If you fail an attempt, recovering becomes cheaper, data shows

[penguinl0v3s]

I'm reading this book by Thomas Joiner and this caught my interest. It shows that people don't care as much until you attempt to kys, at least my pessimistic interpretation says

 

[Shrike]

Ah so that's what's I've been doing wrong my whole life, I've never properly attempted.

 

[Homo erectus]

The "it's not your time" near death experience is informative then. The person goes back and does something 20% more valuable.

 

[Forever Sleep]

I've wondered this myself... Whether the reason some people (apparently) go on to be grateful they didn't succeed in their attempt is because maybe finally they were taken notice of and given the help they needed.

It's like that statistic I don't entirely believe... supposedly nine out of ten people who fail an attempt don't go on to die by suicide. (Supposedly.)

 

[divinemistress36]

The "it's not your time" near death experience is informative then. The person goes back and does something 20% more valuable.

My friend has one and he's all about helping people now

 

[girlsboysthems]

i mean im kinda sceptical. luckily i have insurance so that wasnt a problem but i think for americans an unsuccessful attempt can be financially very damaging, but for me it caused to not have an income for the time i was hospitalized which was a problem because bills still gotta get paid, and i had less social support than before tbh. it might just be my case tho.

 

[motob]

Honestly I get what they're saying. The most attentive treatment I got was when I was close to just CTB. When I could just tell I was sliding towards it, I could barely get the time of day. It made me consider drastic measures just to get anyone to pay attention to me medically.

 

[dinosavr]

The thing is that each one of us is a separate human being, not a statistic :(

 

[Bianka]

An unsuccessful attempt can be financially very damaging, but for me it caused to not have an income for the time i was hospitalized which was a problem because bills still gotta get paid, and i had less social support than before tbh. it might just be my case tho.

Definitely. I had a different but kinda same situation. Hospitalization messed up my studies, I should have a degree soon but now I still have years to go, therapy was hella expensive, meds cost money, I'm in the system now so if a company really wants to "look into me" before hireing I'm screwed... So increase in income is not something I ever saw or will

 

[LaVieEnRose]

Only economically costly in terms of bills in fuckinf America.

It's difficult to find free medical care in America no matter what your mood.

The medical "care" that is forced on people isn't free. He just said in the prior paragraph that it was a reason why attempted suicide could be costly.

 

[rozeske]

In a way it does make sense about some people's failed attempts improving their perspective in life.

 

[penguinl0v3s]

The "it's not your time" near death experience is informative then. The person goes back and does something 20% more valuable.

I've wondered this myself... Whether the reason some people (apparently) go on to be grateful they didn't succeed in their attempt is because maybe finally they were taken notice of and given the help they needed.

It's like that statistic I don't entirely believe... supposedly nine out of ten people who fail an attempt don't go on to die by suicide. (Supposedly.)

My friend has one and he's all about helping people now

In a way it does make sense about some people's failed attempts improving their perspective in life.

A few pages later in the book, it talks about people who survive, if you're interested. It looks like their SI might give them a revelation? I've personally never had an NDE before, this is all just from reading the book. Anecdotally I know a person who regretted failing their attempt, so it definitely doesn't apply to everyone.

i mean im kinda sceptical. luckily i have insurance so that wasnt a problem but i think for americans an unsuccessful attempt can be financially very damaging, but for me it caused to not have an income for the time i was hospitalized which was a problem because bills still gotta get paid, and i had less social support than before tbh. it might just be my case tho.

I don't understand either, because I imagine healthcare bills are expensive. Maybe this applies to lower income individuals, which we disproportionately more prone to attempting suicide? I have not read the study, but I looked up the study mentioned and found this. The source does explicitly state that effects may vary widely by demographic such as age and credibility of attempt. "May"? Interesting word choice.

The economics of suicide.

When Kirk Jones jumped over the guardrail at Niagara Falls last week and fell 180 feet alongside 150,000 gallons per second of rushing water,...

slate.com

https://userpages.umbc.edu/~marcotte/economics%20of%20suicide.pdf

 

[Unsure and Useless]

Reading the last paragraph made me chuckle. People will charge you an arm and a leg when you actively seek out help, but then force their assistance onto you once the consequences are at their metaphorical front door.

 

[UKscotty]

Iv had attempts and sometimes they do make you appreciate life more I guess.

The problem with this book is it implies recovery is always possible. Not all depression can be treated and therefore no amounts of CTB attempts will improve it.

Also depends how you define an attempt. Sitting after a bit of cutting or a few pills can hardly be considered a serious attempt.

 

[Praestat_Mori]

I do not see how a failed attempt (if I attempted) would seriously increase my income or chances that my life could actually become better. I would not bet on such a statistic. It's better to have only one attempt and that one must be the first and final one.

 

[Adûnâi]

I do not see how a failed attempt (if I attempted) would seriously increase my income or chances that my life could actually become better.

In my case, it would work, but only like in those JAVs with horny nurses.

@OP I wonder what the sex distribution is there, the vast majority of unsuccessful suicides are made by females.

 

[conflagration]

Maybe they need to find better job so they can pay medical bills lol

 

[Adûnâi]

Maybe they need to find better job so they can pay medical bills lol

A "just reincarnate till you're rich" theory.

 

[penguinl0v3s]

I do not see how a failed attempt (if I attempted) would seriously increase my income or chances that my life could actually become better. I would not bet on such a statistic. It's better to have only one attempt and that one must be the first and final one.

Serious SI changes the way your brain thinks maybe? For the increased income it's probably offset by increased debt.

 

[Adûnâi]

Serious SI changes the way your brain thinks maybe?

That would be an argument for the DMT therapy advanced by Joe Rogan. While I personally haven't even drunk coffee, the idea of experimenting with one's consciousness as a last resorts does make sense... too much sense for the normies, dark and uninquisitive.

 

[TAW122]

While it may be 'cheaper', the fact that forced help against one's will is the alarming and disturbing part about it. If I wish to attempt, there is no way that I intend to fail, I want to ensure the best chance of success because I want to end my own suffering and avoid the decades of further sentience, and shitshow associated with life.

 

[penguinl0v3s]

That would be an argument for the DMT therapy advanced by Joe Rogan. While I personally haven't even drunk coffee, the idea of experimenting with one's consciousness as a last resorts does make sense... too much sense for the normies, dark and uninquisitive.

I believe psychiatry as a field itself sees DMT, ketamine, and psychedelics as a future treatment option. It's currently in trial phase.

 

[Final_Choice]

I think there might be a bias that only those who attempt and turn their life around and then manage to live life more economically actually get surveyed and included into the data. I haven't really read the research in full or verified their methodology, but I just feel like those who attempt and just plan on trying again at a later time would not include themselves in the data; and I feel that in order to truly add data you'd need their permission to get their income, expenses, and all financials before and after the attempt. Though I could be wrong.

 

[sserafim]

The "it's not your time" near death experience is informative then. The person goes back and does something 20% more valuable.

Wdym by "valuable"?

My friend has one and he's all about helping people now

Oh wow

 

[LetMeBeSad]

Could also be because they are permanently injured and entitled to disability or some other government funding.

 

[Lycan]

I'm reading this book by Thomas Joiner and this caught my interest. It shows that people don't care as much until you attempt to kys, at least my pessimistic interpretation says

View attachment 128942

When I attempted back in 2018 they put me in a mental ward where I got verbally abused\ humiliated by a member of the staff. I came out of that shit hole worse than I went in. My attempt didn't make things easier or cheaper as far as I've noticed. Only worse.

 

[Homo erectus]

Wdym by "valuable"?

Oh wow

I can't remember what OP said, but I think I was referring to people who had attempted had 20% more income than people without an attempt.