Zzzzz

Zzzzz

Nothing compares to the bliss of death.
Aug 8, 2018
879
No one has the right to interfere with our legal right to ctb. I want to at least get to the point where those who genuinely want to die will not be forced to stay alive. We need a way to differentiate those who are struggling and want to live between those who genuinely want to die instead of grouping them all in the same category . A person can create a legal document stating their desire to die, and we simply respect their wishes. The document would make it illegal for anyone to interfere without the individual specifically asking for help. This is just like a DNR document, except the cause of death would be suicide rather than something else.
 
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throwaway_2620

Specialist
Nov 1, 2018
370
No one has the right to interfere with our legal right to ctb. I want to at least get to the point where those who genuinely want to die will not be forced to stay alive. We need a way to differentiate those who are struggling and want to live between those who genuinely want to die instead of grouping them all in the same category . A person can create a legal document stating their desire to die, and we simply respect their wishes. The document would make it illegal for anyone to interfere without the individual specifically asking for help. This is just like a DNR document, except the cause of death would be suicide rather than something else.
I agree, and if anyone tries to interfere with people ctb'ing, then we should have the right to sue the fuck out of anyone who "saves" us from ctb and have us involuntarily locked up in a psych ward when we clearly want to die. Also (if you live in the US), we should have the right to refuse to pay any medical bills resulting from being sectioned.
 
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lost_soul83

Wizard
Jan 7, 2019
638
We should include a section on a doctor not being able to turn us away if we have a legitimate medical and/or psychological issue and we want help dying painlessly and quickly.
 
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Whiskeyjames

Whiskeyjames

Emotional ->Irrational->Delusional->Sucidal...
Nov 16, 2018
92
But when it's legal the society as a whole will get into chaos, imagine if one sucided, then it cause one of his/her loved one so sad she commit to sucide as well, which eventually became a domino effect in a massive scale... The economy will be heavily damaged and the whole environment is just depressed af. The only business that benefit would be funeral business...

But I believe some people DO really have the rights to commit to sucide, for instancethose who suffer chronic pain that has no chance for recover yet still costing his/her family fortune for the medical bills. Or those who are too old and only which their death doesn't really affect others.

But for those who just wanna escape their responsibilities should not have the right to commit sucide as they are just being irresponsible...(yes I'm talking to myself...)
 
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ThinkingAboutThis

Student
Jan 7, 2019
142
I also believe that there should be legislation that a doctor should never ever cut off a patient from any prescription where a quick stop (or even a slow stop) would send a person into a medical crisis and/or suicidal thoughts of actions. Those doctors who prescribe meds that are capable of causing serious suicidal thoughts should be obligated to go see the insides of a psychiatric ward or a psychiatric hospital once in a while, so that they understand what they're forcing their patients into by firing them or cutting off their prescriptions.
 
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Whiskeyjames

Whiskeyjames

Emotional ->Irrational->Delusional->Sucidal...
Nov 16, 2018
92
But again if you can legally proof your sucide will not interfere your love ones life or your surroundings, then I guess you can get a pass for that
 
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throwaway_2620

Specialist
Nov 1, 2018
370
Not to mention that if people were allowed to commit suicide (instead of being sectioned), then this may help with population control because the world is overpopulated as it is.
Edit: By the way, have any of you seen this video:

 
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gingerplum

gingerplum

Enlightened
Nov 5, 2018
1,450
We should include a section on a doctor not being able to turn us away if we have a legitimate medical and/or psychological issue and we want help dying painlessly and quickly.

Well, you can't force a physician to participate in something that conflicts with their beliefs. By the same token, you don't have to see that doctor if you don't agree with their beliefs. For example, I recently learned that my kids' pediatrician believes in gay conversion therapy. I was pretty appalled, but he's no longer going to see my kids, gay, straight, or otherwise.

Then, who gets to determine what medical or psychological issues are legitimate? Who decides the criteria? It gets really sticky, really fast.
 
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couragetodie

Student
Jan 2, 2019
154
It's pretty wild how the system works and I have witnessed firsthand how some people are just used in the psych wards as they have good insurance.
I agree, and if anyone tries to interfere with people ctb'ing, then we should have the right to sue the fuck out of anyone who "saves" us from ctb and have us involuntarily locked up in a psych ward when we clearly want to die. Also (if you live in the US), we should have the right to refuse to pay any medical bills resulting from being sectioned.
 
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Smilla

Smilla

Visionary
Apr 30, 2018
2,549
But when it's legal the society as a whole will get into chaos, imagine if one sucided, then it cause one of his/her loved one so sad she commit to sucide as well, which eventually became a domino effect in a massive scale... The economy will be heavily damaged and the whole environment is just depressed af. The only business that benefit would be funeral business...

But I believe some people DO really have the rights to commit to sucide, for instancethose who suffer chronic pain that has no chance for recover yet still costing his/her family fortune for the medical bills. Or those who are too old and only which their death doesn't really affect others.

But for those who just wanna escape their responsibilities should not have the right to commit sucide as they are just being irresponsible...(yes I'm talking to myself...)

Who are you to tell me that I am not "allowed to die" and are being "irresponsible" by relieving myself from pain. I leave no dependents, and dare I say I am worth more to people dead than alive.

Your first paragraph is laughable, so many errors in your thinking,
as is the rest of it, but you are entitled to your opinion.
 
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gingerplum

gingerplum

Enlightened
Nov 5, 2018
1,450
This ain't gonna happen...ever in modern times. Maybe thousands of years in the future in some entirely different society...but it's an unrealistic thing to expect and a waste of energy. Most people who have never experienced this will NEVER see it as acceptable period, let alone a service to be provided in a hospital etc. No amount of activism or awareness will change this. It's deeply built into the human psyche. Even the euthanasia that is available in very few places is mostly so restrictive it's useless except for someone terminal in their last days, with lots of bureaucracy, and even THAT is controversial. I understand how helpless it makes people feel...but it just isn't going to happen. It's like wishing for warp drive or other fictional stuff.

I agree it's not going to happen in the next few generations, but I think we owe it to future society to play a part in changing the general perspective. Kervorkian was too extreme for most, but at least he got the discussion started.
 
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Smilla

Smilla

Visionary
Apr 30, 2018
2,549
This ain't gonna happen...ever in modern times. Maybe thousands of years in the future in some entirely different society...but it's an unrealistic thing to expect and a waste of energy. Most people who have never experienced this will NEVER see it as acceptable period, let alone a service to be provided in a hospital etc. No amount of activism or awareness will change this. It's deeply built into the human psyche. Even the euthanasia that is available in very few places is mostly so restrictive it's useless except for someone terminal in their last days, with lots of bureaucracy, and even THAT is controversial. I understand how helpless it makes people feel...but it just isn't going to happen. It's like wishing for warp drive or other fictional stuff. Rather than wish for impossible things, focus on working outside the system to accomplish your goal if you MUST CTB. Frankly I don't even know why people would waste the huge amount of money to go to Dignitas etc when you can get your own N and consume it when and where you like. It's so clinical and weird to me...and insanely expensive for the same thing.

The laws in the Netherlands are way out there for assisted suicide-they helped an alcoholic die at 42 years old, a woman in her 20s who couldn't overcome childhood trauma, another woman with BPD in her 50s, and hundreds more with mental illnesses.

It's worth the fight, and I believe in 50 years US (and others) laws will be more similar to the Netherlands.
 
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gingerplum

gingerplum

Enlightened
Nov 5, 2018
1,450
I'm sure end of life euthanasia will broaden...and become less of a rule crippled shitshow...over a long period of time...but we are never going to have "free for all suicide services" where anyone with depression can go get killed or handed a "peaceful pill". I think it's entirely unrealistic for anyone to think this could ever happen and you see people post about it all the time as if it's even a possibility. It's not even worth spending the energy getting mad about because it's so not gonna happen and anyone being rational cannot expect the average joe to be ok with it. I think the energy is better spent on planning one's exit with the means available...if they can't find a way to live.
 
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throwaway_2620

Specialist
Nov 1, 2018
370
The laws in the Netherlands are way out there for assisted suicide-they helped an alcoholic die at 42 years old, a woman in her 20s who couldn't overcome childhood trauma, another woman with BPD in her 50s, and hundreds more with mental illnesses.

It's worth the fight, and I believe in 50 years US (and others) laws will be more similar to the Netherlands.
In my opinion, that's the way it should be. People should be allowed to ctb peacefully without being forced/bullied into living against their will. That way, people won't have to resort to painful/violent methods or methods that involve others, nor would they have to worry about being involuntarily locked up in case they miss the bus.
 
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Lifeisatrap

Arcanist
Oct 5, 2018
408
You shouldn't even have to request permission from doctors. The decision to end one's life is entirely personal. But I agree that it's a pipe dream that's never going to happen. Humanity will go extinct before ever granting citizens the right to exit on their own terms unfortunately.
 
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throwaway_2620

Specialist
Nov 1, 2018
370
You shouldn't even have to request permission from doctors. The decision to end one's life is entirely personal.
Agreed, everyone should have the right to exit on their own terms. Sucks that the right to one's own autonomy has to be a pipe dream.
 
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TAW122

TAW122

Emissary of the right to die.
Aug 30, 2018
6,803
I agree with many points here, and quite frankly, I do wish to sue the parties involved, including the authorities, the hospitals, and of course, the pro-lifers, suicide-preventionists, heheheh. In regards to whether that is likely to be a reality, I would say that it isn't, at least not in current day. The government and society has much more to gain, extract labor and resources from it's citizens when citizens are alive to fuel the economy, contribute to the societal, monetary system. I suppose if there were ever a point where a government could not benefit from someone being alive, like not even healthcare workers, not hospice, what not, and costs much more to keep someone alive such that there is a net negative, then the government may be looser with allowing (passive) euthanasia or at least not try as hard to keep someone alive. Of course, at that point, it's just societal pressure and religious influences imposing their will to keep a person 'alive' just because of their subjective morality and want of control over another's life.

@throwaway_2620 Yes, I agree with you that we should NOT be held financially responsible or required to pay off medical bills, especially for "forced" treatments against our will. It's quite disgusting that we are treated worse than animals in some situations and then expected to be grateful for the shit treatment, going into debt (and ruining one's credit) just for the wrong action of suicide ideation, planning, or having a method.

In regards to the video you posted, yes I have watched it before. Several times in fact. I agree with his position as a pro-choice position which is very objectively grounded. Upon reading the comments of that video, there are a few commentors that show their ignorance and do not argue rationally, but emotionally. Some people who counter-argued against those anti-suicide/pro-lifers did so rationally and objectively. They did well. Sadly, the pro-lifer crowd (which is the 20% of the dislikers on that video) will never get it and don't want to accept it.

@oneofthesedays Yes, while it is true that it is very unlikely that we will not see voluntary euthanasia and the right to die in our generation or even the next few generations, this is why I have taken matters into my own hands. I have acquired my method of ctb'ing when things become too harsh for me and past my limit. However, I do agree more with @gingerplum that we should sow the seeds ot voluntary euthanasia at the least, before we ctb, so that in the future (longer after we are gone from this life either via ctb, natural causes, other causes of death, etc.) it will become a reality. Many changes in this world are only possible because someone or some group many years ago did something about it and while the fruits did not bear immediately or in that particular timespan, it did facilitate change and overtime, their vision becomes a reality.

@Smilla I think I would have moved to Europe (or at least die trying or something) if I was for any reason unable to obtain my method in the US. Fortunately, I was able to legally obtain my method (firearm) in the US so now I have the control to exit at any given time should I choose to do so. Having such control does give me empowerment to stick around a bit longer and while I'm still around, I'll fight against the pro-life, anti-suicide rhetoric. I will support the pro-choice stance and help push that front. While I don't forsee that I'm able to make a significant dent, I would at the least be able to contribute a little bit such that one day (which is likely beyond my time on this rock called Earth) our pro-choice and right to die vision will become reality.

@Lifeisatrap Yeah, this seems like the reality that I feared. I am 28 years old and the way things are going in the world and society, as well as the people around me IRL, suicide is an inevitability and the ultimate solution out of this miserable existence. It is not a matter of if, but when and where, which is heavily dependent on my life circumstances as well as any major catalyst.

*TAW122 drops the mic* *thud sound echoes through the auditorium*
 
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gingerplum

gingerplum

Enlightened
Nov 5, 2018
1,450
I agree with many points here, and quite frankly, I do wish that suing the parties involved, including the authorities, the hospitals, and of course, the pro-lifers, suicide-preventionists, heheheh. In regards to whether that is likely to be a reality, I would say that it isn't, at least not in current day. The government and society has much more to gain, extract labor and resources from it's citizens when citizens are alive to fuel the economy, contribute to the societal, monetary system. I suppose if there were ever a point where a government could not benefit from someone being alive, like not even healthcare workers, not hospice, what not, and costs much more to keep someone alive such that there is a net negative, then the government may be looser with allowing (passive) euthanasia or at least not try as hard to keep someone alive. Of course, at that point, it's just societal pressure and religious influences imposing their will to keep a person 'alive' just because of their subjective morality and want of control over another's life.

@throwaway_2620 Yes, I agree with you that we should NOT be held financially responsible or required to pay off medical bills, especially for "forced" treatments against our will. It's quite disgusting that we are treated worse than animals in some situations and then expected to be grateful for the shit treatment, going into debt (and ruining one's credit) just for the wrong action of suicide ideation, planning, or having a method.

In regards to the video you posted, yes I have watched it before. Several times in fact. I agree with his position as a pro-choice position which is very objectively grounded. Upon reading the comments of that video, there are a few commentors that show their ignorance and do not argue rationally, but emotionally. Some people who counter-argued against those anti-suicide/pro-lifers did so rationally and objectively. They did well. Sadly, the pro-lifer crowd (which is the 20% of the dislikers on that video) will never get it and don't want to accept it.

@oneofthesedays Yes, while it is true that it is very unlikely that we will not see voluntary euthanasia and the right to die in our generation or even the next few generations, this is why I have taken matters into my own hands. I have acquired my method of ctb'ing when things become too harsh for me and past my limit. However, I do agree more with @gingerplum that we should sow the seeds ot voluntary euthanasia at the least, before we ctb, so that in the future (longer after we are gone from this life either via ctb, natural causes, other causes of death, etc.) it will become a reality. Many changes in this world are only possible because someone or some group many years ago did something about it and while the fruits did not bear immediately or in that particular timespan, it did facilitate change and overtime, their vision becomes a reality.

@Smilla I think I would have moved to Europe (or at least die trying or something) if I was for any reason unable to obtain my method in the US. Fortunately, I was able to legally obtain my method (firearm) in the US so now I have the control to exit at any given time should I choose to do so. Having such control does give me empowerment to stick around a bit longer and while I'm still around, I'll fight against the pro-life, anti-suicide rhetoric. I will support the pro-choice stance and help push that front. While I don't forsee that I'm able to make a significant dent, I would at the least be able to contribute a little bit such that one day (which is likely beyond my time on this rock called Earth) our pro-choice and right to die vision will become reality.

@Lifeisatrap Yeah, this seems like the reality that I feared. I am 28 years old and the way things are going in the world and society, as well as the people around me IRL, suicide is an inevitability and the ultimate solution out of this miserable existence. It is not a matter of if, but when and where, which is heavily dependent on my life circumstances as well as any major catalyst.

The only thing this is missing is for you to drop the mic. Nailed. It.
 
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