existence and that you can't remember anything before this life

the universe is finite by focusing on scale, matter, and limits.
matter only gets so small, and that's a real, measurable limit. In physics.

Planck length (~1.6 x 10⁻³⁵ meters) – the smallest meaningful length scale in quantum gravity.

Planck time (~5.4 x 10⁻⁴⁴ seconds) – the smallest meaningful time interval.

Below these, the very concept of space and time breaks down. There's no "smaller" that has any physical meaning—just mathematical abstraction. That implies a bottom floor to reality. It's not infinitely divisible.

So if there's a minimum size and structure to matter, that suggests a finite number of building blocks, especially in a given volume of space.

Reality is made of finite components. If matter only goes so small, and energy is limited, then so is the universe itself.

So, while very large, the universe doesn't necessarily offer infinite possibilities. There's probably a finite but massive number of permutations.

Even if the universe is finite in size, energy, and information—it doesn't rule out it being eternal in time. You could still have cycles: universes expanding, contracting, rebooting. Finite structures rearranging forever.

So you may still "come back" in some sense—not because the universe is infinite, but because the same ingredients may remix themselves in endless variations over cosmic time.

If something had always existed, it would have progressed infinitely already. But because we're in a primitive or undeveloped state,
the universe must have had a beginning—from nothing.

something had existed forever—truly infinite time—then anything that can happen, would have already happened an infinite number of times.

All stars would have already formed, evolved, and died an infinite number of times.

Civilizations would've had infinite time to rise, fall, and advance.

If the universe had always existed, it shouldn't be so unfinished. It should be infinitely evolved. The fact that it's not suggests it had a beginning.

 

[ringo99]

Sorry if you think I'm harsh, but yes, death is very much the end imo. There's no such thing as an afterlife. It's just an invention of power hungry pos in every religion to manipulate the masses and eliminate the crippling and destructive fear that mentally unprepared humans (which is most of us, let's be real) will feel if they realized that a lifetime of memories, actions and experiences mean absolutely nothing after death. Your consciousness ceases to exist and your body rots away. That's all.

 

[Darkover]

Sorry if you think I'm harsh, but yes, death is very much the end imo. There's no such thing as an afterlife. It's just an invention of power hungry pos in every religion to manipulate the masses and eliminate the crippling and destructive fear that mentally unprepared humans (which is most of us, let's be real) will feel if they realized that a lifetime of memories, actions and experiences mean absolutely nothing after death. Your consciousness ceases to exist and your body rots away. That's all.

You have no proof that this is your first or only time being

 

[ringo99]

You have no proof that this is your first or only time being

Neither do you or anyone else. Just a bunch of stories in a bunch of ancient books. Hence the imo in my comment

 

[sambrosia]

I want this to not be the end. I want another life , a better life, a beautiful life.

I agree with this. Regarding my current existence, I had so much potential, if not for my diseased brain. I would like another chance at life, with a different brain.

I used to think death was just the end, and, I guess I believe it's the end of my conscious experience as me, but I want to believe there's something after. If nothing else, my atoms return to the world, and who's to say they won't rearrange into another great accident and bring me back as a human.

 

[pthnrdnojvsc]

Yes . Death is the end.

1 micro second after my brain dies i will cease to exist forever.

non-existence forever is the only guarantee of never suffering so bad the suffering is a trilion times worse than you can imagine. Permanent non-existence is the only guarantee of never suffering , no pain, no problems no bad memories ever. so eternal non-existence is the only perfection, the ultimate bliss.

what i am is cells, chemical reactions, an animal , a machine. but also a brain that can suffer unending constant unbearable pain. to me i wouldn't want to continue that and that's just one reason i want non-existence forever asap. why would i want to exist ? to suffer ?

yes i'm glad after Death i won't exist .but in the meantime i still have a long way and very risky to avoid extreme suffering to finally get to non-existence . so i want to suicide to get to non-existence and skip over any extreme suffering.

what i am is an illusion created by my brain, a machine . 1 micro second after my brain dies it can never create the illusion there is a me

there is decades , thousands of experiments , and all research confirms that the brain creates consciousness.

Frontiers | The Attention Schema Theory: A Foundation for Engineering Artificial Consciousness

The purpose of the attention schema theory is to explain how an information-processing device, the brain, arrives at the claim that it possesses a non-physic...

www.frontiersin.org

 

[telemark05]

the universe is finite by focusing on scale, matter, and limits.
matter only gets so small, and that's a real, measurable limit. In physics.

Planck length (~1.6 x 10⁻³⁵ meters) – the smallest meaningful length scale in quantum gravity.

Planck time (~5.4 x 10⁻⁴⁴ seconds) – the smallest meaningful time interval.

Below these, the very concept of space and time breaks down. There's no "smaller" that has any physical meaning—just mathematical abstraction. That implies a bottom floor to reality. It's not infinitely divisible.

So if there's a minimum size and structure to matter, that suggests a finite number of building blocks, especially in a given volume of space.

Reality is made of finite components. If matter only goes so small, and energy is limited, then so is the universe itself.

So, while very large, the universe doesn't necessarily offer infinite possibilities. There's probably a finite but massive number of permutations.

Even if the universe is finite in size, energy, and information—it doesn't rule out it being eternal in time. You could still have cycles: universes expanding, contracting, rebooting. Finite structures rearranging forever.

So you may still "come back" in some sense—not because the universe is infinite, but because the same ingredients may remix themselves in endless variations over cosmic time.

If something had always existed, it would have progressed infinitely already. But because we're in a primitive or undeveloped state,
the universe must have had a beginning—from nothing.

something had existed forever—truly infinite time—then anything that can happen, would have already happened an infinite number of times.

All stars would have already formed, evolved, and died an infinite number of times.

Civilizations would've had infinite time to rise, fall, and advance.

If the universe had always existed, it shouldn't be so unfinished. It should be infinitely evolved. The fact that it's not suggests it had a beginning.

Yes, but a beginning still can't come from nothing. If you think stuff just randomly spawned out of nowhere, then I think a god is more likely to have caused that.

 

[JoaoBye]

Permanent non existence. Where we came from. Were we go.

Im tired of being me

 

[ididnotconsent]

I don't think anyone can definitively prove if it is or not. However when i look at 8 billion plus people, it seems a bit arrogant to think my consciousness is so special that is goes on forever.

I'm okay with non existence after death, it really doesn't bother me. I just don't want the process to hurt, for there to be a hell, re-incarnate as a Jewish inmate in Auschwitz or some other crazy bullshit like that. That unknown does scare me. I just want us to all find peace forever.

 

[Darkover]

Yes, but a beginning still can't come from nothing. If you think stuff just randomly spawned out of nowhere, then I think a god is more likely to have caused that.

How can there be a beginning if nothing existed before it? And if something did cause it, then where did that come from?

if you prescribe to the idea that god created everything that doesn't explain what created god the obvious conclusion to be drawn is that something did come into existence from nothing

God as a More Coherent First Cause

If "something cannot come from nothing," then logically, something must have always existed—but that something can't just be stuff. It would need to:

Exist beyond time and space

Not require a cause itself

Have the power to create

Be timeless, necessary, not contingent

That sounds very much like the philosophical concept of God—not necessarily the religious figure, but the uncaused cause, or necessary being.

Everything we know of—objects, people, stars, thoughts—has a beginning and an end.
Everything we observe follows this pattern:

Stars are born from gas clouds and eventually die as white dwarfs, neutron stars, or black holes.

Organisms begin with birth and end in death.

Civilizations rise and fall.

Even atomic particles decay (e.g., protons may decay over unimaginable timescales).

Thoughts arise in the mind and vanish just as quickly.

In other words, the entire universe appears to operate under temporality and impermanence. Nothing seems truly eternal.

This makes it feel natural—even necessary—to assume that:

The universe itself must also have had a beginning and will someday end.

 

[DTA]

I read a paper by a an ex-NASA scientist once where he crunched the numbers on the big bang. He concluded if all the known matter in the universe was compressed into a singularity then exploded, it would not have had enough energy to escape its own gravity and would have almost immediately collapsed back into a singularity.

I'm no scientist, so I could be wrong here. But from what I know of quantum physics it seems that consciousness is a requirement for reality rather than a byproduct (which means it had to have existed first in some form at 'the beginning'). I think of it like a Minecraft world where everything outside of one's immediate vicinity exists in theory until a player goes there and the world generates (collapses) the probability into a playable world.

But the established fact that a conscious mind's observations affect objective reality implies that consciousness is more than electrical signals firing between brain cells. Because of that I believe there is an existence after death, and perhaps also before.

 

[Darkover]

it seems that consciousness is a requirement for reality rather than a byproduct

Claim: Quantum physics proves consciousness creates or collapses reality.

This is not true based on mainstream physics. Here's why:
1. Misunderstanding the Observer in Quantum Mechanics

In quantum mechanics, "observer" doesn't mean a conscious human.

It refers to any interaction that extracts information from a quantum system—like a photon hitting a screen, a detector registering a particle, or an atom colliding with another.

So, wave function collapse is triggered by physical interactions, not by human awareness.

This idea that consciousness collapses reality stems from early interpretations (e.g., Wigner, von Neumann), but these were philosophical, not experimental.

This idea that consciousness collapses reality stems from early interpretations (e.g., Wigner, von Neumann), but these were philosophical, not experimental. Modern physics has moved away from this idea.

 

[Apathy79]

God as a More Coherent First Cause

If "something cannot come from nothing," then logically, something must have always existed—but that something can't just be stuff. It would need to:

Exist beyond time and space

Not require a cause itself

Have the power to create

Be timeless, necessary, not contingent

That sounds very much like the philosophical concept of God—not necessarily the religious figure, but the uncaused cause, or necessary being.

Yeah. No beginning and no end. Always was, always will be. The rest (time, space, cause, etc) is us trying to explain our miniscule perceptual experience of it. Open loops we'll never be able to explain with our limited apparatus frustrates people endlessly.

Reminds me of Zeno's paradox(es). I still can't figure out if he's right 2500 years later.

 

[Darkover]

No beginning and no end. Always was, always will be.

everything that has a beginning has an end is a statement about the nature of existence and time, suggesting that all things, from the smallest to the largest, have a finite lifespan and undergo a cycle of creation and destruction. This can be seen in various aspects of life, from the life cycle of an insect to the eventual demise of a star