Inert gas (N2 and/or CO2) to not look like suicide?

[thelastfish]

Hello all, can anyone tell me if this will work?

I have decided that I want to shuffle off this mortal coil in a few months. I'll turn 80 in September, and that's more than enough time on this earth! I lost my wife 2 years ago, and have constant back pain that won't be getting better. The only things medical science can do for me would take too long, be too expensive and offer too little relief.

I have been paying the premiums on my life insurance policy for decades, and I want my daughter to be able to collect it. It will give her the financial security she has never had, so my death can't look like a suicide!

Here is what I was thinking: I can get a tank of nitrogen, or carbon dioxide, or both, and have them in my bedroom, turning them on when I go to sleep. The bedroom is sealed pretty tight, no furnace register or AC vents. My neighbor has kindly agreed to come the next morning to open the sliding glass door to my bedroom (from the outside, of course) to let all the gas blow away, and then to take the tanks away later once he has let it air out. I live at the end of a private road, so no one will see this. The next day he would come by "to check on me", find me, call an ambulance, and that would be that (I hope)!

It sounds like this would be a painless way to go (good!), but my question is this: since there would be no signs of foul play, do you think that the paramedics, police or coroner would just assume I had died because I'm so old!, or would they be likely to do an autopsy? If they did, would they be able to tell that I had been breathing this mix instead of air? I've heard of little red dots that can sometimes appear below the skin and in the eyes, that can point to CO2 poisoning, and that there is a "blood gas test" they can do, but I don't know if the results would be different if I had been gone for a day or more.

Does anyone know anything about this? Particularly about the gasses and how much would be enough but not too much! I am grateful for any advice.

-Fish

 

[WhatIsMyLife]

Your neighbor is taking a big risk here. That's aiding a suicide, which can be a lengthy jail term.

 

[Meowkin]

If the heating in your house "malfunctioned" it might be an opportunity for you to use charcoal in your house for indoor heating. If your room is well insulated, carbon monoxide could build up without your having to take obvious measures to seal the room. You also wouldn't need the neighbour to dispose of the evidence as the evidence would point to accidental death from using charcoal to heat your room in a poorly ventilated space.

 

[autumnal]

Hello all, can anyone tell me if this will work?

I have decided that I want to shuffle off this mortal coil in a few months. I'll turn 80 in September, and that's more than enough time on this earth! I lost my wife 2 years ago, and have constant back pain that won't be getting better. The only things medical science can do for me would take too long, be too expensive and offer too little relief.

I have been paying the premiums on my life insurance policy for decades, and I want my daughter to be able to collect it. It will give her the financial security she has never had, so my death can't look like a suicide!

Here is what I was thinking: I can get a tank of nitrogen, or carbon dioxide, or both, and have them in my bedroom, turning them on when I go to sleep. The bedroom is sealed pretty tight, no furnace register or AC vents. My neighbor has kindly agreed to come the next morning to open the sliding glass door to my bedroom (from the outside, of course) to let all the gas blow away, and then to take the tanks away later once he has let it air out. I live at the end of a private road, so no one will see this. The next day he would come by "to check on me", find me, call an ambulance, and that would be that (I hope)!

It sounds like this would be a painless way to go (good!), but my question is this: since there would be no signs of foul play, do you think that the paramedics, police or coroner would just assume I had died because I'm so old!, or would they be likely to do an autopsy? If they did, would they be able to tell that I had been breathing this mix instead of air? I've heard of little red dots that can sometimes appear below the skin and in the eyes, that can point to CO2 poisoning, and that there is a "blood gas test" they can do, but I don't know if the results would be different if I had been gone for a day or more.

Does anyone know anything about this? Particularly about the gasses and how much would be enough but not too much! I am grateful for any advice.

-Fish

As well as the clear legal risks which @WhatIsMyLife mentions, I'd say the concentrations of gases are going to be at best unreliable and at worst insufficient when essentially using an entire room as your Exit Bag.

Note also that using carbon dioxide would not be peaceful, either on its own or in combination with another gas. Rising levels of carbon dioxide in the body produce oxygen hunger, panic and survival instinct.

There are accounts I believe of using an Exit Bag and having someone else remove it after your death. These may be in one of the printed books that is available in the Resource Compilation. But obviously that still brings the same legal problems for your accomplice.

You may be better off dying by some form of misadventure.

EDIT: Also, whatever method you choose, make sure you thoroughly remove all traces of researching suicide from your computer and other devices. In any kind of death investigation, these may be examined.

 

[thelastfish]

Your neighbor is taking a big risk here. That's aiding a suicide, which can be a lengthy jail term.

My neighbor is 74, and he offered to help, I didn't twist his arm! Even in a worst case scenario what would they try to get him for? He isn't causing my suicide, only cleaning up after it!

If the heating in your house "malfunctioned" it might be an opportunity for you to use charcoal in your house for indoor heating. If your room is well insulated, carbon monoxide could build up without your having to take obvious measures to seal the room. You also wouldn't need the neighbour to dispose of the evidence as the evidence would point to accidental death from using charcoal to heat your room in a poorly ventilated space.

It probably won't be cold then, and my house has radiant heating so it would be hard to make it look like something had gone amiss. Do people in the first world really burn charcoal for warmth? I would think that if anything it would look suspicious to the coroner or police. But I am far from an expert!

As well as the clear legal risks which @WhatIsMyLife mentions, I'd say the concentrations of gases are going to be at best unreliable and at worst insufficient when essentially using an entire room as your Exit Bag.

Note also that using carbon dioxide would not be peaceful, either on its own or in combination with another gas. Rising levels of carbon dioxide in the body produce oxygen hunger, panic and survival instinct.

There are accounts I believe of using an Exit Bag and having someone else remove it after your death. These may be in one of the printed books that is available in the Resource Compilation. But obviously that still brings the same legal problems for your accomplice.

You may be better off dying by some form of misadventure.

EDIT: Also, whatever method you choose, make sure you thoroughly remove all traces of researching suicide from your computer and other devices. In any kind of death investigation, these may be examined.

Would CO2 be more unpleasant than just CO? How about nitrogen?

I read about the exit bag but I was concerned about the red skin dots and red spots in the eyes that can sometimes appear. I think if they were just on my head it would look odd. And I think it would be awful for my neighbor to have to take a bag off of my head.

My neighbor recommended something called Tor that I am using only for this web page. I will get rid of it before the day.

 

[autumnal]

My neighbor is 74, and he offered to help, I didn't twist his arm! Even in a worst case scenario what would they try to get him for? He isn't causing my suicide, only cleaning up after it!

It probably won't be cold then, and my house has radiant heating so it would be hard to make it look like something had gone amiss. Do people in the first world really burn charcoal for warmth? I would think that if anything it would look suspicious to the coroner or police. But I am far from an expert!

Would CO2 be more unpleasant than just CO? How about nitrogen?

I read about the exit bag but I was concerned about the red skin dots and red spots in the eyes that can sometimes appear. I think if they were just on my head it would look odd. And I think it would be awful for my neighbor to have to take a bag off of my head.

My neighbor recommended something called Tor that I am using only for this web page. I will get rid of it before the day.

Nobody suggested you were twisting your neighbour's arm. But by deliberately hiding the fact that your death was a suicide, he would be an accessory to the insurance fraud. I'm not saying they would neccesarily throw the book at him, but the potential penalties certainly aren't nothing.

Here is a brief explainer on why carbon dioxide would be very unpleasant.

I don't think you should be even considering filling your entire room with gas until someone with more experience confirms that it would be a viable method for the reasons I mentioned previously.

Is there anything stopping you from dying from some kind of misadventure? That way, you wouldn't need to involve anyone as an accessory.

 

[Kumachan]

CO2 is extremely unpleasant way to go id imagine. Thats the gas that triggers the urge to inhale infact(not the lack of oxygen). CO or any inert gas would be peaceful. If CO2 was peaceful a simple plastic bagd be way to go... But its not

 

[shipwreck]

I'm sorry to hear about your unhappy situation. I don't mean to sound harsh, but what you're proposing is ill conceived. I won't rehash the previous posts but I'll just say that I echo them. CO2 in particular sounds like an agonizing way to go. And while your neighbor seems kind, he's putting himself at a lot of risk. There are too many "maybes" and "what ifs". Please reconsider.

 

[GoodPersonEffed]

Have you checked your insurance policy to be certain that suicide nullifies the policy after the first two years? It may still be covered.

Yes, CO may show the red dots (I also think you're confusing CO2 with CO, CO would be charcoal poisoning or from a generator). A nitrogen or argon exit bag would be a better way to go (lots of info on this site, look up posts by @fightingsioux), and have the neighbor remove the equipment. If they're willing, it's their choice and their risk.

If you don't have any known health conditions that would lead to death, there will likely be an autopsy.

 

[thelastfish]

Thank you, GoodPersonEffed, for the info! I read through fightingsoux's posts; he was very informative!

The only chronic health conditions I have would be unlikely to cause my death. In my Advance Care Directive and my instructions to my executor, I state that I would prefer there to not be an autopsy. I understand that suspected foul play would override that, but I'm hoping that being 80, and there being no evidence of anything being amiss, would keep their motivation low.

From what you and others say, it sounds like CO2 is not an option, which leaves me with Nitrogen. (And you're right, I meant CO2, but wrote CO! Oops) I don't know anything about argon. I will look into that.

Afraid my life insurance policy specifically says that it will not pay out due to suicide. I bought the policy in 1967, so it was written in a different era. I once tried adding up how much I paid over the years, expecting it to be able to take care of my wife in her old age, and it was over $55,000. I would hate to have thrown that away! My daughter should get something out of it!

autumnal said "Is there anything stopping you from dying from some kind of misadventure?"

Yes, me! I want my exit to be as unlikely as possible to fail, and to not be a horrible thing to go through. I can't think of anything that satisfies both of those, and won't raise suspicions of foul play or suicide. The last thing I want is to "fall off a mountain" or drive my car off a cliff, only to end up paralyzed, or "drown while fishing", but instead get pneumonia!

 

[Aap]

If worried about looking like suicide, you must use nitrogen. No Ar, no He.

 

[shipwreck]

If worried about looking like suicide, you must use nitrogen. No Ar, no He.

Why no Ar or He?

 

[Aap]

High concentrations of Ar or He in the alveoli of the lungs are not natural

 

[shipwreck]

True, but detection seems unlikely. Hypoxia can be inferred from an autopsy as well.

 

[Aap]

Certainly true, and if OP is in poor health with a chronic condition, then ME analysis may be cursory. That said, the comments still hold. GC-MS of lung gases would definitely point to a non natural death if He or Ar are used. Given what the OP is considering, it would be reckless not to use Nitrogen and expose someone else to that risk.